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  #81  
Old 02-08-2018, 03:40 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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Originally Posted by GetAgrippa View Post
Of course someone can emulate Buddy Rich-as posted here on DW. http://www.drummerworld.com/drummers/Eric_Fischer.html. Pretty dang impressive of Eric.
I watched the side-by-side comparison vid of Trombone Man and while he's 100% skilled and phenomenally impressive, Eric lacks the showmanship Buddy did. Eric looked bored to be honest while Buddy was "putting on the show" for those watching.

That to me is the difference between what Buddy did & how everyone else does it.
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  #82  
Old 02-08-2018, 03:58 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Well it's like watching Jeff Porcaro demonstrate his Roseanna shuffle-in the video he first does a Bonham and Purdie shuffle to demonstrate his developing his shuffle. Course he's got the mechanics of both-but it doesn't really sound like either. I often note those who sight read while they play-technically sound great but visually often seem lack luster. So I get where you are coming from. Tex listened to plenty of Buddy (I'm 62) and West Side Story-we did it in an orchestra I use to play so I listened to numerous versions by many including Buddy. Course the orchestra I was in didn't think the drum kit was front and center so it was always hold back. Like I said Buddy was a huge influence on me and I think he's a great drummer but "greatest" isn't terms I generally think. I was a scientist and I've never pondered who is the greatest scientist-it'd be what discipline, what question, what era, etc. Plenty of greats but "greatest" seems too subjective. It's difficult too cause drummers like Tony Williams, Elvin Jones, and others muddy the waters with great drumming. I'm a huge Tony Williams fan too-and not giving him a nod just seems wrong-then too he died relatively young while he was still an evolving drummer expanding drum horizons. But in general terms neither Tony or Elvin really had the name recognition and general popularity as Buddy so I see how people generally weigh the question-but if you start asking drummers then plenty of great drummers state Tony was the most phenomenal drummer they'd ever seen live. It would be interesting to do a scientific poll with categories of pointed questions to objectively measure "greatness" as defined by questionnaire. I bet the general population might say Buddy Rich, but asking musicians or drummers you will definitely run into differences I wager.
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  #83  
Old 02-08-2018, 04:42 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

I think the phrase "one of the greats" would be more appropriate in music.

In sports it's easy to say if someone is the greatest.

"He always came 1st in his races, he was the greatest". Bolt.

"He's the greatest swimmer that ever lived, he won more gold medals than anyone that ever lived." Phelps.

"He's the greatest racing driver, the only person to win 7 world championships." Schumacher.

All the above named the greatest are valid titles because they're based on unbeaten records.

How does one quantify that in music? You could argue that Hal Blaine is the greatest drummer that ever lived because his unbeaten record is actually the amount of records he played on. But it's not the same type of comparison as in sports.

With drumming or any instrument, does one translate "greatest" by technical ability, musicality, versatility? Buddy had great technical ability and of course swung really well. Was he versatile? As I think had been mentioned, he's an amazing big band drummer. But that's the only style of music he played, or that I know of.

Take someone like Jeff Porcaro who's revered by almost every drummer because of his feel and tastefully conceived and well placed fills. Because he's not flying around the kit like Buddy, does this mean he's not as great? Nope. He's playing in a way Buddy simply couldn't. Steve Gadd, Vinnie Colaiuta, incredibly versatile, musical and tons of chops. Not being flashy for the sake of it, but really saying something.
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  #84  
Old 02-08-2018, 06:16 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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Originally Posted by Merlin5 View Post
I think the phrase "one of the greats" would be more appropriate in music.

In sports it's easy to say if someone is the greatest.

"He always came 1st in his races, he was the greatest". Bolt.

"He's the greatest swimmer that ever lived, he won more gold medals than anyone that ever lived." Phelps.

"He's the greatest racing driver, the only person to win 7 world championships." Schumacher.

All the above named the greatest are valid titles because they're based on unbeaten records.

How does one quantify that in music? You could argue that Hal Blaine is the greatest drummer that ever lived because his unbeaten record is actually the amount of records he played on. But it's not the same type of comparison as in sports.

With drumming or any instrument, does one translate "greatest" by technical ability, musicality, versatility? Buddy had great technical ability and of course swung really well. Was he versatile? As I think had been mentioned, he's an amazing big band drummer. But that's the only style of music he played, or that I know of.

Take someone like Jeff Porcaro who's revered by almost every drummer because of his feel and tastefully conceived and well placed fills. Because he's not flying around the kit like Buddy, does this mean he's not as great? Nope. He's playing in a way Buddy simply couldn't. Steve Gadd, Vinnie Colaiuta, incredibly versatile, musical and tons of chops. Not being flashy for the sake of it, but really saying something.
Agee. In reference to music, toss out the rulebook and put away that measuring tape.

I find maestro to be a good word to describe that nebulous, immortal stamp that some musicians put on their music. Maestro- Thats good enough. To describe Buddy, Mike Mangini, Jim Keltner, Gadd, Marco Minnieman, Tony Williams... yadada

For every apple called Buddy, there's an orange called Ringo.... or a strawberry called Gadd, a watermelon called Elvin n so on..

Kick back and enjoy what they had to say, not how they said it..


...
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  #85  
Old 02-08-2018, 08:20 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

I think Buddy was a good showman and had very fast hands which lead to much of his fame at the time. His big mouth had a lot to do with his fame in the later years, but I digress. He was a very influential drummer, likely the most influential drummer of all time, but this doesn't make him "the best" in my book.

He's well known to John Q. Public (thanks to his many talk show appearances - as a guest and not part of the musical act) and I think this is why his status as "best of all time" is always brought up, because he is a good drummer and is popular. People who actually know drumming and know that there are other great drummers out there will know that Buddy was a one trick pony. Yes he was very good at what he did, but he was very limited to his specific style.
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  #86  
Old 02-08-2018, 09:52 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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Much much better. If Buddy was session drummer in the 80's the radio would be a blast to listen to.
I have never heard Buddy do an interesting rock performance.

Maybe he didn't want to?

I do not think he would have come up with the composition we hear in Tom Sawyer....which is a large part of the brilliance of Peart's Performance...and I doubt what he would have composed would be interesting beyond a technical standpoint.
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  #87  
Old 02-08-2018, 10:19 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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I have never heard Buddy do an interesting rock performance.
Isn't that an oxymoron?
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  #88  
Old 02-08-2018, 11:30 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

I suspect that those who think BR was a one trick pony have never heard his brush work or his small combo recordings. I guess as the OP said that everyone from Peart to Weckl, plus others like John Bonham saying Buddy Rich is the greatest of all time just isn't good enough for some on this thread.
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  #89  
Old 02-08-2018, 11:57 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Here is an interesting article about Buddy Rich. https://jazztimes.com/features/buddy-rich-legacy/
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  #90  
Old 02-09-2018, 01:57 AM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Great article, especially Steve Smith suggesting albums that people could listen to and hear a different side of his playing where Rich is both a subtle and an explosive accompanist.

Last edited by Texan; 02-09-2018 at 01:59 AM. Reason: Grammar correction
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  #91  
Old 02-09-2018, 02:45 AM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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Originally Posted by Texan View Post
I suspect that those who think BR was a one trick pony have never heard his brush work or his small combo recordings. I guess as the OP said that everyone from Peart to Weckl, plus others like John Bonham saying Buddy Rich is the greatest of all time just isn't good enough for some on this thread.
^^Agreed.

Sometimes the internet just blows my mind with attitudes about people who have worked hard to become bonafide masters. On Facebook, someone commented on the death of Ndugu Chancellor saying that anyone could have played the drums on Michael Jackson's Billie Jean. The best response to that from someone was (paraphrased) "He got the call, and he did it. You didn't. And not anyone could have done it".

This is the same case here (and any other discussion of people we may hold in high esteem. They did the work to get there. You didn't, and by nature of this, they got there first. It's not just technique and mastery of your instrument that gets you places (and we keep discussing that here). It's who you know, how you get along with them, and the interaction of the musicians you work with.

Does it matter that he couldn't have composed Tom Sawyer? Does it matter that his feet aren't what Mike Mangini's are? The fact is, Buddy became a bonafide drum star by being able to cut it with his contemporaries, and by being sociable enough to make lifelong career friends. This seems like a lot more than working hard to be a bedroom Youtube drummer, no? Which, by the way, is the majority of people you meet at NAMM. All those products? Being sold to the dreamers who dream about making it bigger than where they currently are.

I think it's cool that people have opinions, but it would be cooler if those people would look in the mirror first about where they're at before espousing an opinion on someone who made their music career the first thing in their lives, and to try to push along their craft. In fact, I've often noticed that people who are always working, are not on internet forums complaining about others. They're too busy working and playing music with other musicians.

This has happened in the past - remember when everyone complained about Hannah Ford? You know, the musician who got the gig playing for PRINCE? I'm pretty sure she wasn't busy worrying about what was said about her on Drummerworld. Heck, people say mean things about Lars Ulrich (still) or (insert any drummer you don't like). But you know, they're out there doing what they do. As we should all be doing. I'm going out right now.
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  #92  
Old 02-09-2018, 02:49 AM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Buddy is one the greatest musicians ever born. He deserves way more credit! If he would have played another instrument full time, it would be the greatest at that instrument. You can sit here and dig on his attitude or chops and say he over played or he was an asshole. Those people that say that have clearly not done their homework about Buddy. You have no clue what you're saying and are getting your information from ignorance. That's ok, because maybe these people will one day figure that out and learn how to actually listen to his music and learn to research. Also, read some articles from his family and friends and tell me he was an asshole.

Yes ..listening to music and being able to point out certain things in time, what the drummer is doing in relationship to the band, is something you learn over time in your life. Please take your time and listen. Go get some Buddy Rich albums and videos and watch, listen, and learn. Do it even if you don't like the music! It took me a lot of time to begin to HEAR what Buddy was doing and it wasn't chops!! It's nothing but pure emotion and in the zone. He took drumming to a level beyond anyone ever whether you like it or not.

On that note, some of his albums he put out were very simple drum parts and disco. Yeah buddy did an almost disco album. Or you could call it porn music.

I wish I was older and grew up with Buddy and the great players back then. What we have these days is shit. No substance, no music, and no feel. The great players these days are not in the spotlight. What does that tell you?-this is a major subject!

I also would like to ask why there are no drummers in the spotlight like Buddy? Why is there no other drummer in the world since Buddy that gets to that level? We have more tech, opportunity, and there is no draft! Where is the greatest? If you research his life and playing you will find the answers. Not YouTube bullshit
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  #93  
Old 02-09-2018, 03:39 AM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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Originally Posted by bud7h4 View Post
Reason 2: Just because we can't all agree on who the "best" is, doesn't mean that there is no best. We'll never know who the best is, that's true, but it's not because there is no best. It's because our opinions and tastes, among other factors, won't allow for a consensus.
Are you saying that the ambiguous imaginary construct by which we declare our favorite idols superior to others is not.... an ambiguous imaginary construct?

Who would have guessed?!

OżO
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  #94  
Old 02-09-2018, 03:44 AM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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Are you saying that the ambiguous imaginary construct by which we declare our favorite idols superior to others is not.... an ambiguous imaginary construct?

Who would have guessed?!

OżO
Those are some big words but what would Jeff Indyke say?
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  #95  
Old 02-09-2018, 10:08 AM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Wow, some of these Buddy Rich accolades are starting to sound like a certain beer commercial.

He's one the greatest musicians ever born.
He could play 600 strokes per minute continuously with his left hand--cleanly.
If he would have played another instrument, he would be the greatest at that instrument.
He could play anything in front of him, in any genre, without practice. He just looked, listened and played.
He once wowed a packed house with nothing more than two bass drums.
He famously played a complete set with NO SPRING on his pedal.
His version of Tom Sawyer would have made Neil Peart cry tears of joy.

He is... the most interesting drummer in the world.

Buddy: "I don't always play drums. But when I do, I play the shit out of them."


(Note that I paraphrased or combined some of these responses for effect)

Last edited by TK-421; 02-09-2018 at 10:20 AM.
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  #96  
Old 02-09-2018, 10:32 AM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

https://youtu.be/VJh9W3Gcpmo Animal seems to think so.
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  #97  
Old 02-09-2018, 10:36 AM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Buddy Rich is the greatest Drummer of all time...

..and now we go down in our practice room

Bernhard
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  #98  
Old 02-09-2018, 01:32 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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Originally Posted by Bo Eder View Post
^^Agreed.

Sometimes the internet just blows my mind with attitudes about people who have worked hard to become bonafide masters. On Facebook, someone commented on the death of Ndugu Chancellor saying that anyone could have played the drums on Michael Jackson's Billie Jean. The best response to that from someone was (paraphrased) "He got the call, and he did it. You didn't. And not anyone could have done it".

This is the same case here (and any other discussion of people we may hold in high esteem. They did the work to get there. You didn't, and by nature of this, they got there first. It's not just technique and mastery of your instrument that gets you places (and we keep discussing that here). It's who you know, how you get along with them, and the interaction of the musicians you work with.

Does it matter that he couldn't have composed Tom Sawyer? Does it matter that his feet aren't what Mike Mangini's are? The fact is, Buddy became a bonafide drum star by being able to cut it with his contemporaries, and by being sociable enough to make lifelong career friends. This seems like a lot more than working hard to be a bedroom Youtube drummer, no? Which, by the way, is the majority of people you meet at NAMM. All those products? Being sold to the dreamers who dream about making it bigger than where they currently are.

I think it's cool that people have opinions, but it would be cooler if those people would look in the mirror first about where they're at before espousing an opinion on someone who made their music career the first thing in their lives, and to try to push along their craft. In fact, I've often noticed that people who are always working, are not on internet forums complaining about others. They're too busy working and playing music with other musicians.

This has happened in the past - remember when everyone complained about Hannah Ford? You know, the musician who got the gig playing for PRINCE? I'm pretty sure she wasn't busy worrying about what was said about her on Drummerworld. Heck, people say mean things about Lars Ulrich (still) or (insert any drummer you don't like). But you know, they're out there doing what they do. As we should all be doing. I'm going out right now.
I agree with what you say, and certainly not anyone could have played Billy Jean the way Ndugu did. But I think you might have gotten off topic a little. Noone in this thread is putting Buddy Rich down or acting like an armchair critic where they should need to look at themselves before passing judgement. Everyone here knows Rich was an amazing drummer, a child prodigy, and certainly someone who I have admired and been inspired by for nearly 50 years. This thread is just about people's opinions as to whether he, or anyone drummer for that matter, is, can or should be labelled the greatest of all time.

Just because Peart, Bonham and other famous drummers say he was is to be fair, just their opinion, although I'll grant you that given their status and abilities, it certainty adds weight to their claim! :)
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  #99  
Old 02-09-2018, 01:38 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

I would put Gene Krupa above Buddy, not for technique or expertise, but for his feel and groove.

If you want speed, go with Rich; if you want "musicality", go with Krupa.

Edit- Krupa also brought more to the drumming world.
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  #100  
Old 02-09-2018, 02:21 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Gene Krupa quote, "Buddy Rich is the greatest drummer who ever drew breath."
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  #101  
Old 02-09-2018, 05:13 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

"Buddy Rich is a better drummer than me."

-God
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  #102  
Old 02-09-2018, 06:12 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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Originally Posted by TK-421 View Post
Wow, some of these Buddy Rich accolades are starting to sound like a certain beer commercial.

He's one the greatest musicians ever born.
He could play 600 strokes per minute continuously with his left hand--cleanly.
If he would have played another instrument, he would be the greatest at that instrument.
He could play anything in front of him, in any genre, without practice. He just looked, listened and played.
He once wowed a packed house with nothing more than two bass drums.
He famously played a complete set with NO SPRING on his pedal.
His version of Tom Sawyer would have made Neil Peart cry tears of joy.

He is... the most interesting drummer in the world.

Buddy: "I don't always play drums. But when I do, I play the shit out of them."


(Note that I paraphrased or combined some of these responses for effect)
I'm so into this response. Right on.
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  #103  
Old 02-09-2018, 09:04 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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I'm so into this response. Right on.
Thanks, Watso. Obviously Buddy was an amazing drummer, and I hope no one thinks I was trying to put him down or anything like that. But you have to admit, some of these over-the-top accolades begin to sound more like "legend" than reality. Of course, I know a few of these were meant to be funny.

Just for the record, my two favorite drummers are Vinnie Colaiuta and Gavin Harrison. I can watch either of them for hours on end. But every time I watch a Buddy Rich video, after 5 minutes I've had enough. That's not to say that he's not a great drummer, it's just that his style of playing doesn't really resonate with me. If he resonates with anyone here, great. By all means, watch him and say how great he is to your heart's content. Everyone is going to have a different favorite drummer, and everyone is entitled to their favorites.

I guess what irks me is the notion that Buddy is, was, and will always be the greatest of all time, period. That kind of thinking is very closed minded, like you're just supposed to "accept" that as fact, and anyone who questions it be damned. I'm the kind of person who likes to question things and come up with my own conclusions.

And my conclusion is that there isn't a greatest of all time. No one, not Buddy, not Vinnie, not Neil, not Gavin, nor anyone else can claim that title. As others have mentioned (and as I've alluded to), there's really no way to objectively measure who's the greatest, so no one really can be.

But if anyone wants to say that Buddy was the GOAT, I'm not going to argue with you or try to talk you out of it. Just as I'm entitled to my opinion, you are entitled to yours.
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  #104  
Old 02-09-2018, 09:33 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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Originally Posted by TK-421 View Post
Thanks, Watso. Obviously Buddy was an amazing drummer, and I hope no one thinks I was trying to put him down or anything like that. But you have to admit, some of these over-the-top accolades begin to sound more like "legend" than reality. Of course, I know a few of these were meant to be funny.

Just for the record, my two favorite drummers are Vinnie Colaiuta and Gavin Harrison. I can watch either of them for hours on end. But every time I watch a Buddy Rich video, after 5 minutes I've had enough. That's not to say that he's not a great drummer, it's just that his style of playing doesn't really resonate with me. If he resonates with anyone here, great. By all means, watch him and say how great he is to your heart's content. Everyone is going to have a different favorite drummer, and everyone is entitled to their favorites.

I guess what irks me is the notion that Buddy is, was, and will always be the greatest of all time, period. That kind of thinking is very closed minded, like you're just supposed to "accept" that as fact, and anyone who questions it be damned. I'm the kind of person who likes to question things and come up with my own conclusions.

And my conclusion is that there isn't a greatest of all time. No one, not Buddy, not Vinnie, not Neil, not Gavin, nor anyone else can claim that title. As others have mentioned (and as I've alluded to), there's really no way to objectively measure who's the greatest, so no one really can be.

But if anyone wants to say that Buddy was the GOAT, I'm not going to argue with you or try to talk you out of it. Just as I'm entitled to my opinion, you are entitled to yours.
Stop being so logical. We are having a discussion about an art form here.





(I love watching Buddy play, but I do agree with you.)


.
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  #105  
Old 02-09-2018, 09:39 PM
KamaK KamaK is offline
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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Originally Posted by Freightshaker View Post
I would put Gene Krupa above Buddy

Edit- Krupa also brought more to the drumming world.
I credit Krupa for getting people to pick up the sticks, whereas I credit Rich for showing drummers what they could do with them after their third year playing.

Funny related anecdote...

I was talking to Jay Boon about Guitar Center circa 1999 and how they were eating mom&pop shops and asked what he thought. He said that he loved GC, because they sold thousands of $300 trash instruments, and one in a thousand of their customers would eventually learn to play guitar.... At which point they would come to him.
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  #106  
Old 02-09-2018, 09:54 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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Originally Posted by TK-421 View Post
I guess what irks me is the notion that Buddy is, was, and will always be the greatest of all time, period. That kind of thinking is very closed minded, like you're just supposed to "accept" that as fact, and anyone who questions it be damned. I'm the kind of person who likes to question things and come up with my own conclusions.
If you think that's bad you should have seen the guys saying the same about Travis Barker.
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  #107  
Old 02-09-2018, 10:12 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

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Originally Posted by Dr_Watso View Post
If you think that's bad you should have seen the guys saying the same about Travis Barker.
Oh, THAT. Yeah, I remember the whole Travis Barker thing. But I think that was mostly trolling, rather than people who actually believed it.
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Old 02-09-2018, 10:44 PM
Hummada Hummada is offline
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Yes when I was born, Buddy came to the hospital and nighted me. He cut my shoulder, slapped my momma,and I have the scar to this day. It gave me a touch of his talent which I have yet to unleash on YouTube. But when I do, it will end all this nonsense.
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Old 02-09-2018, 11:33 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Lots of good points. I won't regurgitate all of the points but only a few to add to them.

First, the idea that any of the greats mentioned couldn't do a specific thing in a different era or genre is flawed thinking. Any of these drummers, given the interest or need to play a different style or genre would have assuredly worked on the skills and techniques needed.

Second, I usually don't go for greatest discussions. Too many variables and if you asked everyone the criteria for their proclamation I guarantee it would vary widely. It would be fun to develop a real list or criteria to then judge them on. Until then, no proclamation of greatest. One of the greats or my favorite, sure thing.

Third I agree with Tex, there can be a greatest given proper criteria.

Fourth, too many folks fail to properly value those that did it first compared to those that copied or added to. The idea that the Beach Boys or the Beatles or not great because people copy them with relative ease, but only accurate to a reasonable degree. They thought this stuff up and perfected without anyone to copy.

Finally I agree with a few that have given solid criteria about Buddy's playing that makes them think he is the greatest. To those that mention people like Mangini, sorry, but see my fourth point.
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Last edited by drummer-russ; 02-10-2018 at 12:34 AM.
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Old 02-09-2018, 11:57 PM
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Pocket-full-of-gold Pocket-full-of-gold is offline
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-421 View Post
Just for the record, my....... favorite drummers are Vinnie Colaiuta ...........
Without a doubt the most "complete" drummer I've ever seen. He's convincing in any genre he's placed in. From rock, to pop, to jazz, to fusion, to metal. He plays it like he belongs. Like it's all he plays.
I think Vinnie's overall skill set, musical ability and the tastefulness to apply it, covers more ground than any other drummer I've laid eyes on. He was definitely an innovator.

If there really was a "best" then I'd vote Vinnie to top my list too. At least in terms of pure drumming ability. But despite his immeasurable musical talent, innovation, ability and expression, and at the risk of sounding like a broken record, he still doesn't stand as tall. Not in the court of wider public opinion. Why that is, may be a mystery. But so is the rest of the general public psyche at times I guess.
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Old 02-10-2018, 12:30 AM
steadypocket steadypocket is offline
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

If we include fame and influence in the definition of “great,” then yeah I’ll call him the greatest. His name is synonymous with drums and is instantly recognizable by people who can’t even spell MUSIC. He’s influenced more drummers to pick up sticks than anyone other than perhaps Ringo. Like Babe Ruth, he was heads and shoulders better at his profession than almost all of his contemporaries. Few were in the same zip code. Good thing character isn’t a trait used to define greatness though. Like Ali, Buddy was an ass. We’re sadly a society that equates decency with fame. Best player? Hardly, for the reasons many have cited in this thread. Several drummers by 2018 have surpassed his musicality on a drum kit.
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Old 02-16-2018, 01:02 AM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

I don't know, but I'd rather listen to Max Roach.
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Old 02-16-2018, 01:32 AM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Gosh the thread is still going I thought it was settled Buddy was the greatest-yep Buddy Guy the Greatest Blues Guitarist. So it's settled. I'd like to see Chick Webb play-just listening to some sound tracks and this one video https://vimeo.com/66999761. can't really reflect this drum giant.
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  #114  
Old 02-16-2018, 05:31 AM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

He wasn't the greatest guitarist of all time:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CtynJQJROko
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Old 03-01-2018, 03:09 AM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

I've gotten to play with a lot of wonderful drummers, including Roach, Shaughnessy, Blakey, and quite often Louie Bellson. Early on, I discovered that top-line drummers produced a higher energy, even when playing softly. Over time, I came to accept this as a power derived from optimum coordination of man and instruments. You could watch Roach for just a few seconds and discern little if any, wasted energy. Then when he tacked on that absurdly high musicianship, you could feel a charge up your back.

That said, I never experienced anything like the voltage received from Buddy. It was on a different level and physically affected you. Comparatively, my first experience with Louie was very uplifting, remarkable in fact. But, my first time with Buddy was jarring. For most of set one, I could barely see notes for the involuntary purple dots. Then at break, I immediately ran for the bathroom, nor am I the only horn player to know that transformation. As for this greatness thing, I defer to other drummers. Roach and Rufus Jones were the only high enders I ever heard not speak of Buddy with something bordering on reverence. Jo Jones for example, used to make a wide path for him. So, who am I to disagree?
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Old 03-01-2018, 09:11 AM
picautomaton picautomaton is offline
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

All I can say is that if Buddy Rich used sticks like the Vic Firth signature model he is definitely one of the strongest drummers ever. To be able to do all the stuff he did with those sticks (heavy / long) he must be an exceptionally strong drummer.
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  #117  
Old 03-01-2018, 01:21 PM
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Alex Sanguinetti Alex Sanguinetti is offline
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattsdad View Post
I've gotten to play with a lot of wonderful drummers, including Roach, Shaughnessy, Blakey, and quite often Louie Bellson. Early on, I discovered that top-line drummers produced a higher energy, even when playing softly. Over time, I came to accept this as a power derived from optimum coordination of man and instruments. You could watch Roach for just a few seconds and discern little if any, wasted energy. Then when he tacked on that absurdly high musicianship, you could feel a charge up your back.

That said, I never experienced anything like the voltage received from Buddy. It was on a different level and physically affected you. Comparatively, my first experience with Louie was very uplifting, remarkable in fact. But, my first time with Buddy was jarring. For most of set one, I could barely see notes for the involuntary purple dots. Then at break, I immediately ran for the bathroom, nor am I the only horn player to know that transformation. As for this greatness thing, I defer to other drummers. Roach and Rufus Jones were the only high enders I ever heard not speak of Buddy with something bordering on reverence. Jo Jones for example, used to make a wide path for him. So, who am I to disagree?

Very interesting, and what´s your real name?

Best regards!
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Old 03-01-2018, 01:25 PM
Alex Sanguinetti
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  #118  
Old 03-03-2018, 04:56 PM
J-Boogie J-Boogie is offline
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Very interesting to say the least!!! Wow, what real world experience....with the gods of our instrument. Your input it truly appreciated Mattsdad, thank you.
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  #119  
Old 03-03-2018, 05:13 PM
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Buddy during his time was on a different level. He couldn't keep up with today Portnoys or Manginis though. He was leaps and bounds ahead back then, but now there is a bunch of guys on a level above him.
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  #120  
Old 03-03-2018, 05:33 PM
J-Boogie J-Boogie is offline
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Default Re: Is Buddy Rich REALLY the greatest drummer of all time?

Yup, another vote for Portnoy. Buddy was great and all, but I feel like I never a heard a single quad and very little double bass except for that one audio file.

Gosh, I thought one was supposed to be less of a d#$& after a vacation, mine obviously didn't work, sure was nice tho...I gotta move to Florida
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