DRUMMERWORLD OFFICIAL DISCUSSION FORUM   

Go Back   DRUMMERWORLD OFFICIAL DISCUSSION FORUM > Drum Gear > Heads and Sticks

Heads and Sticks Discuss Heads and Sticks

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 09-19-2012, 11:59 PM
adamteasdale1407 adamteasdale1407 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 48
Default Coated Resonant Heads

Hey all,

So I'm re-heading my Gretsch Catalina Kit. I've considered using coated kick batter, coated kick reso, coated tom batter, coated tom reso. All Remo. Does anyone use coated tom resonant heads? If so, is there anything important I should know? Do they give off a warmer sound?

Also, has anyone ever used a coated snare side head? I heard Bonham did, not 100% sure though. If anyone has, again is there anything I should know?

Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 09-20-2012, 04:49 AM
Bo Eder's Avatar
Bo Eder Bo Eder is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Southern California
Posts: 11,533
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

I've used all kinds of heads for resos, and yes, coated resos do sound a bit warmer to me. But it's a "whole drum" sound, meaning, you need to be on the other side of the kit, maybe at least 5 feet away in order to hear if the tone is more rounded. It was negligible to me from the playing side. The warmest tone I've ever heard was when someone used remo fiberskyn 3's top and bottom.

To be honest, I'm not sure if remo ever made a coated snare side head. White, yes, but coated? I doubt that. Historically it wouldn't make sense either because back in the day of calf heads, snare side heads were made from the skins of unborn calves (sorry, but it's the truth) because they were alot thinner than an older cow's skin.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 09-20-2012, 04:56 AM
Pocket-full-of-gold's Avatar
Pocket-full-of-gold Pocket-full-of-gold is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Melbourne, Australia.
Posts: 10,007
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

I've got coated Ambs as reso on my Cats at the moment.

Yes......warmer sound. I like Bo's description of "more rounded" that's how my ear has always heard the difference between coated and clear heads.

Quote:
Originally Posted by adamteasdale1407 View Post
Also, has anyone ever used a coated snare side head? I heard Bonham did, not 100% sure though. If anyone has, again is there anything I should know?
Nup. You've heard wrong. No such thing as a coated snare side head. Bonzo used a stock standard snare side Ambassador or occasionally snare side Diplomat.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 09-20-2012, 07:05 AM
audiotech
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

I currently use a coated Ambassador head on the resonant side of my toms on my DW Classic drums. It not only makes them a bit warmer but also a little more focused. The sound between a clear resonant head and a coated can vary quite a bit depending on the shell's make-up using the same tensioning.

Dennis
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 09-20-2012, 01:53 PM
dmacc's Avatar
dmacc dmacc is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,404
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

I use coated G1's as reso's on all of my toms and the stock coated reso on my bass drum with great results. It's all opinion but to me they do provide a warmer, focused, round sound.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 09-20-2012, 05:08 PM
ENRICO ENRICO is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Buenos Aires ,Argentina
Posts: 770
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold View Post
I've got coated Ambs as reso on my Cats at the moment.

Yes......warmer sound. I like Bo's description of "more rounded" that's how my ear has always heard the difference between coated and clear heads.



Nup. You've heard wrong. No such thing as a coated snare side head. Bonzo used a stock standard snare side Ambassador or occasionally snare side Diplomat.
there's no such a thing as a coated snare reso but the's a textured snare reso, the remo black suede snare side: http://remo.com/portal/products/3/8/...snareside.html
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-16-2014, 01:22 AM
cangaroo cangaroo is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 20
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

I've read in a interview with Ross "Drum Doctor" Garfield that he suggests using coated ambassador as reso when using snares 5 inches deep or less.

I think i'll give a try one of these days, cause i'm struggling to make my 14x5 supra to sound with more body ...
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-16-2014, 02:15 AM
Winston_Wolf's Avatar
Winston_Wolf Winston_Wolf is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Fayetteville, NC
Posts: 1,153
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by cangaroo View Post
I've read in a interview with Ross "Drum Doctor" Garfield that he suggests using coated ambassador as reso when using snares 5 inches deep or less.

I think i'll give a try one of these days, cause i'm struggling to make my 14x5 supra to sound with more body ...
I've seen that quote too, and it's just gotta be a typo.

I've used a 5-mil snare head before, and it made the drum sound like a cardboard box. I can only imagine what twice that much head, with coating, would do.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-16-2014, 02:38 AM
Pocket-full-of-gold's Avatar
Pocket-full-of-gold Pocket-full-of-gold is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Melbourne, Australia.
Posts: 10,007
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by cangaroo View Post
I think i'll give a try one of these days, cause i'm struggling to make my 14x5 supra to sound with more body ...
Experiment, by all means. There's only one way you're ever really gonna know. But in all honesty, a coated head that thick on the bottom of a snare drum is not going to give it more body. I reckon you'll note far less body, not to mention a distinct lack of snare sensitivity.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-16-2014, 06:38 AM
porter's Avatar
porter porter is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,822
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

You could try a Remo Renaissance Ambassador snare side. I found that it gave a very comparable effect to a clear/coated tom reso conversion. (Or the Evans Orchestral 300, but that's only 14").

On the topic of tom heads- I found coated resonant heads to work very well with coated batters. Benny Greb has used a Coated Ambassador/Coated Ambassador combo on his dvd, I don't know if he still does, but I found that mine and his gave a very nice, sweet sound. Sweet is probably the best word I can think of do describe it.

They didn't work so well with Pinstripes but I think rock guys looking for a punchy sound could do very well with some clear G14s on batter and coated 10mil heads on resonant side, FWIW.
__________________
Check out my Youtube channel!
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-16-2014, 10:46 AM
cangaroo cangaroo is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 20
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winston_Wolf View Post
I've seen that quote too, and it's just gotta be a typo.

I've used a 5-mil snare head before, and it made the drum sound like a cardboard box. I can only imagine what twice that much head, with coating, would do.
Actually i've found online another interview to the man, here is one excerpt :

[...]

If the snare drum has too much ring:
- Tune the heads lower.
- Use a heavier head like a coated CS with the dot on the bottom or a coated Emperor.
- Use a full or partial muffling ring.
- Have the edges checked and/or recut to a flatter angle.

[...]

unless the guy is not able to tell top from bottom, i think he's sure of this metodology.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold View Post
Experiment, by all means. There's only one way you're ever really gonna know. But in all honesty, a coated head that thick on the bottom of a snare drum is not going to give it more body. I reckon you'll note far less body, not to mention a distinct lack of snare sensitivity.
I tried almost every tuning combination : higher batter with low reso, both tuned equals low and high, lower batter with higher reso, tuned to precise intervals (third, fifth, etc). The tone quality goes from an awful and bodyless "slosh" when tuned low to a an almost decent crack when tuned high, but i still haven't nailed a good snare sound. I'll experiment some more but i'm more into moving to a deeper snare or another brand.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-16-2014, 11:17 AM
Pocket-full-of-gold's Avatar
Pocket-full-of-gold Pocket-full-of-gold is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Melbourne, Australia.
Posts: 10,007
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by cangaroo View Post
I tried almost every tuning combination : higher batter with low reso, both tuned equals low and high, lower batter with higher reso, tuned to precise intervals (third, fifth, etc). The tone quality goes from an awful and bodyless "slosh" when tuned low to a an almost decent crack when tuned high, but i still haven't nailed a good snare sound. I'll experiment some more but i'm more into moving to a deeper snare or another brand.
Strange. I have to work hard to get a bad sound out of my Supra's, including my 14x5. I've always seen them as one of the most versatile drums on the planet due to their ability to sound fantastic across a very wide tuning range. Anyway, it's possible it's just not to your taste.....and there ain't nothin' wrong with that. It'd be a boring place if we all dug the same thing.

As to the coated head as a snare side. You wouldn't be the first person to use it, but it's usually done to give a very specific sound (i.e. that cardboard box sound mentioned earlier). In the normal course of playing, it just produces far too boxy and lifeless a sound for general musical purposes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cangaroo View Post
- Use a heavier head like a coated CS with the dot on the bottom or a coated Emperor.
Just on this one. I reckon you've misinterpreted what he's saying mate. I reckon he's definitely talking about the batter head, it's just when he refers to the CS he actually means using a CS Reverse dot (dot underneath the plies), as opposed to the model that has the dot on top of the plies (Remo make both kinds).....OR a coated Emperor.

I'm not reading it that he means to use it as a snare side head. Make sense?
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-16-2014, 02:19 PM
JD7's Avatar
JD7 JD7 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 56
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

are we sure that this "drum doctor" wasn't saying to put coated heads on your tom resos if your snare is 5" or less? Maybe it has something to do with sympathetic snare vibrations when the tom is struck?

At the same time, I'd try out a non-snare side head for fun. It could become a cool secondary snare sound. Speaking of trying things out (and returning to the original post), I am currently using clear tom batter heads and coated AMB's on the reso side (with a coated Aquarian on the FT) and really like the sound. Plus, coated resos look super cool on my cherry wine superstars from the 80s.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 01-16-2014, 03:27 PM
AudioWonderland AudioWonderland is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 457
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by adamteasdale1407 View Post
Hey all,

So I'm re-heading my Gretsch Catalina Kit. I've considered using coated kick batter, coated kick reso, coated tom batter, coated tom reso. All Remo. Does anyone use coated tom resonant heads? If so, is there anything important I should know? Do they give off a warmer sound?

Also, has anyone ever used a coated snare side head? I heard Bonham did, not 100% sure though. If anyone has, again is there anything I should know?

Thanks
A coated reso head will result in a warmer tone. Vinnie C. used coated reso's on the Gretsch kits for years. Nothing special you need to do.

I don't think your information on Bonham is correct..
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 01-16-2014, 03:41 PM
cangaroo cangaroo is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 20
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold View Post
Strange. I have to work hard to get a bad sound out of my Supra's, including my 14x5. I've always seen them as one of the most versatile drums on the planet due to their ability to sound fantastic across a very wide tuning range.
the only well known supra sound i'm familiar with is bonham's, which by the way was using coeated resos, just not my taste. maybe it just could be that i don't know how a supra should sound !!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold View Post
Just on this one. I reckon you've misinterpreted what he's saying mate.
Yes you're right, i misinterpreted his quote, sorry for that. At this point i'm curious to ask him but i don't really know if he can be contacted in any way.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 01-17-2014, 12:01 AM
Pocket-full-of-gold's Avatar
Pocket-full-of-gold Pocket-full-of-gold is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Melbourne, Australia.
Posts: 10,007
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by JD7 View Post
are we sure that this "drum doctor" wasn't saying to put coated heads on your tom resos if your snare is 5" or less?
Read post 11 for what he actually said. The drum doctor was misinterpreted. He is refering to a reverse CS dot batter head....not having a CS head as a snare reso. I'll stake everything I own on it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cangaroo View Post
the only well known supra sound i'm familiar with is bonham's, which by the way was using coeated resos, .
Nah, not true mate. Bonham most definitely didn't use a coated reso on his snare drum. Again, I'll stake everything I own on that. The info is just incorrect. He used a snare side Ambassador (that weight (3ml) being the most commonly used snare reso in existance) and a coated Emporer batter.

Last edited by Pocket-full-of-gold; 01-17-2014 at 12:27 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01-17-2014, 11:37 AM
cangaroo cangaroo is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 20
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold View Post
Read post 11 for what he actually said. The drum doctor was misinterpreted. He is refering to a reverse CS dot batter head....not having a CS head as a snare reso. I'll stake everything I own on it.
The 5" thing was in another interview, not in the one i talked on post 11. That one was less prone to misinterpretation to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold View Post
Nah, not true mate. Bonham most definitely didn't use a coated reso on his snare drum. Again, I'll stake everything I own on that. The info is just incorrect. He used a snare side Ambassador (that weight (3ml) being the most commonly used snare reso in existance) and a coated Emporer batter.
Strange, i was quite sure of that. I've read the coated Reso story in a lot of places around the web. If you try to google bonham coated reso you can find some threads about it. Of course they all can be wrong.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 01-17-2014, 11:46 AM
Pocket-full-of-gold's Avatar
Pocket-full-of-gold Pocket-full-of-gold is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Melbourne, Australia.
Posts: 10,007
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by cangaroo View Post
Strange, i was quite sure of that. I've read the coated Reso story in a lot of places around the web. If you try to google bonham coated reso you can find some threads about it. Of course they all can be wrong.
Links?

Coated resos on his toms and bass drum, for sure. At least his wooden and stainless steel kits. He used clears on the Vistalites. But on the snare? You're the only person I've ever heard make the claim mate. I fear you might be mistaking the snare reso for what he used on the toms. I'm gonna have to ask for evidence.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 01-17-2014, 04:11 PM
cangaroo cangaroo is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 20
Default Re: Coated Resonant Heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold View Post
I fear you might be mistaking the snare reso for what he used on the toms.
umm i think you're right. i checked all the thread / articles i've read some time ago and i must admit that i wrongly remembered the snare part. yes he used coated on toms but not on the snare. my memory is playing tricks on me ...
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are Off
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off




All times are GMT +2. The time now is 05:48 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Bernhard Castiglioni's DRUMMERWORLD.com