Getting funded by a record label

The thought of forming my own label is looking more interesting to me at this point.

Go for it.

The down side is, anyone can can do it, and usually do. Forming a label is easy. Making it successful is another story.

The advantage of a traditional label, even a small one, is distribution and marketing.

I've "DYI"-ed it a few times. And while there has been some success in getting the music to a certain point, it becomes apparent that even a small labels wold be a big help in getting credibility.

DJs, radio people, the public at large, are hit with 100's of submissions every week of bands who think they have what it takes. No matter how good your material is, getting people to actually pay attention is a battle.

If you present yourself as "this really good band" that's nice, but it doesn't stand out.
If you can presented as "Name label's new recording artist" then it brings more credibility which has a better chance of inspiring a person to open the package and listen to the music.

One hard aspect of not being on a label is labels send out thousands of promo compilations of all their newer bands too all the key people in your market, along with flyers, posters and such. As a DIYer, that's your competition for a person's listening time, along with all the other bands who are doing the same thing you are.

Stores (the few that still exist) aren't going to show much interest in stocking your independent CD. But they will buy stock from repeatable labels through distribution networks.

It's possible, but difficult.

And if you want to do it without debt, I hope you either win the lotto, or come from a very rich family.
 
to start out small, to do a show of roughly 1000 to 2000 people, it costs me on an average of about $8000 not including alcohol and depending on just how much equipment and personnel you need for the show. now given i own my own sound system large enough to accommodate that pretty easily, i have 2 decent sound guys in my band and most of the other bands that we do this with also have several guys that can do the job, several fairly big friends that do security for free and we sell our own merch. i'd say it will probably be more then $8000. if we actually fill the place which we usually don't get 2000, average around 12-1500 per show, we sell tickets for $10-$15 depending on how many bands, usually 6-8 we can make $20,000 for a pretty good show so take out my initial investment of $8000, then wages for the people we do have to hire and all the little things, we're usually left with around $10,000 divided up between 8 bands is $1250 per band then take out what each band had to pay out of pocket for merch that didn't get sold we might make $150-200 a person after it's all said and done. results probably very but thats a rough estimate of what your looking at.

shirts cost on average $6 bucks to print, more for larger sizes, cd's if you buy i've seen anywhere from $2-$6 bucks each. if you do your own the right equipment will cost you around $2500 and supplies around $1500 for i think 1000 cd's but i'd have to double check the quantities, might be 1500.

for the most part the rest is all leg work making phone calls to city and state offices for permits, venues for rates and bookings, advertising in which ever way you can get it, placing orders and all that good stuff.

selling your cd's in stores, you'd have to call the major outlets corporate office and get their supplier, then call them and find out what you need to get them to start dealing your product which will require previous sales and demand statistics and god knows what else but your going to have to prove what you have sells and that they want it. i only deal with 2 local stores that cater to local bands so i'm not completely sure of what a full blown distributor is going to require.

there's starting small, if you can swing the money and time, go for it there's nothing stopping you from trying. but i can tell you we've lost money doing this several times and others we couldn't pull it off at all due to legal reasons others we made money so there is still no guarantee...

This is a gem of a post. Obviously lots of experience in the real world of music promotion here. Things that don't often get considered when fantasizing about promoting your own event. I've got acouple friends who are promoters, and even this sketch that azrae1l has spelled out is pretty bare-bones depending on what kind of show you are doing. Again, very good post.
 
From Wiki:


Naive

1.Lacking experience, wisdom, or judgement.
Surely you're not naive enough to believe adverts!
2.(of art) Produced in a simple, childlike style, deliberately rejecting sophisticated techniques.
I've always liked the naive way in which he ignores all the background detail.
 
The thought of forming my own label is looking more interesting to me at this point.

If/when you do, here's a good link:

www.reverbnation.com

I can see what you want: Honest, pure-black business. Really, what you describe is the act getting the money it deserves, but even then it seems one-sided for the band.

Debt is something I'd prefer to avoid myself as well, but with all of the explanations given here, I find that unlikely.
 
I still disagree with you that a Christain metal band cant be hugely successful.

After reading this entire post, I have to jump in at this point.

Define 'successful'. If your primary goal is to be financially comfortable, why bother finding a Christian band? Just find a regular metal band. What is your main purpose for being a part of a Christian band?

And I believe that even if you are a successful Christian artist, you're still not well-known. Just look at their current top songs... How many people on this forum do you think know who Chris Tomlin, Matt Maher, or the Newsboys are? Even more so with Christian metal.
 
I advise getting some reading material about the business, there are lots of good books out there; as others have said, your understanding of the realities seems a little sketchy at the moment.

Remember that advance payments to artists come in different forms, most importantly recoupable and non-recoupable. If your band gets given a non-recoupable advance then it's happy days - that payment is essentially a grant which is not to be paid back. However, whether you get this kind of payment depends on your potential selling power.

Get good before worrying about advances.

Get some touring together before courting labels. They will want to see a strong fan base. Touring can be done on a shoe string, be prepared to sleep in vans though!
 
After reading this entire post, I have to jump in at this point.

Define 'successful'. If your primary goal is to be financially comfortable, why bother finding a Christian band? Just find a regular metal band. What is your main purpose for being a part of a Christian band?

And I believe that even if you are a successful Christian artist, you're still not well-known. Just look at their current top songs... How many people on this forum do you think know who Chris Tomlin, Matt Maher, or the Newsboys are? Even more so with Christian metal.

Im a devout Christian and i want to share my faith and world view through my life and my music. And i also love metal. Those are the 2 main reasons why i want to start or join a Christian metal band.

Some of the bigger rock/ metal bands that are Christain are: P.o.d, Underoath, Norma Jean, Living Sacrifice, Zao. While some of these bands are less known then others, some have been very big. So being in a Christain metal band does not mean that the band cant reach a huge level while staying true to their beliefs and to their musical vision.

Its about where my heart is at.
 
I advise getting some reading material about the business, there are lots of good books out there; as others have said, your understanding of the realities seems a little sketchy at the moment.

Remember that advance payments to artists come in different forms, most importantly recoupable and non-recoupable. If your band gets given a non-recoupable advance then it's happy days - that payment is essentially a grant which is not to be paid back. However, whether you get this kind of payment depends on your potential selling power.

Get good before worrying about advances.

Get some touring together before courting labels. They will want to see a strong fan base. Touring can be done on a shoe string, be prepared to sleep in vans though!

I will admit that there is a lot that i dont understand. If i have to go into debt, if that is the only way, to make it work then that is what i have to do. Im just really tying to avoid that.

I am reading a really good book called tour smart that has a lot of good info in it that i like. And i hope to read more books over the course of this year and a half (im sure i will always be reading to get a better understanding of things that i need to get better at).

I am ready to sleep in a van and on floors to make this thing happen. I want to tour and get out on the road. There are just some things that i have to take care of before i can do that.
 
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From Wiki:


Naive

1.Lacking experience, wisdom, or judgement.
Surely you're not naive enough to believe adverts!
2.(of art) Produced in a simple, childlike style, deliberately rejecting sophisticated techniques.
I've always liked the naive way in which he ignores all the background detail.

I admit that i dont understand everything. But you seem to have the "cant do it" attitude (you have shown this in another thread as well). You seem to be your typical naysayer. And thats fine if thats how you want to live your life. I choose to live my life thinking about what i can do, not what i cant do.

If everybody believed that something could not be done just because others told them it could not then where would the world be? Nowhere, thats where.

I posted this quote from paul stanley from Kiss in another thread. But i think its worth posting again for you to read:

"Listen to your inner voice. You know within yourself what you should be doing. The people around you who tell you that things are impossible are the ones who failed, and people who fail always need somebody else to cry with. Those are the people you dont need around you. You need people around you who will spur you on and will tell you what is possible".

I think this is one of the best things that i have ever heard anyone say. And its something that i think every naysayer should read and really think about. Im not trying to bust on you, like you did no me. Im saying that if you look at what can be done instead of what you think cant be done its going to get you farther in what you really want to achieve in your life. I cant change how you think (thats up to you), but i dont have to agree with how you think either.
 
Im a devout Christian and i want to share my faith and world view through my life and my music.

Okay, wait just a minute. Have you been writing Christian metal songs, songs that are ready for rehearsal with a band? How many Christian metal songs do you have that are ready for rehearsal with a band? Enough for three sets, maybe? Enough to record an impressive CD?

Because if don't have any of that then you're pretty much chasing rainbows my friend. I don't like coming across as harsh but you are a classic case of putting the cart before the horse.
 
If everybody believed that something could not be done just because others told them it could not then where would the world be? Nowhere, thats where.

Who ever said "IT CAN'T BE DONE"? Who? Where? In which one of your many threads?........Please, show me.

This is where we digress my friend. Across all your threads, I've never seen a single soul tell you straight up that "it can't be done"........never. You confuse practicality for negativity.....the two are vastly removed. A good start would be to learn the difference.

But I'll tell you this. I stopped believing a long time ago that Santa, or the tooth fairy or whatever magical entity you want to portray, was gonna just up and hand it to me on a platter, no questions asked. If you want something you've gotta get off your arse and work for it. At 34 years of age, this should be self evident.

The simple fact is, that you won't. You haven't got a band, you haven't got music, at this point in your "career" you've got nada! Get the important issues sorted first (a band would be a great start, then I'd concentrate on the MUSIC) and then worry about the "what if's".

That's pretty much all I've tried to tell you all along. Yet, those practicalities get lost in dream time and everyone gets branded as a naysayer as a result. It's so frustrating!

A successful career CAN be made, there's NO disputing that. But NOT without taking that first step. Get a band, write music, get a product that people want to hear. Until you accept that, the rest is just polite (though albeit, delusional) conversation.
 
Okay, wait just a minute. Have you been writing Christian metal songs, songs that are ready for rehearsal with a band? How many Christian metal songs do you have that are ready for rehearsal with a band? Enough for three sets, maybe? Enough to record an impressive CD?

Because if don't have any of that then you're pretty much chasing rainbows my friend. I don't like coming across as harsh but you are a classic case of putting the cart before the horse.

I have pieces of songs but not full songs. I will need a band for that s i dont play guitar (though i do come up with riff ideas in my head and sing them). As is i live out in the sticks and i am going to be moving to Atlanta in december of 2011 (its going to take me that long to get some things together first).
 
Who ever said "IT CAN'T BE DONE"? Who? Where? In which one of your many threads?........Please, show me.

This is where we digress my friend. Across all your threads, I've never seen a single soul tell you straight up that "it can't be done"........never. You confuse practicality for negativity.....the two are vastly removed. A good start would be to learn the difference.

But I'll tell you this. I stopped believing a long time ago that Santa, or the tooth fairy or whatever magical entity you want to portray, was gonna just up and hand it to me on a platter, no questions asked. If you want something you've gotta get off your arse and work for it. At 34 years of age, this should be self evident.

The simple fact is, that you won't. You haven't got a band, you haven't got music, at this point in your "career" you've got nada! Get the important issues sorted first (a band would be a great start, then I'd concentrate on the MUSIC) and then worry about the "what if's".

That's pretty much all I've tried to tell you all along. Yet, those practicalities get lost in dream time and everyone gets branded as a naysayer as a result. It's so frustrating!

A successful career CAN be made, there's NO disputing that. But NOT without taking that first step. Get a band, write music, get a product that people want to hear. Until you accept that, the rest is just polite (though albeit, delusional) conversation.

People dont have to come right out and say it cant be done in order for me to see that that is what they mean (im not saying everybody that has posted by any means. Just some). Personally, what i see some as calling practicality is nothing more then negativity just under a different name. Its certain people in this thread tearing others down because they believe that they themselves cant do it. So they want to convence others that they cant as well. Everyone that has ever been successful at something has heard the same things from people that dont believe that they can do it so they try to tear others down. Its not a new thing in the world. What you call "dream time" i call forward thinking. Just because i dont think like you does not mean that i am wrong. Of course there is a lot that i still need to learn. But if you had it all figured out you would be rolling in money playing huge stadiums with a huge band. Are you? I have a feeling the answer is no. If im wrong please post a pic of your platinum album.

I know its going to take hard work. There are things that i have already accomplished (like getting my music degree). I dont expect anyone to just hand me what i want to achieve.

You keep bring up my age as is if one is ever too old to be successful. This is just not true by any stretch of the imagination. Look at colonel sanders. He was cooking chicken at age 40 out of his service station( not sure if he owned the station and not exactly sure when he started cooking chicken) but he did not franchise Kentucky Fried Chicken restaurants until he was 65 years old. And he did it on 105.00 from his first social security check. Then he turned around and sold the corporation for 2 million dollars. One is never too old to do something.

I am working my way towards a goal. Just because i am not there yet does not mean that i will never be there. In this time of my life i am working some things out that need to be worked out (one being a hand injury). After this season i will be moving to Atlanta to get things going there.

Your dead wrong that i wont work for what i want. And yor also dead wrong that ive got "nada". Your sitting in your ivory tower and passing judgment on me and frankly you have no idea of what you are talking about. Just because i dont have a band right now does not mean that i am not moving forward. I had a band not too long before i left virginia and moved to florida. That band did not work out. Its real easy to yack away at me on your keyboard when you dont know me personally. And you dont know where i am at and what i have done and what i am doing.

I dont have to convence you of anything. Its not important to me that i prove anything to you. Whats important is that i prove to myself that i can be successful.

I dont take kindly to be ripped up one side and down the other just because i dont agree with the masses and blindly follow what im told on the internet.
 
You keep bring up my age as is if one is ever too old to be successful.

I haven't brought age into it as a measure of success. Believe me!!


People dont have to come right out and say it cant be done in order for me to see that that is what they mean.........................

...............................I dont take kindly to be ripped up one side and down the other just because i dont agree with the masses and blindly follow what im told on the internet.


We've officially jumped the shark here mate. Best if I just get out of your hair and not bother you again.
 
I haven't brought age into it as a measure of success. Believe me!!





We've officially jumped the shark here mate. Best if I just get out of your hair and not bother you again.

I dont mind talking with you man. Its just the way that you have come at me that has bothered me. There are times when its good just to agree to disagree with no hard feelings.
 
Idealism.
Its good to have ideas, but sometimes the reality of a situation is not compatible with your ideals. I do not believe anyone here is telling you that your dreams are impossible or that you can't do it. Most people are telling you that the world does not work in an ideal manner that you believe. If you wanna make it, you gotta play the game.

I guess what I am trying to say is, you seem like a nice guy but you have some unrealistic ideas about life. Don't get me wrong, I am a deep thinker about things & I am out here giggin all the time, tryin to live the dream & make it too, but I am playing the game. I would rather play covers for money, & work on my original music on the side.
In an ideal utopian world things would be different, all musicians would only be creative, play what they feel when they felt like it & not worry about image or money. It sucks but that is how it works. Especially in the southeast U.S. So if opportunity knocks go for it, but don't let your ideals hold you back. Do some research on Thomas Jefferson for example of idealism vs. reality.
 
I dont take kindly to be ripped up one side and down the other just because i dont agree with the masses and blindly follow what im told on the internet.
Then why are you here in the first place asking for affirmation? It isn't like people are looking for you to lecture or in your view criticize. In fact you've even taken this road show to other forums. I just saw this identical thread on the Roddy Forum and they're telling you the exact same thing.

And please, no one is ripping you. If you believe that then your skin is way too thin for the music business. And that's not up for discussion. That's a stone cold fact.

You want rips? Go visit an old WFD thread. This is nothing. In fact everyone here has tried to be nice to you.

Really man, what's this all about? If this is a marketing ploy there are better ways of doing that. Besides it's long past time that you show some of your music so people can objectively help you decide if all this talk is worth it anyway. Now I am of course aware that if it's not up to spec you're going to tell us we don't get that either, but at least we will know if talking to you is a waste of time and can simply ignore the next 8-10 threads you post.

But if you're sensational we can keep trying to work on you in a positive manner.

However, I will tell you this flat out. I am just now starting to know all the kinds of people you're hoping to connect with, and I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt that they're going to say your presentation up to now is naive and amateurish. Sorry, but I'm telling you the truth.

Besides, if you're already on board with a plan, why aren't you out there doing it instead of wasting all this time trying to sway strangers on the Internet? Just get on it with it and prove everyone wrong.

See, I just think there's something else going on here.
 
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