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  #1  
Old 05-25-2007, 09:58 AM
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Default My Revelation.....

I have had a revelation!!!!!


For years I had a Danmar Click pad, and a whole beds worth of stuff inside my bass drum....

I wanted a metal sound, but I had to close mic it, and it didnt sound good...

BUT:

yesterday, for the first time, I TOOK IT ALL OFF!!!

and you know, what - I LOVE IT!!!

It sounds so deep and resonant, I have paid lots of money for a 22x18 bass drum, and now I can hear and feel its potential low-end!!!

This was inspired by the fact that Neil Peart and Thomas Lang have amazing bass dum sounds, but no bedding, so I wanted to try it.

Trust me, if you have an expensive bass drum filled with pillows, take some (or all) of it out, and feel the power!!!!
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  #2  
Old 05-25-2007, 10:16 AM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

Hey man, welcome to the real world of "drums without laundry".
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  #3  
Old 05-25-2007, 10:34 AM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

Haha, had that same revelation some time ago. I a huge pillow in my kick, and it pretty much touched both sides of the drum, so the sound was short and deep. Now I have my little zebrapillows inside them, to dampen a little bit of the sound but still let the head resonate a lot. You know, I have found out there is a little zebra in everyone :p.
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Old 05-25-2007, 01:50 PM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

I thnk the reason I like the sound is the fact that the Reso head is unfettered, so you get tons of low end, especially from a 22" bass....

Harry, You bass must be amazing, if its 26(?) from what I remember...
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  #5  
Old 05-25-2007, 05:31 PM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....



16X22 fusion style Force 2001...rocks plenty deep with an agressive low end punch. The foam...I just happen to come across that someone was tossing to the trash...thought it might work well; it does.

I don't get too involved in the "which head is best" thing. Sound engineering has come so far in the last decade that you could could play cardboard heads on a trash can for a bass drum and a good sound engineer could turn it into something beautiful (both live and in the studio). I play what feels most comfortable AND delivers a more than satisfactory sound to my ears...this knowing that I can potentially get away with murder both live and in the studio.

my $.02
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  #6  
Old 05-25-2007, 08:13 PM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by sticksnstonesrus View Post

16X22 fusion style Force 2001...rocks plenty deep with an agressive low end punch. The foam...I just happen to come across that someone was tossing to the trash...thought it might work well; it does.

I don't get too involved in the "which head is best" thing. Sound engineering has come so far in the last decade that you could could play cardboard heads on a trash can for a bass drum and a good sound engineer could turn it into something beautiful (both live and in the studio). I play what feels most comfortable AND delivers a more than satisfactory sound to my ears...this knowing that I can potentially get away with murder both live and in the studio.

my $.02
Russ Miller is a studio guy who would probably try that, but in his own words, drums need correct resonance.
Which means that you are making it easier for the sound tech to get the desired low-end.

I used to thing that I could record a double pedal on a woodblock for a death metal kick, but over the years I have realized that only a drum can give you a drum sound - in a bass drum sense anyway.

You could trigger a garbage can with a roland module sure, but for an organic sound it might not work....

Not a rant btw, your 2 cents is fine, It makes perfect sense, I just wanted to add some stuff...
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  #7  
Old 05-26-2007, 05:28 PM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

I wasn't serious about the trash can and cardboard. I think you got that...just trying to make a point about technology. Truth is, I do search for the right heads, aiming for tonal resonance...I just haven't had a problem finding satisfaction in "lesser" heads. Part of me truly believes in that proper heads, PROPER TUNING, and overall experience in playing them will answer the organic side of making drum-sounds plus make it that much easier to satisfy the sound engineer behind the board, in the studio and the venue. Why pay exhorbinant prices for heads that are overkill for the situation? The day I flounder under a pile of various heads trying to perfect a sound is when I have endorsements falling out of my backside. I just don't have the financial overhead to support that right now...so, I'll fall back on my know-how for the meantime...it's free!
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  #8  
Old 05-26-2007, 06:21 PM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

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Originally Posted by sticksnstonesrus View Post
I wasn't serious about the trash can and cardboard. I think you got that...just trying to make a point about technology. Truth is, I do search for the right heads, aiming for tonal resonance...I just haven't had a problem finding satisfaction in "lesser" heads. Part of me truly believes in that proper heads, PROPER TUNING, and overall experience in playing them will answer the organic side of making drum-sounds plus make it that much easier to satisfy the sound engineer behind the board, in the studio and the venue. Why pay exhorbinant prices for heads that are overkill for the situation? The day I flounder under a pile of various heads trying to perfect a sound is when I have endorsements falling out of my backside. I just don't have the financial overhead to support that right now...so, I'll fall back on my know-how for the meantime...it's free!
I agree entirely.

Why buy an E-MAD when you can put a free piece of foam inside for the same effect.

Nice peadal by the way, love the black finish!!!

(But if you have a sub driver on the reso head, make sure there is nothing touching it...
You get attack from a mic on the batter head.)

/\ /\ /\ studio tip of the day....
lol
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  #9  
Old 05-26-2007, 09:49 PM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

Now take off the reso head !
I did that about a month ago and its still off, i feel it gives much more low end and a "woodier (if thats a word) sound" only thing is that you cant burry the beater or youll get a flappy sound but if you let the beater rebound off the head it sounds great.
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  #10  
Old 05-26-2007, 10:01 PM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

Pulling the resonant head defeats the purpose of trying to achieve a resonant sound...don't you think? Not having it will give you a sound, sure...possibly one you are fine with. Not me though.

One suggestion (maybe you've done this) and it's a simple one. Have someone play your drums while you walk to different positions and distances away from it. You'd be amamzed at how the drums sound WAY different on the opposite end of the batter-side of things...i.e the resonant side. You might change your tune about pulling that reso off...

Just a thought.

Andy
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  #11  
Old 05-27-2007, 05:34 AM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

actually, if you tune the batter medium high it has a very long sustain. and ive never heard it from long distance, I initially took the reso off because I was having problemes getting the sound I wanted when miced, It felt like the reso was choking the drum. Anyways, Im constantly experimenting...

Edit: Oh, I just reread the first post post and realized he was looking for a "metal" sound, so never mind with taking off the reso, taking it off (for me) gives a more earthy kind of sound.
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  #12  
Old 05-27-2007, 08:24 AM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuxido View Post
Now take off the reso head !
I did that about a month ago and its still off, i feel it gives much more low end and a "woodier (if thats a word) sound" only thing is that you cant burry the beater or youll get a flappy sound but if you let the beater rebound off the head it sounds great.
Two heads -> more resonance -> more projection and potential for low-end.
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  #13  
Old 05-27-2007, 08:41 AM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by fijjibo View Post
Harry, You bass must be amazing, if its 26(?) from what I remember...
You are correct, sir, and it is. Clear Powerstroke3 batter and an ebony Ambassador with a HOLZ port reso. wide open. Might not be for everyone, but it makes me happy.
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  #14  
Old 05-27-2007, 11:16 AM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuxido View Post
actually, if you tune the batter medium high it has a very long sustain. and ive never heard it from long distance, I initially took the reso off because I was having problemes getting the sound I wanted when miced, It felt like the reso was choking the drum. Anyways, Im constantly experimenting...

Edit: Oh, I just reread the first post post and realized he was looking for a "metal" sound, so never mind with taking off the reso, taking it off (for me) gives a more earthy kind of sound.
I wasnt looking for a metal sound, Im a prog-funker.
lol

My bass drums sounded like Joey Jordison, but I wanted a change in sound, so I played around, like I said in my first post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wavelength View Post
Two heads -> more resonance -> more projection and potential for low-end.
Yeah, exactly, Thats what Ive been trying to explain.

Quote:
Originally Posted by harryconway View Post
You are correct, sir, and it is. Clear Powerstroke3 batter and an ebony Ambassador with a HOLZ port reso. wide open. Might not be for everyone, but it makes me happy.
Cool, I saw your avatar, and I thought, WOW!!! Thats one hell of a drum...
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Last edited by fijjibo; 05-28-2007 at 01:03 PM. Reason: spelling
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  #15  
Old 05-28-2007, 12:38 PM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by fijjibo View Post
I want looking for a metal sound, Im a prog-funker.
lol
Prog-funker eh???Is that sarcasm or the sort....because im in a Prog-Funk band....influences like Steve Vai,Rush,King Crimson,Zappa etc. and early Chili Peppers,Sly And the Family Stone,James Brown,Hendrix etc...

you should check us out...but our myspace is nonexistent....gotta make that up...
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  #16  
Old 05-28-2007, 01:05 PM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

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Originally Posted by da cheese walks View Post
Prog-funker eh???Is that sarcasm or the sort....because im in a Prog-Funk band....influences like Steve Vai,Rush,King Crimson,Zappa etc. and early Chili Peppers,Sly And the Family Stone,James Brown,Hendrix etc...

you should check us out...but our myspace is nonexistent....gotta make that up...
Sorry, I meant to say "wasnt" lol

I wasnt being sarcastic, Prog-Funk rules!!
RUSH!!! CHILLIES!!!

Yeah, man, I will check out your band, ill try your profile if I can find anything.

Cheers
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  #17  
Old 05-29-2007, 04:44 AM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuxido View Post
actually, if you tune the batter medium high it has a very long sustain. and ive never heard it from long distance, I initially took the reso off because I was having problemes getting the sound I wanted when miced, It felt like the reso was choking the drum. Anyways, Im constantly experimenting...

Edit: Oh, I just reread the first post post and realized he was looking for a "metal" sound, so never mind with taking off the reso, taking it off (for me) gives a more earthy kind of sound.
Sound is what you make. What you like is exactly that. For a looong time, a lot of drums were made without reso-sides. Toms, bass drums, etc...

Whatever floats your boat.
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  #18  
Old 05-29-2007, 05:46 PM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

Yeah, there is a general tuning idea for metal (higher reso than batter), but sticksnstonesrus is right, sound is what you make of it.

At the end of the day, you should sit down and experiment.

I'd like to think that I am good at tuning, because im not afraid to go out and use my own way of getting a sound, rather than following general ideas.

Of course, tuning lug patterns and head seating should always be followed, but at the end of the day, there is no right or wrong as long as you get your sound without doing damage to drum or head.
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Old 05-30-2007, 10:46 AM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

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Cool, I saw your avatar, and I thought, WOW!!! Thats one hell of a drum...
Thank you very much. My simple 2 piece kit.
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Old 05-30-2007, 10:50 AM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

Wow, your like a symetrical Bonham!!!!

Nice ride too, never seen a red one before...

Do you play toms too?
or just the bare essentials?
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Old 05-30-2007, 09:46 PM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

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Nice ride too, never seen a red one before...
Thanx. It's a Paiste Colorsound 20" Power Ride.

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Originally Posted by fijjibo View Post
Do you play toms too?
or just the bare essentials?
This is it, as far as my current acoustical set-up. I do have Ludwig 15x12, 16x16 and 18x16 toms to complement my kick, just not part of my deal with the band I'm working with now. Then I have my Roland SPD-S and loop station for my "other" endeavors.
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Old 05-30-2007, 10:18 PM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

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Originally Posted by harryconway View Post
Hey man, welcome to the real world of "drums without laundry".
hahahahaha I liek how you put that! NO MORE LAUNDRY FOR ME!
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Old 05-31-2007, 12:15 PM
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Default Re: My Revelation.....

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Originally Posted by harryconway View Post
Thanx. It's a Paiste Colorsound 20" Power Ride.

This is it, as far as my current acoustical set-up. I do have Ludwig 15x12, 16x16 and 18x16 toms to complement my kick, just not part of my deal with the band I'm working with now. Then I have my Roland SPD-S and loop station for my "other" endeavors.
Cool. Nice kit overall really.

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hahahahaha I liek how you put that! NO MORE LAUNDRY FOR ME!
Lol.

Yeah, I think after some thinking that maybe if we were meant to put stuff in our bass drums, they would come with laundry in them....
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