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  #1  
Old 10-09-2013, 11:04 PM
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Default Heat gun on Resos

I was watching a head changing demo online and the gentleman used a heat gun to form the reso head to the snare bed after tightening the lugs JAW. I have never seen this done before and wondered if any of you do this and what benefit it provides if any?....... Terry
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Old 10-09-2013, 11:15 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by AZStickman View Post
I was watching a head changing demo online and the gentleman used a heat gun to form the reso head to the snare bed after tightening the lugs JAW. I have never seen this done before and wondered if any of you do this and what benefit it provides if any?....... Terry
I always use a hair dryer to do the same thing with all of my heads when I seat them and tune them up. It is said to help the head seat to the bearing edge faster. It seems to be easier to get things in tune since I started doing it.

The way I do it, however is, I crank the head up nice and tight, tune it to itself, run the heat around the edge, let it cool, then I bring it back down to JAW, and then tune to the pitch I want. It all goes pretty fast once you get used to it.
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Old 10-10-2013, 12:07 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by TColumbia37 View Post
I always use a hair dryer to do the same thing with all of my heads when I seat them and tune them up. It is said to help the head seat to the bearing edge faster. It seems to be easier to get things in tune since I started doing it.

The way I do it, however is, I crank the head up nice and tight, tune it to itself, run the heat around the edge, let it cool, then I bring it back down to JAW, and then tune to the pitch I want. It all goes pretty fast once you get used to it.
Interesting...... I would be nervous using a heat gun for fear of melting the head, but a hair dryer wouldn't get hot enough to worry about. I may have to give it a try next time I do a head change out....... Terry
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  #4  
Old 10-10-2013, 12:18 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

Bob Gatzen recommends this too. Heads are made out of a petroleum product, and petroleum products shrink when heated. It's somewhat like shrinkwrap. Get the outer edge of the head warm, but not hot. Bob says that as soon as it's warm, it's seated. Although, never tighten a snare side head down further than you're going to tune it because they can be permanently overstretched by doing that. Batter heads should be stretched though. It will reduce the amount of times you have to retune the head.
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  #5  
Old 10-10-2013, 12:22 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by AZStickman View Post
Interesting...... I would be nervous using a heat gun for fear of melting the head, but a hair dryer wouldn't get hot enough to worry about. I may have to give it a try next time I do a head change out....... Terry
I have the same reservations about this. I would also worry about using a heat gun around wood. If too hot, would the plys start to separate, or could the head possibly melt to the bearing edge and infuse itself into the pores of the wood?

I once read that you can remove dents from heads using a hair dryer. It does not work. A heat gun might, however, if one is really careful while doing so.
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Old 10-10-2013, 12:28 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by MrInsanePolack View Post
I have the same reservations about this. I would also worry about using a heat gun around wood. If too hot, would the plys start to separate, or could the head possibly melt to the bearing edge and infuse itself into the pores of the wood?

I once read that you can remove dents from heads using a hair dryer. It does not work. A heat gun might, however, if one is really careful while doing so.
The heat gun he may be referring to might be just a re-purposed hair dryer. I think I saw the same video today because the person doing it called it a "heat gun" even though it looked like a hair dryer to me.

Either way, Bob Gatzen uses (or used to use) a hair dryer to seat his heads. He would slowly warm up the outer edge of the head until it was warm and then he could go directly into removing all of the tension and start tuning.
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  #7  
Old 10-10-2013, 01:03 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

I have never used a heat gun or hair dryer.

For many years I have been re-tuning my new heads after the first time I play the drum.
I always thought that the drum head seats itself after a little hard playing. I play rock and roll.

My process has always been:
Install new head and tune. Play the drum hard for at least an hour. Then re-tune the head.



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  #8  
Old 10-10-2013, 01:06 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

Actually in the video I watched he was using a heat gun like you can buy at Lowes or Home Depot for removing wall paper. I have one just like it in my shop I use for heat bending wood...They get real hot........... Terry
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  #9  
Old 10-10-2013, 01:08 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

It's weird how I've never heard anyone talk about Gatzen's playing ever, but anytime "tuning" comes up in a thread, he'll get mentioned 75 times. A bit odd, but I guess that's his calling.
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  #10  
Old 10-10-2013, 01:35 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by Hollywood Jim View Post
I have never used a heat gun or hair dryer.

For many years I have been re-tuning my new heads after the first time I play the drum.
I always thought that the drum head seats itself after a little hard playing. I play rock and roll.

My process has always been:
Install new head and tune. Play the drum hard for at least an hour. Then re-tune the head.



.
I'm not sure, but I think that warming up the outer edge with a hair dryer while it's seating eliminates the need to do this because it seats the head immediately because the head acts a little like shrink wrap. It's not that we need to get the head hot, but just warm. As he demonstrates this, he's going around the edge about 2 lugs per second about an inch or two away, about 2 or 3 complete passes.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Watso View Post
It's weird how I've never heard anyone talk about Gatzen's playing ever, but anytime "tuning" comes up in a thread, he'll get mentioned 75 times. A bit odd, but I guess that's his calling.
Yeah, he's not known for his drumming. Sure, he's a drummer, but his focus has been on sound and design in the drum industry. He's been involved in the development of more products and other drum-related things than I think most people realize.
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  #11  
Old 10-10-2013, 06:26 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by Dr_Watso View Post
It's weird how I've never heard anyone talk about Gatzen's playing ever, but anytime "tuning" comes up in a thread, he'll get mentioned 75 times. A bit odd, but I guess that's his calling.
True! Does he have any videos on Youtube that actually show him playing, like in context with a band??

Hmmm?

I sure he does, I just too lazy right now to look for it. :-(
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  #12  
Old 10-10-2013, 06:35 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by mmulcahy1 View Post
True! Does he have any videos on Youtube that actually show him playing, like in context with a band??

Hmmm?

I sure he does, I just too lazy right now to look for it. :-(
Unfortunately, no. I'd like to see that too because I bet he would have a fantastic sound.
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  #13  
Old 10-10-2013, 06:46 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

The dude in fact DOES play!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXt5GICDJ0A
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  #14  
Old 10-10-2013, 06:54 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

Not into it myself. Just like guitar strings, drum heads stretch. Deal and tune. I have never taken a hair dryer to the bridge or nut or strings of my guitars to "seat" anything. And I will not to my drums. JMO! but I say, let Nature take it's course.
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  #15  
Old 10-10-2013, 07:00 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by Razbo View Post
Not into it myself. Just like guitar strings, drum heads stretch. Deal and tune. I have never taken a hair dryer to the bridge or nut or strings of my guitars to "seat" anything. And I will not to my drums. JMO! but I say, let Nature take it's course.
Well, that's because taking a heat gun to the bridge would do nothing, and to the nut could potentially melt the glue.. Do you not pull on your strings while tuning up to stretch them?

I don't see a problem with speeding up nature a little bit. I know that I would personally rather spend less time tuning and more time playing.
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  #16  
Old 10-10-2013, 07:01 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by Razbo View Post
Not into it myself. Just like guitar strings, drum heads stretch. Deal and tune. I have never taken a hair dryer to the bridge or nut or strings of my guitars to "seat" anything. And I will not to my drums. JMO! but I say, let Nature take it's course.
Heads are made out of a petroleum product, and therefore they react to heat like shrinkwrap, although it's very subtle. That's why they seat instantly when the collar is warmed up after tightening the head down evenly. Guitar strings won't do that since they're not made out of a petroleum product.

So, you can either wait, or you can do it instantly. Both get the same results, except one is much faster. It's handy for when changing heads at a gig.
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  #17  
Old 10-10-2013, 07:02 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by MrInsanePolack View Post
The dude in fact DOES play!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXt5GICDJ0A
But we're looking for footage of him playing with a band. We've all seen videos like this.
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  #18  
Old 10-10-2013, 05:22 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post
Both get the same results, except one is much faster. It's handy for when changing heads at a gig.
Great, now I have to start carrying a hair dryer to all of my gigs! Actually not a half bad idea, what with how I'm usually dripping with sweat after a 30 minute set. I already have to bring a change of clothes so I don't stink everybody out.
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  #19  
Old 10-10-2013, 05:38 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

If Bob Gatzen does it, it has to be correct. He reminds me of a cult leader with the following he has for tuning. It was like when Neil Peart was working with Freddy Gruber. In his interviews every other word was Freddy Gruber. It got to the point of demi god worship. I wonder if Bob sits back and laughs " they are actually doing the hair dryer thing" .
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Old 10-10-2013, 05:51 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by The Old Hyde View Post
If Bob Gatzen does it, it has to be correct. He reminds me of a cult leader with the following he has for tuning. It was like when Neil Peart was working with Freddy Gruber. In his interviews every other word was Freddy Gruber. It got to the point of demi god worship. I wonder if Bob sits back and laughs " they are actually doing the hair dryer thing" .
I'm waiting for Bob to pee on a drum head before seating it to see if the Bobites follow suit.
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  #21  
Old 10-10-2013, 05:53 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

I was under the impression that modern heads didn't need seating. That was old technology. I haven't done that since my hair was all blonde
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  #22  
Old 10-10-2013, 06:00 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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I was under the impression that modern heads didn't need seating. That was old technology. I haven't done that since my hair was all blonde
LOL..... We need pics....... Terry
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  #23  
Old 10-10-2013, 07:18 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by MrInsanePolack View Post
The dude in fact DOES play!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXt5GICDJ0A
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post
But we're looking for footage of him playing with a band. We've all seen videos like this.
Yes, the dude does play. Nobody's arguing that fact, but has anybody ever seen video of him playing with actual other real people?

You know, like performing a song
- live
- onstage
- with a band
- without headphones
- in front of real people
- sweating???
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  #24  
Old 10-10-2013, 07:44 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

Man I would never even get a blow dryer that close to my shell, let alone a heat gun. I crank my snare reso so tight anyway that this is just an extra unnecessary step. I tried ironing a dented drum head once. Yea that didn't work out too good. No heat for me. Or pee. Lol Muckster!
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  #25  
Old 10-10-2013, 07:59 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

It seems to me that if you do this, the head is on that drum and that drum only. While i concede every head has a certain amount of life and thats it, i may want use old heads for cheaper drums that im buying and selling. And to top it all off, being ocd about drumming does not make you any better of a drummer. It just makes you ocd about drumming.
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  #26  
Old 10-10-2013, 08:05 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

The Drum Tuning Bible also mentions a little heat to speed up the seating process. He says the alternative would be to let the drum sit for 12 hours.

http://www.menet.umn.edu/~kgeisler/Tuning.pdf

I don't have a hair dryer (don't have hair either, but I digress) so used a heat gun with trepidation. I practiced a LOT on my hand and anything that resembled a thin flat surface. When I applied heat to the head I followed directly behind the hot spot with the palm of my off hand to monitor the process.

Did it make a difference? I can't say for certain, as it was the first time I used Coated Ambassadors over Clear Diplomats. From what I recall, they only needed a minor tweak in the next week or so. Will I do it again? Probably not.
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Old 10-10-2013, 08:23 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

I'll mention this technique to my Roadies and see what they think.



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  #28  
Old 10-14-2013, 08:48 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by TColumbia37 View Post
Well, that's because taking a heat gun to the bridge would do nothing, and to the nut could potentially melt the glue.. Do you not pull on your strings while tuning up to stretch them?

I don't see a problem with speeding up nature a little bit. I know that I would personally rather spend less time tuning and more time playing.
Sorry to bump this old thread. I saw I posted and couldn't remember doing so. I think I was "feeling a bit silly" when I did.

Yes, I do stretch my strings when I change them. Thoroughly, using the "suitcase method". I still need to retune a fair bit for the first hour or so.

When changing heads, I press most of my weight in the center with a cloth, which I feel is a comparable effort to string stretching. I still need to retune them after a while, and this is even the case with well worn (presumably well stretched) heads due, probably, to atmospheric changes. I know moving my guitars from one place to another almost guarantees a retuning, while they can stay in tune for days if the temperatures are stable.

The idea of adding heat just seems odd to me, and I'd be afraid agitating those molecules would affect the integrity of the skin somehow. If it is something some folks believe in, maybe I'll give it a try.

Edit to add:

Also, I must confess, since my long absence from drumming, I have not been exposed to serious tuning and retuning yet. This past Saturday, I spent the entire day changing heads and tuning up two sets of drums. My perspective on 'anything that speeds up the process' could be rapidly changing!
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Old 10-14-2013, 09:41 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by Razbo View Post
Sorry to bump this old thread. I saw I posted and couldn't remember doing so. I think I was "feeling a bit silly" when I did.

Yes, I do stretch my strings when I change them. Thoroughly, using the "suitcase method". I still need to retune a fair bit for the first hour or so.

When changing heads, I press most of my weight in the center with a cloth, which I feel is a comparable effort to string stretching. I still need to retune them after a while, and this is even the case with well worn (presumably well stretched) heads due, probably, to atmospheric changes. I know moving my guitars from one place to another almost guarantees a retuning, while they can stay in tune for days if the temperatures are stable.

The idea of adding heat just seems odd to me, and I'd be afraid agitating those molecules would affect the integrity of the skin somehow. If it is something some folks believe in, maybe I'll give it a try.

Edit to add:

Also, I must confess, since my long absence from drumming, I have not been exposed to serious tuning and retuning yet. This past Saturday, I spent the entire day changing heads and tuning up two sets of drums. My perspective on 'anything that speeds up the process' could be rapidly changing!
Okay, see I thought you were essentially saying that you just throw the heads on, tune them up, and play and retune until they're seated. I also put pressure on my heads, to stretch them and crack the glue. The heat is just a little extra step that seems to make a difference for the better. I would recommend everybody give it a try, because they don't really stand to lose anything unless they use too much heat. The amount of heat it takes isn't enough to damage anything, as you just get it a little warm.
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  #30  
Old 10-14-2013, 10:13 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

Bob Gatzen also says that due to the coriolis effect, all drums tuned in the southern hemisphere should from this point forward, have left hand threads on the tuning lugs and only be tuned counterclockwise.
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Old 10-14-2013, 11:07 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by The Old Hyde View Post
Bob Gatzen also says that due to the coriolis effect, all drums tuned in the southern hemisphere should from this point forward, have left hand threads on the tuning lugs and only be tuned counterclockwise.
There really REALLY should be "Like" buttons for posts on this forum.
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  #32  
Old 10-14-2013, 11:08 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Yes, I do stretch my strings when I change them. Thoroughly, using the "suitcase method". I still need to retune a fair bit for the first hour or so.
What is the "suitcase method"?
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Old 10-15-2013, 03:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Razbo View Post
Sorry to bump this old thread. I saw I posted and couldn't remember doing so. I think I was "feeling a bit silly" when I did.

Yes, I do stretch my strings when I change them. Thoroughly, using the "suitcase method". I still need to retune a fair bit for the first hour or so.

When changing heads, I press most of my weight in the center with a cloth, which I feel is a comparable effort to string stretching. I still need to retune them after a while, and this is even the case with well worn (presumably well stretched) heads due, probably, to atmospheric changes. I know moving my guitars from one place to another almost guarantees a retuning, while they can stay in tune for days if the temperatures are stable.

The idea of adding heat just seems odd to me, and I'd be afraid agitating those molecules would affect the integrity of the skin somehow. If it is something some folks believe in, maybe I'll give it a try.

Edit to add:

Also, I must confess, since my long absence from drumming, I have not been exposed to serious tuning and retuning yet. This past Saturday, I spent the entire day changing heads and tuning up two sets of drums. My perspective on 'anything that speeds up the process' could be rapidly changing!
Heads are made out of a petroleum product, and so heat makes the heads act a little bit like shrinkwrap. As Bob Gatzen says, petroleum products shrink when heated. So, getting them warm (not hot) around the edge when they are evenly tensioned down very hard will seat the head instantly. It will not harm the head nor the shell because you're not using anywhere near enough heat to do any damage, especially if you're using the low setting on a hair dryer, or if you're using the high setting and going around the circumference of the head rather fast, like 2-3 lugs per second on a 10-lug drum. Going that fast 2-4 times around the head will be perfect and will only get the head warm, not hot and therefore it's harmless.

Besides, humidity is far more harmful to wood than heat. The air coming out of a hair dryer is only as humid as the air that it's pulling in through the intake side.
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  #34  
Old 10-15-2013, 03:58 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by Bobrush View Post
What is the "suitcase method"?
I read that term somewhere. Grab a string around the middle like a suitcase handle and pull it up from the body. To be honest, I actually stopped using that after I broke one. I usually just bend each string up a couple full steps repeatedly until they are all staying in tune.

The details of guitar are already fading as drums take over all waking thoughts.
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  #35  
Old 10-15-2013, 04:03 AM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post
Heads are made out of a petroleum product, and so heat makes the heads act a little bit like shrinkwrap. As Bob Gatzen says, petroleum products shrink when heated. So, getting them warm (not hot) around the edge when they are evenly tensioned down very hard will seat the head instantly. It will not harm the head nor the shell because you're not using anywhere near enough heat to do any damage, especially if you're using the low setting on a hair dryer, or if you're using the high setting and going around the circumference of the head rather fast, like 2-3 lugs per second on a 10-lug drum. Going that fast 2-4 times around the head will be perfect and will only get the head warm, not hot and therefore it's harmless.

Besides, humidity is far more harmful to wood than heat. The air coming out of a hair dryer is only as humid as the air that it's pulling in through the intake side.
Gatzen ought to know what he's taking about. Still seems a bit unnatural, since the normal process for a drum head would be to stretch, not shrink. Could be innovation to take advantage of, though. I will try this on my next head change and see how it goes.
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Old 10-15-2013, 04:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Razbo View Post
Gatzen ought to know what he's taking about. Still seems a bit unnatural, since the normal process for a drum head would be to stretch, not shrink. Could be innovation to take advantage of, though. I will try this on my next head change and see how it goes.
Yeah, but what you're trying to do is custom-fit the collar to your drum. In other words, you're altering the shape of the collar in order to fit your drum perfectly. Or to put it in another way, if you were able to have the heads manufactured to fit your drums perfectly where the collar is already fitting your drums like a custom-made glove, then you wouldn't need to do this.

So, a huge innovation would be having a wide range of heads that are specifically designed to fit a particular drum like a glove. For example: heads that are designed to fit the exact size and bearing edge of my Stage Customs. Of course, this would be very difficult to keep up with due to the changes that drum manufacturers like to make to their drums. So, we have a very generic collar shape to start with instead.

Fortunately, Aquarian and now Evans have a collar that's designed to sit much better on the bearing edge, to sit perfectly level as opposed to being able to wobble or teeter-totter it.
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Old 10-15-2013, 04:31 AM
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GRUNTERSDAD GRUNTERSDAD is offline
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

All I want is for my drum head to sit tight and evenly against the bearing edges, batter or reso. This will happen with no problem if the edge is clean and the head is tightened evenly. Maybe we need to put the heads on loose and give the whole thing a spin in the clothes dryer. Over tighten if you wish and then detune down to the proper place, but my hair dryer will remain with the Goodwill where I last saw it when I said good bye. and why is this in the General Discussion to begin with. It belongs in the heads area. Moved.
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Old 10-15-2013, 04:39 AM
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Default Re: Heat gun on Resos

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Originally Posted by Razbo View Post
I read that term somewhere. Grab a string around the middle like a suitcase handle and pull it up from the body. To be honest, I actually stopped using that after I broke one. I usually just bend each string up a couple full steps repeatedly until they are all staying in tune.

The details of guitar are already fading as drums take over all waking thoughts.
Oh, kind of like each string is treated as a handle. I've seen that done before.
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Old 10-16-2013, 05:49 PM
EvansSpecialist EvansSpecialist is offline
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by GRUNTERSDAD View Post
I was under the impression that modern heads didn't need seating. That was old technology. I haven't done that since my hair was all blonde
Only if my "modern" you mean Level 360 ;-)

I wouldn't recommend the hair dryer/heat gun technique if you've got Evans heads with the Level 360 collar (I really wouldn't recommend it otherwise either, unless you can insure that your application of heat will be completely uniform). We go to great lengths in order to minimize the amount of heat used when forming our collars. Because of the Level 360 collar design, the head is already sitting flat on the shell and doesn't require over-tensioning, CPR, hair driers, mystic voodoo, or monkey chants. :-)
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Old 10-16-2013, 06:02 PM
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Default Re: Heat Gun on Snare Reso Head

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Originally Posted by EvansSpecialist View Post
I wouldn't recommend the hair dryer/heat gun technique if you've got Evans heads with the Level 360 collar (I really wouldn't recommend it otherwise either, unless you can insure that your application of heat will be completely uniform). We go to great lengths in order to minimize the amount of heat used when forming our collars. Because of the Level 360 collar design, the head is already sitting flat on the shell and doesn't require over-tensioning, CPR, hair driers, mystic voodoo, or monkey chants. :-)
yeah but Bob Gatzen said to do it. I mean if he said it..
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