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  #1  
Old 11-02-2013, 06:19 PM
Boyres Boyres is offline
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Default Roland spd-sx click track issue

Hi everyone

I'm thinking to get myself a Roland spd-sx in the near future. I only have one question:

Is it possible to make a sub wave with a self made clicktrack and send it to the phones output?
So the main wave goes to the PA and the sub wave to my in ears.

Other solutions are always welcome!

Thanks!
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  #2  
Old 11-02-2013, 08:12 PM
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bermuda bermuda is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

The answer is no, and this is one of my biggest issues with the SPD-SX. Why does the unit have 2 sets of stereo outs, with pads that will trigger 2 sounds, yet both sounds have to come out of the same designated outs? The sounds can't be split!

Well, there is a workaround if you have pads to spare: you can link one pad to another. That is, you strike one pad, it plays its sound, and at the same time it triggers a linked pad that plays its sound. You can send the first pad sounds to one set of outs, and the linked pad sound (your click) to the other. Or in your case, the phones.

It seems like a simple fix for Roland though. The fact that there are 2 sets of outs, and a pad will trigger 2 sounds, but the sounds only go to one set, is kinda shortsighted IMO. I wrote to Tim Root a while back, he's got the ear of the techs in Japan. Maybe there'll be a firmware update down the line?

I have a few issues with this unit, Roland got so close to being truly pro (even the Alesis SamplePad has it beat in some ways.) But, it does what it does well enough. With a few concessions, I made it work for touring purposes. I suppose Roland's response would be 'if you need it to do more, you probably need a software solution'. They may be right. but I still question why there are hardware aspects to the unit - such as 2 stereo outs - that aren't being utilized to their fullest.

Bermuda
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  #3  
Old 11-02-2013, 08:23 PM
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bermuda bermuda is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

BTW, I don't want to sell the unit too short, with 2g of ram it really allows you a large amount of sample playback - more than 3 hours of stereo sounds at CD quality. But it's more of a pro-sumer unit, I resent that they call it "pro". I don't hate mine, but I definitely settled when I got it.

Bermuda
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  #4  
Old 11-02-2013, 09:30 PM
Boyres Boyres is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

Thanks for the reply! This answer spares a lot of googling for me ;)

Cheers
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  #5  
Old 07-18-2014, 02:51 PM
garethlthomson garethlthomson is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

Bermuda - I just made an account with drummerworld.com so I can say thank you! Your work around has solved so many issues for me. It's amazing how careless Roland was at the making SPDSX a more functional backing track tool. Cheers!
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  #6  
Old 08-19-2014, 10:12 AM
Drumbasta Drumbasta is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

You can also let the backing track/click run through a foot switch by linking footswitch one with footswitch two. That way you still have all your pads available and you also don't run the risk of accidentally hitting the backing track pad during performance.
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  #7  
Old 07-05-2015, 10:00 PM
Kroy Kroy is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boyres View Post
Hi everyone

I'm thinking to get myself a Roland spd-sx in the near future. I only have one question:

Is it possible to make a sub wave with a self made clicktrack and send it to the phones output?
So the main wave goes to the PA and the sub wave to my in ears.

Other solutions are always welcome!

Thanks!
I don't own an SDP-SX but I have the manual in front of me and on page 43 it seems to indicate that any individual pad can be assigned to phones only (like with the click). Isn't that the solution? I'm not sure why you'd need to do it with a sub-wave..

Does this concur with your experiences with the SPD-SX, Bermuda?
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  #8  
Old 07-06-2015, 12:07 AM
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bermuda bermuda is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

Yep, any pad's main OR sub sound can go to any output, but the main AND sub sounds cannot be split... which is what the OP was trying to accomplish.

As for where the Roland's click can be sent, I assume its phones only? Not absolutely sure, I don't use that.

bermuda
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  #9  
Old 07-08-2015, 11:40 AM
Kroy Kroy is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

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Originally Posted by bermuda View Post
Yep, any pad's main OR sub sound can go to any output, but the main AND sub sounds cannot be split... which is what the OP was trying to accomplish.

As for where the Roland's click can be sent, I assume its phones only? Not absolutely sure, I don't use that.

bermuda
Thanks Bermuda, that does make it easy to use a customized click. It's a shame Roland did away with the sequencer they had in the SDP-S because then you'd be able to make a customized click quickly 'in the box,' instead of needing to import a loop from another source.

Bermuda, I know you have the Alesis Samplepad as well. May I ask, what are the pads like to play on compared with the SPD-SX? eg how does it handle playing 32nd notes with doubles? You mentioned earlier that in some areas the Alesis beats the SPD-SX. Can you expand on that?
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  #10  
Old 07-08-2015, 04:03 PM
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bermuda bermuda is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kroy View Post
Thanks Bermuda, that does make it easy to use a customized click.
Actually, with the SPD-SX, it's not easy to use a custom click and a track at the same time triggered from the same pad. There's a workaround though, but it's counterintuitive to what the unit's sub sound and sub outs suggest. The hardware is there, the firmware is not, even after 4+ years it's been available.

Quote:
Bermuda, I know you have the Alesis Samplepad as well. May I ask, what are the pads like to play on compared with the SPD-SX? eg how does it handle playing 32nd notes with doubles? You mentioned earlier that in some areas the Alesis beats the SPD-SX. Can you expand on that?
The SamplePad (the 4-pad first version) is a very basic sample playback pad with somewhat limited ram (14mb) and plays mono samples only. It's quite a bit easier to configure than the Roland although admittedly it doesn't do any of the 'tricks' the Roland does, and for which you pay a price at $799. The Alesis is $199!

The latest SamplePad Pro is being fine-tuned right now, it has a more usable 48mb of ram, plays stereo samples, and has 8 pads on top (with a few trigger/pedal inputs.) Like the SamplePad, it's extremely easy to use, and also lets you tune samples on the fly (the Roland does not for some reason.) And the onboard sounds alone are worth the price: $299!

The Roland is a very capable unit, I don't hate it, but I resent paying for a lot of features I don't need and will never use. I just want to load samples, hit a pad, and have them play, and the Alesis excels at that, at a considerably lower price.

While the Alesis' ram is far from the generous 2g of the Roland, it depends what kind of samples you are playing. Drum hits and various effects are fairly short, and the Alesis will cheerfully handle them, without paying for all the bells & whistles of the Roland.

In a nutshell, here are the differences between the SamplePad Pro and the SPD-SX:

RAM - Hands down, Roland has Alesis beat on this. You could play full stereo tracks as loops or whatever, for up to a total of more than 3 hours if nec. Note: the Alesis is 48mb ram per preset.

Sampling - The Roland samples, the Alesis does not. Does any even use a hardware sampler any more? Not me, and I did not enjoy having to pay for that feature.

Loading sounds - super simple and intuitive on the Alesis, it's probably not even necessary to read the instructions, but that would only take 5 minutes, tops. The Roland menu structure is more complicated, and I often need to refer to the SPD-SX's 200+ page manual.

Sound quality - equal, both are CD-quality (16/44.1) although the Alesis allows you to use lower-res samples in order to conserve ram as needed.

Looping - The Roland has some options that the Alesis doesn't, but it also require a separate pad to 'stop' the looping, so you lose a usable pad right from the start. The Alesis lets you start and stop from the same pad.

Pads - they feel the same to me, and the Alesis' are slightly larger. But the Alesis advantage is that their pads are surrounded by a lighted border, so you can see the target if it's dark on stage. I am constantly missing the Roland pads because they're hard to see.

Triggering - Both feel great to me, I always test with 32nd open rolls, and they're clean and accurate. Dynamics are also good on both units.

Size - comparable. The Alesis is a little wider, but not quite as tall or 'thick'.

Price - Roland, $799, Alesis, $299.

For just playing most stereo samples - which is what I do - the choice is very clear. But for those who need more from a hardware unit and don't want to grapple with a laptop, software, and pad interface, the Roland is a good option, and that comes with a price.

The SamplePad Pro should be tweaked and ready soon, I'm looking forward to replacing my SPD-SX when it is!

Bermuda
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  #11  
Old 07-09-2015, 08:57 PM
Kroy Kroy is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by bermuda View Post
Actually, with the SPD-SX, it's not easy to use a custom click and a track at the same time triggered from the same pad. There's a workaround though, but it's counterintuitive to what the unit's sub sound and sub outs suggest. The hardware is there, the firmware is not, even after 4+ years it's been available.



The SamplePad (the 4-pad first version) is a very basic sample playback pad with somewhat limited ram (14mb) and plays mono samples only. It's quite a bit easier to configure than the Roland although admittedly it doesn't do any of the 'tricks' the Roland does, and for which you pay a price at $799. The Alesis is $199!

The latest SamplePad Pro is being fine-tuned right now, it has a more usable 48mb of ram, plays stereo samples, and has 8 pads on top (with a few trigger/pedal inputs.) Like the SamplePad, it's extremely easy to use, and also lets you tune samples on the fly (the Roland does not for some reason.) And the onboard sounds alone are worth the price: $299!

The Roland is a very capable unit, I don't hate it, but I resent paying for a lot of features I don't need and will never use. I just want to load samples, hit a pad, and have them play, and the Alesis excels at that, at a considerably lower price.

While the Alesis' ram is far from the generous 2g of the Roland, it depends what kind of samples you are playing. Drum hits and various effects are fairly short, and the Alesis will cheerfully handle them, without paying for all the bells & whistles of the Roland.

In a nutshell, here are the differences between the SamplePad Pro and the SPD-SX:

RAM - Hands down, Roland has Alesis beat on this. You could play full stereo tracks as loops or whatever, for up to a total of more than 3 hours if nec. Note: the Alesis is 48mb ram per preset.

Sampling - The Roland samples, the Alesis does not. Does any even use a hardware sampler any more? Not me, and I did not enjoy having to pay for that feature.

Loading sounds - super simple and intuitive on the Alesis, it's probably not even necessary to read the instructions, but that would only take 5 minutes, tops. The Roland menu structure is more complicated, and I often need to refer to the SPD-SX's 200+ page manual.

Sound quality - equal, both are CD-quality (16/44.1) although the Alesis allows you to use lower-res samples in order to conserve ram as needed.

Looping - The Roland has some options that the Alesis doesn't, but it also require a separate pad to 'stop' the looping, so you lose a usable pad right from the start. The Alesis lets you start and stop from the same pad.

Pads - they feel the same to me, and the Alesis' are slightly larger. But the Alesis advantage is that their pads are surrounded by a lighted border, so you can see the target if it's dark on stage. I am constantly missing the Roland pads because they're hard to see.

Triggering - Both feel great to me, I always test with 32nd open rolls, and they're clean and accurate. Dynamics are also good on both units.

Size - comparable. The Alesis is a little wider, but not quite as tall or 'thick'.

Price - Roland, $799, Alesis, $299.

For just playing most stereo samples - which is what I do - the choice is very clear. But for those who need more from a hardware unit and don't want to grapple with a laptop, software, and pad interface, the Roland is a good option, and that comes with a price.

The SamplePad Pro should be tweaked and ready soon, I'm looking forward to replacing my SPD-SX when it is!

Bermuda
Hey thanks Bermuda, the info you've laid out is really helpful for me in making a decision. I love the ease of use of the Alesis - I've owned a few Roland units in the past and their menu architecture has never been simple. But the Alesis doesn't seem that well spec'd to deal with tempo-synced loops and backing tracks (where it's essential to be able to route the click to the phones output). This is def a strong consideration for me.
Good to hear that the pads on the Alesis are as sensitive as the SPD-SX and the lighted borders look great, and practical.
btw you said you can't stop a loop playing on the SPD-SX with the same pad. What about if you set Trigger type to ALT?
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  #12  
Old 07-09-2015, 09:16 PM
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bermuda bermuda is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kroy View Post
But the Alesis doesn't seem that well spec'd to deal with tempo-synced loops and backing tracks (where it's essential to be able to route the click to the phones output). This is def a strong consideration for me.
It really depends what you need on the gig. The Alesis doesn't claim to do everything the Roland does, just the basics of a pad of this type: assign a sound, hit the pad, it plays. There are a lot of bells & whistles on the Roland... none of them have a use for what I do. The only thing I want is an all-in-one unit to play my samples, and the Alesis does that equally well, more simply, and with a few nice features that the Roland doesn't have. And, it's less than 40% of the price of the Roland!

Quote:
btw you said you can't stop a loop playing on the SPD-SX with the same pad. What about if you set Trigger type to ALT?
I don't know all of the specifics, I just happened to check the Roland after seeing that the Alesis looped very simply, and read that the SPD-SX needed a separate pad to turn off the loop. Perhaps there's an additional mode, which would make sense. Then again, it would make sense that you can adjust the pitch of a pad on playback, yet the Roland makes you copy the sample first and save it at the new pitch.

I can't claim to know everything the Roland does, even though I've used it for over 4 years. I have no need for most of what it does, and unfortunately there was no other all-in-one option at the time (the Yamaha multi-pad fell short in some areas.)

BTW, as much as I like the new SamplePad Pro, don't run out and get one just yet, they're still working out some bugs. Hopefully will be road-ready in a month or two.

Bermuda
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  #13  
Old 07-10-2015, 07:04 AM
New Tricks New Tricks is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

Quote:
you said you can't stop a loop playing on the SPD-SX with the same pad. What about if you set Trigger type to ALT?
That will do it. Sometimes I will build a slightly audible click like a tambourine or closed HH that will cut through and I/we can hear through the PA. I set it to alt and turn it on/off whenever I feel the need to check tempo.

A few songs we play have a backing track in the middle of the song, often a rhythm guitar while the guitarist plays lead. We just need to be close to tempo when it gets triggered. If I feel the songs is rushing or lagging, I can hit the "click" and make adjustments before it's too late.
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  #14  
Old 07-10-2015, 12:11 PM
Kroy Kroy is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

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Originally Posted by bermuda View Post
It really depends what you need on the gig. The Alesis doesn't claim to do everything the Roland does, just the basics of a pad of this type: assign a sound, hit the pad, it plays. There are a lot of bells & whistles on the Roland... none of them have a use for what I do. The only thing I want is an all-in-one unit to play my samples, and the Alesis does that equally well, more simply, and with a few nice features that the Roland doesn't have. And, it's less than 40% of the price of the Roland!

Absolutely, if I just needed to play samples without doing any tempo-syncing I'd go for the Alesis.
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  #15  
Old 07-10-2015, 12:13 PM
Kroy Kroy is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

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Originally Posted by New Tricks View Post
That will do it. Sometimes I will build a slightly audible click like a tambourine or closed HH that will cut through and I/we can hear through the PA. I set it to alt and turn it on/off whenever I feel the need to check tempo.

A few songs we play have a backing track in the middle of the song, often a rhythm guitar while the guitarist plays lead. We just need to be close to tempo when it gets triggered. If I feel the songs is rushing or lagging, I can hit the "click" and make adjustments before it's too late.
That's an interesting approach, and that could be done on the Alesis Samplepad Pro too.
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Old 07-10-2015, 12:15 PM
Kroy Kroy is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

Good tutorials here on setting up the SPD-SX for using backing tracks and click tracks:
This is part 1 (see also parts 2-4):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsmBJZf6GLs
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  #17  
Old 07-23-2015, 12:35 AM
lildrumr lildrumr is offline
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Default Re: Roland spd-sx click track issue

Hi there!
May I suggest you look at the Yamaha DTX M12. It has a built in click that can be assigned to PA, phones or both. The click can be stopped/started with a pad, the click button or a footswitch. It has a ton of onboard sounds, you can create your own loops using these, or load samples. The drawback is the sample memory capacity. Only 23 seconds per sample (CD quality; more if you reduce the quality) and a max total of only 64 mb.
It does everything I need it to do, allthough programming is somewhat qumbersome, and like the Roland some features (or lack of) just seems weird. There are pros and cons with all of them (Yamaha DTX M12/Roland SPD-SX and Alesis SamplePad). For my needs, I went with the Yamaha. The deciding factor for me was Yamaha's hi-hat pedal input, that enables you to use it as a drumkit. They all will cover the basic needs, it's the fancy stuff that separates them.

Regards, David (Norway)
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