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  #1  
Old 05-30-2017, 01:40 PM
Steeeeve Steeeeve is offline
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Default Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

Hey guys,


Iīm going to buy new cymbals soon and I love the sound of Ziljdianīs K custom dark series. However, I play rock music and Iīve heard that more suitable for this genre is Zildjianīs A series.

I wanna buy a whole pack.Kīs custom dark pack specifications: 20 ride, 18 and 16 crash, 14 hihat

Zildjian Rock pack series: All Aīs 20 ride, 19 and 17 crash, 14 hihat

So which one would you suggest?

Thanks!
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  #2  
Old 05-30-2017, 02:16 PM
KamaK KamaK is offline
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

Ultimately it's all about pitch and where everything (as a band) sits in the sonic space. Low pitch K's will sound great with sparse and acoustic arrangements, but if you're competing in the same frequency range as two screaming guitars, you're just going to be shaking air without being heard. A great sound-guy will be smart enough to notch out some space for you, but it really takes a good ear and the proper gear.

High-pitch cymbals cut through by being at the top of the spectrum. This is great for getting heard over top of dense sonic maelstroms. Not so good if you want a lot of complexity for sparse arrangements.

Many drummers come to own a bright set (~A's) and a dark set (~K's) of cymbals and interchange them as the situation dictates.
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  #3  
Old 05-30-2017, 02:54 PM
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larryace larryace is offline
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

Go with your heart not your head with musical instrument purchases. If they don't work out, you will have learned a very important sonic lesson that only applies to YOU. It's up to you to find the sound that trips your trap. It doesn't matter what anyone else thinks. It only matters what you think. And the only way to figure that out is by trial and error.

I buy cymbals brand new so I can utilize the return policy. Buy the K's, play them for a week. If they don't work out for you or your band(s), return them and try the A's. Rinse and repeat until you have a set that you can't bring yourself to return. Financially, that's the most painless way I've found to choose cymbals, utilizing the return policy.

Heck, I'd buy 2 or 3 K packs and cherry pick the best ones, and return the others. I have zero problems with that, because the next person can do the same thing.
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Old 05-30-2017, 04:11 PM
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

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Originally Posted by larryace View Post
Go with your heart not your head with musical instrument purchases. If they don't work out, you will have learned a very important sonic lesson that only applies to YOU. It's up to you to find the sound that trips your trap. It doesn't matter what anyone else thinks. It only matters what you think. And the only way to figure that out is by trial and error.

I buy cymbals brand new so I can utilize the return policy. Buy the K's, play them for a week. If they don't work out for you or your band(s), return them and try the A's. Rinse and repeat until you have a set that you can't bring yourself to return. Financially, that's the most painless way I've found to choose cymbals, utilizing the return policy.

Heck, I'd buy 2 or 3 K packs and cherry pick the best ones, and return the others. I have zero problems with that, because the next person can do the same thing.
Larry, where do you buy cymbals with a return policy? Most places I see have a "cymbals not returnable" clause. Also-how do you get the stick marks off?

Seriously like the idea of what you are saying.... Great way to match a set of "matched" cymbals...
THANKS!
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  #5  
Old 05-30-2017, 04:21 PM
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larryace larryace is offline
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

Guitar Center, Sam Ash are two for sure. You're in SJ, you will have no problem going to a GC. Stick marks? Never cleaned them off. TBH, I can tell within a minute or 2 if I think a cymbal is a keeper. So if I determine that it's not a keeper, I set it aside to return. I never bought a box set. In that case, I probably would wipe off stick marks just so I don't have any hassles returning. Most of my cymbals came off the rack, and had stick marks already. I would just wipe them off with a damp cloth, no products.

I have purchased new cymbals online, only because Soultones are not available near me to try, bought on faith because I knew what series I like, and have been lucky.
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  #6  
Old 05-30-2017, 04:28 PM
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Mongrel Mongrel is offline
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

Ok, cool, and thank you.

I always figured I was stuck with what I bought, so I never even asked at GC or Sam Ash. Mostly I buy from Sweetwater.

Should be able to tell within a few hits whether a cymbal works I guess. And, I wasn't thinking about the off the floor cymbals already having stick marks. I was thinking in terms of buying a full pack new in the box.
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  #7  
Old 05-30-2017, 10:24 PM
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MikeM MikeM is offline
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

I'd be super extra careful in deciding between these two because they really couldn't be more different.

The biggest difference apart from how dark/bright they are is how they play and how they feel under the stick. This is a function of how thick and heavy they are.

If you're looking at pretty much any "Rock" line, know that they're going to be as heavy (for their size) as you'll find anywhere. That thickness, along with their high profile, raises their pitch high enough to clearly rise above walls of amps. But if you're not used to them, they will feel like manhole covers; your sticks will seem to bounce right off of them in a jarring way, and they won't be in any hurry to get out of the way. This is great in a loud rock band where you're swinging for the fences, but will be a major disappointment/limitation if you're looking for any kind of nuance.

K Customs, on the other hand, are pretty much on the opposite end of the spectrum since they typically break toward the thin end of the spectrum and lower profiles low the pitch. Because they're so much thinner, your stick will feel like it's getting absorbed right into the cymbal and it's not at all jarring to your hand. Sound-wise, they're also deeper and richer, and you get it all without having to bury the stick in it. If you do play in a loud rock band, you have to be careful not to overplay them because they do stop giving back after a certain point and they will crack (as even rock weight cymbals will do).

All branding and marketing aside, what you're essentially looking between these two are bright/heavy vs. dark/thin. But it isn't just that - you're looking at those in their extremes.

There are a lot of cymbals that occupy a more middle ground. The regular A Series are a good place to start, but again, pay close attention to the weights. A or K Series Zildjians make it simple because a medium-thin crash (for example) is called "Medium Thin Crash" (though K also adds the word "Dark").

You have to pay more attention to A Customs where the regular Crash is a thin; Projection Crash is medium thin; and Medium Crash is, well, medium. You get the idea. Same goes for K Customs. So you really have to educate yourself. Peruse the Zildjian website to see how they class the relative weights of their cymbals, and notice that Rock goes way beyond thin, past even just a medium, and lands way out there at Heavy, or even extra-heavy. They're not kidding, either; those are some heavy cymbals.

Armed with that information, get yourself to a music store and start checking them out and really pay attention to how they play. I'd also say that, independent of brand, the most versatility is with medium-thin weight crashes, medium rides, and medium over heavy hi hats.
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  #8  
Old 06-01-2017, 01:02 AM
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ibernalq ibernalq is offline
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

In my opinion, the best for you (and for your rock needs) is the rock pack, As are so versatile cymbals, but personally I like the Ks sound much more... finally, the only cons is that the K dark ride may be not so suitable for rock.. good luck!!!
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  #9  
Old 06-03-2017, 04:24 PM
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MJD MJD is offline
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

My main concern would be the ride. The Rock pack comes with a Ping ride which tends to be a bit heavier and harder to control at lower volumes. The fact that it comes with medium thin crashes instead of Rock crashes is a plus. rock weight cymbals tend to sound pretty awful unless you have hit them hard enough. Of the 2 I would gravitate more towards the K's. You may want to consider the A391 pack. Thats Zildjian A series 21 sweet ride 16 and 18 medium thin crashes and a pair of 14 New Beats. This would be a pretty good middle ground between the 2 sets you are considering. Also a tried and true set up that should fit almost any music you end up playing.
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  #10  
Old 06-03-2017, 04:53 PM
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wildbill wildbill is offline
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

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Originally Posted by MJD View Post
....You may want to consider the A391 pack. Thats Zildjian A series 21 sweet ride 16 and 18 medium thin crashes and a pair of 14 New Beats. This would be a pretty good middle ground between the 2 sets you are considering. Also a tried and true set up that should fit almost any music you end up playing.

Exactly what I was going to say.
The A pack is right about in the middle of the two he's considering.
It would be what I'd grab if I was doing rock gigs.
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  #11  
Old 06-04-2017, 12:23 PM
Brian Brian is offline
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

I would add that the K custom dark's do have some cut. I've got the 14" custom dark hats and although they are not ideal for rock, they aren't the worst choice either. But for rock, I would prefer the higher pitch AND cut in most cases.

Ultimately though, the A391 pack is probably the best option. Only because I cannot stand the Zildjian ping ride, it's extremely one-dimensional, unless you really want a pingy ride that doesn't do much else. The sweet ride is on the other end of the spectrum, washy and crashes easy, but maybe not quite enough ping/cut/projection
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  #12  
Old 06-04-2017, 04:09 PM
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

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Originally Posted by Brian View Post
I would add that the K custom dark's do have some cut. I've got the 14" custom dark hats and although they are not ideal for rock, they aren't the worst choice either. But for rock, I would prefer the higher pitch AND cut in most cases.

Ultimately though, the A391 pack is probably the best option. Only because I cannot stand the Zildjian ping ride, it's extremely one-dimensional, unless you really want a pingy ride that doesn't do much else. The sweet ride is on the other end of the spectrum, washy and crashes easy, but maybe not quite enough ping/cut/projection
I played some K Customs for the record we just finished. They are excellent cymbals although i feel they are more suited to Jazz/Fusion type stuff(at least the ones i was playing,Zildjians can be a little inconsistent) We also used some K Custom Hybrids which may be better suited to rock than the regular K Customs.OP out of curiosity why aren't you considering regular K's? In my experience the regular A and K series cymbals are the most versatile of the Zildjian lines while once you go into the other variations like their Custom lines they tend to be more suited to specific situations. Some exceptions of course.
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  #13  
Old 06-04-2017, 06:44 PM
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w3r1_drums w3r1_drums is offline
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

^^I second the above - I use Ks for rock/metal and they're great. They're pretty versatile. The 14" hats are PERFECT for rock and metal. They're better than As IMO.
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  #14  
Old 06-11-2017, 04:01 PM
Steeeeve Steeeeve is offline
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

Hey Guys,

thank you all for good advices. However I didnīt bought the Kīs neither the Rock pack but I decided to go for the A Custom set. And I must say that the cymbals are absolutely amazing. I did few band rehearsals and one gig with them and so far so goood. So thank you!
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  #15  
Old 06-11-2017, 10:13 PM
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w3r1_drums w3r1_drums is offline
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeeeve View Post
Hey Guys,

thank you all for good advices. However I didnīt bought the Kīs neither the Rock pack but I decided to go for the A Custom set. And I must say that the cymbals are absolutely amazing. I did few band rehearsals and one gig with them and so far so goood. So thank you!
Awesome! I've always thought A customs sounded good on recordings, didn't like them so much in person. It's all personal preference though.
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Old 06-12-2017, 04:12 PM
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeeeve View Post
Hey Guys,

thank you all for good advices. However I didnīt bought the Kīs neither the Rock pack but I decided to go for the A Custom set. And I must say that the cymbals are absolutely amazing. I did few band rehearsals and one gig with them and so far so goood. So thank you!
Yes, A customs are very good for rock applications. IDK why but they are like most Paiste's that i've played. Beautiful and shimmery but lacking in a particular type of complexity that i prefer. They should last you a good long while and serve you well.
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  #17  
Old 06-14-2017, 03:51 PM
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PorkPieGuy PorkPieGuy is offline
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Default Re: Zildjian K Custom Dark (box set) vs. Zildjian Rock Pack

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeeeve View Post
Hey Guys,

thank you all for good advices. However I didnīt bought the Kīs neither the Rock pack but I decided to go for the A Custom set. And I must say that the cymbals are absolutely amazing. I did few band rehearsals and one gig with them and so far so goood. So thank you!
Although I'm not a huge fan of the A Custom hi-hats, I was getting ready to suggest the A Custom set. I don't think you can go wrong with A Customs. I have fast crashes that I play at church in addition to a regluar A Custom ride.

They are fantastic.
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