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  #1  
Old 10-23-2013, 05:54 AM
Zurgman Zurgman is offline
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Default Am I a terrible drummer?

So, for starters I have been playing drums for about 3 years, and have been playing seriously for about 2. I have felt confident in my drumming for quite awhile, and everyone I know has said that I'm talented and should keep on playing. But recently I've been told differently. I'm currently in high school marching band and I'm playing the drum set, I feel like I've been doing ok, but our director is always critizing me, and only me. He says that I set my drums up wrong, I don't play enough like "Ringo Starr" (we're doing a Beatles show this year), and that I'm not "dedicated enough". These are things that I've always felt very strongly that should be left to the drummer himself, if I'm pleasing the audience and myself, I really don't care how my drums are set up, and I'm not Ringo Starr, dammit, I'm my own person and if I want to be my own person that's sure as hell what I'm going to be. I don't think these are things that matter to anyone but him, but what does everyone else think? Are these really things that define a good drummer? Or am I really that bad? Should I just quit? Because after being beaten into the ground daily, I feel like I would contribute more to the band by just not showing up.
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Old 10-23-2013, 06:47 AM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Without hearing you play I can't comment on how terrible or otherwise you are.

But I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

But as a high school student, I'll go out on a limb and guess you're "spicing up" the drum parts. In that you should be aiming to play like Ringo when you're playing Beatles songs, the director is spot on.

You don't have to set your kit up the same way, cut your hair the same way or wear a collarless jacket...but you should play as close to Ringo's playing as you possibly can, and avoid the urge to come up with "better" drum parts.

The other thing you might want to consider is having a frank discussion with the director and find out what his gripe really is. Be prepared to talk, and be prepared to listen too.
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Old 10-23-2013, 07:10 AM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

I think the only real solution is to go down to the courthouse and get your name legally changed to "Ringo Starr".

What's he going to say?

"Hey, uh, Ringo... You need to play a bit more like, er..."

Mods, I think we can go ahead and close the thread. I've solved the issue entirely.
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Old 10-23-2013, 07:15 AM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Yes I agree.. you can't mess with Ringo's parts! Or if you are trying to play them and they're not sounding the same then you need to seriously analyze what it is that's stopping you. I think they call it 'woodshedding'.. spend some serious time practicing the parts and video yourself and watch objectively.. Is your time steady? Are you getting the dynamics right... a solid balance between your kick , snare and hats? Are the fills simple yet expressive? Take it as a challenge to see if you can get inside the parts and really nail them - and the next time you play for the conductor if you don't blow him away then get a second opinion to make sure its not him that/s off!
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Old 10-23-2013, 07:37 AM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Nobody will play like Ringo. I was joking around with a fellow this weekend who played in a Beatles tribute band. Tasteful grooving player, and he is a lefty playing righty so he should be able to nail Ringo. He gets close to the feel but told me that it's much harder than it looks. http://youtu.be/KG0MA1ZErUk
When playing other people's music, start by trying to capture as much of their vibe as possible. You can learn from everybody''s playing. If you're playing in some sort of show/tribute/someone else's band, try to reproduce that. If you're playing in your own band doing your own thing, start from where you found it and then add yourself. Don't shortcut the way you found it.

About a year ago, I was at a jam and was behind a singer who turned out to want everything to be like a runaway freight train. She started the song in free time and didn't count in, so I played it at standard tempo. A friend who is a much better drummer than I was laughing afterwards and said that I played it "exactly where famous and important producers and arrangers had long ago decided where it should be". In the absence of any other direction, I played it like the record. Everyone else knew where to be with the original tempo and groove (as best as I could manage it).
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  #6  
Old 10-23-2013, 08:37 AM
Ekim Ekim is offline
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

You like being in band and want to stay, right?

So go to your director and ask for specific things to fix in regards to your playing. Listen and apply what he says best you can. If he's criticizing, he should know enough to explain what he wants.

With setup, you might find setting your kit up more like Ringo might make certain parts easier to play in some fashion. AND it might placate your director some and get him off your back.

Dedication? Only you can answer that one. If you honestly feel like you're dedicated, maybe up it a notch anyway. It's drums! So the worst that happens is a few more sticks and heads get worn out and you get better, right?
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Old 10-23-2013, 08:42 AM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

I'd say you haven't played long enough anyway. After you've done ten years or so (for some even 20) you should be able to get a handle on whether or not you can do what you're supposed to do. 2-3 years just isn't enough for me to be a judge.

That said, band directors aren't perfect people either, so there may be some legitimate gripe he has too.

Or, like has already been said, you're messing with the parts you should be playing. I say post a video of your playing and then we can be the judge.
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Old 10-23-2013, 09:19 AM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Young drummers are pretty bad with overplaying (I was too), and in a concert band setting you're playing with instruments that draw more conservative musicians and so you will stick out like a sore thumb if you play a big fill or don't serve the song.

If you're worried you suck then you should demonstrate your playing to someone.. We have no clue what you're like.
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Old 10-23-2013, 09:22 AM
mikel mikel is offline
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

On the other hand perhaps the Director is just a git and has an issue with you. It is possible, we only have one side of the story here. If its a marching band how earth can it sound exactly like the Beatles? Also its high school, I would presume there is a fairly broad range of abilities. Is the bassist a leftie and is he using a Hofner Violin bass?

Also I find it hard to agree with Bo, on the longevity take, If you can play you can play. Using the 10 or 20 year minimum stance would rule out most if not all the drummers in pop/rock/punk.
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Old 10-23-2013, 10:21 AM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Here have some motivation.

I remember watching a video on YouTube a while back, can't remember what it was called otherwise I would link it. It said that no one is a bad drummer. And no one is worse than anyone else.
Drumming is a journey, and anyone who is "better" than you, is just ahead of you on this journey, and at some point were exactly where you are. Anyone who is actually a committed player can't be called bad, they're just behind other people on their journey. Inspirational post of the day there
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Old 10-23-2013, 11:09 AM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Don't let it get you down. It's hard to sound like another drummer, but if you're doing a proper "cover" without any embellishments, it's best to stick as closely to the source material as possible.
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  #12  
Old 10-23-2013, 11:32 AM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Zurg, I only see challenges in your OP :)

3 years drumming is not what you'll call a lot of experience, so it might be quite a few things to look at...

How do you project yourself? your attitude towards your band mates, the director and the music might need a different approach?

Take the challenge to play Ringo's parts as close as the records as you can, it's easily said, harder to do, try to capture the feel. Do not overplay and do not add your own things/patterns while playing the songs.

Work and practice those songs at home, really hard, so on your next rehearsal, the director should see some serious improvement, that should get the "dedication" part solved.

I have not seen your setup, but set it up as conventionally as possible, beginners and young drummers tends to have strange set up. Is the tuning of your kit OK?

Last but not least, ask your director for advices, directions, etc... he/she will like that.




Here you go, if after genuinely applying all the above, your director's still not happy with you, then it might be something wrong with him/her.

But I'll reckon you'll be alright, swallow your pride and ego... and go for it :)

Let us know how it goes.
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Old 10-23-2013, 11:49 AM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

I love Ringo...he's one of my favourite drummers of all time. And he's massively under-rated.

But, seriously, I have to say this. His drum parts, in the main, are not particularly challenging. I'm not suggesting that it's easy to pull off the exact sound Ringo produced, but certainly in terms of technicality, he rarely did anything 'scary' for competent, even to lower standards, drummers.

If the show is a Beatles show, I can wholly understand why the tutor would want the drum sequences to be 'Ringo-like'....which again I don't suggest means 'simple' or 'dumbed down' but I would say means 'linear' or 'without excess'.

Just my humble opinion.
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Old 10-23-2013, 02:12 PM
mikel mikel is offline
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Zurg......there are a lot of people on here giving you a hard time, not sure why, this forum is usually supportive of its members. What we need is for you to come back and give us some more details and info. Are you playing the parts as close to original as you can?
Is the rest of the band nailing every part spot on?
Is there another reason why the guy has an issue with you?
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Old 10-23-2013, 02:15 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

The couple of Beatles songs I've played have been fast (160 bpm) and they would be very difficult for a beginner. Normal players with 2-3 years do not have much control of dynamics and sound. I would be very surprised if you did sound like Ringo.

He used to swish his hihats with a sideways motion, which no-one else seems to do. I imagine this introduces a touch of swing to his playing. It's an unnatural technique when you first try it for sure.

Study old videos and just work on your sound. Introduce dynamics one limb at a time in your practice and focus on good technique and lighter playing. Ringo has jazz influences and is not a big hitter.

Davo
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Old 10-23-2013, 02:17 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

There are better ways for a band director to explain how he wants you to play. he sounds like a failed drummer to me.
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Old 10-23-2013, 02:54 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikel View Post
Zurg......there are a lot of people on here giving you a hard time, not sure why, this forum is usually supportive of its members. What we need is for you to come back and give us some more details and info. Are you playing the parts as close to original as you can?
Is the rest of the band nailing every part spot on?
Is there another reason why the guy has an issue with you?
I don't think they're giving him a hard time. I think they're just trying to figure out what's really happening from the little information they have. It's all been pretty good advice in my opinion. As someone who's been playing about the same amount of time as the OP, I've actually gleaned a lot of good information from this thread as I read through. I do think it would help, as you suggested, if the OP could post some of his playing or at least be a little more specific about how's he's playing the songs. If he really is trying to play as close to the original as possible, and not embellishing, then it sounds as if the band leader is being harsh. However, if the OP is trying to make it his own, then maybe he needs to come at it from another angle.

Whatever it is...I hope he has gained some of the same useful insight from this thread that I have. :)
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Old 10-23-2013, 03:03 PM
mikel mikel is offline
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

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Originally Posted by Davo-London View Post
The couple of Beatles songs I've played have been fast (160 bpm) and they would be very difficult for a beginner. Normal players with 2-3 years do not have much control of dynamics and sound. I would be very surprised if you did sound like Ringo.

He used to swish his hihats with a sideways motion, which no-one else seems to do. I imagine this introduces a touch of swing to his playing. It's an unnatural technique when you first try it for sure.

Study old videos and just work on your sound. Introduce dynamics one limb at a time in your practice and focus on good technique and lighter playing. Ringo has jazz influences and is not a big hitter.

Davo
Regarding Ringo's oft used hi-hat technique, I believe its called "Buttering the Bread" or something similar. As for the 2 to 3 year experience players not having much control of dynamics or sound!! I would take great issue with that. Its like anything, If you are good enough you are good enough, regardless of age, experience or gender.

I am yet to see an add for a drummer that includes "Must have at least 20 years experience, or you wont be any good". Not in my neck of the woods anyway and If someone did I would avoid the numpties like the proverbial.
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Old 10-23-2013, 03:10 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

A bad drummer will make a good band sound bad. And a bad band will make a good drummer sound bad. If your listeners are comfortable with what you're doing, and you're confident in your abilities, don't worry about it. More often than not, we're our own worst critics. I often find that when I'm playing in front of a crowd, even if I make an obvious mistake, nobody notices. Even bandmates don't really notice. As long as time is being kept, more often than not, people pay us little mind.

As for your director, he's just one of those judgmental prudes who thinks if you aren't playing how 'he' thinks you should play, it's wrong, and you need to change it. I've met enough chaps like that in my lifetime, and I'm sure I'll meet hundreds more. Ignore it, and hold your head up.
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Old 10-23-2013, 03:16 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

I'm going to bombard you with questions. Is this a marching band field show? Or is this for an indoor concert band on stage? Is a drumline playing, too? Is it the full band or is a jazz band?

Playing in any of these contexts is completely different than playing in a rock band. For the most part, you stay out of the way, keep really solid time, and focus on dynamics. As a drummer in a school band, dynamics are especially important because the rest of the band subconsciously matches your volume. A few simple, tasteful, and well-executed fills are usually all it takes to liven it up.

Do you have a written part? In my experience, two-thirds of the drum set parts I've seen in concert bands are pretty much worthless. I reference them for tempo, time signatures, dynamics, and general style. Even the worst ones usually have at least a hint of where its appropriate to put those few tasteful fills. On the other third of the written parts, I follow it note-for-note just like I would if I were playing say the timpani part.

In a band with a director- especially a school band- your goal is to please the director. You have to trust that the director is coordinating everybody's individual parts to put together to please the audience. What are the director's primary and secondary instruments? Most of my directors have been drummers, so they were very hard on me, but they definitely knew what they wanted. Other directors can be relatively clueless about what they want from the drums and completely ignore them. Your director sounds like he's in the middle somewhere. He knows what he doesn't want and has a vague idea of what he wants. But he's struggling to articulate either to you. Your responsibility to the band is to help bridge that communication gap- even if at times it feels like playing pin the tail on the donkey.

Many band programs require a few one-on-one lessons with the director each semester. Does your band do this? If so, perhaps you should schedule one. One way or another, you really should try to find a chance to discuss or work one-on-one. Before you do, you should prepare some material as others have suggested. Listen to the original recordings and practice playing like that. Brainstorm and practice a few other approaches and just try them in rehearsal. There's a good chance he'll know what he wants when he hears it and let you know.

Finally, do not feel discouraged. Playing the drum set in a concert band is one of the toughest things to do as a drummer. You have to bring out the somewhat rebellious nature of rock and roll music while conforming to the composer and director's interpretation.
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Old 10-23-2013, 04:12 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Zurgman, It is not that you are a bad drummer. I am a marching band percussion instructor. I teach the drumline and pit percussion. I have also taught a beetles show with a drum set player in the pit percussion.

I almost know what your band director is going through. Or maybe I am wrong and he is just a complete ******. The drum set player in my pit was a good drummer but was not doing what he needed to. When you are playing in a marching band that is doing pop/rock/jazz anything where there is normally a drum set player you have to do it the way it was on record. I know that the marching band I taught was a competition band. The first critique of that season that I went to they did not mention the drumline. They told me that the drum set player was not Ringo enough. So that is where my work started. The parts you were given may not be what Ringo played (if you are given music). So it is your job to listen to your field show music and The Beatles recording of what it is supposed to be. From here write out your own music note for note. It can be in standard western civilization notation. Or just a drum tab. It really doesn't matter how you write it although from a percussion instructor I recommend getting comfortable reading and writing western notation. From there learn the parts note for note. Then try to recreate the feel that Ringo had. Honestly this is the hardest part. A lot of young and old drummers alike can't get a good feel for how something is supposed to be. But work on it and you will improve on all aspects of drumming. Remember that one of the first steps of being a good musician is mimicking the masters.

As far as the Set up goes. Go ahead and set up the drums like he wants you to and then just move them a little bit to where you can get comfortable. In marching band visual representation is actually important. Sure it might not be important in all aspects of playing but this time it is.

So just give your band director the benefit of the doubt. More than likely he knows whats best.

And most importantly keep on playing and Have fun playing.
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Old 10-23-2013, 05:15 PM
tamadrm tamadrm is offline
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aeolian View Post
Nobody will play like Ringo. I was joking around with a fellow this weekend who played in a Beatles tribute band. Tasteful grooving player, and he is a lefty playing righty so he should be able to nail Ringo. He gets close to the feel but told me that it's much harder than it looks. http://youtu.be/KG0MA1ZErUk
When playing other people's music, start by trying to capture as much of their vibe as possible. You can learn from everybody''s playing. If you're playing in some sort of show/tribute/someone else's band, try to reproduce that. If you're playing in your own band doing your own thing, start from where you found it and then add yourself. Don't shortcut the way you found it.

About a year ago, I was at a jam and was behind a singer who turned out to want everything to be like a runaway freight train. She started the song in free time and didn't count in, so I played it at standard tempo. A friend who is a much better drummer than I was laughing afterwards and said that I played it "exactly where famous and important producers and arrangers had long ago decided where it should be". In the absence of any other direction, I played it like the record. Everyone else knew where to be with the original tempo and groove (as best as I could manage it).
I completely agee about Ringos identifiable "feel' and groove.Trying to alter Ringos drum parts,without actually completely altering the arrangement is probably not a good idea.

This is an excellent example of when less is more,and recreating his original parts should be your goal,and not seeing how many notes you can play to a bar.

Just a point of information however,there were 3 different drummers on the "Imagine" album; Alan White(who actually plays drums on the title cut),Jim Keltner and Jim Gordon.

Steve B
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Old 10-23-2013, 06:31 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikel View Post
Regarding Ringo's oft used hi-hat technique, I believe its called "Buttering the Bread" or something similar. As for the 2 to 3 year experience players not having much control of dynamics or sound!! I would take great issue with that. Its like anything, If you are good enough you are good enough, regardless of age, experience or gender.

I am yet to see an add for a drummer that includes "Must have at least 20 years experience, or you wont be any good". Not in my neck of the woods anyway and If someone did I would avoid the numpties like the proverbial.
I disagree with just about everything you say here. But that's cool. That's what it's all about! It's good to have different views.

Davo
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Old 10-23-2013, 06:57 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Mr. Zurgman, the optimist in me is saying that perhaps your MD likes you and is trying to better you. It sounds like he gets the fact that the drums can make or break a piece, and perhaps he is trying to steer you down the right path because maybe he sees something in you that can be developed. I would take his critique as positively as possible, and please, don't even think about the quitting thing.

From the info you provided, what you are playing...it sounds like you aren't doing what he is looking for, at least in some places. If you can learn to take comments that are designed to be helpful to your playing...even if the delivery is less than optimal...that skill will serve you well. I suggest recording your practices so you can hear what's going on. Things that don't work should be readily apparent. Taking that recording to the MD for his opinions can only help you, and it will show him initiative on your part. It will give you a chance to really discuss any problem areas, and since you are not playing and have all your brainpower to analyze things, maybe his comments will make more sense.

Learn to use criticism to benefit you, and keep it positive. An open mind and a willingness to hear and use criticism is a great skill, and not limited to drumming. A positive attitude, even when someone is questioning your choices, is admirable. So try and be that guy.

I always say, hey I'll play whatever you want. If someone has an intelligent opinion about the drum part, it's in your best interest to try what is being suggested.
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Old 10-23-2013, 07:59 PM
mikel mikel is offline
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

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Originally Posted by Davo-London View Post
I disagree with just about everything you say here. But that's cool. That's what it's all about! It's good to have different views.

Davo
Hey I don't mind you disagreeing with me at all, but it would be nice to know why.

On the longevity of playing issue, I still don't see how the length of time you have played comes into it. I could have been playing for 20 years, for 2 hours per week and still be a poor drummer. Our friend, the OP could have been playing for 3 years, 8 hours a day, every day, and be a great drummer. Or he could just be a "Natural" who finds everything about drumming easy. Who can tell.
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Old 10-23-2013, 08:53 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Not sure what your long term goals are...but...

The question re: your drumming skills is irrelevant.

The question is, how do you respond to negative feedback?...accurate or inaccurate.

If you do not respect the source, ignore it.

If you respect the source, explore it.


One of the difficult long term learning skills re: drumming(or anything else) is how to learn and persist.
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Old 10-24-2013, 01:31 AM
Zurgman Zurgman is offline
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

So many questions to answer... So, for starters I have been trying to play more like ringo Starr, I have just found that for me personally he just had a certaint, almost uncapturable element, so simple yet tasteful at the same time, which is something I struggle with. I set my kit up relatively average, I flatten my toms, have a ride and a crash cymbal, etc. This is marching band, so often times the battery is playing so I'm not completely dependent on tempo, and as far as dedication goes, I honestly just don't know what he means. I've practiced every day, showed up to every rehearsal (required and optional) and done what Ive been told without batting an eyelash. Sorry if I didn't provide enough info the first time, I'm new to this forum, also, im sorry for not providing feedback sooner, I'm busy with school.
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  #28  
Old 10-24-2013, 01:50 AM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

That was Alan White on Imagine. Post Beatles song.

You know, despite what the collective says here, I've always thought Ringo's drumming on Come Together was lacking, so I do a hybrid of the Aerosmith version and the Beatles version. I've never played it any other way and you know what? I've never had one complaint.
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Old 10-24-2013, 05:39 AM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

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Originally Posted by SquadLeader View Post
I love Ringo...he's one of my favourite drummers of all time. And he's massively under-rated.

But, seriously, I have to say this. His drum parts, in the main, are not particularly challenging.
Try.. "I Feel Fine"..it blew me away when I had to learn it a long time ago; I had no idea Ringo could play like that; each limb is syncopated and fast. The pattern is kind of an inverted copy of Ray Charles "What You Say?" Funny thing is I read that a Lennon interview where he said around that time Ray's tune was all the rage, and one of the reasons they hired Ringo over Pete Best was that he was one of the few that had that kind of Latin rythmn down cold..
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Old 10-24-2013, 04:34 PM
tamadrm tamadrm is offline
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Originally Posted by Midnite Zephyr View Post
That was Alan White on Imagine. Post Beatles song.

You know, despite what the collective says here, I've always thought Ringo's drumming on Come Together was lacking, so I do a hybrid of the Aerosmith version and the Beatles version. I've never played it any other way and you know what? I've never had one complaint.
I completely disagree.I think Ringos drumming on that tune ,fits the arrangement perfectly.What exactly was it lacking?

The difference between his performance and Joey Kramers, is so slight as to be negligible.The only real difference, is a few more beats in Kramers fill,and a slightly faster tempo,which was no doubt a Lennon/Martin decision,and not Ringos.He could have easily played it faster if need be.

Was George Harrisons lead and solo,"lacking" what Joe Perry played also?:):)

Steve B
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Old 10-24-2013, 05:26 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Lots of good points brought up here. But this statement may also be a clue:

"These are things that I've always felt very strongly that should be left to the drummer himself"

If you are focused on you it will show up. You need to be focused on the overall sound and provide your part of it. And if you are playing Beatles music as a tribute in a school band and the director wants you to play more like Ringo, then that is what you need to do.

What none of us can tell is how good you are or what kind of band director you have. You may be giving us the impression you get from him but that may not be the impression we would get if we watched the interaction. It is ALWAYS best when being criticized is to listen and evaluate for yourself. As humans, and even moreso when we are young, we tend to not take criticism well. EVen if the band director is being too harsh on you, by listening and evaluating and improving it will help you in the long run.

A picture of your set up and a video of your playing would allow us to evaluate more objectively.
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Old 10-24-2013, 05:41 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

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Originally Posted by tamadrm View Post
I completely disagree.I think Ringos drumming on that tune ,fits the arrangement perfectly.What exactly was it lacking?

The difference between his performance and Joey Kramers, is so slight as to be negligible.The only real difference, is a few more beats in Kramers fill,and a slightly faster tempo,which was no doubt a Lennon/Martin decision,and not Ringos.He could have easily played it faster if need be.
I personally think Ringo's playing on that was just right, and really a 'signature' of him. Greta dynamics.
The other difference of course is Ringo had dishtowels on his toms for that cut. Thats why the drums are so muted, or thud like.
George Martin was having Ringo use that a lot for some of their last works. You can also see dishtowels on his toms for the concert for Bangladesh (the movie).

To the OP, don't give up, take what positive advice you can from your director. My guess is he's asking you to underplay or at least not overplay. I think Ringo is a great reference to use, the same way somebody would say "try to play it more like" Keith Moon (impossible?) or John Bonham.
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Old 10-24-2013, 08:20 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tamadrm View Post
I completely disagree.I think Ringos drumming on that tune ,fits the arrangement perfectly.What exactly was it lacking?

The difference between his performance and Joey Kramers, is so slight as to be negligible.The only real difference, is a few more beats in Kramers fill,and a slightly faster tempo,which was no doubt a Lennon/Martin decision,and not Ringos.He could have easily played it faster if need be.

Was George Harrisons lead and solo,"lacking" what Joe Perry played also?:):)

Steve B
It's just a personal preference. I'm not looking for anybody's approval.

I play the verse part with a money beat and 8th notes on the BD whereas they play it in half time. Kramer plays the snare, Ringo kept it on the toms. In the verse, I like to play it by riding on the crash for those 3 measure and after the solo part before the third verse I use 3 barks on the hats rather than a grab of the cymbal on the 1. It's subtle differences, but it just feels better to me, and like I've said, nobody has ever complained.
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Old 10-24-2013, 08:49 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

The crux of this particular biscuit is how one deals with critique. Critique can easily sound like criticism, and it's easy to deliver critique as criticism if one is not careful. Try and ignore any emotions a bad delivery stirs and focus on what's really being suggested. People can unintentionally hurt with words, just let it roll off your back.

On another note, it took me a while before I was able to hear everything going on. For a bunch of years in the beginning of my drumming journey, my "listening sphere" didn't expand past the drums. Playing good drums requires good listening skills, (means listening to the others) and a knowledge of what the role of the drumset is in an ensemble situation.

Like generally speaking, unless your name is Keith Moon, the drums are not a lead instrument. They lay down the pavement so the lead players can roll their leads out. Of course the drums are much more than that, but you have to have that going on as Job 1, generally speaking.
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Old 10-25-2013, 08:50 AM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

I knew Imagine wasn't Ringo, but that was an easily found clip that had the Ringoish vibe. I didn't know that Alan White was on the cut though. I can see Keltner or Gordon coping the vibe but I always thought of White in the Yes vein. Goes to show that a really good musician has more gears than you think.

That is one of the things that people starting out miss out on, I think. Copping the vibe and feel of the songs and the players on them. I think there is more to learn there that is musically useful than in complex time signatures and such. Somehow, you have to let go of the flash and recognize the skill needed to play all these different genres and feels. And feel the same sense of accomplishment when you get the feel that's on the original that you get when you manage to get though some elaborate riff.
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Old 10-25-2013, 04:08 PM
tamadrm tamadrm is offline
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

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Originally Posted by Midnite Zephyr View Post
It's just a personal preference. I'm not looking for anybody's approval.

I play the verse part with a money beat and 8th notes on the BD whereas they play it in half time. Kramer plays the snare, Ringo kept it on the toms. In the verse, I like to play it by riding on the crash for those 3 measure and after the solo part before the third verse I use 3 barks on the hats rather than a grab of the cymbal on the 1. It's subtle differences, but it just feels better to me, and like I've said, nobody has ever complained.
I think it's just awe inspiring that you aren't seeking anybodies approval.It's equally astounding that no ones has ever complained.Tacit approval can be inspiring

So because Ringos performance is DIFFERENT than yours,his was some how LACKING? Not just different....and totally original?

So no credit for actually coming up with the drum parts to an original song,and having to please three of the biggest celebrity musicians in the world,not to mention some of the most critical perfectionists in McCartney and producer,George Martin.

The ground work was already done.That's the hard part.

Steve B
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Old 10-25-2013, 04:22 PM
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Zurg,

Sorry to read you're having a hard time, no one likes to be beaten into the ground daily, not fun.

There has been a lot of good advise given here, you're new to the site, so It may read like tough love, but those who have offered advice are good folk, and are looking to help.

One point I would echo, is to try and have a quite word with the MD, at a time when he is not rushed, and ask for some pointers and examples of where he feels things are not going right, it will show you care, and are willing to ask for help.

If it is a question of maybe you're overplaying, try to get this out of your system when you're practicing on your own, then put on your Ringo hat for rehearsals.

Lastly, drumming is meant to be fun, even in a band or drumline, so keep your head high, and realise after 3 years of drumming you're the one on the stool, not someone else, so its not all going wrong!

Please keep us up to date with how things progress.

Last edited by HMNY; 10-25-2013 at 04:23 PM. Reason: need to proof read more!
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Old 10-25-2013, 07:08 PM
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drummer-russ drummer-russ is offline
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Larry, I thought it was the Apostrophe!

"The crux of this particular biscuit is how one deals with critique"
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Old 10-25-2013, 08:06 PM
mikel mikel is offline
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

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Originally Posted by tamadrm View Post
I think it's just awe inspiring that you aren't seeking anybodies approval.It's equally astounding that no ones has ever complained.Tacit approval can be inspiring

So because Ringos performance is DIFFERENT than yours,his was some how LACKING? Not just different....and totally original?

So no credit for actually coming up with the drum parts to an original song,and having to please three of the biggest celebrity musicians in the world,not to mention some of the most critical perfectionists in McCartney and producer,George Martin.

The ground work was already done.That's the hard part.

Steve B
Nice one Tad.

That is the whole crux of being a musician, coming up with the part in the first instance. Its ok guys saying, I can play that, that's easy.....but they did not have the nouse to come up with it as an original piece.

As Stewart Copeland said: "Slavish devotion to copying and emulation is the death of musical creativity. .’ That whole thing of replicating what others do is a siren call. The sirens lure you to the rocks of unoriginality."
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Old 10-25-2013, 08:22 PM
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Midnite Zephyr Midnite Zephyr is offline
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Default Re: Am I a terrible drummer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tamadrm View Post
I think it's just awe inspiring that you aren't seeking anybodies approval.It's equally astounding that no ones has ever complained.Tacit approval can be inspiring

So because Ringos performance is DIFFERENT than yours,his was some how LACKING? Not just different....and totally original?

So no credit for actually coming up with the drum parts to an original song,and having to please three of the biggest celebrity musicians in the world,not to mention some of the most critical perfectionists in McCartney and producer,George Martin.

The ground work was already done.That's the hard part.

Steve B
I don't care as much as you do. Ringo can go pound sand. Sorry that I don't hold all these drummers in such high regard as you do. I like playing things my own way and hitting the signature parts. If I think a part is lacking, then I make it my own. If I can't play a part, then I do what I can. I don't hold such a deep reverence for the original song parts like you guys.

So freakin' what?
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