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  #41  
Old 05-25-2013, 04:52 PM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Originally Posted by aydee View Post
...

Sad that everything in the end somehow boils down to ethnic/racial profiling because, we, the recipients of the grand media buffet have absolutely nothing else to hold on to except a fleeting image or clip of a black person, a brown person, or whomever, associated with our daily diet of gruesomeness.

To quote Bob Marley, I'm not quite sure what " All the Trouble in the World" is but this global fear psychosis based on color and religion is doing a lot of damage that will take generations to undo.

What a frikkin mess.


...
Who said anything about race? The butchers claimed their God told them to do it. People who are stoning homosexuals to death, chopping off hands and feet of thieves, throwing acid in womens' faces, burning women to death, burning down libraries, demonstrating to destroy liberal democracy, slashing the throats of artists and beheading their critics are all saying their particular God told them to do it. And we aint' talking about Buddha here!

To quote Maya Angelou, "If someone shows you who they are, believe them"
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  #42  
Old 05-25-2013, 06:00 PM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Originally Posted by Deathmetalconga View Post
Who said anything about race? The butchers claimed their God told them to do it. People who are stoning homosexuals to death, chopping off hands and feet of thieves, throwing acid in womens' faces, burning women to death, burning down libraries, demonstrating to destroy liberal democracy, slashing the throats of artists and beheading their critics are all saying their particular God told them to do it. And we aint' talking about Buddha here!

To quote Maya Angelou, "If someone shows you who they are, believe them"
No disagreement on your point here, DMC, but we are getting into a very broad and deep discussion here, perhaps better had over a drink.
My point, very simply, is that the media's tendency to ID a 'monster' by race or religious persuasion, is often misunderstood by most people on either side the debate and creates more friction than neccesary.

The answers are always beneath the surface, but 'breaking news' never seems to have the time for that. All thats left then, is just a lot of hate. That saddens me.


...
  #43  
Old 05-25-2013, 08:52 PM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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As for the beheading of a British citizen on our own streets, it is essentially bringing war to our front door. The liberals among us may disagree with this next statement but everyone I've spoken to it about (I work in the supply industry and spend a lot of time 'chatting' to people of all ages and races - including Muslims) believe that this is the time to say that enough is enough, shut the borders, declare emergency and scoop up all the extremists, immigrant criminals and people that don't deserve to be here and ship them back to the rat-pit countries they belong too!.
I'm a liberal, and I also try to think rationally. We did that to the Japanese-Americans after the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor. Yet another ugly mark on our history. I really think it was just a hate crime, but my perspective is from the outside looking in.
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  #44  
Old 05-25-2013, 09:27 PM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

Out of respect for the deceased I have deleted my posts in this thread.

Last edited by zarrdoss; 05-26-2013 at 02:55 PM. Reason: it was the right thing to do
  #45  
Old 05-25-2013, 09:56 PM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Originally Posted by aydee View Post
No disagreement on your point here, DMC, but we are getting into a very broad and deep discussion here, perhaps better had over a drink.
My point, very simply, is that the media's tendency to ID a 'monster' by race or religious persuasion, is often misunderstood by most people on either side the debate and creates more friction than neccesary.

The answers are always beneath the surface, but 'breaking news' never seems to have the time for that. All thats left then, is just a lot of hate. That saddens me.


...
Agreed, it's always good to be on guard against any kind of -ism. But when the people doing evil tell you repeatedly why they are doing evil - if they stand in front of a camera with blood on their hands and explain it to you - at some point, you should take the evildoers at their word.
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  #46  
Old 05-26-2013, 12:32 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

I too was very saddened by a senseless act of murder.Doing so in the name of a belief system is further proof that terrorists need little provocation to take human life.

This young man, chose to serve his country in the military; a selfless and altruistic act.

I applaude him for voluntarily placing himself into harms way.

Those humanoids that did this,need to be turned over to that soldiers family members.

Rest easy soldier.

Steve B
  #47  
Old 05-26-2013, 12:38 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Originally Posted by Deathmetalconga View Post
Agreed, it's always good to be on guard against any kind of -ism. But when the people doing evil tell you repeatedly why they are doing evil - if they stand in front of a camera with blood on their hands and explain it to you - at some point, you should take the evildoers at their word.
Very good analogy. Now if we could just get our governments and there bias media to think that way
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  #48  
Old 05-26-2013, 12:49 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Originally Posted by zarrdoss View Post
At times like this I just have to come to the realization that there is no getting through to some people and add a few to the ignore list, actually for the first time since I have been on here.
Good luck to you all.
Here's a summary of our discussion Zarrd:

Statement: You're safer with a gun. This would never happen in America (Texas actually, put took your wider point) because we have guns.
Response: No you're not, and it has in fact happened in America. Gun ownership didn't save anyone or solve anything in those cases.
Result: Right, I'm putting you on the ignored list.


You're gonna run and hide because you don't like the counter argument? I'm more than happy to drop the whole thing.....but putting me on an ignore list for questioning what I perceive to be a few glaring holes in your initial argument is a little feeble, not to mention a lot defeatist, don't you think?

Come one mate, you're better than that.
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  #49  
Old 05-26-2013, 01:25 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

PFOG, you're right. It's already been said that a gun would not have helped the soldier - he was run down by a car. Guns won't help if you're ambushed like that unless you're Quick Draw McGraw on constant lookout. I'd rather play the odds than live wired up like that.

zarrdoss, I think that we should do more to deal with overpopulation and women's education in developing countries, resource scarcity and climate change but I don't shoehorn my political views into irrelevant threads. We all feel passionate about whatever stuff we think we should be passionate about, but it comes down to dialling it back a notch for the sake of everyone's sanity.
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  #50  
Old 05-26-2013, 03:48 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold View Post
Here's a summary of our discussion Zarrd:

Statement: You're safer with a gun. This would never happen in America (Texas actually, put took your wider point) because we have guns.
Response: No you're not, and it has in fact happened in America. Gun ownership didn't save anyone or solve anything in those cases.
Result: Right, I'm putting you on the ignored list.


You're gonna run and hide because you don't like the counter argument? I'm more than happy to drop the whole thing.....but putting me on an ignore list for questioning what I perceive to be a few glaring holes in your initial argument is a little feeble, not to mention a lot defeatist, don't you think?

Come one mate, you're better than that.
You appear to be doing your part to escalate things.
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  #51  
Old 05-26-2013, 04:01 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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You appear to be doing your part to escalate things.
I'd never have pegged you as one to be threatened by balance and common sense, DMC.
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  #52  
Old 05-26-2013, 04:40 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

Perhaps a separate thread on gun control in the off topic lounge would be a good thing, then it wouldn't have to creep into threads like this one, where I think all the OP really wanted to do on behalf of, and with support of all us was say so long and rest easy drummer pal.
  #53  
Old 05-26-2013, 04:54 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Originally Posted by CCdrummer View Post
Perhaps a separate thread on gun control in the off topic lounge would be a good thing, then it wouldn't have to creep into threads like this one, where I think all the OP really wanted to do on behalf of, and with support of all us was say so long and rest easy drummer pal.
Not gonna happen. The forum rules explicitly state that political discussions are off-limits here. As well they should be. People just can't seem to help themselves.

Anyway, this is a terrible tragedy and my heart goes out to the loved ones of this soldier. Hell, this affects ALL of us. Just awful.
  #54  
Old 05-26-2013, 05:01 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

‘Once a Fusilier, always a Fusilier’.

&

"Once a Drummer, always a Drummer".

... Rest In Peace - Soldier Drummer!
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  #55  
Old 05-26-2013, 05:25 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Hell, this affects ALL of us.
Well, now you've got me wondering. Not to be confrontational or disagreeable in any way, but I'm curious to know how the murder of this British soldier affects us all?
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  #56  
Old 05-26-2013, 05:48 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Well, now you've got me wondering. Not to be confrontational or disagreeable in any way, but I'm curious to know how the murder of this British soldier affects us all?
I just mean in the sense that so many of us have been impacted by terrorism and its after-effects that incidents like this resonate with people far and wide. I guess I can't speak for everyone, but people around me in my little corner of the world have been affected by it.
  #57  
Old 05-26-2013, 05:52 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Well, now you've got me wondering. Not to be confrontational or disagreeable in any way, but I'm curious to know how the murder of this British soldier affects us all?
It's a precedent that will now cost all western countries in implementing expensive knee jerk reactions. Of course we all have far more chance of dying in a car or by a self-inflicted gunshot wound but ...
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  #58  
Old 05-26-2013, 06:14 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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It's a precedent that will now cost all western countries in implementing expensive knee jerk reactions. Of course we all have far more chance of dying in a car or by a self-inflicted gunshot wound but ...
Yes, that is exactly how it ends up affecting most of us.
  #59  
Old 05-26-2013, 06:29 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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I'd never have pegged you as one to be threatened by balance and common sense, DMC.
Correct you are. But I can see when people are antagonizing each other.
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  #60  
Old 05-26-2013, 06:37 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Originally Posted by 8Mile View Post
I just mean in the sense that so many of us have been impacted by terrorism and its after-effects that incidents like this resonate with people far and wide. I guess I can't speak for everyone, but people around me in my little corner of the world have been affected by it.
Seriously? People in Detroit have been affected by the murder of this British soldier?
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  #61  
Old 05-26-2013, 06:56 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Seriously? People in Detroit have been affected by the murder of this British soldier?
I guess you were affected enough by it to read this thread, right? Me, too.

News travels fast in the age of the internets.
  #62  
Old 05-26-2013, 06:59 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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I guess you were affected enough by it to read this thread, right? Me, too.

News travels fast in the age of the internets.
Well, no. I'm actually not affected by it at all, to be completely honest. You just can't be affected by everything, can you?

And I still don't see the impact this would have on the citizens on Detroit, I mean I don't see any connection, sorry.
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  #63  
Old 05-26-2013, 07:01 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Well, no. I'm actually not affected by it at all, to be completely honest. You just can't be affected by everything, can you?
I guess not.

On the other hand, we're both sad that Ed Shaughnessy has passed. Even though I'm here in Detroit and you're in the lumpen post-industrial district.
  #64  
Old 05-26-2013, 07:04 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Correct you are. But I can see when people are antagonizing each other.
I don't see it that way, but that's not to diminish the fact that you do. Perhaps a better alternative would just be to put the whole forum on ignore and never be challenged again? :-)
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  #65  
Old 05-26-2013, 07:06 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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I guess not.

On the other hand, we're both sad that Ed Shaughnessy has passed. Even though I'm here in Detroit and you're in the lumpen post-industrial district.
I'm surprised at how sad I actually feel about Ed Shaughnessy dying.
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  #66  
Old 05-26-2013, 10:56 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

Everyone in the UK and the USA should be affected by this. This is a scary thing to happen and for, finally, there to be at-home brutal terrorism on our streets that's isn't orchestrated by our own governments (yes, I mean 9/11 and 7/7, even a monkey could see that was nothing to do with Al Qaeda!) is a big shock to people!

People need to turn off their televisions and read a bit more - thats the only way to protect yourself from the scaremongering and biased media output that the government rely on to control their citizens
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  #67  
Old 05-26-2013, 11:23 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Everyone in the UK and the USA should be affected by this. This is a scary thing to happen and for, finally, there to be at-home brutal terrorism on our streets that's isn't orchestrated by our own governments (yes, I mean 9/11 and 7/7, even a monkey could see that was nothing to do with Al Qaeda!) is a big shock to people!

People need to turn off their televisions and read a bit more - thats the only way to protect yourself from the scaremongering and biased media output that the government rely on to control their citizens
A not even remotely political post ;)
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  #68  
Old 05-26-2013, 11:34 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Originally Posted by keep it simple View Post
A not even remotely political post ;)
Haha, yeh, I like to think I veiled that pretty well :P master of subtlety me!
it's pretty much impossible to debate this particular subject without being political as it has it's roots firmly in politics.
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  #69  
Old 05-26-2013, 02:33 PM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

I just heard that more arrest have been made in connection with this young mans murder.So do you thing there is some kind of terrorist knife wielding death squad running around over there? very disturbing news you folks need to be very alert of your surroundings
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  #70  
Old 05-26-2013, 04:25 PM
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I just heard that more arrest have been made in connection with this young mans murder.So do you thing there is some kind of terrorist knife wielding death squad running around over there? very disturbing news you folks need to be very alert of your surroundings
Yes, in fact they do have such death squads.
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  #71  
Old 05-27-2013, 12:24 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Well, now you've got me wondering. Not to be confrontational or disagreeable in any way, but I'm curious to know how the murder of this British soldier affects us all?


I think it demonstrates that terrorism isn't confined to just a few countries, or the US.It's a global pandemic that effects every citizen of planet earth,no matter what nationality or beliefs they hold.

This soldier was beheaded in broad daylight,for what? Because he was a soldier.

People,all people have to realize that an attack of that nature is insanity and pure hatred personified.It was the complete antithisis of rational thinking.

This should serve to remind all of us,that if you see something,say something.

If as a rational being,you see a person or group of people doing something that seems out of place.....call the police,the FBI,Scotland yard,call law enforcement right away.It's your duty as a citizen of your country,and it's just the right thing to do,before this or what happened in Boston a month ago,happens in your neck of the woods.

Humans are fairly intuitive creaturers,trust your own.

Steve B.

Steve B

Last edited by tamadrm; 05-27-2013 at 07:32 PM.
  #72  
Old 05-27-2013, 02:20 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Well, no. I'm actually not affected by it at all, to be completely honest. You just can't be affected by everything, can you?

And I still don't see the impact this would have on the citizens on Detroit, I mean I don't see any connection, sorry.
I agree with you that you can't be affected by everything and I'm not saying we have to grieve and mourn the loss of every single person on the planet.
However, if you've become so de-sensitised to violence that when a person (not to mention soldier, father and fellow drummer) is run down and then hacked to death with machetes like a piece of meat and you don't even bat an eyelid- well, I feel sorry for you TBH.
  #73  
Old 05-27-2013, 04:07 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Originally Posted by JohnnySomersett View Post
Everyone in the UK and the USA should be affected by this. This is a scary thing to happen and for, finally, there to be at-home brutal terrorism on our streets that's isn't orchestrated by our own governments (yes, I mean 9/11 and 7/7, even a monkey could see that was nothing to do with Al Qaeda!) is a big shock to people!

People need to turn off their televisions and read a bit more - thats the only way to protect yourself from the scaremongering and biased media output that the government rely on to control their citizens


And why do you choose not to conspire about this event?
  #74  
Old 05-27-2013, 04:50 AM
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I agree with you that you can't be affected by everything and I'm not saying we have to grieve and mourn the loss of every single person on the planet.
However, if you've become so de-sensitised to violence that when a person (not to mention soldier, father and fellow drummer) is run down and then hacked to death with machetes like a piece of meat and you don't even bat an eyelid- well, I feel sorry for you TBH.
Well, I can assure you that I've not become desensitized to violence.

I don't know about the fellow drummer thing. That's taking it a bit far, isn't it?
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Old 05-27-2013, 05:37 AM
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

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Well, I can assure you that I've not become desensitized to violence.

I don't know about the fellow drummer thing. That's taking it a bit far, isn't it?
Didn't mean to imply that we were all best buddies with the guy or anything but he was a drummer (as we all are on this forum)- therefore, he was a fellow drummer.
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Old 05-27-2013, 05:55 AM
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Didn't mean to imply that we were all best buddies with the guy or anything but he was a drummer (as we all are on this forum)- therefore, he was a fellow drummer.
If he'd been a member of this forum then yes, of course I could understand the reaction.

But the thing is, nobody'd ever heard of him before he was a victim. And we wouldn't give a monkey's arse about him anyway if the news hadn't reported that he'd been a snare drummer in the army.

Really now.
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  #77  
Old 05-27-2013, 06:13 AM
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If he'd been a member of this forum then yes, of course I could understand the reaction.

But the thing is, nobody'd ever heard of him before he was a victim. And we wouldn't give a monkey's arse about him anyway if the news hadn't reported that he'd been a snare drummer in the army.

Really now.
You're right- no-one on this forum would have given a "monkey's arse" that a human being was butchered in the street (what's the big deal- happens every day right)? It was only the fact that he was a drummer that we cared about the story.

Really now.
  #78  
Old 05-27-2013, 06:40 AM
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You're right- no-one on this forum would have given a "monkey's arse" that a human being was butchered in the street (what's the big deal- happens every day right)? It was only the fact that he was a drummer that we cared about the story.

Really now.
You've missed the point, though. If you'd never heard of him, why would you care about him?
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  #79  
Old 05-27-2013, 07:41 AM
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Anon La Ply Anon La Ply is offline
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

Jay, I think what people are saying is they were disturbed by the story. It's pretty gruesome and seems to cross a boundary where we figured that we'd be safe from this kind of attack in populated areas in broad daylight.

Obviously it's still very unlikely (much less risk than car crashes etc) but now we know it's possible. People don't like these kinds of boundaries being crossed. It feels like a loss - not just in personal terms but also felt more widely.
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Old 05-27-2013, 07:50 AM
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toddmc toddmc is offline
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Default Re: English drummer killed in attack.

Quote:
Originally Posted by con struct View Post
You've missed the point, though. If you'd never heard of him, why would you care about him?
OK let's try it from this angle- do you have a complete lack of empathy for this man and the circumstances of how he died?
You are correct in that I don't care in the same way I would if someone close to me had died (and no, his death doesn't directly affect my daily life) but I can at least empathise (the key word here) with this guys family and what they're going through.
Maybe I've misunderstood (wouldn't be the first time) but your posts seem to be suggesting that since nobody here on this forum knew him personally (as far as I know) we waive the right to care about the wider issues surrounding this horrific event?
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