For those looking for lessons (review of some online sites)

Thank you for all the kind comments... But I promise I wasn't fishing for anything like that. I've been publishing videos online since around 2002-2003 and have been called everything under the sun, so it's nothing I haven't heard before.

In the past, the feedback given would really hurt as people say things in such a negative way when posting online. Rarely do people chat online like they'd chat to me in person. But I've gotten thick skin over the years.

That said, I LOVE all feedback, good or bad. I'd just sometimes prefer people give it more diplomatically and then it would more likely be heard.

As it relates to Online Lessons vs. Private Lessons...

Some of you have said that you can't compare the two, but I will disagree. Not because it's my opinion, but it's just a trend I'm seeing these days. When it comes to the adult learners (18+) people are beginning to prefer online lessons instead of private lessons. I believe that the market is the market, I don't determine what people are interested in, the general market does. So it could move in either direction in the coming years and I have some opinions on where it will go but this comment is already way too long. :)

But if anyone personally thinks that private lessons are much better for all types of drummers then share your opinion as it may help a drummer determine the best solution for them. At Drumeo, we launched a Drum Teacher Directory to help connect students with good private instructors, so I have nothing against private instruction.

Anyways, back to work for me. Thanks for reading!

Let me also thank you for chiming in here, and for the all the stuff you put out there for folks who aren't even members...that is greatly appreciated!

Everyone has an opinion, and that's a good thing. Not everyone will agree, and that too is good. I enjoy the content I've seen from your site, and I find it valuable, to me. To others, it might not be nearly as valuable. We are all at different levels of experience and ability, and some folks learn differently than others. Having Drumeo as an option is very valuable to drumming as a whole, along with all the other avenues the OP mentioned. And of course live instruction, too!

Cool stuff, everyone.
 
Thank you for all the kind comments... But I promise I wasn't fishing for anything like that. I've been publishing videos online since around 2002-2003 and have been called everything under the sun, so it's nothing I haven't heard before.

In the past, the feedback given would really hurt as people say things in such a negative way when posting online. Rarely do people chat online like they'd chat to me in person. But I've gotten thick skin over the years.

That said, I LOVE all feedback, good or bad. I'd just sometimes prefer people give it more diplomatically and then it would more likely be heard.

As it relates to Online Lessons vs. Private Lessons...

Some of you have said that you can't compare the two, but I will disagree. Not because it's my opinion, but it's just a trend I'm seeing these days. When it comes to the adult learners (18+) people are beginning to prefer online lessons instead of private lessons. I believe that the market is the market, I don't determine what people are interested in, the general market does. So it could move in either direction in the coming years and I have some opinions on where it will go but this comment is already way too long. :)

But if anyone personally thinks that private lessons are much better for all types of drummers then share your opinion as it may help a drummer determine the best solution for them. At Drumeo, we launched a Drum Teacher Directory to help connect students with good private instructors, so I have nothing against private instruction.

Anyways, back to work for me. Thanks for reading!

To add my 2 cents...

I recently got back into drumming after a huge amount of time away from a kit. Drumeo and all it's content has been a god send for me - there was nothing like this around in the late 90's when I was playing and having watched hours of lessons and snippets I can honestly say it has covered a vast amount of things and filled me with knowledge, some of it a refresher and some of it new.

The site is extraordinarily well run, from the studio sounds / cams to the content distribution. There are many youtube channels with great stuff on but I find the range and clarity of education from Drumeo unparalleled.

I don't understand why Jared would get any flak - he has clearly worked extremely hard over the years to build up Drumeo to what it is, and I for one am grateful as I get to sit at home and watch / learn from a variety of amazing players form the comfort of my bed or my kit. And I am not even an edge member!
 
Thanks for this and saving me the time of typing something similar.

Thanks, you stated that better than me.

Jared---
Keep on keeping on and ignore the haters.

No "haters" here. This is strictly about getting good information to people who want to learn how to play the drums.

As it relates to Online Lessons vs. Private Lessons...

Some of you have said that you can't compare the two, but I will disagree. Not because it's my opinion, but it's just a trend I'm seeing these days. When it comes to the adult learners (18+) people are beginning to prefer online lessons instead of private lessons.

Since Boomka and I outlined some ways in which our services absolutely cannot be duplicated by any current online products, I'm not sure in what sense you mean they are comparable. Just because people mistakenly believe they are equivalent services, doesn't mean they actually are. That's the whole point.

Guys, I didn't mean to ruffle any feathers. I was simply providing a narrative of MY experiences and what MY preferences were/are. I stated right off the top that i am a beginner and that these are just my opinions...i am not an expert. Everyone learns differently and I don't mean to imply that one method is better than another...just commentating on what has worked for me for other people that may be looking for some comparison...like I was.

No feathers ruffled, just giving additional information to help future readers put your reviews in proper perspective. And again, when you say something has "worked" for you, that can only mean that it worked to the best of your ability to judge as a 9-month-old drummer, and based only on a very short trial period. Assuming you've been using these products your entire drumming career, you're averaging less than 2 months per thing.
 
All I can say is..... the OP has spend quite a bit of coin in all kinds of lessons in only 9 months. Between a full time job, a family with 4 kids and watching all those lessons, when do you find the time for practice? I mean, some of those videos are 1 hour long...assuming you can dedicate 2 hours a day (which is probably a lot) to everything related to drumming, how much of that time is spent watching videos? Seems like you're trying to buy your way into learning.
 
No feathers ruffled, just giving additional information to help future readers put your reviews in proper perspective. And again, when you say something has "worked" for you, that can only mean that it worked to the best of your ability to judge as a 9-month-old drummer, and based only on a very short trial period. Assuming you've been using these products your entire drumming career, you're averaging less than 2 months per thing.

So because I have only been drumming 9 months I dont know anything? I've been listening to music my whole life...I played guitar for almost 10 years...but I dont know what good drumming is supposed to sound like and I need an instructor to hold my hand? You sound like a teacher who is bitter about losing business to the big bad internet.

All I can say is..... the OP has spend quite a bit of coin in all kinds of lessons in only 9 months. Between a full time job, a family with 4 kids and watching all those lessons, when do you find the time for practice? I mean, some of those videos are 1 hour long...assuming you can dedicate 2 hours a day (which is probably a lot) to everything related to drumming, how much of that time is spent watching videos? Seems like you're trying to buy your way into learning.

So because I wanted to try out different options and find what works best for me I'm "buying my way into learning"? How is doing what Im doing worse than paying way more for in-person lessons? Are those people who pay more for that "buying their way"? I guess shopping around for an in person instructor that works well with you would be frowned upon as well? Or is that ok?

I watch videos in my free time and I practice as much as I can...usually an hour or 2 a day. I dont watch TV, I dont have other hobbies, and as sad as it is I pretty much have no life outside of work and my kids....drumming is where I put my efforts.

Frankly I was super hesitant to post this to begin with because there is SOOOO many pessimistic attitudes on this forum. I have severely restricted my posting lately, and this is why. All I wanted to do was try to help out some new drummers and this is what I get, a big fuck you from a bunch of people who have nothing better to do than bitch.

I wish I could just delete this. This forum is a joke.
 
You pretty much have to post knowing someone will find fault in what you said or how you said it on any forum. You did well in providing a great review of your personal deductions of various training options. that has already been said. Don't worry about the others. I found a fix for an overheating problem on my bike several years ago and got flack for it non-stop saying it wouldn't work, after I had run a full AZ summer without overheating. It's the Internet of Debbie Downers. Don't stop posting. I wish more would post details as you have.
 
So because I wanted to try out different options and find what works best for me I'm "buying my way into learning"? How is doing what Im doing worse than paying way more for in-person lessons? Are those people who pay more for that "buying their way"? I guess shopping around for an in person instructor that works well with you would be frowned upon as well? Or is that ok?

No, it's not like that at all. But you have to understand that trying five different paid-for courses in only 9 months gives the impression that you might not be giving a fair chance to each course. Learning any instrument takes time, and even though the knowledge of one instrument might translate well towards other instruments, that is not the case for guitar and drums (for instance, I've tried very unsuccessfully to learn piano and guitar).

I watch videos in my free time and I practice as much as I can...usually an hour or 2 a day. I dont watch TV, I dont have other hobbies, and as sad as it is I pretty much have no life outside of work and my kids....drumming is where I put my efforts.

I can relate to that because I also have a full time job (not related to music), two very demanding kids, and little time for music, which is a hobby I have invested very large quantities of time and money into. I'm currently on vacation and these days I can dedicate 1 or 2 hours a day to drumming. During working days... not as much. I've bought lots of gear thinking it will make me a better musician, when in fact all I need is to practice more.

I'm a self-taught drummer because there was no widespread internet when I started playing and I could not afford lessons. But I've recently discovered online lessons and I find that for every lesson I watch, I need to practice several hours. That's why it seems a bit unrealistic to me trying to follow so many different courses in such a short time.

Frankly I was super hesitant to post this to begin with because there is SOOOO many pessimistic attitudes on this forum. I have severely restricted my posting lately, and this is why. All I wanted to do was try to help out some new drummers and this is what I get, a big fuck you from a bunch of people who have nothing better to do than bitch.

I wish I could just delete this. This forum is a joke.

I think you're overreacting. No one has said f* you and no one is bitching. If you read closely, people are only giving their honest advice, according to their own experience. People here *also* want to help out some new drummers, and that includes you and me (I consider myself new in many regards, such as gear and technique).
 
I think you're overreacting. No one has said f* you and no one is bitching. If you read closely, people are only giving their honest advice, according to their own experience. People here *also* want to help out some new drummers, and that includes you and me (I consider myself new in many regards, such as gear and technique).

Not in a literal sense no, but I spent a long time writing that and there are several posts on here criticizing me and telling me I dont know what Im talking about. Thats a slap in my face. This forum is one of the worst I've seen for negative posts...its just not a positive community.

That said, this has inspired me to spend less time online (something Ive been wanting to do anyway) and not to waste my time with this forum anymore. So....thanks for that!
 
So because I have only been drumming 9 months I dont know anything? I've been listening to music my whole life...I played guitar for almost 10 years...but I dont know what good drumming is supposed to sound like and I need an instructor to hold my hand? You sound like a teacher who is bitter about losing business to the big bad internet.

Are you responding to me? I don't recognize anything of what I said in your statements here, but it seems like you must be. I don't know what your thinking is here, that you can post your opinions, but professionals can't? I don't get it. I haven't seen anything personal directed at you to warrant this kind of response.

So because I wanted to try out different options and find what works best for me I'm "buying my way into learning"? How is doing what Im doing worse than paying way more for in-person lessons? Are those people who pay more for that "buying their way"? I guess shopping around for an in person instructor that works well with you would be frowned upon as well? Or is that ok?

I watch videos in my free time and I practice as much as I can...usually an hour or 2 a day. I dont watch TV, I dont have other hobbies, and as sad as it is I pretty much have no life outside of work and my kids....drumming is where I put my efforts.

Frankly I was super hesitant to post this to begin with because there is SOOOO many pessimistic attitudes on this forum. I have severely restricted my posting lately, and this is why. All I wanted to do was try to help out some new drummers and this is what I get, a big fuck you from a bunch of people who have nothing better to do than bitch.

I wish I could just delete this. This forum is a joke.

Sorry you're taking the generally very constructive comments here as some kind of personal slight. Last free pro tip I'll give you: change your attitude in the direction of growing up. You're not going to be right about everything. Every good drumming musician I've ever known has been really good at figuring out who knows more than him, and at recognizing good information when it's being handed to him. Do that more.
 
Hey there, coming out of lurking to comment.

I think most folks reading his review will understand that he might not be the best judge from a critical standpoint. He is giving us his experience coming from a beginners perspective. Most folks looking athese services are likely beginners themselves. More skilled and/or experienced players might not appreciate the methods taught, but that will also be coming from a more experienced position than the OP (or the target demographic for such services.) The cost comparisons are simply handy to have, if only to know what you're looking at before spending too much time investigating a service that might be out of your price range, or if it can be justified.

Thanks for the reviews.
This is where I'm at. I am the target market of online learning - adult beginner, looking for an enjoyable new hobby and not looking to become a pro. I have less than zero interest in taking lessons, for a variety of reasons.

The major reason is that I want to go at my own wildly variable pace, which is determined by adult life and my other hobbies, and can change week to week. I also don't want to invest the time, money and effort until I can find someone I click with.

I'm currently working my way through one of Drumeo's dvd packs. When I started I went looking for a plan, and looking at Youtube videos and random online resources were overwhelmingly confusing. I picked Drumeo out of the because I enjoyed the free I looked at, and I thought it was a reasonable price. I'm having a lot of fun and I like the way the lessons are organized.

I've gotten decent enough to play a couple of songs with my husband's band (he's a guitar player), and it's such a hoot.

I read this site to learn from people who, as the saying goes, have probably forgotten more than I'll ever know about drumming. I haven't waded in because I don't feel I have much to add as a rank newbie. And with that, back to lurking I go!
 
Savage190 asks to delete his account - if i do so all posts and threads like this one are removed - so i wait a moment....

JARED FALK DRUMEO:

I changed my opinion about the business model 10 years ago and now with Drumeo 100%.

He provides the greatest drummers and greatest Videos you can imagine - all the Top Shots in the business....
Just now we agreed about a kind of cooperation - so some Drumeo Videos are appearing from now on also an Drummerworld. The idea behind is: Enjoy these free videos and eventually start studying with Drumeo.

I wish you all a happy new year....

Bernhard
 
Hey there, coming out of lurking to comment.

This is where I'm at. I am the target market of online learning - adult beginner, looking for an enjoyable new hobby and not looking to become a pro. I have less than zero interest in taking lessons, for a variety of reasons.

The major reason is that I want to go at my own wildly variable pace, which is determined by adult life and my other hobbies, and can change week to week. I also don't want to invest the time, money and effort until I can find someone I click with.

I'm currently working my way through one of Drumeo's dvd packs. When I started I went looking for a plan, and looking at Youtube videos and random online resources were overwhelmingly confusing. I picked Drumeo out of the because I enjoyed the free I looked at, and I thought it was a reasonable price. I'm having a lot of fun and I like the way the lessons are organized.

I've gotten decent enough to play a couple of songs with my husband's band (he's a guitar player), and it's such a hoot.

I read this site to learn from people who, as the saying goes, have probably forgotten more than I'll ever know about drumming. I haven't waded in because I don't feel I have much to add as a rank newbie. And with that, back to lurking I go!

Bondaroo, your review has really nailed an important point. Online lessons are fine, as long as they're used as a supplement to "real world drumming", i.e. playing with a band. If they've helped to give you the confidence to play in your husband's group, then great! Hopefully your husband has encouraged you as well.

The main critique of online videos is that they can't watch you play and tell you what you're doing right or wrong. They can't play drums along with you, and they can't pick up a guitar or bass, or sit at a keyboard, and jam with you. They can't encourage you directly, or remark at the progress you've made, or even smile at you with any authenticity. They can't applaud for your performances, or commiserate about difficult challenges. The claims by site owners or users, that equate online videos with in-person lessons or supervised band instruction, are wildly overstating the value of their videos. Their arguments possess the flawed logic of salesmanship and marketing campaigns.

Deleted so no one else gets their panties in a twist.

Savage, you may not believe it, but TB and I (and other teachers and pros) are looking out for people like you, who are just beginning their drumming journey. Obviously, many users feel that online sites are worthwhile, and that is enough to justify their existence. But as a teacher, it's important to point out the distinctions, so that adults can make informed choices for their kids, or for themselves. I hope you add back your post; it was great, and it started a very intelligent and courteous discussion.
 
Disappointed the OP has gone, very few people have the chance to experience such a wide range of options so it was definitely useful. Online tuition is here to stay, to compliment face to face tuition, and no personal experience or opinion can be 'wrong'. We should all be grateful for increased options we have, a good deal of it free. Before the internet I taught myself the Blushda by guesswork: it sounded almost identical but technically completely wrong. I now appreciate half the things I'm doing wrong (and the other half I'm in ignorance of :) ). Many online people are hugely inspiring and get you motivated.

I tried a taster lesson earlier in the year, first one in in almost 40 years, and I really enjoyed it. But I couldn't commit to their package of lessons (I work too many random lates in the office) plus I've no use for learning some of the styles in their preset curriculum. So, it's not for everyone. But I'd love to find the right tutor.
 
Savage190 asks to delete his account - if i do so all posts and threads like this one are removed - so i wait a moment....

JARED FALK DRUMEO:

I changed my opinion about the business model 10 years ago and now with Drumeo 100%.

He provides the greatest drummers and greatest Videos you can imagine - all the Top Shots in the business....
Just now we agreed about a kind of cooperation - so some Drumeo Videos are appearing from now on also an Drummerworld. The idea behind is: Enjoy these free videos and eventually start studying with Drumeo.

I wish you all a happy new year....

Bernhard

Thank you so much, Bernhard!
 
[*]Actual face time with an expert teacher who is also a good communicator is just a completely different animal from these no-feedback or video feedback "lessons." For example: often I'll work with the student on specific technical issue for up to 30-45 minutes, involving many dozens or hundreds of information exchanges: him/her doing the thing and me assessing, correcting and refining, or making her do it another way, or jumping something else if I see that it will help her get the thing we're working on. It's a complex process. And it is impossible to duplicate that service with any video feedback product.
[/LIST]

So, yeah. I don't think these services/products are really comparable. Using the sites is much more like just buying a bunch of drum books than it is like actually taking lessons.

This is important, imho. There is no better way, and a serious student should do whatever it takes to get real lessons. There is no substitute. And hey, what do you know, one of your local musicians gets some income, so it's all good. Real lessons are leaps and bounds ahead of all other methods.

Video lessons are imho better than books for some things because of video demonstrations, and I've dropped a few bucks here and there at mikeslessons.com and always felt the money was well spent when I had something I wanted to tune up. But I've also had enough private lessons to know how to get the benefit from video lessons, if you know what I mean.

I watch Youtube videos mainly for ideas and inspiration, for instance I watched Jo Jo Mayer's PASIC spot this morning, and he had some interesting things to say about contrast in orchestration. It just so happens it's something I needed to hear, right about now. There are two other cats I watch on Youtube now and again, one is called Aussiedrumnerd, and the other is the Orlando Drummer. Good, concise ideas, not much blather. I particularly like the Aussie vids where he says nothing, holds up a notepad with the notation, and then plays it at different speeds. I can check it out without having to hear a lot of stuff about blah blah blah.
 
Savage190 asks to delete his account - if i do so all posts and threads like this one are removed - so i wait a moment....

JARED FALK DRUMEO:

I changed my opinion about the business model 10 years ago and now with Drumeo 100%.

He provides the greatest drummers and greatest Videos you can imagine - all the Top Shots in the business....
Just now we agreed about a kind of cooperation - so some Drumeo Videos are appearing from now on also an Drummerworld. The idea behind is: Enjoy these free videos and eventually start studying with Drumeo.

I wish you all a happy new year....

Bernhard

There's a Pat Petrillo Drumeo video out there on hand exercises that is very good. If someone's looking for a fresh group of exercises for the hands, I recommend it.
 
JARED FALK DRUMEO:

I changed my opinion about the business model 10 years ago and now with Drumeo 100%.

He provides the greatest drummers and greatest Videos you can imagine - all the Top Shots in the business....
Just now we agreed about a kind of cooperation - so some Drumeo Videos are appearing from now on also an Drummerworld. The idea behind is: Enjoy these free videos and eventually start studying with Drumeo.

I wish you all a happy new year....

Bernhard

I can't find the above referenced Drumeo videos ... anyone know where these videos are posted?
 
Well, I'm a Drumeo member.

I have no problem saying that the first products I picked up when I started drumming back in 2009 are pretty much crap. Much of the format in those "system" DVDs are still so much in conflict with anythng I represent as a teacher.

However.

The site today is a pretty amazing and awesome resource. There' so many great players, something for anyone and all sorts of things you can check out just for inspiration, open some new doors, get an intro to a new style. It's almost too much, so it takes some discipline to use it wisely.

Now we're just waiting for Vinnie, Phil, Dr. Gadd, Mr. Husband, Weckl, Panos, Sheila E, Terri Lyne.

I's personally like to see Ranjit Barot as well as a good step by step tabla course.

Actually, some other percussion stuff, anything from egg shakers to Surdo.
 
Handle with caution. I notice they've been doing some stuff with real players lately, which is good, but the general "teaching method" of the site is extremely suspect. The philosophy seems to be break down all of drumming into hundreds of individual little single ideas, and then making videos of them. I'm sure it's well suited for creating subscribers, but it's really the exact opposite of musicianship.
 
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