Recommended books - where to start (after some hiatus)?

StickIt

Senior Member
Hello all!! I have been visiting this site as a guest for a couple of years now, but have just recently become a member. Mostly because I couldn't think of any questions that haven't already been answered in this forum; what a wealth of knowledge!!! So...

I have been playing again for about 3 years (after about 10 years without a kit...playing around on bass and acoustic guitar and whatnot) and am looking to seriously work on my chops. I am thinking of ordering the following three things:

1. Stick Control - G.L. Stone
2. Groove Essentials - Tommy Igoe
3. Secret Weapons - Jojo Mayer

In your opinion(s), should I start with one of these and work exclusively for a while, or can I possibly work the first two into my practice regimen together? (I'm thinking the Jojo might be a next step kinda thing)

I am an intermediate/beginner player (can keep a good beat onstage, comfortable in straight rock tempos, slow swing, waltz, blues rhythyms, some funk, very limited fill vocabulary etc...). Obtaining an instructor is currently not possible for different reasons, so I come to you...

Any help/guidance/advice will be warmly welcomed.
 
Hello all!! I have been visiting this site as a guest for a couple of years now, but have just recently become a member. Mostly because I couldn't think of any questions that haven't already been answered in this forum; what a wealth of knowledge!!! So...

I have been playing again for about 3 years (after about 10 years without a kit...playing around on bass and acoustic guitar and whatnot) and am looking to seriously work on my chops. I am thinking of ordering the following three things:

1. Stick Control - G.L. Stone
2. Groove Essentials - Tommy Igoe
3. Secret Weapons - Jojo Mayer

In your opinion(s), should I start with one of these and work exclusively for a while, or can I possibly work the first two into my practice regimen together? (I'm thinking the Jojo might be a next step kinda thing)

I am an intermediate/beginner player (can keep a good beat onstage, comfortable in straight rock tempos, slow swing, waltz, blues rhythyms, some funk, very limited fill vocabulary etc...). Obtaining an instructor is currently not possible for different reasons, so I come to you...

Any help/guidance/advice will be warmly welcomed.

I think those first two are an excellent choice to work on together, covering both hand technique and drumset coordination/grooves. If you're not familiar with the concept of the free stroke, I would look into that so that you can get the maximum benefit from practicing Stick Control. Here's a particularly good youtube clip on the idea by Danny Gottlieb: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tI2ODPVBvqI

I would recommend focusing on practicing everything (from both books) very slowly and precisely at first, with a metronome.
 
Hi Stickit,
good to have you on board. While those books are amazing and timeless resoueces, I recommend you take a second look at getting even a single lesson, a Skype lesson with for example Dom Famularo http://www.domfamularo.com or Bill Backmann http://www.billbachman.net/news.html. It should not be much more than those books would cost you and the impact will be much bigger, I can guarantee it.

I hope you will consider this. If not, the resources you mention are great. I would get Dom Famularo's It's Your Move before Secret Weapons, Secret Weapns is very advanced.

I hope this helps.
Casper
 
Thanks for the advice!

If you're not familiar with the concept of the free stroke, I would look into that so that you can get the maximum benefit from practicing Stick Control. Here's a particularly good youtube clip on the idea by Danny Gottlieb: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tI2ODPVBvqI

Thank you for the link, eddy. I've realized already that I'm going to have to "rebuild" my technique in order to improve upon the little knowledge that I have, but as I watched the video I started to understand that I should start at the very very beginning...oh how little I know.

While those books are amazing and timeless resoueces, I recommend you take a second look at getting even a single lesson

I might consider that, Dr. I was a percussionist (mostly snare, and some quads during marching season) in Jr. High and High School, so I have had some formal teaching, and I thought that I might build upon that with some help/refreshing from these publications...I have read that having a teacher is leaps beyond what even a great book or video could offer, however, I have a super-limiting schedule.

I would get Dom Famularo's It's Your Move before Secret Weapons, Secret Weapns is very advanced.

Thanks for the suggestion. I was worried that Jojo's video might be a little advanced for me. I'll check that one out for sure!
 
Recommend 1001 Drum Grooves. My Teacher got me into that book a year and half ago. I still go back to it to work on latin stuff. It literally has every drum style in it. Double Bass to Latin to Swing. Its great. Also All American Drummer 150 snare solos by Wilcoxon snare book is great for starting snare solos. Stick control is awesome as well. Anyways, those two books really got me going with the help of a good teacher.
 
I think it's hard to recommend anything without seeing where you're at, which is why I would recommend getting with a qualified teacher first. Books and videos are good but not when you need feedback. Maybe you could post a video that we can all see to better say what I think you should do?
 
Lol, I think I'm beginning to see a pattern here...

The online lessons are appealing, due to my time constraints and my middle-of-nowhere location, so I think I'll contact one of the guys mentioned above and see about their availability. If they are unavailable at this time, would anyone be able to recommend someone for one or two lessons to help get me started? I read the "Find Teachers Here" thread, but only a couple of them were available for online assistance, and one of them, although an amazing drummer, was a little out of my league monetarily...

Maybe you could post a video that we can all see to better say what I think you should do?
Thank you, Bo, for the suggestion, but, ummmm, I don't know...a little hesitant...What type of "skills" would I showcase and how? I mean, to preview where I'm at. A couple of beats, some snare and tom work...I guess what I'm saying is that I wouldn't really know what to play. Also, I don't know if I want my mediocrity on display, but if it helps, I suppose I would do it.
 
If you were to get groove essentials, I reckon it's worth getting the DVD as well as the book, I have just begun working through this, and I find the DVD incredibly useful as Tommy shows you through each part of each beat, rather than having it just written on the page.
Also the book comes with music to practice each beat at 2 different tempos (ie Fast and slow) which is a bit more interesting than playing to a metronome whilst still working on playing the groove consistently.

I've been practicing this stuff on my e-drums, so I just set up in front of my TV, with the songs cued up on a laptop next to me and dip in and out of the DVD as I'm working through if there's anything I can't get to grips with just from reading the parts on the page.

Dave
 
Thank you, Bo, for the suggestion, but, ummmm, I don't know...a little hesitant...What type of "skills" would I showcase and how? I mean, to preview where I'm at. A couple of beats, some snare and tom work...I guess what I'm saying is that I wouldn't really know what to play. Also, I don't know if I want my mediocrity on display, but if it helps, I suppose I would do it.

Well, that's the thing. Go find a teacher and show him where you're at, and he can probably steer you in the right direction as far as books and what to play, and better, what to listen to. I don't always suggest people post up their playing for all of us to see, but when people want honest answers, then that's what it would take. I commend people who do that and certainly wouldn't embarrass anyone who posts their playing. They would more than likely get an honest and genuine answer from most of us here. MaryO is one member who was brave enough to post her playing and she gets better all the time - its good to see people take something on and get better at it. She also has a teacher too.

I figure when people are being genuine and realistic about their goals, and really want constructive criticism, we are a much better group of people to do it here than anywhere else ;)

However you want to do it is fine. You don't have to post your playing up. It's just a suggestion.
 
I recommend Bill Bachmans stick technique. It's the best book for hand technique by far IMO. Not many books explain technique, they just give you exercises.

Also the exercises in this book are really clever. The point of the book is to have as few exercises as possible that cover all possible motions you can do with your hands. It's the fastest way to be able to play everything at any tempo in the least amount of time.
 
Any help/guidance/advice will be warmly welcomed.
gary chaffee's books. it's possible to create a massive arsenal of intermediate practice routines with them. they can be tailored to your own needs, weaknesses, which is the best part.

the best part is when you take the technique and mechanics stuff from stuff like secret weapons, etc., and then applying it on the drumset.
with a disciplined practice routine, you'll see it all come together.
 
Thank you, everybody, for your advice. After a second-thought, I've decided to go ahead and post a couple of videos. They aren't very good quality, and the only thing I have to practice with is my phone and headphones, so I couldn't attempt a live play-along or anything.

I just wanted to give a couple of quick examples of what I can do, and give you guys some idea of where I'm at with my playing.

What I want is to improve my stick control, and expand my stylistic abilities, and get a few books/DVD's to help me along.

I am definitely open to taking lessons via SKYPE, if anyone's offering :)

OK, here goes:

http://youtu.be/9MrP008z9dg

http://youtu.be/Vkg_mzVLJPI

Once again, any advice is warmly welcomed...
 
Thank you, everybody, for your advice. After a second-thought, I've decided to go ahead and post a couple of videos. They aren't very good quality, and the only thing I have to practice with is my phone and headphones, so I couldn't attempt a live play-along or anything.

I just wanted to give a couple of quick examples of what I can do, and give you guys some idea of where I'm at with my playing.

What I want is to improve my stick control, and expand my stylistic abilities, and get a few books/DVD's to help me along.

I am definitely open to taking lessons via SKYPE, if anyone's offering :)

OK, here goes:

http://youtu.be/9MrP008z9dg

http://youtu.be/Vkg_mzVLJPI

Once again, any advice is warmly welcomed...

Hey thanks for posting! That gives me a better idea of where you're at. I understand you want to get better stick control and more styles to play, and that's cool. You can demonstrate a 12/8 groove and a straight groove and that's cool.

I think more importantly, you might want to learn how to play along with a click of some kind. Timing seems like the biggest hurdle for you. Learn how to lay down a simple groove and hold it steady. Above all else (for me, anyway) the groove has got to be there. You can play beats. You just need a measure of how well you can play them in time. Giving the notes their full value is something you learn as you progress.

I would suggest either getting a Boss Dr. Beat (you can wear headphones with this metronome, or watch the light blink), or search for a cheap used drum machine on eBay (I saw old Boss DR-550's selling for as low as $90 - a new Dr. Beat would cost about the same).

I understand you're looking for good books and DVD's, but other than hand development books, like Stick Control, or an old favorite of mine, Podemski's Modern Snare Drum Method, I haven't got that many other ones. If you want to challenge your reading and grooving, I'd suggest Gary Chaffee's New Breed (the first one), or Ted Reed's Syncopation. Start drilling your hands mindlessly in front of the TV to build those up. It just takes the time to be put in.

But the big thing I wanted to suggest (and this is where I'm not sure if you need instructional materials at all) was to listen to alot of music. If you want ideas, you can only get them by hearing what the pros have already done. It's like learning a language - if you don't know what's already been said, it's very hard to say anything new, or anything that's all yours. You could spend a lifetime listening to the great jazz drummers, funk drummers, rock drummers....so you won't possibly get to intimately know them all, but you have to try. I've spent alot of time listening to Buddy Rich and Max Roach (among other jazz greats), John Bonham and Ringo Starr (rock greats), Steve Jordan is a favorite of mine too...Stewart Copeland....there's so much to listen to and learn from, and you hear it in a musical context, so you can hear how it works.

One problem I've had alot of beginning students go through is to work through a book and then they mindlessly apply that to music being played with others. Whereas, had they been fans and listening to alot of their favorite musicians, they would know what would work. I would say listening is about 80% of the work you should be doing at this point. You have the facility to play stuff, it's knowing what to play and making everything feel good that's the trick.

Playing music is like staring at a blank computer screen knowing you have to write a 12-page report on something. You have to produce. By knowing what your favorite artists have done, it'd be easier to come up with ideas you can call your own.

Open up an iTunes account and start buying music! Good job on the videos, I know you were apprehensive about it. But thanks for sharing your playing. It's easier to recommend stuff. Although I still say run your stuff by a good local teacher too. Nothing beats that kind of feedback.
 
Awesome! Thanks for taking the time to listen, Bo. I tend to just "practice" the same things over and over and...never feeling any growth. I think, though, I now have a direction for the immediate future.

All of the advice has been very helpful, and I appreciate the time and effort! I have downloaded a metronome onto my phone for now (a well-regarded one), and have ordered "Stick Control".

I don't know what I'll do with the metronome until the book gets to me...maybe just play "the same-ol' stuff", but in proper-time, lol. I'm just looking forward to getting started and progressing...

Bo, as far as listening to "good drummers" goes, does it begin to seep-in if it is played as background (at work, while driving etc), or is this something you should take time to really concentrate on (outside of trying to learn specific parts), in your experience?
 
Awesome! Thanks for taking the time to listen, Bo. I tend to just "practice" the same things over and over and...never feeling any growth. I think, though, I now have a direction for the immediate future.

All of the advice has been very helpful, and I appreciate the time and effort! I have downloaded a metronome onto my phone for now (a well-regarded one), and have ordered "Stick Control".

I don't know what I'll do with the metronome until the book gets to me...maybe just play "the same-ol' stuff", but in proper-time, lol. I'm just looking forward to getting started and progressing...

Bo, as far as listening to "good drummers" goes, does it begin to seep-in if it is played as background (at work, while driving etc), or is this something you should take time to really concentrate on (outside of trying to learn specific parts), in your experience?

I was blessed when I was born 'cause my parents loved music and there was always good music being played in the house. Whenever Buddy Rich came to play at Disneyland, mom and dad would take me to see him (all the jazz greats came through Disney back in the 70s, so I got to see alot of live performances while having fun as a kid there). I had an uncle who played jazz trumpet who would always bring records to listen to and my cousins were always listening to everything, so it all rubbed off on me. But I probably consciously listen to more music more than a normal person would because I'm always trying to keep up with what's happening out there. For some students of mine, I'm just happy if they're able to change the radio station from time-to-time, and that's a big improvement right there. So you don't necessarily need to buy music, just reach out on the radio or YouTube and it's all free these days.

But I have music playing alot in the background that I can tune out if I want. It's the immersion that's important. Just start letting new music play and see if you latch on to it, or if it makes your foot tap. Don't make it a total chore, you'll probably not do it if you approach it that way.
 
Here I am, bumping my own thread like a little troll, but I wanted to say that I got "Stick Control", and have been practicing the first page with a metronome for three days steadily (not long at all, but long enough to realize that I am on the right path), and am already noticing a small change. Not so much an increase or improvement in my playing, yet :), but a slight change of attitude.

The whole 'Less is More' thing is kind of starting to seep in.......finally! I always thought that train of thought to be truth, but thinking, believing, and doing are definitely totally different things! A small step, but one that I am very excited about at the moment.

Also, I have taken Bo's advice and have been filling my ears with all sorts of sounds. I already had an appreciation for the amazing abilities of quite a few drummers, but I have begun to stop and really listen, and you know what? I think that I have been overthinking. My priorities are a little different now, and I am going to try and be a little more patient, and let my abilities naturally conform to the ideas in my head, instead of trying to force myself to improve...at least I think that's what I'm trying to say.

Thanks again for all the advice, and I'm hoping to post an updated video or two in a couple of months, when I feel that I have something to show.
 
Hello all!! I have been visiting this site as a guest for a couple of years now, but have just recently become a member. Mostly because I couldn't think of any questions that haven't already been answered in this forum; what a wealth of knowledge!!! So...

I have been playing again for about 3 years (after about 10 years without a kit...playing around on bass and acoustic guitar and whatnot) and am looking to seriously work on my chops. I am thinking of ordering the following three things:

1. Stick Control - G.L. Stone
2. Groove Essentials - Tommy Igoe
3. Secret Weapons - Jojo Mayer

In your opinion(s), should I start with one of these and work exclusively for a while, or can I possibly work the first two into my practice regimen together? (I'm thinking the Jojo might be a next step kinda thing)

I am an intermediate/beginner player (can keep a good beat onstage, comfortable in straight rock tempos, slow swing, waltz, blues rhythyms, some funk, very limited fill vocabulary etc...). Obtaining an instructor is currently not possible for different reasons, so I come to you...

Any help/guidance/advice will be warmly welcomed.


Dude thats awesome! I have been at it with Stick Control too since about December of last year I have been concentrating on the page 5 alone and can play the whole thing at 200 bpm! I started off at 80 though and have been addimant about practicing it everyday if I can. I would also recommend "The New Breed 1" by Gary Chester these are the two books my current drum teacher and I are working on lately and its amazing what these two books have done to my playing. As a lot of people have been saying above me though its different strokes for different folks, I am pretty much gonna recommend you the same thing Bo did which is to see if you can get together with a teacher. My teacher also does online lessons and he is fantastic. So, if you are interested man just message me and I can give you his website. Good luck on everything though bro, sounds like your starting off on the right foot.
 
My teacher also does online lessons and he is fantastic. So, if you are interested man just message me and I can give you his website.

I would have, if you would've gotten to me one day earlier! I just returned an email from a teacher from www.musiclessonsonskype.com, so I am going to see how that pans out, but THANKS for offering. I might come back and accept that offer soon, depending on what happens.

Thanks for the encouragement too. It sounds like you've been working hard and steady, and it has been paying off!

Bo recommended The New Breed too, as well as Syncopation. I guess I will see what my teacher recommends before buying another book. Just out of curiosity, do you have any vid's up? Just curious to see where your practice has taken you...

Good stuff!
 
You might try Rod Morgenstein's Drumset Musician-- I imagine that you'll be wanting to brush up on your fundamentals while getting some real stuff together, which that book is good for. You could also try Joel Rothman's Mini-Monster Book of Rock Drumming. There's not much explanation in it, but a ton of useful, learnable stuff.

A couple of other random, inexpensive but fun books are A Funky Primer by Charles Dowd and Studio Funk Drumming by Burns/Farris. They're each narrower than the titles above, but you can do a lot of playing with them.

Re: the other suggestions-- Every drummer should own Stick Control and Syncopation, but you can burn out fast practicing just Stone, and you will probably need an instructor to know what to do with Reed. New Breed and Chaffee are advanced books that are good to own, but you will probably hit a wall with them quickly.
 
Thanks todd!! I guess you're a drummer, not a mind-reader, and that's how you came up with that, lol. Yeah, I'm working on getting a teacher, but it would be very nice to have some relatively easy-to-understand books that are more in the vein of playing 'music', than just drilling with the hands and whatnot, so I am interested in checking out your suggestions!

Thanks for your advice on the other recommendations too.

On a side note, I read a thread yesterday about ghost-notes, and went home and recorded myself and some of my ghost notes...turns out the aren't very ghostly at all! So, another thing I'm trying to focus on is my dynamics. Things are easier once you have an idea of what your shortcomings are! Just hope that they all don't jump out at me at once. I am trying really really hard to take this slow and steady and not get overwhelmed, and you have all been very helpful. Even in threads that I was never involved in. Cool place.
 
Back
Top