View Single Post
Old 12-18-2012, 04:38 PM
TTNW's Avatar
TTNW TTNW is offline
Pioneer Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Posts: 1,963
Default Re: Shooting in Newtown, Connecticut Elementary School

Just catching up on this thread after a couple of days. Interesting comments.

Originally Posted by larryace View Post
It's all about money though, who's gonna pay? The middle class, who else? .. .. It would be nice if the guys like Zucherberg and Gates and Turner would and the other top 1%-ers would be required by law to donate a billion a year to combat this. It's the least they could do to give back from the land they profited so immensely from.

They need to free up the money they spend on the war on cannabis and use it on a war against mass killers instead.
Larry, I'm surprised at this comment. I don't think it would be "nice" to use the police powers of the state to force wealthy people to surrender money to the federal government to use on this sort of public safety. Gates probably donates willingly more than a billion a year through his foundation to global and domestic causes. Not sure about Z or Turner. Most extremely wealthy people already give to charity much more than the average person realizes.

Besides, I look at school safety and security issues as a local and state concern. The taxes received by counties and states can be used much more efficiently and productively when it doesn't get filtered down by corruption and waste to the local schools that need it.

Originally Posted by Deathmetalconga View Post
Where do you draw the line on mental stability? For example, should someone diagnosed with clinical depression have their guns taken away - even if they have never committed any crime? I would tend to say yes, at least for their own safety, and even if they're being medicated for it. Gun ownership is a tremendous responsiblity and you really need to have each and every one of your marbles.

If we're going to look at issues of mental instability, then we need to be prepared to make some very hard choices about who may and may not own firearms.
It's a slippery slope to say the least. It is immensely difficult to deal with all of these issues on a individual case by case basis. Regulating and legislating according to groups inevitably leads to the unfair loss of rights to some that might unfairly be put into one group or another. A related example would be my 80 year old mother. I would agree that taking the privilege to drive on public roads away from elderly people at a certain age would reduce the accidents and deaths in Florida by a huge percentage. My mother, however, is sharp as a tack and would throw a fit and probably drive anyway if you tried to take her drivers license away.

Originally Posted by Deathmetalconga View Post
I'll be darned, I guess i need to reconsider that aspect of it. I always thought SROs were mainly for junior high school and high school, where kids are starting to get into more trouble. I used to be a newspaper reporter and covered police and crime and had work relationships with numerous officers, including SROs, which were just in the upper grades at the time and the schools paid part of the officer's salary. I learn something new every day.

As long as there is an armed police officer, or a secured defensive firearm accessible to trained staff, then I think schools are much safer. If each school needs to have an officer assigned to it, and if the school districts and cities can budget for that, then so be it. I'd be willing to pay more in taxes to assign an officer to every school.
I would too. I'd pay extra on an airline ticket for a uniformed sky marshall. By referendum, I would allocate some of the property tax money I pay for school security.

Originally Posted by CCdrummer View Post
You are willing to pay DMC, but I think the reality of it is many are not. Most people are willing to spend more on their F*cking cars,( a stinking piece of metal) or that 3000 square foot house that they don't need with its goddamn granite countertops and stainless steel appliances, or a 90 inch flat screen tv etc etc than they would on the safety and welfare of children.
I totally understand where your disgust and frustration come from. Many people are selfish but it does make me worry if 150 people who feel like you do got together in a legislative capacity, how quickly would you be trying to mandate what people spend their personal money on?

Originally Posted by zarrdoss View Post
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
Albert Einstein
We cannot make this any better by passing more senseless laws or restrictions.These things happen and we keep on doing the same thing that does not work. Banning guns simply will not work or any anti gun laws would not have prevented this type of thing from happening. it never will. All over the world where guns are present or not when some psyco wants to kill a bunch of people what does he do? go to some unsecured place where people gather together for maximum body count. I seems to me the solution is simple, make places like that more secure. when was the last massacre at a courtroom? Never, they have armed guards and metal detectors and everyone that goes in is checked. Yes we have the technology, manpower and know how we can make public venues more safe and schools especially.
I got this quote from another forum but it is so true.
" Violence is a part of nature. No creature on this earth is exempt from it. Violence has shaped human society since the dawn of man and only people who have accepted this fact and prepared to meet evil with force have ever stopped it."
Amen, brother. This issue is about violence and public safety. I have not gone anywhere in the last 15 years unarmed. I do it legally, discreetly, responsibly and vigilantly.

I only wish that I or someone like me could have been there so at the first murderous act, one of us could have shot Lanza dead right on the spot.

Originally Posted by Dr_Watso View Post
I don't need to see police-state checkpoints everywhere I go just so that I can feel slightly more secure that a rare thing might not happen to me if I give up just a bit more freedom. I don't need to be scattered with useless ionizing radiation or take off my shoes to get on a plane just because someone decided that they want to pretend I'm safer for it. I'm not. If someone wants to do something crazy like this, we aren't going to stop them by pretending we can secure every potential target or place people congregate.

If a private party wants security at their event, so be it. Let them pay for it. I do not need more in-effectual government stooges standing around scanning or searching everyone in public spaces. It wouldn't change anything. I/we certainly do not need to pay for it.
Yes and no. I don't like the "in-effectual government stooges" either. Maybe Mary O has an idea of who provides security in government schools. Is it private contractors, government agencies or both.

Originally Posted by GRUNTERSDAD View Post
I agree with sitting down and talking. I agree with tightening rules. The only problem is the lawless don't care about laws. People still speed. Kids still make fake ID's. People still rob banks. All against the law and yet still happen every day. then we have the nut bag in Norway a few years ago who just went on the spree of a life time in a country with little or no homicide killing 72 people.
I prefer to live under the rule of law. It makes it harder on the individual but that's not a bad thing.

Originally Posted by zarrdoss View Post
What worked for Australia and the rest of the world simply will not work here, We already have states separating from the union at the mere thought of banning guns and they are tired of the federal government getting too big and controlling. I simply do not want to live in a country where you do not have the ability to defend yourself. May be time to move back to Texas or Oklahoma where they will never ban guns.
What do previous gun owners think about the bans in your country? Don't they feel naked? I am sure all the criminals turned in they're guns as well. What about rape? I hear that went way up.
When I travel to states that do not have reciprocity for my Georgia State issued concealed carry permit, I do feel vulnerable to the most extreme and rare of circumstances that I might not be able to save my own life. I just accept it. I guess if I started to travel to these places and feel more concerned more frequently, I would go about getting a non-resident carry permit.

As a community we have to try harder to protect our most vulnerable public places. It is nigh impossible to prevent every act of insanity that results in tragedies like Newtown.

I hope this doesn't sound too cavalier, but I agree with Otto. I have had a good life. I would have traded my life to save any of them that day.
Philippe - Eat, Sleep and Drum.. .. it makes for a good weekend.
Reply With Quote