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  #1  
Old 12-19-2010, 03:34 PM
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Default Never impulse buy

I visited this drum shop in Nyack NY, called the long island drum shop. I was looking for a new snare drum at the time.

http://www.longislanddrum.com/


I was about to make an impulse purchase buy for the Tama metal works 5.5x14 snare drum. I do that once in a while, and the wife is not happy at all with me when I do that.


However, the salesman and I started talking about my older equipment and he told me that he would sell me the tama snare for $150.00 if, I throw in my two year old Catalina jazz snare and my two year old 20" Zildjian K session ride cymbal.

I smiled enthusiastically and said it was a good deal and that I would think about, knowing full well that I was just mistaken for a mark in a caravel and he was trying to screw me with a large acme thread. I never went back to the small shop in Nyack NY, and perhaps with actions like this it will never get very large.

If I wanted to sell either of these items, I knew they were worth more than $50.00 for both. I did not know the value of this Tama snare at the time, because I did not research it. But, when I got home I went online and found that I could purchase the snare at the time was selling for $150.00 with free shipping as well.

http://drums-percussion.musiciansfri...LAID=462623348

Hopefully, the internet will make scenes like this a thing of the past. Everyone is now able to price shop at light speed. Thank you Leonard Kleinrock, the inventor of the internet. (Please no Al Gore jokes)

Here are the conclusions to this story;
1. Never impulse buy.
2. Always know the average price before hand.
These two are lessons to me as well as friendly advice to others.

3. Do not over sell the sale. The salesman, if he was aware of what was going on, he would have tried to close the deal and been done with it. Instead he went over the snares bearing edge and got greedy.

4. Do not get greedy. This salesman could have stopped at selling the snare at a higher profit, but he wanted to get more than just one sale out of the deal and ended up loosing this sale and my business.
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Last edited by evolving_machine; 01-08-2011 at 07:02 AM.
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  #2  
Old 12-19-2010, 03:46 PM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

I take my iPhone with internet capability now everywhere and used it to price a new computer printer at Staples by showing the salesman the same thing at Amazon.con. He said they didn't match with internet stores only true stores so I left and bought it online with free shipping. My phone has made me impulse free.
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Old 12-19-2010, 03:46 PM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

Smart move,
I also always sleep on any deal before committing.
I also always research what I want to buy.

Last week there was a new Mapex snare on eBay for $145 or best offer plus $15 shipping.
I googled it and I found that Casico had 6 of them in stock for $130 shipped.

I bid $105 on the eBay snare to make it $120 shipped.
No one else bid, and the auction ended.
The seller refused my offer.

A few days later I won a better Sonor snare for $125 shipped.

When you are using eBay your impulse is to bid and beat the other guy and win the item.
That's wrong! If it's a bad deal, move on, until a good deal comes along.
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Last edited by bobdadruma; 12-19-2010 at 04:01 PM.
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Old 12-19-2010, 05:49 PM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

When I read "and your 20" Z K"....I figured this guy thought you were a rube. In my opinion never trade cymbals for drums. Good choice on your part!
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Old 12-19-2010, 06:47 PM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

You know, a friend of mine had his iPhone out with the barcode app to scan for prices on the internet. That's almost worth having an iPhone!
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Old 12-19-2010, 06:48 PM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

Yes, that "deal" was a stinker. What a shark.

I agree with the "never impulse buy" theme, and not just when faced with used drum salesmen. I'd like to add "don't scrimp on purchases" too. I was desperate for something to practice on and bought a cheap e-kit, figuring anything was better than nothing. Bad move. The pads have lousy bounce, the triggering is uneven (the difference between tap and TAP is a hair's breadth) and the cymbal triggers have dead spots.

For an extra $400, which I could afford, I would have had a reasonable Yammie e-kit. Stupidity.
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Old 12-19-2010, 09:04 PM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

I feel old fashion. I use my computer at home to do the price searches and take my time before I buy. For me slowing down the process helps me put it in perspective.
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Old 12-19-2010, 09:54 PM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

I don't really agree, at all..... you just need to know a good deal, when you see one.
A few years ago, a painter/cat I knew, bought two amps, off a commercial job site he was working on. After working all day, thinking, getting buyers remorse, by chance he runs into me, at the local coffee house. Tells me his story. One amp, he gave to his "helper", for payment, for the day. The "other" amp, it's in his truck. I ask him, ...... "so, what do you want for it" ..... his reply, ...... "I just want to get my money back out of it". Which was $50. Well hell, I got $50 in my pocket, so I say, ...."OK, let's take a look at it".
Well, first thing I see, is it's a Fender. It's a Twin Reverb. It's a Black Face. So I ask him .... "Does it work?" .... His reply, .... "Man, I don't even know. Guy I bought it from says it works, but I don't even have a guitar right now, to check it out. I just wanna get my money back out of it, I think".
So I gave the cat $50 for it, and we put it in my truck. Run it up to my buddies amp shop the next day, it works, but it's a little noisy. My amp guy says he can "clean it up". I told him "do it".
We sold that amp for $800.
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Old 12-20-2010, 12:12 AM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

Harry,

it seems that you are able to smell a bargain and you have the ability to judge a persons character instantly. These are very good traits to have.
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Old 12-20-2010, 02:07 AM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

Quote:
Originally Posted by evolving_machine View Post
I feel old fashion. I use my computer at home to do the price searches and take my time before I buy. For me slowing down the process helps me put it in perspective.
It's OK to slow down the process to a speed that you are comfortable with. The item that you are considering will still be there tomorrow.
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Old 12-20-2010, 02:16 AM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

Quote:
Originally Posted by harryconway View Post
I don't really agree, at all..... you just need to know a good deal, when you see one.
A few years ago, a painter/cat I knew, bought two amps, off a commercial job site he was working on. After working all day, thinking, getting buyers remorse, by chance he runs into me, at the local coffee house. Tells me his story. One amp, he gave to his "helper", for payment, for the day. The "other" amp, it's in his truck. I ask him, ...... "so, what do you want for it" ..... his reply, ...... "I just want to get my money back out of it". Which was $50. Well hell, I got $50 in my pocket, so I say, ...."OK, let's take a look at it".
Well, first thing I see, is it's a Fender. It's a Twin Reverb. It's a Black Face. So I ask him .... "Does it work?" .... His reply, .... "Man, I don't even know. Guy I bought it from says it works, but I don't even have a guitar right now, to check it out. I just wanna get my money back out of it, I think".
So I gave the cat $50 for it, and we put it in my truck. Run it up to my buddies amp shop the next day, it works, but it's a little noisy. My amp guy says he can "clean it up". I told him "do it".
We sold that amp for $800.
Harry, what you did was not an impulse buy, It was what is called a "No Brainer!" Any classic non solid state tube amp can be repaired because of the way that they were designed and manufactured.
These amps are worth more than $50 working or not.
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Old 12-20-2010, 07:00 AM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobdadruma View Post
It's OK to slow down the process to a speed that you are comfortable with. The item that you are considering will still be there tomorrow.
Sometimes it won't--that's been my experience, anyways. Missed several "golden opportunities" myself.

If I know something is a deal, I hop on it, knowing that I can at least make my money back on it if I decide to sell it. If it's something I'm not looking for, personally, I'll pick it up if it's something one of my students would want. If I'm not sure it's a deal, but I *might* be interested, I'll whip out my phone and price-check online. Pretty handy.
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Old 12-20-2010, 08:07 AM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

Yeah good thing you thought about that or you would have gotten screwed. I went to my local shop once to get a quote on a tama artwood snare drum. I was ordering through the shop because I didn't have a debit/credit card at the time. I just cashed my check and stuck the money in my pocket. I tell the guy behind the counter what i wanted. He comes back 15 mins later with 550 dollar quote for what i know is a 250 dollar drum. I was like no thank you and walked out of the store.
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Old 12-22-2010, 10:19 AM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

What I have found, is that there is "Suggested Retail price," (SRP) "Average Retail Price," (ARP) and the "Real Price," (RP).

The SRP seems to be a fictional price that the manufacturer sets so they can make an appearance of discounts. The SRP is usually the price that is shown in the manufacturers catalogs. The SRP is usually close to double what the ARP usually is.

When you look at an ad from Musician's Friend or Guitar Center, they have the ARP in them. The RP is what you should be paying. The RP is usually starts at about 87% of what the ARP is.

The hard part is that you have to find a store that gives you the RP right away. This is so you do not have to go back to the stores to get them to lower the price all the time. No one really likes wasted time. Wasted time is too hard to play. I know how to play cut time is, but how do you play wasted time?

So this is what I have found out. Perhaps many of you learned this lesson already. But I am evolving slowly each day I learn something new.
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Last edited by evolving_machine; 12-23-2010 at 08:07 PM.
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Old 12-22-2010, 01:05 PM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

Quote:
Originally Posted by evolving_machine View Post
But I am evolving slowly each day I learn something new.
Amen to that...........................................
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Old 12-22-2010, 04:19 PM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

Quote:
Originally Posted by evolving_machine View Post
I feel old fashion. I use my computer at home to do the price searches and take my time before I buy. For me slowing down the process helps me put it in perspective.
This is the best advice for me. Anything to slow down the process helps me know if it is something I need versus something I want. So far, the last thing I needed was a Flu shot 22 years ago. But desire for stuff rears its head daily.

The last thing I "wanted" was an 18 Inch Custom A. China. It is awesome. Clears the room when I hit, however I was clear in my intentions, didnt need it.

Thats a pretty good place to be and great advice all around.
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Old 12-28-2010, 12:48 AM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

Well, I am ready to make a purchase on a new shell pack. My Catalina Jazz Gretsch needs an upgrade. I emailed and visited many shops. I got some good prices, and when I asked for some shops to match my price, many of them, but not all, came back and matched the price.

Here is the question; why should I go back to these shops that gave me a higher price at first? This tells me that in the future they will do the same thing and I really can't trust them to give me a good price right away in the future. They will not remember my name a few years from now. When I visit the shop they will not remember that I gave them a lot of business. If they do remember, they will remember that I nickeled and dimed them. I gave the shops a chance to come clean and to give me the best price right away, but should I go back to them after I found out how much more they were trying to make from of me?
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Old 12-28-2010, 01:21 AM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

They won't remember you, Those days are gone in retail for the most part.
The retail world simply doesn't work that way anymore.
Customers don't have loyalty anymore either.

I see it everyday in my work.
A customer will get a price from me to repair their car.
My price will be higher because I only use the best, let's say Brake Pads.
They take the car to another shop and they have cheap Brake Pads installed.
They then bring the car to me and they ask me if I can do anything because they are not happy with the brake job that the other shop did with the cheap parts.

I tell them that I can only do the brake job over again with the parts that I suggested.
They say never mind and they leave!

They have no loyalty to me and I have no loyalty to them.
I just go to the next flower like the bee that is looking for nectar.
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Last edited by bobdadruma; 12-28-2010 at 01:36 AM.
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Old 12-28-2010, 02:29 PM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

I do a lot of research before I buy most anything, including electronics, musical equipment, appliances, cars, etc. I don't like being pressured into buying before I'm ready, and I hate the feeling afterward of being burned. On a rare occasion I'll impulse buy if I get the feeling it is a good deal.

eBay can be great but it can also be a total ripoff as others have shown examples of. If I lose out on a bid, then it just wasn't meant to be. Same goes for an item that sells while you think about it.
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Old 12-29-2010, 03:42 AM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

This is probably straight forward advice but I've found my best strategy on eBay is to to decide how much I'm willing to pay for something- bid that and then walk away. eBay will do it all for me and let me know the outcome.

This means I'm never in a bidding war with anyone and pay too much

Yes I've lost plenty of auctions this way - but it's already been said that it was not meant to be
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Old 12-31-2010, 11:13 PM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

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This is probably straight forward advice but I've found my best strategy on eBay is to to decide how much I'm willing to pay for something- bid that and then walk away. eBay will do it all for me and let me know the outcome.

This means I'm never in a bidding war with anyone and pay too much
I'm going a bit off-topic here, but I'll bring it back...

I agree that you should decide how much you are willing to spend, and then stick to that. However, I always wait until the last few seconds of an auction to bid.

If you bid early what happens is this: other people bid, and are told they were outbid. So they bid again and again until their bid finally tops yours. Or they give up if it's getting too high for them. But the result is that the price of the item gets driven up higher than it might be otherwise. Early bidding is great if you are the selller, but bad for a buyer.

If you wait until the final seconds, you don't show your cards. No one knows how much you have decided to spend. The price hasn't been prematurely driven up, and you can see if it's likely you can win, or if you're already priced out. Everyone is feeling pretty sure about how the auction will finish, then in the last few seconds, I swoop in with my bid and steal it away.

The only time I ever lost an auction is when I've accidentally clicked the wrong link, gone to some other page entirely, and missed bidding in time. And that's only happened once.

Now that I've given my secret away, I hope I don't come up against any of you in an ebay auction anytime soon!
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Old 12-31-2010, 11:23 PM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

Just a couple of weeks ago, I had my eyes opened about store pricing. I went to my local Sam Ash with a bit of cash, and a Paiste Signature to trade in, for which I wanted to get a Paiste 2002 22" ride in return. I got into a long discussion with the manager about how little they were willing to give me for my mint condition Signature, and the bottom line amount I wanted to spend. As I was leaving he said that classic line: "What can I do to make this deal today?"

Long story short, it turned out that even though he was limited as to what he can pay out for used gear, he had a ton on leeway on the sale price of the 2002. I gave him a price I'd seen on the internet, and he beat it.

In the past I've gone into Sam Ash and GC and just given them the asking price. From now on, I'm gonna bargain!
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Old 01-02-2011, 09:34 AM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

Quote:
Originally Posted by criz p. critter View Post

..........I gave him a price I'd seen on the internet, and he beat it.

In the past I've gone into Sam Ash and GC and just given them the asking price. From now on, I'm gonna bargain!
I've tried that very unsuccessfully with Sam Ash and GC. But, I am glad it worked for you though. Normally the higher the ticket price, the more room for bargaining there is. At least that is rule I heard years ago.
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Old 01-03-2011, 01:26 AM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

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Originally Posted by evolving_machine View Post
I've tried that very unsuccessfully with Sam Ash and GC. But, I am glad it worked for you though. Normally the higher the ticket price, the more room for bargaining there is. At least that is rule I heard years ago.
Maybe the manager was in a more-than-usually flexible mood because it was right before Christmas and he needed to move a lot of gear. Or maybe because they gave me a kinda low price for my trade-in. Whatever. I walked away a happy man. I will try the bargaining again next time. Can't hurt.
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Old 01-22-2011, 09:38 PM
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Default Re: Never impulse buy

I took my own advise and drove many of the stores crazy. I got the best price and best customer service. I purchased a new Pearl MCX 924XP/C, color 259.
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