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-   -   Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony (http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47242)

trkdrmr 02-16-2009 10:14 PM

Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Ok so far, I am not impressed. I am really cranked about this.

I have been pouring over documentation of the Steinberg cu base le 4. It's not shaking hands with my presonus firebase studio. I am downloading about 200 megs worth of updates (at a pathetic 7kbps trickle) from the site. This software has been bang-your-head-on-the-wall frustrating. Perhaps it hates vista, and these patches won't help.

This is my last day of screwing with it. If the downloads don't help, this PC will be replaced *immediately* by a IMAC with garage band.

Anyone using garage band?

I just want to be able to record my kit digitally (1 terabyte external drive :) ) and maybe add video capability later.

jayp 02-16-2009 11:18 PM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
I dont have much to say about garageband other then Ive had a good experience using it.

I only record a track from my MPC(sampler) into my girlfriends Macbook pro using garage band, everything was very fluent and the workflow was nice, very smooth overall and the quality of the recording was great.

GRUNTERSDAD 02-16-2009 11:27 PM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
I don't post much of my playing here, but what I do is through my Garage Band program.
I have two mics and a small mixer, with a USB out right to the Mac.

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 12:19 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
It's the end of an era for me. No more screwing around with PC multimedia.

I saw a demo of garage band, and it was intuitive, and effortless!

I purchased a 2.66 ghz IMAC and a 1 terabyte external drive (LACIE).

I am going to bump the mac up to 4gb.

I should be recording (when I get time) either tomorrow or Wednesday.

My new Trick side snare should be in this week as well.

805Drummer 02-17-2009 12:22 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by trkdrmr (Post 541501)
It's the end of an era for me. No more screwing around with PC multimedia.

I saw a demo of garage band, and it was intuitive, and effortless!

I purchased a 2.66 ghz IMAC and a 1 terabyte external drive (LACIE).

I am going to bump the mac up to 4gb.

I should be recording (when I get time) either tomorrow or Wednesday.

My new Trick side snare should be in this week as well.

Nice! Great decision, to buy the Mac. After using a PC since I was 4, I finally saved up enough to get a Macbook Pro when I was 13. It is basically the best computer ever. From hardware, to software, to everything in between, everything is smooth and effortless. Soon, you'll be using PCs and saying "how did I ever live with this?" I promise.

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 12:38 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
I just ordered a 4gb sodimm module. Apple wanted $300 plus shipping, I found one from a reputable dealer for $57.00

I have dabbled with mac in the past, and the reasons/ excuses I used before not to buy one:

1) Gaming-- well, I don't PC game anymore. I have a PS/3 on my bigscreen.

2) Software reinvestment: well, there are enough free things out there like "Open office" that will work like MS office. And ivideo blows away windoze movie mangler.

A few of my friends have macs in various forms, so that helps.

I will still have my dual core AMD pc upstairs and the imac in my drumroom.

I am looking forward to pain-free multimedia.

Mediocrefunkybeat 02-17-2009 12:42 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
What can I say? A wise decision. I've had my iMac for 2 years now and it's been nothing but a great computer. I bumped up the RAM to 2Gb (for 27 from ORCA) and run Logic Pro 8 as my main DAW. It's excellent. Logic 8 was a deal for me (student discount means 120) and is a great piece of software - but Garageband is not to be sniffed at for a free application.

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 12:51 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediocrefunkybeat (Post 541510)
What can I say? A wise decision. I've had my iMac for 2 years now and it's been nothing but a great computer. I bumped up the RAM to 2Gb (for 27 from ORCA) and run Logic Pro 8 as my main DAW. It's excellent. Logic 8 was a deal for me (student discount means 120) and is a great piece of software - but Garageband is not to be sniffed at for a free application.

Now I have an alternative software to go to if I outgrow garage band! There were not many alternatives on the pc that I could afford. They all cost $500+, and then you add specific hardware. I could drop a couple grand on just getting the software alone!

Not only did cubase not want to talk to the presonus input (firewire) but it was an insane "big brother" application. There was a long, multistep process to download a specific license, and give them your life's story to activate, and then another process to register from a "software license vault". Then there was a nearly 300mb download of patches only available from the steinberg site, and fed at a ludicrous dial-up like speed of 7kbps.

I am just glad that CRAPbase LE came with the purchase of my presonus firebase studio. The store offered a $249 upgrade (which I passed on, and very glad I did.)

I am going to my drumroom to make space on my table for the imac.

GRUNTERSDAD 02-17-2009 01:33 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
You can buy memory at OWC.com Other World Computing. About 1/3 of the Apple price.
I've done it for my laptop and my iMac

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 02:06 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by GRUNTERSDAD (Post 541540)
You can buy memory at OWC.com Other World Computing. About 1/3 of the Apple price.
I've done it for my laptop and my iMac

Cool! I have saved the link, thanks!

Now maybe I need to look at an eventual source for software....

Mediocrefunkybeat 02-17-2009 03:10 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by trkdrmr (Post 541519)
Now I have an alternative software to go to if I outgrow garage band! There were not many alternatives on the pc that I could afford. They all cost $500+, and then you add specific hardware. I could drop a couple grand on just getting the software alone!

Not only did cubase not want to talk to the presonus input (firewire) but it was an insane "big brother" application. There was a long, multistep process to download a specific license, and give them your life's story to activate, and then another process to register from a "software license vault". Then there was a nearly 300mb download of patches only available from the steinberg site, and fed at a ludicrous dial-up like speed of 7kbps.

I am just glad that CRAPbase LE came with the purchase of my presonus firebase studio. The store offered a $249 upgrade (which I passed on, and very glad I did.)

I am going to my drumroom to make space on my table for the imac.

Not sure how much Logic 8 is in US Dollars without the student discount; but the price is still much less than Cubase and most of the industry rivals. It's a great bit of software and whilst the install is huge (46 Gb) it's well worth the three hours it takes. The copy protection is simple as well, it is JUST a serial number. The other DAW's I've seen are all generally very good, but Logic wins on the price and ease of use. It's just as powerful as the others as well really (with the possible exception of Pro Tools with regards to audio editing, but that's a pain in the backside). So - it's all good!

EDIT: I just looked it up and Logic Studio 8 is $500. But there is Logic Express, which is the equivalent of Cubase LE for Logic. Although with a much improved functionality. That runs to $200 directly from Apple. I used the previous version (Logic Express 7) and that was a good bit of software. I just wanted the extra power of the professional version seeing as this is for my degree.

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 03:18 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediocrefunkybeat (Post 541581)
Not sure how much Logic 8 is in US Dollars without the student discount; but the price is still much less than Cubase and most of the industry rivals. It's a great bit of software and whilst the install is huge (46 Gb) it's well worth the three hours it takes. The copy protection is simple as well, it is JUST a serial number. The other DAW's I've seen are all generally very good, but Logic wins on the price and ease of use. It's just as powerful as the others as well really (with the possible exception of Pro Tools with regards to audio editing, but that's a pain in the backside). So - it's all good!

It seems to be about $449. Even if it was the same price as cubase, I'd go for it instead, because now I have that option. I also enjoy that I am no longer fighting the evil forces of the vista code, or cruel, user-resistant apps like cubase.

I *should* be able to squeeze 46 GB install somewhere on either my 500gb internal or 1 terabyte external drive.

Of course you know, this means I will have to try to work my digicam (firewire) into the equation.

My ultimate goal is primarily to get at least decent quality audio, and eventually...video. I promise that If I ever put anything on you tube, I will edit out the awkward moments of climbing onto the throne and preparing to play.

Mediocrefunkybeat 02-17-2009 03:22 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
I'm not sure how the external drive will deal with it. For me, I had to install onto my main system drive (my 120Gb internal) but if your 1Tb is a FireWire drive, it might be entirely different. They can be used as boot drives. Never having tried it though, I wouldn't know. Either way you have much better storage options than I do.

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 03:28 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediocrefunkybeat (Post 541591)
I'm not sure how the external drive will deal with it. For me, I had to install onto my main system drive (my 120Gb internal) but if your 1Tb is a FireWire drive, it might be entirely different. They can be used as boot drives. Never having tried it though, I wouldn't know. Either way you have much better storage options than I do.

Yep, the Lacie is either usb or firewire. (It was on sale for $199.)
http://www.lacie.com/imgstore/produc...bignetwork.jpg
http://www.lacie.com/imgstore/produc...dra_drives.jpg

LaCie 2big Quadra
2-BAY RAID I USB I FireWire 400 & 800 I eSATA
1TB
http://www.lacie.com/us/products/product.htm?pid=11140

Mediocrefunkybeat 02-17-2009 03:38 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
FireWire is more likely to accept the install. USB external drives won't, which is what my problem is. On the other hand, I don't need massive internal storage anyway and I tend to use my external drive for most of my projects and back up on my music department server. Comes in handy!

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 03:41 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediocrefunkybeat (Post 541600)
FireWire is more likely to accept the install. USB external drives won't, which is what my problem is. On the other hand, I don't need massive internal storage anyway and I tend to use my external drive for most of my projects and back up on my music department server. Comes in handy!

Yep. Ironically, the imac is also almost as small as a laptop, given it's slim form factor.

I could not pass up $199 for that lacie. I may never fill it, but there is 3x the space I have ever had on a system (the most before being 320gb).

I was more concerned with proper amounts of ram. The imac ships with 1gb, which on a mac seems to work *ok.* 4gb will rock, it would be like 16gb on a pc, thanks to app bloat.

Mediocrefunkybeat 02-17-2009 03:44 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Well 1Gb always did me well until I put Logic on here. Then on the advice of a technician I put the extra gig in. I did actually have a major software conflict on here that stopped Logic from working to start with (never got to the bottom of it) and actually installed my system again from scratch - but even that was relatively painless. Backed up my user files to my external drive, put the disks in and followed instructions. No problems at all and now my system is nice and clean. Result.

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 03:52 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediocrefunkybeat (Post 541606)
Well 1Gb always did me well until I put Logic on here. Then on the advice of a technician I put the extra gig in. I did actually have a major software conflict on here that stopped Logic from working to start with (never got to the bottom of it) and actually installed my system again from scratch - but even that was relatively painless. Backed up my user files to my external drive, put the disks in and followed instructions. No problems at all and now my system is nice and clean. Result.

Good! I am not attempting anything until I ensure the OS is up to date, as is the rest of the software. I am probably going to be at least 6 months away from going to something heavy duty like Logic.

I also want to get Sony vegas software for the video work.

Incidentally, vista ran like a slug uphill until I got at least 4gb.

Mediocrefunkybeat 02-17-2009 03:56 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Were you running Vista in 64-bit? There's a little scandal going on at the moment whereby Vista will only recognise 3Gb of RAM in 32-bit. Which is more than a little ridiculous given the amount of system resources it consumes. Roll on Windows 7...

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 04:00 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediocrefunkybeat (Post 541612)
Were you running Vista in 64-bit? There's a little scandal going on at the moment whereby Vista will only recognise 3Gb of RAM in 32-bit. Which is more than a little ridiculous given the amount of system resources it consumes. Roll on Windows 7...

I did after a while. It's recognizing all of it now. It DIDN'T on my older machine's initial install. (Circa vista's release) After a few gigs of patches, I could see 4gb register.

If this pc I am on now (upstairs) ever needed to be replaced, it would likely lose it's job to a macbook pro.

Note that apple builds on os/x, and as good as it was when it started, I know it's better now. My friends swear by it. This will be windows 3rd major reincarnation since os/x started.

Mediocrefunkybeat 02-17-2009 04:05 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
I'm waiting for 10.6 to do my upgrade of OS/X, but I like the fact that they don't do a complete re-write as well. The source is UNIX, which is stable as Hell and they can't really go wrong - they've accepted issues with the system in the past and quickly sorted out solutions for users. I really think Apple are winning the OS war at the moment; the number of Apple systems I've seen around University is getting more and more with each day.

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 04:13 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediocrefunkybeat (Post 541616)
I'm waiting for 10.6 to do my upgrade of OS/X, but I like the fact that they don't do a complete re-write as well. The source is UNIX, which is stable as Hell and they can't really go wrong - they've accepted issues with the system in the past and quickly sorted out solutions for users. I really think Apple are winning the OS war at the moment; the number of Apple systems I've seen around University is getting more and more with each day.

It's shocking to note the extremes the US Government has to go to to secure and maintain xp/vista that it runs. The extreme measures, restrictions and (lack of) stability issues would not exist if we contracted for Macs, or at least linux.

Armed services multimedia services *all* use loaded macs with huge displays.

Mediocrefunkybeat 02-17-2009 04:20 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Funny that you mention Linux. I'm messing around with various distributions on an old PC Laptop that I have. I've tried Fedora 10 and 9 on there (9 is awesome), Ubuntu 6.06, 8.04 (current install), 8.10, Madriva, (whatever the new one is) Puppy Linux (great micro distribution) and at least a couple of others I forget. All I can say is that they're all pretty good and it won't be long until commercial companies will start producing software for at least the Debian-based systems. Now Microsoft have been made vulnerable, more savvy users are starting to get their way again. Interesting how the tide turns.

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 04:25 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediocrefunkybeat (Post 541626)
Funny that you mention Linux. I'm messing around with various distributions on an old PC Laptop that I have. I've tried Fedora 10 and 9 on there (9 is awesome), Ubuntu 6.06, 8.04 (current install), 8.10, Madriva, (whatever the new one is) Puppy Linux (great micro distribution) and at least a couple of others I forget. All I can say is that they're all pretty good and it won't be long until commercial companies will start producing software for at least the Debian-based systems. Now Microsoft have been made vulnerable, more savvy users are starting to get their way again. Interesting how the tide turns.

My (now retired) PC with cubase was set up as a dual boot to kubuntu. I didn't get too far, because that pc (unlike this one) had too many proprietary media boards/chips that ubuntu didn't like. That may also be why Cubase hated it as well.

That was the only, and last "pre built" pc I have owned in 18 years.

Mediocrefunkybeat 02-17-2009 04:26 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
I tried Kubuntu on there too actually now I think about it. Hated the KDE interface with an absolute passion. Next on the list is Xubuntu. My main problem is the damned Broadcom wireless adapter in the laptop - same problem you have with the drivers. I have to go around and use a firmware cutter every time I install the system and I invariably forget how to do it.

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 04:29 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediocrefunkybeat (Post 541633)
I tried Kubuntu on there too actually now I think about it. Hated the KDE interface with an absolute passion. Next on the list is Xubuntu. My main problem is the damned Broadcom wireless adapter in the laptop - same problem you have with the drivers. I have to go around and use a firmware cutter every time I install the system and I invariably forget how to do it.

I think I gravitated toward that because of the GUI, maybe gnome would have been better. But when you have a "windows xp media edition" pc, it's as if it is designed to react like a body rejecting an organ transplant if it has anything except xp media edition on it.

Mediocrefunkybeat 02-17-2009 04:31 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
That would sound about right. No surprises there. I think my next laptop is going to be one of those subnotebooks with dual boot XP and Ubuntu. I need XP to run Max/MSP but the rest of the time it'll be a Linux distribution. Ideally I'd get a Mac, but I'm considering a Mac Pro as my next desktop and a small (non Mac) laptop.

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 04:34 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediocrefunkybeat (Post 541638)
That would sound about right. No surprises there. I think my next laptop is going to be one of those subnotebooks with dual boot XP and Ubuntu. I need XP to run Max/MSP but the rest of the time it'll be a Linux distribution. Ideally I'd get a Mac, but I'm considering a Mac Pro as my next desktop and a small (non Mac) laptop.

I was under the impression that the new intel-based macs would run XP apps? I don't know how good...

Mediocrefunkybeat 02-17-2009 04:36 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
They run XP full stop natively. Dual boot system on Boot Camp. They'll also run Linux if you want them to. I was referring to my next laptop, which I doubt will be a Mac laptop - mainly because of the expense and the fact that I'm a poor student.

trkdrmr 02-17-2009 05:57 PM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
I have a rubbermaid folding table (approximately 5' wide) that I am going to have to use instead of my round table.

With all this gear, I need to spread it out better.

I am also considering a wireless mouse and keyboard to eliminate a couple cables.

trkdrmr 02-18-2009 01:15 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
1 Attachment(s)
My Mac arrived via ups today. It took less time to go from the box, to recording than it did simply to install and register cubase.

Power on.
Make a few language choices.
Instantly recognizes netgear network, and several others in the area, with a signal so strong it blows away the signal I was getting on my PC
Instantly recognizes Lacie backup via time machine.
Instantly recognizes firestudio
Launch garage band.
Instantly recognizes firestudio control input and synchs.
Add track, record done.
The end. All that took a whole 20 minutes from the box.

This was the easiest computer setup I have had since plugging in an Atari to a TV set.

Now I am updating software, and getting something less rudimentary than iphoto--like GIMP.

Rudimentary recording studio:

trkdrmr 02-18-2009 04:47 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
A brisk 675mb of software updates, GIMP and Open office and I now have a full function workstation.

Now comes the challenge of recording. I also intend to experiment with the recordability of 2002 vs Zildjian A customs.

I will also find a more elegant way to route the wires and set up the presonus.

My side snare will be here no later than saturday.

Mediocrefunkybeat 02-18-2009 12:28 PM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Good to see it's all working for you mate! It's really not difficult is it?

trkdrmr 02-18-2009 12:39 PM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediocrefunkybeat (Post 542153)
Good to see it's all working for you mate! It's really not difficult is it?

I am surrounded at work with hardcore Mac naysayers. That, was a waste of breath on their part.

If relationships with women were this easy, I'd have a dozen right now.

I hate to call this stuff a no-brainer, but nothing "PC" has ever worked this well and this quickly. It's almost scary how well it works. Setting up vista +cubase was a project to keep my blood pressure intact after the 14th re-boot and complete failure to interface with the presonus.

Reservations I had were gone, and os/x does everything better -in every conceivable way- than xp or vista with the possible exception of crashing.

trkdrmr 02-18-2009 07:48 PM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
If I thought I could get a fair price for my PC, I would sell it and get another IMAC.

My PC's days are numbered, because it will get replaced, if by attrition.

GRUNTERSDAD 02-18-2009 09:32 PM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by trkdrmr (Post 541987)
My Mac arrived via ups today. It took less time to go from the box, to recording than it did simply to install and register cubase.

Power on.
Make a few language choices.
Instantly recognizes netgear network, and several others in the area, with a signal so strong it blows away the signal I was getting on my PC
Instantly recognizes Lacie backup via time machine.
Instantly recognizes firestudio
Launch garage band.
Instantly recognizes firestudio control input and synchs.
Add track, record done.
The end. All that took a whole 20 minutes from the box.

This was the easiest computer setup I have had since plugging in an Atari to a TV set.

Now I am updating software, and getting something less rudimentary than iphoto--like GIMP.

Rudimentary recording studio:

I have my iMac on that same exact table. Plenty of room to spread out.
Now you need a small midi/keyboard to add piano and effects to your drum playing.

805Drummer 02-18-2009 09:36 PM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by trkdrmr (Post 542158)
Reservations I had were gone, and os/x does everything better -in every conceivable way- than xp or vista with the possible exception of crashing.

That's exactly what the rest of the world should realize.

Mediocrefunkybeat 02-19-2009 12:56 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 805Drummer (Post 542415)
That's exactly what the rest of the world should realize.

If it's any consolation, mine hasn't crashed in over two years.

trkdrmr 02-19-2009 02:19 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediocrefunkybeat (Post 542500)
If it's any consolation, mine hasn't crashed in over two years.

I haven't seen the blue screen of death often, however...

In XP and vista things happen that MS claims the system was designed to avoid. One application can go haywire and lock up the whole system. This is to the point the task manager has no effect or cannot even be used. This happens plenty of times.

If this happens in linux/OS/X they have a force shutdown to kill the offending application.

On a pc, it just goes into a coma as all memory/CPU resources are gone.

Power off... restart. Safe mode? Normal?

Xp and Vista are uncooperative multi-crashing platforms.

I am completely amazed how fast the imac runs on ONE gig of ram. XP and especially vista need much more just to be minimally useful. My 4gb module has been shipped and should be here soon.

trkdrmr 02-19-2009 03:12 AM

Re: Garage band (imac) vs CUbase le 4 agony
 
Ok, minor fiddling, not a killer learning curve.

I was able to do a test recording. It sounds like I have mics on EACH drum, not just overheads.

I don't quite have the depth of the ban's , but the attack and most of the tone is there.

I had to set the mics to midpoint and let er rip. I have some slight cleanup to do with the kick, but that's it.

Finally!

I just have to figure out a few more tweaks on how garage band works, and get the kick dialed in.

Definaetly getting low end through the sub!


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