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  #1  
Old 08-05-2008, 01:04 AM
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Default Head Options

Hey all,

Currently using Pinstripe on Ambassador (clear) on all my toms and time has come for new heads all round so thinking about changing as now is the time.
How much would the sound change if i used clear Diplomat instead as its only 2.5 mil thinner than Amb?

Or... even use Ebony Pinstripes over clear Ambassador/Diplomat heads? How would that sound and compare?

The toms are a Yamaha Stage Custom fusion set
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  #2  
Old 08-05-2008, 01:23 AM
AlexM AlexM is offline
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Default Re: Head Options

Since the diplomat is a little thinner, its going to resonate a little more than an ambassador, giving you a very open tone. Everyone I know who uses these plays really lightly, and mostly in the vein of Jazz...

Ebony Pinstripes are fairly thick heads, and give you a note that is short in sustain. When used in conjunction with an ambassador reso I think you could get a nice 70's tom sound. I think that diplomats are too thin to be used with a pinstripe. I could be slightly off though...

What kind of sound are you going for?
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Old 08-05-2008, 04:12 AM
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Default Re: Head Options

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexM View Post
Since the diplomat is a little thinner, its going to resonate a little more than an ambassador, giving you a very open tone. Everyone I know who uses these plays really lightly, and mostly in the vein of Jazz...

Ebony Pinstripes are fairly thick heads, and give you a note that is short in sustain. When used in conjunction with an ambassador reso I think you could get a nice 70's tom sound. I think that diplomats are too thin to be used with a pinstripe. I could be slightly off though...

What kind of sound are you going for?

Actually, a Diplomat will resonate less.Bob Gatzen explains it in this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2ibBol23hs
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Old 08-05-2008, 08:07 AM
Bassdrummer Bassdrummer is offline
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Default Re: Head Options

Good video!

I can tell you from that clip that really inlightened me in regard to the 7mm versus 10mm reso and the difference in sustain. I'm not into the dampened heads too much, but I do like the increased sustain he thicker reso gives the drum. I do have dips on my toms now, this will make me consider going to an ambs for reso's.
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Old 08-05-2008, 05:27 PM
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Default Re: Head Options

Yes. Less mass means they stop vibrating sooner.

Also, diplomats will be a tad brighter sounding.

And no, they are not used strictly in jazz playing--there are more than a few rock guys using them--and they need not be played "lightly" for any particular reason.
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Old 08-14-2008, 08:17 PM
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Default Re: Head Options

Hi, thanks for the advice.

Think Ebony Pinstripe would be too much so either
* clear Pinstripe (current set-up) ontop of a Ambassidor clear
* clear Emperor ontop of Ambassidor clear
* clear Powerstroke 3 ontop of Ambassidor clear
* Vintage A ontop of Ambassidor clear

I play mainly soft rock, some jazz and R'n'B with pasite 17" 2002 thin crash, 14" pasite dimension hi-hats, 12" Turkish splash and a 19" Istanbul crash/ride on a Yamaha stage custom wood.

So, advice please? Do love the current pinstripe but not sure its just a tad too much "fat" at times on especially my 8" tom or a bit less on my 10" tom
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Old 08-14-2008, 08:40 PM
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Default Re: Head Options

I used pinstripes when I was younger but on my Yamaha kit I use Clear Emporer's instead they resonate better and they seem to play better also they're just better all-around IMO.PS3's are better for bass drums instead of toms IMO on little toms I use Coated ambassodors they have more of a jazz type sound then emporers

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Old 08-15-2008, 09:08 AM
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Default Re: Head Options

Quote:
Originally Posted by bonzolead View Post
I used pinstripes when I was younger but on my Yamaha kit I use Clear Emporer's instead they resonate better and they seem to play better also they're just better all-around IMO.PS3's are better for bass drums instead of toms IMO on little toms I use Coated ambassodors they have more of a jazz type sound then emporers

Bonzolead

The PS3 heads on the toms are geat for the fat sound from the rock recordings of the 70s and early 80s. Pinstripes came into more widespread use in the mid to late 1980s, and mostly in metal.


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  #9  
Old 08-15-2008, 02:09 PM
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Default Re: Head Options

Let those drums sing a little, you paid good money for that wood. Let it be heard. As far as the sound the sound files in the video give you a pretty good idea what they will sound like, ebony heads from my past experience tend to be a little darker sounding and don't seem to have the same resonance as it's clear counterpart. I think you'd find a nice change going to the Emperor over ambassador combo.

BTW Great video, thanks for the link!
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Old 08-15-2008, 02:14 PM
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Default Re: Head Options

Quote:
Originally Posted by bonzolead View Post
I used pinstripes when I was younger but on my Yamaha kit I use Clear Emporer's instead they resonate better and they seem to play better also they're just better all-around IMO.PS3's are better for bass drums instead of toms IMO on little toms I use Coated ambassodors they have more of a jazz type sound then emporers

Bonzolead
So what really is the difference between coated and clear emporer's? I want to use head that do resonate better as they can get lost in a un-miced gig with pinstripes.
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Old 08-15-2008, 02:29 PM
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Default Re: Head Options

Coated are warmer and a bit drier sounding.
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  #12  
Old 08-15-2008, 04:15 PM
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Default Re: Head Options

With the kind of music you play I'd go for a nice single-ply coated for batters, such as coated Ambassador or coated Evans G1. They have the tone for those kinds of music.

They'll also be louder unmiked than a 2-ply.
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Old 08-15-2008, 04:36 PM
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Default Re: Head Options

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skitch View Post
The PS3 heads on the toms are geat for the fat sound from the rock recordings of the 70s and early 80s. Pinstripes came into more widespread use in the mid to late 1980s, and mostly in metal.


Mike

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http://www.dominoretroplate.com

http://www.youtube.com/drummermikemccraw
http://www.myspace.com/drummermikemccraw
IMO PS3 are way too thick for toms can you say "rubbermaid garbage cans" LOL

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Old 08-15-2008, 04:40 PM
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Default Re: Head Options

Quote:
Originally Posted by Green_Shoes View Post
So what really is the difference between coated and clear emporer's? I want to use head that do resonate better as they can get lost in a un-miced gig with pinstripes.
if you're using pinstripes use the clear emporers they are are little more brighter than coated emperers IMO.Emporers are way more resonate then pinstripes.

Bonzolead
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Old 08-15-2008, 06:53 PM
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Default Re: Head Options

coated heads have a tendency to be a little warmer with more focus.
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Old 08-15-2008, 08:21 PM
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Default Re: Head Options

Quote:
Originally Posted by konaboy View Post
coated heads have a tendency to be a little warmer with more focus.
Thank but are you able to define 'warmer' and 'focused' please?
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Old 08-16-2008, 12:33 AM
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Default Re: Head Options

Sorry to double post but after a hours of research on the web and this forum i have learn that the thinner the resonance heads are, the less resonance they are so as i do want resonance (limited to a degree) i am sticking with ambassador clear on the resonance side.

For the batter, its no so simple to decide. I do like my pinstripe but they just don't cut through so it makes the obvious choice Emperor or equivalent (Aquarian option is teh same for pinstripe and emperor so not enough change rules that out, Evans still an option with G2). On the matter of coated or clear, i do want resonance but not too much so i think coated gives me that by also cutting out brighter overtones.

Another option is that classic Remo have brought back: Vintage A which is coated (see above) and is two thin heads combined (7.5 and 3 mil). According to Remo's website it has the same tone as an emperor coated but one 'mark' more towards a longer sustain. I believe it has more resonance than the emperor but with an ambassador resonance head (see top) maybe a diplomat would be better (see video and post above me).

Finally, from this website (http://home.earthlink.net/~prof.sound/), i am also think about Ebony as i quote:
" Ebony is in between the coated and walks that balance of properties between coated and clear and the stick slap does not have bright sandpaper like characteristics as found on coated heads. It produces a less of a high frequency overtone resonance (“darker” tone)."
which i like the sound of with the removal of high frequency overtones but just wondering if its too far from the pinstripe sound?


So, there you have it ladies and gentlemen, my thoughts on heads of a few hours research. Feel free to comment and correct me where necessarily. I know at the end of the day its my money and the choice will always be mine but advice is always helpful! :D
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Old 08-16-2008, 03:23 PM
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Default Re: Head Options

IMO there isn't as much difference between the ebony and clear as the quote would imply. Yet another reason to be wary of the DTB.

Once again, if you're playing "mainly soft rock, some jazz and R'n'B" then I would seriously consider a 1-ply coated, that's the sound for those styles. You're getting recommendations for heads from guys who don't play those styles and don't have your drums, so beware.

In the past when I've had the itch to try new heads I've bought two or three of my likely candidates for just one drum, say a 12". Try them each out on the one drum and you'll get an idea of what a whole set of them will sound like without springing for a whole set of heads you may end up not liking.
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Old 08-17-2008, 01:05 AM
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Default Re: Head Options

Quote:
Originally Posted by drumtechdad View Post
In the past when I've had the itch to try new heads I've bought two or three of my likely candidates for just one drum, say a 12". Try them each out on the one drum and you'll get an idea of what a whole set of them will sound like without springing for a whole set of heads you may end up not liking.
Yes I'd say that's a good way to do it.
There is nothing better than trying things out for yourself.. then you can properly evaluate the difference in sound created by the heads in relation to your drums.
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  #20  
Old 08-17-2008, 02:39 AM
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Default Re: Head Options

Quote:
Originally Posted by drumtechdad View Post
IMO there isn't as much difference between the ebony and clear as the quote would imply. Yet another reason to be wary of the DTB.

Once again, if you're playing "mainly soft rock, some jazz and R'n'B" then I would seriously consider a 1-ply coated, that's the sound for those styles. You're getting recommendations for heads from guys who don't play those styles and don't have your drums, so beware.

In the past when I've had the itch to try new heads I've bought two or three of my likely candidates for just one drum, say a 12". Try them each out on the one drum and you'll get an idea of what a whole set of them will sound like without springing for a whole set of heads you may end up not liking.
Great Post. I would like to say that i second Drumtechdad's advice. For your styles, definitely go with something more towards a coated ambassador or other brand counterpart, and stick with the clear ambassador resos.

Pinstripes are absolutely no good for you, as you said, emperors are the same head without the glue around the ede, so a tad better, but still a little thick for what you want.

Ambassador is much better as it is a good weight single ply head, and the coating will add more warmth to the drums, giving them a rounder sound by cutting out just a little bit of ring that you get with clear heads.
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