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  #1  
Old 05-30-2012, 08:17 AM
kuren84 kuren84 is offline
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Default Reso heads

Hi all i was just wondering really how important it is to change your reso heads? I mean how much difference does it really make? I have had my reso's on my kit for years and they still sound great. Help me out what are the advantages or are drum head company's just trying to make a extra bit of cash??

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Old 05-30-2012, 09:08 AM
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Default Re: Reso heads

I've always generally changed my tom reso's every third time I bought batters. With bass drums it's less. With snares it depends on usage but it's usually more often than with toms.

Keeping fresh resonant heads will maintain the sustain and midrange of the drum, and sensitivity with snares. Over time (quite slowly) they just wear out and don't perform as well. Some people like the sound of old heads. Elvin Jones almost never changed his drumheads. So did most of the Motown and Soul drummers. There are no rules.

What are you using as resonant heads now?
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Old 05-31-2012, 06:18 PM
kuren84 kuren84 is offline
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Default Re: Reso heads

Hi sorry for the late reply i have Remo UT reso heads at the moment and as i say they still sound great in my opinion. Thanks for all your thoughts.

Kevin
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Old 05-31-2012, 11:32 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

I think this is a job for our very own Reso Head!

But yeah, it's pretty important to have nice reso heads, not extremely important what kind though.
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Old 05-31-2012, 11:34 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

Since we can't hear them we can only take your word, but do they sound good still or have you just gotten used to the sound?
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Old 06-01-2012, 08:12 AM
kuren84 kuren84 is offline
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Default Re: Reso heads

Thanks for all the comments i guess yes i have got used to them but people say they sound nice so i guess until someone says they sound crap or until i think so i'll stick with them for a bit longer.

Kevin
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Old 06-01-2012, 08:33 AM
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Default Re: Reso heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by NerfLad View Post
I've always generally changed my tom reso's every third time I bought batters. With bass drums it's less. With snares it depends on usage but it's usually more often than with toms.

Keeping fresh resonant heads will maintain the sustain and midrange of the drum
Same here...

I especially notice the longer sustain with new resos.

If it's been years since you've changed them and still dig the sound, cool. I guarantee you'll notice the difference when you do change them though. I ran original resos for two years or more and only changed them because I wanted all new heads for a recording. Was this good? bad? who's to say?

Did it really make a huge difference in the recording? probably not.
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Old 06-01-2012, 01:43 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

I am currently in the studio with the band I play bass in. The drummer plays Ludwig Classics circa 1990. He had the original reso's on them. To me the drums sounded dead and flat, he had 3 month old batters on them. I convinced him to change out the reso's and the drums basically came to life. He could not believe the difference and now he is a firm believer in changing them out. I think the "once every 3" rule noted by another poster is a very good one.

The resos obviously don't take the beating of the batters and should last somewhat longer if you think about it.

Physically, a plastic head loses its flexibility over time, especially under constant tension. This will not allow the air column to vibrate as freely and resonance and sustain will be limited. So, yes change the resos!
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Old 06-01-2012, 02:05 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

This is a first for me. Never heard of that. Nobody changed reso heads "back in the day." I've had the reso heads on for years and the drums sound lively as hell as long as the top heads are new. The reso heads barely experience any stretching so how are they wearing out? By resonating? The vibration of an entire nights pounding would be equivalent to maybe a single stroke struck with a stick. Maybe.

I have to question the placebo effect here. The only way to know the difference would be to do a side by side blindfold comparison with the exact same drums tuned at the exact same pitch with new resos and with old. I doubt anyone could tell the difference.
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  #10  
Old 06-01-2012, 03:09 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

I leave the stock reso heads on my kit. They've never been changed. I tune my reso heads really tight, and tune my batter really low so my drums have a nice punchy attack. So my reso heads never reall wear out. I'm sure I'll replace them soon just for the heck of it, but I don't ever see myself changing the bass drum reso head - I like the Sonor logo too much.
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Old 06-01-2012, 05:21 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

They don't wear out from beating but they are under constant tension which eventually takes away the flexibility of the head as it stretches. It is not a placebo effect. Try it. Take one off and just feel it versus a new head...no comparison.
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Old 06-01-2012, 05:41 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

For those of you who never change your resos,does that mean you never change your snare reso either? That always makes a huge difference to me.

I have a friend that just changed his tom resos for the very first time in 15 years.I was shocked when he told me that he had never done it before.
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Old 06-01-2012, 05:45 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

I think the drummers that take the cake though, are the ones that swap the sides their tom heads are on when the batters get worn out... or even worse, just flip them over and play the resonant side...
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Old 06-01-2012, 05:56 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by the_drum_dad View Post
They don't wear out from beating but they are under constant tension which eventually takes away the flexibility of the head as it stretches. It is not a placebo effect. Try it. Take one off and just feel it versus a new head...no comparison.
+ 1

Of course it makes a difference.
I too believe the 3 to 1 rule is sufficient.
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Old 06-01-2012, 05:57 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

How often do you guys change the springs on your pedal? That gets stretched far more than a reso head.
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Old 06-01-2012, 06:05 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by plangentmusic View Post
How often do you guys change the springs on your pedal? That gets stretched far more than a reso head.
Whenever I notice the difference in feel. I keep the tension maxed out. Tightening them isn't an option.
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Old 06-01-2012, 06:08 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

I actually change my snare reso when I change the snare batter.
I let my snare get more worn than my tom batters because I like a good broken in sound from my snare. But there is a point where it's just too dead and needs to be swapped.
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  #18  
Old 06-01-2012, 07:17 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

The resonant heads are almost as important as the batter heads. They do indeed wear out. The three to one rule mentioned above is right on the money. I REALLY like the Evans EC Resonant head with G2 or G1 batters. But that is just me. Peace and goodwill.
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Old 06-01-2012, 08:08 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

They vibrate as many times as the batter heads they just dont move as much because they are hit with the stick. But the stick hits the batter, makes it move and the air make the batter move. They are under tension and do move, stretch, and wear out.
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Old 06-01-2012, 08:08 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

I just replaced my tom resos with coated heads for the first time... It kinda rules. I'd always used "lighter" un-coated resos; never anything over 7mil... The combo I've got now of G2 coated over G1 coated sounds really great to my ear, nice and mellow rumbling.

My point is, the resos make a huge difference in the way the drum sounds. If you're not totally happy with the tone, try something different. Lots of new dedicated reso heads coming out these days, and some combos I'm sure we all haven't tried.
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  #21  
Old 06-01-2012, 08:28 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

Thank you all so much for you thoughts and opinions. I will have a think and see what i want to do.

Thanks again
Kevin
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Old 06-01-2012, 09:28 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

I write the date on heads when I change them. That way I can easily remember to berate myself for not changing resos more often.
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Old 06-01-2012, 09:33 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by kuren84 View Post
Thank you all so much for you thoughts and opinions. I will have a think and see what i want to do.

Thanks again
Kevin
If you're not sure, just try it with ONE drum and see how you like the difference. No need to go all-in at once.
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  #24  
Old 06-01-2012, 11:25 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by plangentmusic View Post
How often do you guys change the springs on your pedal? That gets stretched far more than a reso head.
I'll have to consciously listen to the tone of the spring, when it goes flat, I'll change it, lol.

I for one regularly change my resonant heads, in fact I did an entire head change this week on my Tama Starclassic Bubinga set. In doing so I found that I had two brand new heads in my stock that were dead. A resonant head going bad is sometimes a very gradual thing, similar to loosing your hearing over a period of time. You don't notice it until it's too late and the tone is gone or changed.

Dennis
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Old 06-02-2012, 07:58 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anduin View Post
I write the date on heads when I change them. That way I can easily remember to berate myself for not changing resos more often.
+1.

I usually forget, but I sometimes do this.
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Old 06-03-2012, 01:22 AM
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Default Re: Reso heads

For all you non believers that new resos don't make a difference or that they don't wear out over time - go over to You Tube and search for super slow motion drums - the stuff with Mike Mangini - I know, those videos are all batter heads and cymbals, but still, I can imagine that the reso heads move waaaay more than most folks think.

Neal
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  #27  
Old 06-03-2012, 05:14 AM
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Default Re: Reso heads

I never heard a set with new heads and thought "yeah, but the resos sound dead. " But okay, if everyone says they hear a difference I guess there's something to it. I haven't changed my reso heads in about 10 years and I always get complements of how good my drums sound. I just think it's splitting hairs.

Some guys change their guitar or bass strings every show. Some guys leave a set on for years. I think there's a happy medium. I actually think hi hats go dead after a few years, but changing them would just be impractical. Even piano strings get a little more mellow over time. It all depends on how fastidious you want to get.
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Old 06-03-2012, 05:40 AM
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Default Re: Reso heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by plangentmusic View Post
How often do you guys change the springs on your pedal? That gets stretched far more than a reso head.
Thats an idiotic comment for a few reasons...

#1, A spring stretches far less over it's lifetime, Look at Mangini's slo-mo drum video, Those heads move a whole lot more than you think... springs have a limited movement, heads do not.

#2 Springs have a useful life that they have been engineered to sustain, heads are the same way, they are disposable just like everything. They all have a lifespan.


Maybe some quick material physics would help you guys out here, materials have an elastic, plastic, and yield point. Elastic means the material will bounce back to its original state, this is the state the heads are in when new and when they are considered fresh... when they start to degrade in sustain and feel (they loose that "bounce") They begin to enter the plastic phase... this is when heads begin to loose the ability to bounce back into position. This is the phase we typically replace the heads, ever notice most well used heads when the tension is dropped are concave? That head has entered the plastic stage and been stretched out in the center by repeated vibrations and impacts. Yield point is the point at which the material breaks. All three of these phases can be demonstrated by over tightening or over stretching a head. Three stages can be also demonstrated by dents or holes in the head... you hit the head normally and get a great rebound... then you hit the piss out of it and get a dent, that area is now in the plastic phase as it has been stretched too far by the impact of the stick. Hit it hard enough and it will break through. It is easier to break into the yield point if the head is in the plastic phase already.

For those who want to know the truth about Reso heads, I use the 3 to 1 policy already mentioned... And despite the vent, the reso heads deflect and resonate every bit as much as the batter heads... the only reason we replace batters more is because the force of the stick is concentrated in small surface areas... whereas the air column moving the reso head is distributed rather equally over the entire surface area.


Hope this puts some actual facts behind the argument that new reso's sound better, I did in fact just place an order for new batters and reso's... and look forward to the drums coming back alive like they always do. Maybe I will make a video...
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Old 06-03-2012, 06:14 AM
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Default Re: Reso heads

back in the day (late 80's/early 90's) when i was playing 3-5 nights a week i used to change my reso heads twice a year....and probably could have gotten away with once a year. i don't put a whole lot of stock in changing the reso heads that often. in the same respect, i used to change my batter heads about every 6 weeks or so. if you gotta change batters a hell of a lot more often than that, it's either time to switch to a different head or a different stick.
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Old 06-03-2012, 03:45 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richards1008 View Post
Thats an idiotic comment for a few reasons...

#1, A spring stretches far less over it's lifetime, Look at Mangini's slo-mo drum video, Those heads move a whole lot more than you think... springs have a limited movement, heads do not.

#2 Springs have a useful life that they have been engineered to sustain, heads are the same way, they are disposable just like everything. They all have a lifespan.


Maybe some quick material physics would help you guys out here, materials have an elastic, plastic, and yield point. Elastic means the material will bounce back to its original state, this is the state the heads are in when new and when they are considered fresh... when they start to degrade in sustain and feel (they loose that "bounce") They begin to enter the plastic phase... this is when heads begin to loose the ability to bounce back into position. This is the phase we typically replace the heads, ever notice most well used heads when the tension is dropped are concave? That head has entered the plastic stage and been stretched out in the center by repeated vibrations and impacts. Yield point is the point at which the material breaks. All three of these phases can be demonstrated by over tightening or over stretching a head. Three stages can be also demonstrated by dents or holes in the head... you hit the head normally and get a great rebound... then you hit the piss out of it and get a dent, that area is now in the plastic phase as it has been stretched too far by the impact of the stick. Hit it hard enough and it will break through. It is easier to break into the yield point if the head is in the plastic phase already.

For those who want to know the truth about Reso heads, I use the 3 to 1 policy already mentioned... And despite the vent, the reso heads deflect and resonate every bit as much as the batter heads... the only reason we replace batters more is because the force of the stick is concentrated in small surface areas... whereas the air column moving the reso head is distributed rather equally over the entire surface area.


Hope this puts some actual facts behind the argument that new reso's sound better, I did in fact just place an order for new batters and reso's... and look forward to the drums coming back alive like they always do. Maybe I will make a video...

Nah, not an idiotic comment. You just didn't comprehend it. It's okay though.
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  #31  
Old 06-03-2012, 07:00 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

You're supposed to change reso heads????????
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  #32  
Old 06-03-2012, 07:30 PM
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Default Re: Reso heads

All heads deteriorate over time, & not just by mechanical means. Plasticisers are used to keep plastic materials in a flexible state. Exposure to both UV & ozone diminishes the plastic ability. The time taken for these affects to be noticed in isolation depends on exposure to the aforementioned elements.

The deflection of the reso head is close to the amplitude of the batter head, so wear through cyclic flexing is similar, but overall wear is still significantly less because of a lack of impact damage.

Away from the science, & into the real world, the reso head will change in characteristics over time, but it's typically gradual, & that's why it's ageing affects are often dismissed. Change your batter head on one drum. Of course, you'll hear a difference. Then, if the reso head is old, change that out too, & you should notice a brighter timbre & generally more vibrant tone to the drum.

Changing reso heads will never produce as much benefit as changing the batter head, but to suggest that reso heads somehow possess a miraculous ability to defy the affects of ageing, is wrong.

I change my reso's every 4th batter head change, or every year, depending on which is the sooner. I have changed just the batter heads on a couple of occasions, because I noticed a fairly rapid change in my drum tone that couldn't be explained by the batter head condition. Sure enough, on both occasions, the reso head change did the trick.

I generally find, that players who don't tune for long sustain, notice reso head deterioration far less than those who do.
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