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  #41  
Old 07-10-2017, 08:50 PM
Matt Bo Eder
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

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Originally Posted by sonormapex View Post
"We provide drums"...I,d be interested to know what you do supply, including hardware, cymbals etc.
A kit like that would be tweaked and tuned more in one month than mine would be in a year..LOL.
Well, we have a deal with Yamaha, so everything gets supplied as far as kits go. Paiste is the cymbal provider of choice so there are lots of those floating about. Remo provides drumheads. We basically maintain a stock of everything in several warehouses and whenever something needs fixing, we can do that. Anything special we have a direct line to S.I.R. for rentals.

But some drummers still insist on their own cymbals and pedals. Sometimes we have specialty acts come in, like an Elvis impersonator, and his drummer brings in his own 1950s Gretsch round badge kit. Same thing for most of the period-specific acts - especially any Beatles tribute bands - those guys will not expect anyone to have a 1960s Ringo kit.
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  #42  
Old 07-10-2017, 08:58 PM
cutaway79 cutaway79 is offline
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

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Originally Posted by Matt Bo Eder View Post
There's a practical argument to this as well in favor of the big names. If you ever get to the point where you're traveling around playing all the time (like most big name artists), the big names will have a network of distribution points for you to get drums when you need them.

Years ago at my first NAMM show visit, I spoke with a rep at Hohner, who distributes Sonor. And he explained to me the issues he had getting Gavin Harrison a kit when he played on David Lettermen's TV show. It was a nightmare for him because Sonor basically ships out exactly what Gavin needs for the performance and has it there waiting for him when he arrives for the show. Only in this instance, FedEx lost the entire kit. The panicked rep then had to scrounge around to find a kit for Gavin and came close to the wire.

I'm sure a small little custom shop would not be able to provide a kit to their artists unless they had that same kind of distribution network (sometimes worldwide) to be able to provide for their endorsees. After this story, I'm fairly certain that no big name drummer is actually carrying his own stuff on planes for a gig. The company is handling all those logistics.

Even with my work at Disneyland, we don't expect drummers to be bringing in their own stuff, we provide drums and amplifiers at least, so all the talent has to do is show up and play. Can you imagine a small custom shop just having to provide drums to a theme park for advertisement? That would probably kill any profit margin they may have had.

I love the work some of the custom shops do, but it's not necessary for me to be able to play. The gear's job for me is to just not break down while I'm playing it and to sound good. I can get that out of a lot of gear, and at the rate I'm going, I'm going to be able to say I've tried everybody's drums before I die ;)
You work at Disneyland? I know a few folks in the bands there, and play with them in other projects.
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  #43  
Old 07-10-2017, 09:15 PM
Matt Bo Eder
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Originally Posted by cutaway79 View Post
You work at Disneyland? I know a few folks in the bands there, and play with them in other projects.
I was a musician there back in the late 80s to the 90s, I've been a full-blown audio systems technician for the last 17 years now. Although I did play a rather famous rodent playing drums as my last playing gig (and that show continues to this day).
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  #44  
Old 07-10-2017, 10:43 PM
Wave Deckel Wave Deckel is offline
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

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Originally Posted by larryace View Post
When I predicted solid shells would be the mainstream in 50 years, I am definitely counting on some sort of mass production for solid shells, not the way they are built now.
Well, the poblem is: The production of the drum is only a small part of the costs. The main costs are wood itself and storage(!) of wood. This will remain the really expensive parts (Wood has to dry for a considerable time in order to make solid shells or good stave-shells. Some woods are left to dry for 10+ years) and if you want to build a solid shell drum, it means that there are less trees that you can use for that task than for ply-shells. Furthermore, we are harvesting more and more wood on this planet. Wood will get considerably more expensive in the future if humanity keeps on going to cut trees the way they are doing right now. So, no- it won't be cheaper, it won't be the drum for the masses. Absolutely unlikely.
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  #45  
Old 07-11-2017, 01:08 AM
The SunDog
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Did these things become mutually exclusive at some point? Can't you get a custom kit from any major drum maker. DW Collectors is an entirely custom line. I know other major drum makers offer this same service. Custom= made to order and made to customer specs. It does not mean "small" or "independent" or "boutique".
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  #46  
Old 07-11-2017, 01:37 AM
cutaway79 cutaway79 is offline
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

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Originally Posted by Matt Bo Eder View Post
I was a musician there back in the late 80s to the 90s, I've been a full-blown audio systems technician for the last 17 years now. Although I did play a rather famous rodent playing drums as my last playing gig (and that show continues to this day).
Haha, did you have to wear the oversized mascot head? I imagine that would be pretty hard to play in.
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  #47  
Old 07-11-2017, 02:02 AM
Matt Bo Eder
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Originally Posted by cutaway79 View Post
Haha, did you have to wear the oversized mascot head? I imagine that would be pretty hard to play in.
Yep. Full costume. The head articulated (eyes opened and closed and the mouth moved - all kind of mechanics going on, while I was strapped 9-feet up on a float playing a rather nice set of red/orange Yamaha Oak customs. Tougher gig than most people think ;)
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  #48  
Old 07-11-2017, 02:33 AM
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

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Because you can use numbers to prove whatever you want and your numbers are american so they mean sh1t to me

I am speaking from experience of a drummer based in the UK for the last 25 years. The increase of price, not in line with inflation or wages has made the same drums literally more expensive.

I gave the examples of my own experience and you chose not to read them or relate them to what I wrote, so in all honesty, why should I spend even 5 seconds reviewing yours?

It's just an opinion dude, you clearly spent a lot of time researching your reply, what a shame it fell on such deaf ears
I specifically referenced the single example you gave. I suggest you go back and actually read what I wrote. Since you clearly missed it, I'll reference it again:

As far as I can tell, the MSRP of the Pearl Omar Hakim snare rose over the 30 years of its production run pretty much in line with inflation. The same widget, with no changes, inflated in price. That's basic economics, not really dependent on location.

Since you're not inclined to acknowledge the existence of anything not British, here are some other data which prove my point, from Lloyd's TSB:

Everyday goods Price in 1982 Price in 2012 % change
Draught lager, pint 73p 3.18 336%
Bread, white loaf, sliced, 37p 1.24 235%
Milk, pasteurised, pint 20p 46p 130%

You can see there's some variation, from sugar per kilo only rising 123% to that pint of lager at 336%. But there is always a rate of increase. (You can find more here.)

What that shows is there doesn't have to be any improvement for there to be an increase in price. Justification for price increases (New! Improved!) is not required. The global economy being inflationary is often what drives price increases, at least as often as innovation or quality increases.

I recognize your experience. It must be said, however, that experience is not evidence. If experience was evidence, the world would indeed be flat. More to the point, in this case the numbers don't lie. When you combine the prices you've experienced with the empirical evidence of global inflation over that period, a different explanation other than your opinion of "prices went up without the widget getting any better" emerges.

Another thing which must be said: Refusal to even consider facts when they're presented to you is petulant. Reasonable adults - that is to say, fully-developed adult humans capable of exercising reason - reconsider opinions when those opinions are shown to be baseless.
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  #49  
Old 07-11-2017, 03:04 AM
cutaway79 cutaway79 is offline
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

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Originally Posted by Matt Bo Eder View Post
Yep. Full costume. The head articulated (eyes opened and closed and the mouth moved - all kind of mechanics going on, while I was strapped 9-feet up on a float playing a rather nice set of red/orange Yamaha Oak customs. Tougher gig than most people think ;)
Sounds like a real pain in the a$$. I actually had a similar situation recently... My band just played on the top of a float in a 4th of July parade. I was perched at the highest point (maybe like 6 feet off the ground), on a space barely big enough to fit my 4-piece kit minus one crash and my ride (so only hihats, and one crash). Everything was just duct taped down, so at a couple points, I had the overhead mic stand hanging off the float at about a 45 degree angle, tape barely hanging on. Good thing I didn't buy the cheap tape, haha.

Oh, and while I would imagine it's not nearly on par with the bulk/discomfort of a giant animatronic head, it was about 95 degrees outside, and we were all wearing leather suits and 80s wigs, just baking in the sun for two hours. Had to take the jackets off after the first 90 minutes. Cover band world is a whole different ballgame.
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  #50  
Old 07-11-2017, 04:20 AM
Matt Bo Eder
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

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Originally Posted by cutaway79 View Post
Sounds like a real pain in the a$$. I actually had a similar situation recently... My band just played on the top of a float in a 4th of July parade. I was perched at the highest point (maybe like 6 feet off the ground), on a space barely big enough to fit my 4-piece kit minus one crash and my ride (so only hihats, and one crash). Everything was just duct taped down, so at a couple points, I had the overhead mic stand hanging off the float at about a 45 degree angle, tape barely hanging on. Good thing I didn't buy the cheap tape, haha.

Oh, and while I would imagine it's not nearly on par with the bulk/discomfort of a giant animatronic head, it was about 95 degrees outside, and we were all wearing leather suits and 80s wigs, just baking in the sun for two hours. Had to take the jackets off after the first 90 minutes. Cover band world is a whole different ballgame.
Yeah - last time I did it it was 105-degrees. So being in the costume for close to 45-minutes (24 minutes doing the show in front of guests) could kill me. The other people who do it are females in their 20s, and I'm the one 50 year old guy (but I'm the shortest!). After that day I realized I had had enough. I made my bit of history and can now say I've done it. Time to move on ;)

It sounds to me like safety was the last thing on their minds for you guys. Imagine if the float driver had to do a panic stop or something like that. Flying off of a float is no fun - we train for stuff like that too :(
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  #51  
Old 07-11-2017, 05:49 AM
cutaway79 cutaway79 is offline
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Originally Posted by Matt Bo Eder View Post
Yeah - last time I did it it was 105-degrees. So being in the costume for close to 45-minutes (24 minutes doing the show in front of guests) could kill me. The other people who do it are females in their 20s, and I'm the one 50 year old guy (but I'm the shortest!). After that day I realized I had had enough. I made my bit of history and can now say I've done it. Time to move on ;)

It sounds to me like safety was the last thing on their minds for you guys. Imagine if the float driver had to do a panic stop or something like that. Flying off of a float is no fun - we train for stuff like that too :(
That sounds pretty damn miserable. Especially whilst wearing a two-foot diameter globe on your head, hahaha. I heard that those heads have fans or something in them. Is that true? I mean, it still sounds terrible, but that would make it a LITTLE better.

Oh, there were a couple short stops where people on our float were stumbling. And then when the driver would start back up, it was equally jarring. Not the most well thought out situation. It was kind of a last minute thing to add the band, so safety measures were pretty much nil. The float was already built and decorated, and they were like "hey, you guys should play on our float, and we'll make it all 80s-themed", hence Ferris Bueller, Cameron, and Sloan on the front. They did the whole Danka Schoen/Twist and Shout float scene from the movie. It was a fun idea. Just not too safely executed, haha.
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  #52  
Old 07-11-2017, 06:35 AM
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Seafroggys Seafroggys is offline
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

Haven't followed the thread, but honestly, I'd rather get a high end set from a major manufacturer. You know their quality, you know they'll be around for a long time in case of any issues, and you know that you're not being ripped off. Some of these custom small companies charge absurd amounts of money so you can do some crazy finishes and sizes. Really? There's no need for that. The majors all did the research, they know which sizes work best, better than we do. And if you can't find something that looks cool among the majors, well, you just have very narrow taste. I guarantee you I can find 20 finishes from top end major drum builders that I would die to have.
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  #53  
Old 07-11-2017, 07:23 AM
sonormapex sonormapex is offline
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Seafroggys....IMO, you nailed it. There are a couple of weird, strange, physco path builders out there, most of you know, so imagine buying off them instead of a real company dealing with "issues" that affect YOUR! job. These basement/ garage dwellers CANT fool all the people all the time"...they never have, that's why its so quiet around here!...FOR ONCE.
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  #54  
Old 07-11-2017, 07:35 AM
Matt Bo Eder
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Originally Posted by cutaway79 View Post
That sounds pretty damn miserable. Especially whilst wearing a two-foot diameter globe on your head, hahaha. I heard that those heads have fans or something in them. Is that true? I mean, it still sounds terrible, but that would make it a LITTLE better.
Contrary to popular belief, there are no fans or AC units built-in. I'm not surprised people think there's all kinds of space in the suits, but there really isn't any. My rig was a belt harness for all the electronic packs, which connected to a chest harness, in-ear monitors, control packs strapped to both triceps so I can turn the system on and off, and it's connected to the helmet part. Then the rest of the costume goes on, right down to the big shoes. For safety, you're then chained to a post to keep you from falling. All of this on a platform nine feet up. There is a button to push in case of an emergency, but even if you do that, you're not getting down by yourself, someone has to come up and help you down.

It was fun while it lasted. I'm happy to have been asked to do it.

In your case, I'd be seeing $$$$-signs if someone got hurt while that float did something no one was expecting. Good thing you guys made it out OK ;)
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  #55  
Old 07-11-2017, 07:50 AM
cutaway79 cutaway79 is offline
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

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Originally Posted by Matt Bo Eder View Post
Contrary to popular belief, there are no fans or AC units built-in. I'm not surprised people think there's all kinds of space in the suits, but there really isn't any. My rig was a belt harness for all the electronic packs, which connected to a chest harness, in-ear monitors, control packs strapped to both triceps so I can turn the system on and off, and it's connected to the helmet part. Then the rest of the costume goes on, right down to the big shoes. For safety, you're then chained to a post to keep you from falling. All of this on a platform nine feet up. There is a button to push in case of an emergency, but even if you do that, you're not getting down by yourself, someone has to come up and help you down.

It was fun while it lasted. I'm happy to have been asked to do it.

In your case, I'd be seeing $$$$-signs if someone got hurt while that float did something no one was expecting. Good thing you guys made it out OK ;)
That sounds like a claustrophobic nightmare! I'm assuming you weren't required to do a whole lot of fancy footwork in those shoes. No "Hot For Teacher" for the ol' Mickster.

Oh yeah, sorry I derailed the thread everybody...

I have nothing more to add to the original topic than what I already posted waaaaayyyy back in the thread. Carry on.
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  #56  
Old 07-11-2017, 01:40 PM
mpthomson mpthomson is offline
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

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Originally Posted by JohnoWorld View Post
Because you can use numbers to prove whatever you want and your numbers are american so they mean sh1t to me

I am speaking from experience of a drummer based in the UK for the last 25 years. The increase of price, not in line with inflation or wages has made the same drums literally more expensive.

I gave the examples of my own experience and you chose not to read them or relate them to what I wrote, so in all honesty, why should I spend even 5 seconds reviewing yours?

It's just an opinion dude, you clearly spent a lot of time researching your reply, what a shame it fell on such deaf ears

The UK is exactly the same in terms of pricing, drums have increased in price much more slowly than the rate of inflation and are much more affordable (the important bit, not just the number). Just one example, a Premier XPK kit in 1988 was 599 from a shop including hardware, no cymbals. With UK inflation since then that's now 1123 plus coppers.

Mapex Mars of broadly similar quality with hardware is currently 699 street price, so 62% of what a similar kit cost 29yrs ago, and the Mapex is arguably better made, though not by much.
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  #57  
Old 07-11-2017, 03:02 PM
Groov-E Groov-E is offline
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Originally Posted by keep it simple View Post
I'm not quite sure how to take this?
I do not understand the comment either.

Is it plausible that certain people would rather build what they conceive as the best drums they can fathom on a smaller scale on their own terms than go churn out as many generic kits as possible in a given number of hours in one of the major's factories ?

Independant builders are doing the most in terms of innovation, because they can work without blinders.

I can always replace my Yamaha kits, but a Dunnett of Jndc of Guru snare are all one of a kind and irreplaceable. Tehere is great value is this.
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  #58  
Old 07-11-2017, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt Bo Eder View Post
There's a practical argument to this as well in favor of the big names. [cut the rest of the quote for the sake of length]
I think you make a VERY valid point. When I answered the question, I answered it from the point of view that a lot of us are in, which is many of us aren't professional musicians, and we primarily have day jobs and play out on the weekends. In that respect, I'm sticking with my answer of getting a local builder.

On the flip side, I think if I were a heavy-hitting touring musician, then I might pick one of the big boys (as you suggested). I really like what you said in regards to companies having connections (aka drop-off points) around the country to provide whatever is needed for a touring musician. In that case, if I had my choice, man, I don't know who I would pick. I would have to play a whole lot more drum names than I have at this point in my life. If I had to pick right now? It would probably be DW or Ludwig simply on the basis that these two companies have great road-worthy hardware IMO.

One thing I'm a little curious about...say a drummer endorses XYZ drums. If this person's band is showing up to play just one or two songs at a festival and there is an ABC-brand-name backline kit provided, are there "rules" in the endorsement agreement that the drummer HAS to set up his/her XYZ drums just to play one or two songs, or is the backline kit ok because it's such a short set?
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  #59  
Old 07-11-2017, 04:07 PM
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

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One thing I'm a little curious about...say a drummer endorses XYZ drums. If this person's band is showing up to play just one or two songs at a festival and there is an ABC-brand-name backline kit provided, are there "rules" in the endorsement agreement that the drummer HAS to set up his/her XYZ drums just to play one or two songs, or is the backline kit ok because it's such a short set?
The way I've seen it done on tv is that the logo on the bass drum is covered with black gaffers tape. They don't bother with the badges on the individual drums. most of the time they don't do close-ups of the drums.
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  #60  
Old 07-11-2017, 04:49 PM
sonormapex sonormapex is offline
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

I know some players that bring a couple of logo reso heads and do a quick change before a show. Better to at least see the logo, which the company is paying for, than to see a bass drum with a strip of duct tape covering up a name
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  #61  
Old 07-11-2017, 05:01 PM
Matt Bo Eder
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I think you make a VERY valid point. When I answered the question, I answered it from the point of view that a lot of us are in, which is many of us aren't professional musicians, and we primarily have day jobs and play out on the weekends. In that respect, I'm sticking with my answer of getting a local builder.

On the flip side, I think if I were a heavy-hitting touring musician, then I might pick one of the big boys (as you suggested). I really like what you said in regards to companies having connections (aka drop-off points) around the country to provide whatever is needed for a touring musician. In that case, if I had my choice, man, I don't know who I would pick. I would have to play a whole lot more drum names than I have at this point in my life. If I had to pick right now? It would probably be DW or Ludwig simply on the basis that these two companies have great road-worthy hardware IMO.

One thing I'm a little curious about...say a drummer endorses XYZ drums. If this person's band is showing up to play just one or two songs at a festival and there is an ABC-brand-name backline kit provided, are there "rules" in the endorsement agreement that the drummer HAS to set up his/her XYZ drums just to play one or two songs, or is the backline kit ok because it's such a short set?
Usually, from what I've seen, artists endorsing a certain brand are on a two-way street. They love the product, and the company that makes the product loves them too. Steve Smith, talking about his relationship with Sonor, started out like many people as an endorsing artist at the bottom of their list, and he literally bought his gear from them. Over the years as he became more recognizable, did he move up the chain to eventually an A-list artist where things are provided for him. But lets remember what endorsement deals are: the companies are willing to help you, because you in turn help them sell products.

I'm sure Bermuda here has much better things to say about this process (being an endorsed artist himself), but that's what it boils down to: if you can help sell drums for X company, then X company will help you. Companies yearly probably receive hundreds of press packets from would-be endorsers so they don't have to look far for people to endorse their products. But if you are out there plugging away and playing all the time, eventually someone will notice, hopefully.
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  #62  
Old 07-11-2017, 05:05 PM
mesazoo mesazoo is offline
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The major companies main benefit is customer support. I think this belief that they have a better understanding of the manufacture of the instrument is overplayed. They tend to be collection of employees doing a single step in the process. Design and innovation is often in the form of adapting what the boutique guys are doing. Marketing drives production rather than craft. It is similar to the brewing industry. Smaller ones have a few people invested in the whole process large ones have a series of role players.
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  #63  
Old 07-11-2017, 05:24 PM
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

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Originally Posted by PorkPieGuy View Post
I think you make a VERY valid point. When I answered the question, I answered it from the point of view that a lot of us are in, which is many of us aren't professional musicians, and we primarily have day jobs and play out on the weekends. In that respect, I'm sticking with my answer of getting a local builder.

On the flip side, I think if I were a heavy-hitting touring musician, then I might pick one of the big boys (as you suggested). I really like what you said in regards to companies having connections (aka drop-off points) around the country to provide whatever is needed for a touring musician. In that case, if I had my choice, man, I don't know who I would pick. I would have to play a whole lot more drum names than I have at this point in my life. If I had to pick right now? It would probably be DW or Ludwig simply on the basis that these two companies have great road-worthy hardware IMO.

One thing I'm a little curious about...say a drummer endorses XYZ drums. If this person's band is showing up to play just one or two songs at a festival and there is an ABC-brand-name backline kit provided, are there "rules" in the endorsement agreement that the drummer HAS to set up his/her XYZ drums just to play one or two songs, or is the backline kit ok because it's such a short set?

Regarding a backline kit that's not the same manufacturer as the drummer's endorsement: a plain black or white front bass drum head and gaffers tape over the logo badges on the toms and the front head too if needed. I've seen it several times. I've also seen the logos blurred out in videos and photos. Taylor Hawkins at the time a Gretsch endorser, playing a DW kit in a video comes to mind:


Back to the custom or big name discussion at hand:

I see a lot of what's going on in the drum building industry to be quite similar to what happened ~20 years ago in the "Harley-Davidson segment" of motorcycles. A lot of builders (not manufacturers) sprouted up assembling (or building according to them) bikes made from ordered parts from companies such as Custom Chrome of V-Twin Mfg. You can/could literally build a Harley clone from the catalogs and paint it any way you liked. You could customize it any way you like. You could add chrome doo-dads here, there, everywhere. You could keep it minimalist, you could get big tires, skinny tires, buckhorn handlebars, drag bars, etc. In other words you (or your builder) could give you exactly what you wanted. The engines in nearly 100% of these bikes were clones of the Harley-Davidson Evo Motor from manufacturers such as S&S. Think of the American Chopper types.

From those assembler/builders rose a small group who started building their own motorcycle frames instead of using one from a catalog. A small group of these even began experimenting with engine manufacturing.

Since all of these bikes were made and based on a design (45 v-twin, overhead valve, single cam pushrod engine), just about anywhere a rider went, they could get service ("backline") support at an H-D dealership (if the dealer was willing to work on non-HD).

The challenge for most of these builders is that they didn't have the decades of experience in research & design that H-D, Yamaha, Honda, etc. have for developing new products, durability, etc. Then they were hit by a back-to-back recession decade of 2000-2010, combined with an over saturation of motorcycles (side note: starting in the late 80's nearly every H-D dealer had a waiting list to buy a new bike unless you were willing to pay several thousand dollars over MSRP. Now, there are dealers who have brand new bikes on the showroom floor that are 2 model years old, prices are well below MSRP and they still aren't selling -also this ties into the thread about the Death of the Electric Guitar, younger generations aren't getting into motorcycling at the same rate as previous generations).

As I said, drums and motorcycle industries are similar but they aren't the exact same. The financial entry point to begin manufacturing shells is much, much lower than it is to start manufacturing motorcycles and/or their parts. A few drum companies have figured out how to do this successfully. I believe those companies will be similar to the boutique motorcycle builders who have brought something of high-quality and unique design to the industry and thus creating desirability (and a market) for those enthusiasts who really know what they're buying.
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  #64  
Old 07-16-2017, 02:39 PM
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

My own toughts here...
(I didn't read ALL the comments, I passed by and readed a couple, just overall reading)

But.. I will say my story, and also argue a bit towards some comments I saw around.

I have personally gone away from the "big brands" because when I was searching for the perfect kit, I was stuck in the music stores always complaining the quality is not worth the money.
I have several times seen drums being 2000 Euro + and pretty bad finished (as in product control and details). Same goes with guitars, in some cases, some cheap basses are even better finished than the expensive well known brands.

As far for the experience of these "big" companies compared to custom ones, don't think most of their employees have 30+ years or even 15+ experience. People come and go. The ones who stay over those years, are mostly the senior "custom shop" departments builders and managers. That's how it works for most of the industries nowadays, especially taking in count newer trends lke age, where it get's more expensive every year to mantain an employee.
(talking this, by my own experience, I co-own two companies, taking in count normal practices in business)

To the other side, I'm sure there are a lot of builders in general that "prentend" to have experience or sell you something that practically comes straight out of a drum/guitar DIY shop. I have seen that many times, and overpriced too, really overpriced. Others that have much better products than the regular "big brands".

So here I bring you the balance and conclusion: It depends what you need and what you want. Smaller builders can many times give you better support and better products against big companies or vice versa. It depends to who you go. Most important: the business model they are using. (there are also very good and very bad business men/women in the music industry)
Lastly, it's more a psychological thing to choose the big brands, because it makes you feel security and pride for what you are wearing.
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Old 07-16-2017, 05:15 PM
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Pocket-full-of-gold Pocket-full-of-gold is offline
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sonormapex View Post
Seafroggys....IMO, you nailed it. There are a couple of weird, strange, physco path builders out there, most of you know, so imagine buying off them instead of a real company dealing with "issues" that affect YOUR! job. These basement/ garage dwellers CANT fool all the people all the time"...they never have, that's why its so quiet around here!...FOR ONCE.
I've just read this post 6 times over and I still can't figure out what your point is. What on earth are you trying to say?
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Old 07-16-2017, 10:03 PM
cutaway79 cutaway79 is offline
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

Quote:
Originally Posted by keep it simple View Post
I'm not quite sure how to take this?
That's what she said
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Old 07-16-2017, 10:31 PM
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

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That's what she said
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Old 07-16-2017, 10:36 PM
sonormapex sonormapex is offline
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

I forget, but I think I agreed with his point, which I forgot...I just cant remember
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Old 07-17-2017, 12:35 AM
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

To be honest, I am more familiar with big name companies but I will always be willing to try out any custom name equipment.
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Old 07-17-2017, 02:51 AM
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

Quote:
Originally Posted by whiteknightx View Post
I wonder if you took a 6 ply maple shell from Keller, from Gretsch, from Yamaha, from Sonor, heck any ply manufacturer you want.
Gretsch doesn't make their own shells. They're made by Keller to Gretsch's specifications.
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Old 07-17-2017, 03:26 AM
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

I generally roll with more mass produced gear in that you're more likely to see different kits on sale. I like the fact that different companies are offering not just different types of hybrid shells but also different hoop types.

I don't think you can minimize the value of getting good hoops on a kit. Of my three kits, none of them have triple flange hoops. Half of my 6 snares didn't come with them either. Of the ones that did, the top hoop gets replaced by an Ahead S-hoop pronto. Play a Stage Custom or Catalina Maple with flimsy triple flange and then play a Tama Starclassic with zinc die cast, or a Gretsch kit with 302 hoops and tell me how they feel.

The closest I've come to any type of boutique drum is an '04 DW Collectors series Solid maple steambent snare that may or may not be a Craviotto shell. It's not signed but he was still making shells for them at the time this drum was manufactured. I'd love to get a Guru or Oriollo kit but they're cost prohibitive to me. To anyone who can afford them though, I bet they're nice as heck !!

Lastly, You younger guys should be thrilled with the gear available to you today. 40 years ago there were about 3-4 drum companies that made decent drums and ALL the hardware sucked.
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Old 07-17-2017, 02:03 PM
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

My custom orders from Paiste have gone off without a hitch and I have received exactly what I was expecting, but when it comes to drums, I'm sticking with the big names from here on in. I've done quite a few (sometimes very expensive) custom drum orders in an attempt to get exactly what I want, and every time the drums have come up short in one way or another when it comes to quality and fit and finish. I'm not that unrealistic or demanding either (ie: a customer who is impossible to please), but it has happened too many times for it to be a case of coincidence or repeated bad luck.
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Old 07-17-2017, 02:51 PM
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

Quote:
Originally Posted by drumming sort of person View Post
Gretsch doesn't make their own shells. They're made by Keller to Gretsch's specifications.


Wow, I just researched this.

Mind blown!!!

To clarify, here's the best quote I've found on it:

Yes, Keller makes their own maple shells. Yes, Keller makes Gretsch's maple formula shells. They are not the same shell. Gretsch doesn't use Keller's shells, Keller just happens to make Gretsch formula shells for Gretsch and Gretsch only.

Here's the thread:

http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=50047
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Old 07-17-2017, 08:57 PM
Groov-E Groov-E is offline
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Default Re: Custom or Big name?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghostnote View Post
My custom orders from Paiste have gone off without a hitch and I have received exactly what I was expecting, but when it comes to drums, I'm sticking with the big names from here on in. I've done quite a few (sometimes very expensive) custom drum orders in an attempt to get exactly what I want, and every time the drums have come up short in one way or another when it comes to quality and fit and finish. I'm not that unrealistic or demanding either (ie: a customer who is impossible to please), but it has happened too many times for it to be a case of coincidence or repeated bad luck.
No way Ghost, just have Ronn build you a complete kit !

;-)
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