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  #41  
Old 09-29-2012, 03:44 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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I guess that's where critical thinking would come into play.
For sure. I agree with you about the predators. Some of the spam I get worries me a bit because I can imagine elderly noobs worrying about the stern message from the "bank" saying their account will be closed and donated to The Businessman's Club unless they immediately prove their identity with name, address, DOB, credit card number, expiry date and verification code etc.

Darwinian, really.
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  #42  
Old 09-29-2012, 05:41 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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I did read this study...and the study released shortly afterward discrediting most of the facts presented. In fact I believe some of the people involved are being investigated for mis-leading and manipulation of data.
I'll see if I can find the link.
I'm just repeating what I heard on the radio. You can draw your own conclusions. This debate reminds a lot of the global warming debate. It's basically the same scenario as far as who is doing the debating and which side of the fence certain people are on. I prefer to err on the side of caution. I have such a life that I am stuck in this world having to trust this government to look out for my best interests, but I don't feel that this is the case. It's no secret that the politicians are owned by the corporations now. It's also no secret that corporations are in it for profit, not to serve our best interests. Higher yield equals profits. Producing this higher yield outweighs the negative effects that result from corporate profiteering. So, trust but verify? Good luck with that. Based on their track record, they don't deserve my trust.
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  #43  
Old 09-29-2012, 06:09 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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Originally Posted by Midnite Zephyr View Post
I'm just repeating what I heard on the radio. You can draw your own conclusions. This debate reminds a lot of the global warming debate. It's basically the same scenario as far as who is doing the debating and which side of the fence certain people are on. I prefer to err on the side of caution. I have such a life that I am stuck in this world having to trust this government to look out for my best interests, but I don't feel that this is the case. It's no secret that the politicians are owned by the corporations now. It's also no secret that corporations are in it for profit, not to serve our best interests. Higher yield equals profits. Producing this higher yield outweighs the negative effects that result from corporate profiteering. So, trust but verify? Good luck with that. Based on their track record, they don't deserve my trust.
Why should you trust yourself? If you are like most of us, you hand over large amounts of cash to these corporations, ensuring they will keep delivering food, energy and resources so you can live your life as you like and they become wealthy and influential in the process. One nice thing about having ten fingers is you can point at least one at yourself, in addition to everyone else, for problems affecting society.

And GMOs are not at all like global warming. We have evidence the earth is becoming warmer and we argue over the causes. We have no evidence GMOs are harmful to eat.
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  #44  
Old 09-29-2012, 06:12 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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A new medical study examined the long-term effects of Monsanto's Roundup herbicide and Roundup-resistant GMO corn and has found that rats exposed to even the smallest amounts of Roundup, developed mammary tumors and severe liver and kidney damage as early as four months in males and seven months for females, Linda reported. She spoke with Stacy Malkan, a GMO specialist who is working for the passage of Proposition 37 in California, which would make it mandatory to label genetically engineered fish, crops and foods, and to clearly separate them in supermarkets and grocery stores from foods that are not genetically engineered. More.

source
Excellent point to take away: Don't eat herbicides!

OMG, I can't believe you are quoting Coast to Coast AM. This is the biggest site of conspiracy theorists and nuts ever.
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  #45  
Old 09-29-2012, 07:30 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

oh good lord, when will I learn to look deeper at these links.
Sorry but any site that talks of bigfoot , aliens on the moon ,911 inside jobs and the like really should be instantly dismissed.
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  #46  
Old 09-30-2012, 12:50 AM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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Excellent point to take away: Don't eat herbicides!

OMG, I can't believe you are quoting Coast to Coast AM. This is the biggest site of conspiracy theorists and nuts ever.
Oh, c'mon now. It's a fun program to listen to sometimes. The Earth Files are just reporting Earth events. I take that other programming stuff with a grain of salt.

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Why should you trust yourself? If you are like most of us, you hand over large amounts of cash to these corporations, ensuring they will keep delivering food, energy and resources so you can live your life as you like and they become wealthy and influential in the process. One nice thing about having ten fingers is you can point at least one at yourself, in addition to everyone else, for problems affecting society.

And GMOs are not at all like global warming. We have evidence the earth is becoming warmer and we argue over the causes. We have no evidence GMOs are harmful to eat.
I'm kinda stuck in this world. So, unfortunately I have to live like most people in America. I'm too poor to have any choice in the matter. Heck, I don't even have my own kitchen anymore.

They argued the validity of Global Warming for how many years? 20? maybe? The GMO debate is just heating up, and yes, it is still the same players.
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  #47  
Old 09-30-2012, 01:15 AM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

Don't forget nanotechnology. Isn't there some issue with nano particles in sunscreen causing cancer? But if you don't use it you get cancer from the sun. But if you don't go in the sun you suffer Vitamin D deficiency.

We're all gunna die and I blame time. If time didn't keep marching on none of this would happen. And even nanos, sun and osteo don't get you then it's heart disease or stroke or dementia.

I believe that if you consistently eat plenty of fresh veggies and fruit and drink lots of water then you'll be okay. Add exercise, creative interests and your quota of hugs, and that's a healthy lifestyle IMO, even if you do some "naughty" things.
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  #48  
Old 09-30-2012, 01:43 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

Drummers are lucky.


Those who survive as hunter/gatherers, after the inevitable future die-off caused by exceeding the earth's carrying capacity limits for humans, will only need fire to hollow out logs, in order to continue their craft.








.

Last edited by wildbill; 10-04-2012 at 07:35 AM. Reason: clarify my run-on sentence - ha ha
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  #49  
Old 09-30-2012, 02:13 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

Ahh, Monsanto. The Agent Orange people.
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  #50  
Old 02-24-2013, 01:02 AM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

Stumbled upon this. Bill Nye's take on it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKm2Ch3-Myg
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  #51  
Old 02-24-2013, 02:08 AM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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Ahh, Monsanto. The Agent Orange people.
Don't forget Dow Chemical who made it as well.
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  #52  
Old 02-24-2013, 03:02 AM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

Most of the food that is modified is found in the center isles of the grocery store and in fast food restaurants as processed foods.
It is all part of a plot to make people sick,sterile, fat, and stupid so that the "New World Order" can be put into effect.
http://youtu.be/FEMbWn6ClxM
http://youtu.be/DWiJPeGtxQ0
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  #53  
Old 02-24-2013, 09:16 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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Originally Posted by Anon La Ply View Post
Don't forget nanotechnology. Isn't there some issue with nano particles in sunscreen causing cancer? But if you don't use it you get cancer from the sun. But if you don't go in the sun you suffer Vitamin D deficiency.

We're all gunna die and I blame time. If time didn't keep marching on none of this would happen. And even nanos, sun and osteo don't get you then it's heart disease or stroke or dementia.

I believe that if you consistently eat plenty of fresh veggies and fruit and drink lots of water then you'll be okay. Add exercise, creative interests and your quota of hugs, and that's a healthy lifestyle IMO, even if you do some "naughty" things.
Everything in moderation....even the naughty things.You can eat southern fried chicken,as long as its cooked properly ,and as long as you don't eat it once a week or more.

As far as hugs,don't underestimate the power of the right mate,and a healthy bedroom life....or living room,bathroom,basement,swing......you get the idea....variety.....bo ya.

Try brewing your own beer also.Just use filtered water and sterilize everything well.I've been doing it for a little while now,and with a small investment,you can turnout some pretty decent beer...even first time around.......and there's no additives.You have to drink it before 3 months pass,or it begin to go bad.

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  #54  
Old 02-25-2013, 03:48 AM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

http://www.care2.com/greenliving/blu...questions.html

blue strawberries...
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  #55  
Old 02-25-2013, 03:58 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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Originally Posted by bobdadruma View Post
Most of the food that is modified is found in the center isles of the grocery store and in fast food restaurants as processed foods.
It is all part of a plot to make people sick,sterile, fat, and stupid so that the "New World Order" can be put into effect.
http://youtu.be/FEMbWn6ClxM
http://youtu.be/DWiJPeGtxQ0
http://youtu.be/4R1ixshimfM
Agree. Modified anything is disgusting. Especially vintage drums. GMO is banned the world over, right? Except in the good ole USA. "Bring us your tired, your weary, your genetically altered food. Be our guinea pigs..."

p.s. Get your Ludwig club date wmp snare yet Bob? I hope :)
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  #56  
Old 02-25-2013, 05:14 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

So the fact that humans have been genetically modifying mood since the very beginnings of agriculture (and in fact, one of the defining features of agriculture) means nothing then? That humans are now doing it a much more audited and measured way than was ever possible in the past still means nothing?

Ever heard of 'selective breeding'? It's the same result as modern genetic modification, just a slightly different process.

EDIT: Just to add, if you've ever eaten wheat, then you've eaten genetically modified food. If you've ever eaten an orange carrot, then you've eaten genetically modified food. Strawberries? Yep. I could go on but the vast majority of basic staple foodstuffs has - in one way or another - been genetically modified. Selective breeding produces exactly the same result. Take an example whereby two varieties of wheat exist. One is more productive but prone to parasitic disease and another that is less productive but immune to the parasite. For thousands of years, humans have simply crossed the varieties to produce wheats that are both high in yield and resistant to disease. This happens in nature, too - all the time, just the selection process is different and not conscious.

The only difference between modern genetic modification and cross-pollination is specificity. Rather than crossing both varieties to produce a hybrid, very specific parts of the genome can be selected to create a hybrid. It's simply a much more efficient method, more tightly controlled and ultimately potentially much safer - although safety and cross-pollination methods have never been an issue.

To all of those that are criticising genetic modification on emotive grounds, you simply need to do more research and basic reading. For those concerned with genetic modification on an ethical level, you simply have to look at what potential to feed starving populations genetic modification holds. Increasing yields in areas where the yield is hugely important is often the difference not only between price/availability but also hunger, malnourishment, pestilence and (ultimately) death. On a purely ethical level, surely feeding starving millions holds more importance than any other concerns?
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  #57  
Old 02-25-2013, 08:08 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

What about putting genes of animals in plants? They do that. Is that OK too? Not by me it's not. How about making plants that make their own pesticides? Is that OK too? Or making plants so they can handle Roundup pesticides, is that OK too? Not by me. I don't get to have much of a choice, that's the part that gets me hot under the collar. As far as combatting world hunger....it's just the ruse they operate under. They say something altruistic and we are expected to believe it, and many do. I don't. I don't trust my government and what they are doing with the food supply. There's a ton of GMO on the shelves, and people are still starving last time I checked. If that's the first thing on the agenda, combatting world hunger, why are GMO's on supermarket shelves first? The reason for GMO's is to line corporate pockets, cut costs, while controlling/tampering with the food supply. Seriously the powers that be don't give a rats ass about hunger, that's a joke.

What it comes down to is I don't believe anything the government/multinationals tries to pass off on us, history has shown that. The fact that nothing is required to be labeled...that says it all right there. If it was so great, don't you think they would trumpet that? No, they are sneaking it in the food supply. We don't get a choice. Doesn't that raise all the red flags there are? It should.

Duncan I know we will never see eye to eye on this and I am not trying to change your mind, but dam man you sure put a lot of trust in your government. They would love to have you in their ranks.
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  #58  
Old 02-25-2013, 08:16 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

I don't necessarily support the governments, I support the scientists. It doesn't necessarily have to be a political statement, it just turns out that way. As for my government? Bunch of Tories, won't trust them as far as I can throw them but I do trust the scientists (mostly) because they are not politicians.

I'm not going to argue over this with you Larry. I'm just going to say that there are real-World use cases for genetic manipulation and that in the vast majority of use-cases, we have been doing it for as long as human civilisation has existed. There are specific examples that I don't agree with either but I don't make my decisions based on gut feelings, I make them based upon the evidence and that is far more important to me.
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  #59  
Old 02-25-2013, 08:38 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

I support the scientists too. But they are funded by the governments, and the info they uncover is manipulated by the bosses of those good scientists, that's why I don't trust government sources of info. The scientists are truthful, their PR bosses are not. Cross pollination in my mind is a far cry from taking certain genes out and inserting them wherever. You're lucky in that the EU bans GMO's and you don't have to ingest them. You have to ask yourself why that is? Maybe someone can tell me.
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  #60  
Old 02-25-2013, 08:54 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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I support the scientists too. But they are funded by the governments, and the info they uncover is manipulated by the bosses of those good scientists, that's why I don't trust government sources of info. The scientists are truthful, their PR bosses are not. Cross pollination in my mind is a far cry from taking certain genes out and inserting them wherever. You're lucky in that the EU bans GMO's and you don't have to ingest them. You have to ask yourself why that is? Maybe someone can tell me.
The FDA doesn't regulate a lot of things like the EU does. Its very lax in the US. I'm not really sure why, but at least we have options. We can eat the GM food and hope for the best, we can grow our own food, we can move, or we can become a politician and try to change public policy. lol.

Seriously though, there are worse alternatives. I'm no that worried about it. Most scientists in many ways are romantic idealists, they want to discover and make new things to make the world a better place. If these foods were really eminently dangerous to our health, they wouldn't have published the paper in the first place. The fact that these results have been accepted by the scientific community, the FDA, and the grocery distributors, (all of whom do not wish to be sued for distributing and condoning mass consumption of these foods) means that its healthy enough for mass consumption. In my mind its analogous to Skittles: not natural or healthy per se, but it not poison and its tastes good.

I'm very much for labels. If this tomato has a fish gene that prevents it from freezing, it should say that it's genetically modified so people can make informed decisions and be conscious of what they eat. Its not fair to the consumer otherwise.
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  #61  
Old 02-25-2013, 09:29 PM
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The FDA is in bed with Monsanto and others. FDA has Monsanto's and others best interests at heart over the American people. The FDA makes it seem like they are your advocate but nothing is further from the truth. Don't trust the FDA to do what is good for you, just don't. These are the same people who gave us the food pyramid. What a boon to American health that's been.You say they're lax and you don't know why. It's not too hard to deduce. It's the money that the multinationals give to the government to enable them to operate freely without outside scrutiny.

I saw an interview with an FDA official and she flat out stated, and I quote, that "the FDA feels that Monsanto can police themselves". Seriously? I HIT THE ROOF when I heard that. That says it all right there. The Food and Drug Administration feels that something as important as the food supply needs no policing? Really? The FDA condones sneaking GMO's into our food supply with no input from the consumers. If that is not a criminal act, then I don't know what is. Federal Government, criminal act. Yea, I have a major problem with that and so should you.
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  #62  
Old 02-25-2013, 10:41 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

The US government and Monsanto have a long history of being in bed together and doing the wild thing. Monsanto suing small farmers because of cross-pollination due to the neglect of mega-farms using Monsanto product. The soaking of crops in Monsanto's Roundup Ready pesticide sh**t, The outrage goes on and on.

Anyway the safest thing you can do is buy certified organic. It may be more expensive but we don't have to eat like pigs either. Smaller portions are healthier. All Americans ask for is labeling of GMO food. Yet Monsanto is against it. Why, if it's so safe? Well the day will come soon when GMO labeling is a reality in the US. It's will take a bit longer..

Next outrage is mandatory fluoridation of water supplies in the US. That's a whole other discussion :)
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Old 02-25-2013, 10:59 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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Originally Posted by larryace View Post
I support the scientists too. But they are funded by the governments, and the info they uncover is manipulated by the bosses of those good scientists, that's why I don't trust government sources of info. The scientists are truthful, their PR bosses are not. Cross pollination in my mind is a far cry from taking certain genes out and inserting them wherever. You're lucky in that the EU bans GMO's and you don't have to ingest them. You have to ask yourself why that is? Maybe someone can tell me.
There is no credible scientific evidence showing GMOs are unhealthy, or any different in the human body than organic foods. Europe bans GMOs because Europe bans just about everything.

If you want to attack GMOs for the harm their crops may cause to the environment, or for the tactics their companies take against farmers, that's fair game and a different issue. But let's just make it clear there is no scientific evidence that GMOs are unhealthy.
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Old 02-26-2013, 12:00 AM
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Studies at Consumers Union show that people who consume organic food are exposed to 66% less pesticides than those who eat conventionally grown foods. That alone justifies rejecting GMOs. You won't immediately keel over after eating a GMO apple but over the years regular consumption of the stuff? Not me.

Last edited by larryz; 02-26-2013 at 04:06 PM.
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Old 02-26-2013, 01:32 AM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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The FDA is in bed with Monsanto and others. FDA has Monsanto's and others best interests at heart over the American people. The FDA makes it seem like they are your advocate but nothing is further from the truth. Don't trust the FDA to do what is good for you, just don't. These are the same people who gave us the food pyramid. What a boon to American health that's been.You say they're lax and you don't know why. It's not too hard to deduce. It's the money that the multinationals give to the government to enable them to operate freely without outside scrutiny.

I saw an interview with an FDA official and she flat out stated, and I quote, that "the FDA feels that Monsanto can police themselves". Seriously? I HIT THE ROOF when I heard that. That says it all right there. The Food and Drug Administration feels that something as important as the food supply needs no policing? Really? The FDA condones sneaking GMO's into our food supply with no input from the consumers. If that is not a criminal act, then I don't know what is. Federal Government, criminal act. Yea, I have a major problem with that and so should you.


Larry...just another bit of information about the FDA.You know when you read about taking say....a vitamin,and it says the FDA recomended dose is.........Well do you know where that info comes from?

The company that made the vitamin...not the FDA,which is just a regulatory beauracratic agency,and not an agency that actually tests drugs.Private labs and the CDC actually do the testing.

Drug companies frurnish the necessary info to the FDA,and if it meets their criteria,then they give the necessary "FDA approved" stamp.So now, the drug company can sell the drug for an unregulated exorbitant amount of money to recoup their R&D investment as soon as possible.

Steve B
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  #66  
Old 02-26-2013, 02:46 AM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

Sounds like we have a few conspiracy theorists. Personally, I think all of the governments are corrupt, but it is at the point that little or nothing can be done to change it. You vote in that leader that is your "friend" until someone gives them money under the table and then they just do whatever the person paying the most wants. I'm not saying all rich people are corrupt, but some are, and those few are making life worse for a lot of other people.

As far as the modified food is concerned, it probably would be nicer for it not to he genetically modified, but as long as I am not getting sick from it, I am ok. I have bigger worries than how the food I am eating was raised.

I don't want to belittle anyone else's opinion, I am just giving my own. I don't really care as much about certain things when we have people out in the cold freezing or starving.
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  #67  
Old 02-26-2013, 03:31 AM
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I want to know how GMO's are being used, right now, to stop world hunger. I mean that's the banner under which it is being justified.

Larry I'm even skeptical about certified organic. Or the pledge on milk cartons: Our farmers pledge to not use RBHG growth hormones. So what, we are supposed to take their word? You have to be ultra diligent to obtain food that is not corrupted by anything. I don't know that it's even possible in today's commercial marketplace. Not much is as pervasive as the food and water supply.

You can call me a conspiracy theorist, if there is no better term. I feel it is more me looking out for my own best interests. Not much has more impact on your health as the food you eat and the water you drink. I just see right through the lies that are being so carefully fed (no pun intended) to us, and I have come to the conclusion that the powers that be regularly hide the real truth from the masses and count on us to be passive about it. I respectfully decline to oblige them there, I want them held to the same standards that everyone else is.

What if it was proven that GMO's are bad? Then what? That horse has already bolted from the barn. Government funded studies don't count, they are the ones on trial in my mind.
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Old 02-26-2013, 03:49 AM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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Studies at Consumers Union show that people who consume organic food are exposed to 66% less pesticides than those who eat conventionally grown foods. That alone justifies rejecting GMOs. You won't immediately keel over after eating a GMO apple but over the years regular consumption of the stuff? Not me.
Sorry, but i think you meant conventionally grown here.

A lot of the problem, from my understanding, is that Monsanto is trying to eliminate the competition by elimination of non-hybrid seeds. In other words, produce plants that cannot reproduce productive seeds. This is a huge problem. Not only will all the different varieties of certain plants disappear, but what if everybody has to grow the same corn? There used to be a dozen varieties of corn. Now there are just a few available. Monsanto is trying to make it so that all seeds must be bought every year from them. What if a certain crop catches a disease like the Irish and the potato famine back in the day? Can you imagine?

Right now it seems like half of the Southern Hemisphere is trying to move north to more industrialized and fair economies. Can you imagine if there is only one kind of corn and the crops fail due to disease? Where are we gonna go? Crazy? Yep, we're all screwed. I just do what I can do to keep myself out of the doctors office. I don't have enough money to change anything except my own approach to living. We vote with our dollars everyday. We support Wal-Mart, we support Gas Station Convenience stores, we support GMO's, and we support the Governments.
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( http://5gyres.org/what_is_the_issue/the_problem/ ) .
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Last edited by Midnite Zephyr; 02-26-2013 at 02:38 PM.
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Old 02-26-2013, 04:07 PM
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larryz larryz is offline
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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Originally Posted by Midnite Zephyr View Post
Sorry, but i think you meant conventionally grown here.

--Thomas Jefferson

( http://5gyres.org/what_is_the_issue/the_problem/ ) .
Corrected. Thank you. Must be the pesticides affecting my brain !!
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Old 02-27-2013, 12:20 AM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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p.s. Get your Ludwig club date wmp snare yet Bob? I hope :)
I couldn't wait for Ludwig anymore. They kept promising a delivery that never cane. I bought a used one last week. It arrived yesterday. I love it. I'm trying some maple hoops on it tonight.
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Old 02-27-2013, 01:05 AM
wildbill wildbill is offline
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Genetically Modified Humans
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Old 03-06-2013, 11:19 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

It's too late baby

http://youtu.be/kSep7QJXKlE
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Old 03-06-2013, 11:45 PM
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

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Genetically Modified Humans
And since we've already given permission for companies to patent the new life forms they've created by splicing genes, we'll soon have copyrighted human beings. Won't that be fun.
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Old 03-09-2013, 04:15 AM
wildbill wildbill is offline
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Default Re: Genetically modified food

At the rate we're reproducing, we probably won't have to worry about it too long before the crash occurs.

Check the current population clock:

http://www.census.gov/main/www/popclock.html





For those who prefer visuals:


http://www.susps.org/overview/numbers.html
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