DRUMMERWORLD OFFICIAL DISCUSSION FORUM   

Go Back   DRUMMERWORLD OFFICIAL DISCUSSION FORUM > Drummers

Drummers Topic Name = Drummer's Name. Use this forum to discuss the drummers profiled on DrummerWorld

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #41  
Old 09-23-2013, 04:18 AM
Ian Ballard's Avatar
Ian Ballard Ian Ballard is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Lawrence, Kansas
Posts: 734
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Pretzel Logic.

Nuff said.
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 02-08-2014, 11:00 AM
Brian Brian is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: New England
Posts: 630
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Quote:
Originally Posted by opentune View Post
Brian thanks for those. The one shown has been inverted - mirror imaged. Jim Gordon is a righty (not lefty)

(I don't like when photos do that)
Sometimes photography and video authors can play tricks. On the other hand, from this same show he was shown on video playing not only a left-handed kit but matched traditional grip, which is pretty cool. I think it's the Mad Dogs and Englishmen 1971 one.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 06-29-2014, 10:33 AM
Brian Brian is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: New England
Posts: 630
Default Re: Jim Gordon

/watch?v=ZM9Dc1hrT5M
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 06-29-2014, 05:50 PM
opentune's Avatar
opentune opentune is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 2,763
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Brian - link didn't work.
New footage?
__________________
Louis
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 06-29-2014, 05:55 PM
larryace's Avatar
larryace larryace is offline
"Uncle Larry"
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: In beautiful Bucks County, PA
Posts: 12,826
Default Re: Jim Gordon

I love this thread. Jim is my hero, the way he plays those drums. Brian, you contributed some stellar stuff, thanks. The "Why Does Love Have To Be So Bad" clip is such high level playing on Jim's (and everyone else's) part. If I were to have to emulate a style of playing, I'd pick Jim's. Eric Clapton himself has stated point blank that Jim is his all time favorite drummer to back him up.
__________________
Now go fetch your shine box like a good little Wumpus.
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 06-29-2014, 08:39 PM
Brian Brian is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: New England
Posts: 630
Default Re: Jim Gordon

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZM9Dc1hrT5M

Once in a while I post nuggets. To bump maybe the best drummer up until the early 70s, where he went downhill.

^ does that link work?

Recently, I read a thread on session drummers and Jim's name wasn't mentioned nearly enough... so

BUMP :)
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 06-29-2014, 08:56 PM
Brian Brian is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: New England
Posts: 630
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Quote:
Originally Posted by larryace View Post
I love this thread. Jim is my hero, the way he plays those drums. Brian, you contributed some stellar stuff, thanks. The "Why Does Love Have To Be So Bad" clip is such high level playing on Jim's (and everyone else's) part. If I were to have to emulate a style of playing, I'd pick Jim's. Eric Clapton himself has stated point blank that Jim is his all time favorite drummer to back him up.
Hey Larry,
if you want check this out
"A little less conversation" by Elvis 1968
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWVMXLSS1cA
That's the beat IMO Jim Gordon stole from Hal Blaine, but Jim made it funkier with the swung hi-hat 16th notes (sometimes). Like Clyde Stubblefield
example here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=625YUZpHiQQ
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 06-29-2014, 09:35 PM
larryace's Avatar
larryace larryace is offline
"Uncle Larry"
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: In beautiful Bucks County, PA
Posts: 12,826
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian View Post
Hey Larry,
if you want check this out
"A little less conversation" by Elvis 1968
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWVMXLSS1cA
That's the beat IMO Jim Gordon stole from Hal Blaine, but Jim made it funkier with the swung hi-hat 16th notes (sometimes). Like Clyde Stubblefield
example here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=625YUZpHiQQ
More interesting stuff. I just can't get footage of Jim, I love watching him play. He was a big guy, with spot on musical sensibilities, who both simultaneously commanded and finessed the drumset. But I love looking into his eyes to try and make sense of what is going on in there.
I just can't get enough footage of him. His feel...I so envy his feel.
__________________
Now go fetch your shine box like a good little Wumpus.
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 06-29-2014, 10:26 PM
Brian Brian is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: New England
Posts: 630
Default Re: Jim Gordon

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avs6BVIdIuw
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 06-30-2014, 01:17 AM
8Mile's Avatar
8Mile 8Mile is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 2,631
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Glad to see this thread take on such life.

Check this out: http://youtu.be/MWfDLN0aMEw

Apologies if already posted, I didn't see it. I'm with (the other) Larry on this: Jim has the feel I think I most envy/covet. Just amazing authority, conviction and groove. And distinctive, expressive drum parts, too. It's so, so, so hard to do that.
Reply With Quote
  #51  
Old 06-30-2014, 02:23 AM
opentune's Avatar
opentune opentune is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 2,763
Default Re: Jim Gordon

This is really nice, to hear his drumming, more clearly coming out of all the layers laid down on top of that track. All Things Must Pass is a great record but quite a few songs are way overtreated to Phil Spectors' 'wall of sound'.
__________________
Louis
Reply With Quote
  #52  
Old 06-30-2014, 02:53 AM
GeoB's Avatar
GeoB GeoB is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Tidewater Virginia
Posts: 285
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Quote:
Originally Posted by opentune View Post
This is really nice, to hear his drumming, more clearly coming out of all the layers laid down on top of that track. All Things Must Pass is a great record but quite a few songs are way overtreated to Phil Spectors' 'wall of sound'.
The bass drum has a weird thud. I wonder what the recording technique and EQ for that particular drum was?

Here's some more Jim on an old favorite of mine, Rikki Don't Lose That Number

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfZWp-hGCdA

And how about.... Wichita Lineman by Glen Campbell with Gordon on drums.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JoJG9EXX7gU

and... Jim Gordon Drums with Jack Bruce (bass? Cello?) with Frank Zappa playing Apostrophe(')

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXP_pr7np-o
__________________
dic quid gingiberi

Last edited by GeoB; 06-30-2014 at 03:09 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #53  
Old 06-30-2014, 03:01 AM
GeoB's Avatar
GeoB GeoB is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Tidewater Virginia
Posts: 285
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian View Post
Sometimes photography and video authors can play tricks. On the other hand, from this same show he was shown on video playing not only a left-handed kit but matched traditional grip, which is pretty cool. I think it's the Mad Dogs and Englishmen 1971 one.
It is also a way of getting around copywrite law on pictures... or in the case of YouTube of slightly speeding up or slowing down a track to avoid copy write infringement.
__________________
dic quid gingiberi
Reply With Quote
  #54  
Old 06-30-2014, 05:33 PM
Brian Brian is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: New England
Posts: 630
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Jim Gordon's styles and that lazy west coast thing he had going on, he played with authority too. There was no wasted movements in Jim Gordon's playing, every note meant something..very much like future geniuses like Vinny Colaiuta.

Here's a pretty interesting post I read, link here
http://fresnoalliance.com/wordpress/?p=4680

Andy Newmark
November 9, 2013 at 6:20 am ∑ Reply

Quote:

I sat 5 feet away from Jim Gordon, in the drum booth at Trident Studios in London, as he recorded Carly Simonís Youíre So Vain in 1972. I was Carlyís road drummer and played on a few tracks on her No Secrets album, however I wasnít cutting it when we recorded Youíre So Vain. So Richard Perry, the producer of that album brought in the heavyweights. Jim Gordon, Klaus Voorman, and Nicky Hopkins to record Youíre So Vain. Carlyís road band, which included me, was sidelined for half the tracks on that album, except for Jimmy Ryan who played on everything and played that great guitar solo on ďYouíre So VainĒ. Anyhow, I was totally cool with Richard Perryís decision to bring Jim Gordon in. I was in London for the duration of that album, as road bands often were back then, on call at any time. I saw this as an opportunity to watch Jim up close. I had been listening to Jim Gordon and Jim Keltner ever since Mad Dogs and Englishmen. I asked Jim if he would mind if I sat in the drum booth and watched him play. He was totally cool with that. So I watched Jim do 40 takes (Richard Perry was famous for doing a lot of takes) of Youíre So Vain. You see, back then the live performance in the studio had to contain all the magic in the basic backing track. There was no fixing it or replacing parts after the track was recorded. You could repair little things but the vibe and groove had to be all there in the performance. Perry pushed players right to their limit. I liked his style. He had a vision and wasnít going to stop till he got it out of the musicians. He made great bloody records that all stand up today under scrutiny. He always used the best players on his records. As a player, working for Richard Perry was a step up the ladder in session world. It meant something. Anyhow, I watched Jim like a hawk for 4 or 5 hours, playing that song over and over again. Itís one thing to hear a player on a recording but to see a player playing live is a whole different ball game. Body language reveals so much about where a drummer is coming from. Seeing Jim play up that close, and fine tuning his drum part, was like getting intra veinous Jim GordonÖhis DNA being injected into mine. And I got it, big time. I saw what he had and what I didnít have. But not for long. I really understood where his notes were coming from and went away from that session knowing what I had to do to improve my act. Jim never played a rim shot on 40 takes of Youíre So Vain. He hit the middle of the snare drum so hard that the head was completely caved in, in the middle. It was a 6 inch crater in a perfect circle. He hit the exact same spot every time he hit the snare drum. That means all his backbeats sounded as identical as humanly possible. Engineers love consistency from players. I was suffering from total rim shot dependency, playing tight, funky and snappy, New York style, like Bernard Purdie. I am a New Yorker. Jim had that West Coast lazy thing going on. His notes seem to have length. They breathed. Legato drumming I call it. There was all this air around each of his notes. And his groove was so relaxed and secure and comfortable. It was like sitting in a giant arm chair that fit perfect. He made all the other players sound amazing right from Take One. And he made the recording sound like a real hit record right from Take One. I was blown away. The tom tom fills were like thunder. I still copy him doing that today and think about him in that room every time I do it. I put my left hand on the high tom and my right hand on the floor tom and play straight 8th notes (both hands in unison) that crescendo into a chorus. Just like Youíre So Vain. His drumming was intelligent and impeccable on that record. There was no click track either and Richard Perry was very demanding when it came to tempo. (By the way, click tracks have ruined pop music today). Donít get me started. Thatís something else I had to improve on. Playing time. Iím still working on that. Jim nailed that track at least 40 times and every take on the drums was brilliant and useable as a final drum track. However Richard Perry wanted to hand pick where Jim played certain fills and all the other cats too. So thatís where a studio musicianís discipline comes into play. You have to play the same track for hours and maintain the feeling and learn every note in your part till itís written in your DNA. Then on top of that, you have to take instructions after each take from the Producer telling you exactly what to amend or delete in your part. Itís a lot of mental work going on. Not all players are cut out for this kind of disciplined playing, and designing a part. Thatís what great records are. Great parts. Jim was like a computer. He did everything Richard Perry asked of him and still kept all the other stuff going in his part, take after take after take. And he hit the drums so damn hard. His snare drum was monstrous and it wasnít even a rim shot. I was stunned at the power in all his notes. He saw that whole drum part in his head as if it was written on paper and handed to him. And take after take, for maybe 4 or 5 hours with breaks, he played it spot on every time. I got itÖbig time. Thank God I was replaced by Jim that day. What I got from that experience took my playing to another level completely. I put funky drumming on the back burner after watching Jim and started trying to make my notes real long, relaxed, with lots of air around them, giving each note itís full sustain value, and even tuning my drums so that the notes would sustain for their full value. And every note was thought out. Thatís what Jim did. He didnít play any throw away notes. Not one!! Not even an unintended grace note on the snare drum. Thatís what making records is all about. You have to own and believe in every note you play. Every 8th note on your high hat has meaning and character and tells a story. You canít just be playing mindless time with a back beat. Drummers who do that sound bored and uninvolved. A drummer has to be involved in every note and put life into each one. This is what Jim did. I know this for sure. Itís a subtle thing but it makes all the difference in a player. Discipline, restraint, and conviction in every note. Thatís when real music starts to happen. Canít we all start a movement to get him out. Sounds like someone should talk to him. Like me. On the other hand, maybe he wants to be exactly where he is. I respect that too. Returning to ďreal lifeĒ after this many years might be too overwhelming. I can relate to that. By the way, my birthday is 14 July, the same day as Jim Gordonís birthday. Can people visit Jim? Or writer e-mail him? Feed back is welcome which is why I am posting my e-mail address under my name.
Reply With Quote
  #55  
Old 06-30-2014, 05:41 PM
8Mile's Avatar
8Mile 8Mile is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 2,631
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Brian, thanks for that. What an inspiring read from Andy Newmark. Wow. I know what it feels like to be in awe of someone else the way Andy was of Jim. And that's Andy Newmark talking! Already a great at that point. Wow again.
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Old 06-30-2014, 05:59 PM
opentune's Avatar
opentune opentune is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 2,763
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Wow what a piece from Andy Newmark. Very inspiring.
It would be awesome if we could all drop Jim Gordon an email.I doubt the system allows that, but maybe an open letter. If not just to acknowledge his presence in prison, and his work we admire. It's a real shame he is still in there.
__________________
Louis
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old 06-30-2014, 07:02 PM
larryace's Avatar
larryace larryace is offline
"Uncle Larry"
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: In beautiful Bucks County, PA
Posts: 12,826
Default Re: Jim Gordon

It's so sad that this man and his talent just waste away in prison. He should be recording at least.
__________________
Now go fetch your shine box like a good little Wumpus.
Reply With Quote
  #58  
Old 06-30-2014, 08:26 PM
opentune's Avatar
opentune opentune is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 2,763
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian View Post
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZM9Dc1hrT5M

Once in a while I post nuggets. To bump maybe the best drummer up until the early 70s, where he went downhill.

^ does that link work?

Recently, I read a thread on session drummers and Jim's name wasn't mentioned nearly enough... so

BUMP :)
Just curious Brian how you search/find this stuff? I mean knowing Jim was drumming for... Johnny Rivers ...at Montreaux 1973. Kinda obscure and hidden no?
__________________
Louis
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Old 07-01-2014, 02:20 AM
larryace's Avatar
larryace larryace is offline
"Uncle Larry"
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: In beautiful Bucks County, PA
Posts: 12,826
Default Re: Jim Gordon

He was on so many diverse stuff. "Classical Gas", I always loved that thing he did when they gave him like 2 beats or whatever to take the lead.

It occurs to me that Eric Clapton would be the best possible advocate for Jim. He is so high profile and when he talks, it's news. Jim loves Eric to this day, or so I've read. Eric owes this to him. Who better than to kinda champion a movement. Jim needs some serious love from someone.

Another thing that occurs to me...the money. Jim Gordon is LOADED, or so I've read. I find it odd that no one like children, relatives, prison officials, mothers of his possible children, and people of that nature aren't posturing themselves to grab his money from him. It's like nobody gives a damn about him. It really upsets me. I betcha Eric Clapton and music could restore this guy to at least a more normal life. It just breaks my heart.
__________________
Now go fetch your shine box like a good little Wumpus.
Reply With Quote
  #60  
Old 07-01-2014, 05:42 AM
Brian Brian is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: New England
Posts: 630
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Quote:
Originally Posted by opentune View Post
Just curious Brian how you search/find this stuff? I mean knowing Jim was drumming for... Johnny Rivers ...at Montreaux 1973. Kinda obscure and hidden no?
Over the years I was familiarizing with what he played on, so occasionally I'll search to see if new videos or bootlegs pop up. I guess it's an obscure one in this case.
Reply With Quote
  #61  
Old 07-01-2014, 06:30 AM
opentune's Avatar
opentune opentune is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 2,763
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ludwig USA View Post
From Wikipedia: On 10 July 1984 Gordon was sentenced to 16 years to life in prison. As of March 2013, James Beck Gordon, prisoner #C89262, age 67, admission date 13 July 1984, is still serving his sentence at the California Medical Facility, a specialist medical and psychiatric prison in Vacaville, California.
.
hmmm... Am thinking to write this prison/facility, and inquire if one can send letters to prisoners. I wouldn't care if they censored or read it, just to 'drop him a line' t say that the music he made was so great and influential to a bunch of people.
Maybe this has been done. Somebody must have been in contact with him all these years.
__________________
Louis
Reply With Quote
  #62  
Old 07-01-2014, 10:29 AM
evogel evogel is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Milford,PA
Posts: 66
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Quote:
Originally Posted by opentune View Post
hmmm... Am thinking to write this prison/facility, and inquire if one can send letters to prisoners. I wouldn't care if they censored or read it, just to 'drop him a line' t say that the music he made was so great and influential to a bunch of people.
Maybe this has been done. Somebody must have been in contact with him all these years.
Please keep us updated if you go ahead with this. I have read that there was some odd clause that keeps him from being able to be paroled. I have no clue how or why that would happen and/or if he is a forensic patient and that may be a different story.
Reply With Quote
  #63  
Old 07-01-2014, 06:12 PM
Brian Brian is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: New England
Posts: 630
Default Re: Jim Gordon

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zxQD3pdI5Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OnGmYLlv9qM

This is probably Jim Gordon's most well-known style and sound, very radio-friendly rock. He sounds great, jmo. Flawless, as though nothing else was going on. As with the other 70's gigs, he doesn't look too healthy, though. I had read that Jackson Browne had a heart, and gave him a gig when he had been down and out for a while and a broken reputation.
Reply With Quote
  #64  
Old 07-01-2014, 06:29 PM
opentune's Avatar
opentune opentune is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 2,763
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Thanks again Brian.

According to this, any of us can send a letter to Jim. It will be opened and read by staff.
His name and number can be found on the 2nd url. I saw no mention of email (which would be way easier) but, being male, didn't read all rules

http://cdcr.ca.gov/Reports_Research/howtocontact.html

http://inmatelocator.cdcr.ca.gov/

I will put it on my 'to do' list.
__________________
Louis
Reply With Quote
  #65  
Old 07-01-2014, 08:51 PM
Brian Brian is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: New England
Posts: 630
Default Re: Jim Gordon

Quote:
Originally Posted by opentune View Post
Thanks again Brian.

According to this, any of us can send a letter to Jim. It will be opened and read by staff.
His name and number can be found on the 2nd url. I saw no mention of email (which would be way easier) but, being male, didn't read all rules

http://cdcr.ca.gov/Reports_Research/howtocontact.html

http://inmatelocator.cdcr.ca.gov/

I will put it on my 'to do' list.
Thanks for posting that information. I wonder how Jim Gordon feels about people contacting him?

I really liked this article, too:
http://www.granatino.com/sdresource/md1.htm
Quote:
1974: Pretzel Logic

This album featured the hit "Rikki Don't Lose That Number" a bluesy bossa nova that borrowed from Horace Silver's "Song For My Father." The writing on this album is more expansive, with nods to country music ("With A Gun") and jazz (a surprising, note-for-note rendition of Ellington's "East St. Louis Toodle-oo"). With Pretzel Logic, the studio became an instrument, the sound was richer; and they used full orchestration with horns and strings.

The drummer for the bulk of the album was studio musician Jim Gordon. Tall and good-looking with curly blond hair, Gordon was technically gifted and possessed a golden sense of feel and rhythm. During the '60s and early '70s, his trademark right-hand-driven 16th-note groove was in constant demand among artists like John Lennon, George Harrison, Traffic, Joe Cocker, Carly Simon, Delaney & Bonnie, and Eric Clapton. He was the drummer on Derek & the Dominos' Layla & Other Love Songs and the early Clapton solo albums. He wrote the beautiful second half of "Layla," all lush piano chords and trembling guitars. Unfortunately, Gordon's remarkable talent was mired by mental disease that tracked him from the age of seven and eventually ended his career. He heavily influenced two other drummers, though: Jeff Porcaro and Jim Keltner.

According to Keltner, "When he was on, he exuded confidence of the highest level-incredible time, great feel, and a good sound. He had everything." "On Pretzel, " says Porcaro, I played on 'Night by Night' and Gordon and I played double drums on 'Parker's Band.' Gordon was my idol. Playing with him was like going to school. Keltner was the bandito in town. Gordon was the heir to Hale Blaine. His playing was the textbook for me. No one ever had finer-sounding cymbals or drums, or played his kit so beautifully and balanced. And nobody had that particular groove. Plus his physical appearance - the dream size for a drummer - he lurched over his set of Camcos."
Reply With Quote
  #66  
Old 07-10-2014, 12:40 PM
Brian Brian is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: New England
Posts: 630
Default Re: Jim Gordon

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMK_u8IKc-I

can't forget Oh! Calcutta! ;)
Reply With Quote
  #67  
Old 07-24-2014, 07:24 PM
Brian Brian is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: New England
Posts: 630
Default Re: Jim Gordon

/watch?v=RxrBnuT84Ws

17 year old Jim Gordon on a west-coast session.

I'm trying to find the album/band he led in 1968. It's not on youtube to my knowledge, but I've seen pictures of the record.
*edit*

/watch?v=l6DeSLpcAYo
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are Off
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off




All times are GMT +2. The time now is 12:21 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Bernhard Castiglioni's DRUMMERWORLD.com