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-   -   Electronic Drum kit? (http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114640)

Benjo 02-24-2014 08:12 PM

Electronic Drum kit?
 
I am a beginner in the world of drumming, and i am currently getting the money together to get my first kit. I have been seriously looking at the "yamaha dtx400k". Do you think this is the one to go for or shall my money be spent elsewhere?
(BTW i can only get an electronic drum kit and my budget is about £600)
cheers for the help

Dr_Watso 02-24-2014 08:14 PM

Re: Electronic Drum kit???
 
The folks over at a site called "v-drums" will have better answers than us since we mostly deal in "real" drums =).

New Tricks 02-24-2014 08:45 PM

Re: Electronic Drum kit???
 
Used, craigslist.

And I love fake drums :)

New Tricks 02-25-2014 01:02 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Ahhhh banished to the E drum sub section buried in the "gear" forum :)

The love for fake drums is evident here. :)

Hansolo 02-25-2014 02:26 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Dear Dr Watso - I need some advice ...........

I want play my ''real'' drums when I can't sleep, so I offered my neighbors some earplugs but they suggested I use them as suppositories.

Can you recommend an alternative to playing my ''unreal'' electronic drums when I need some rhythmic practice, without disturbing others?

New Tricks 02-25-2014 07:24 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Simple.

Don't use sticks.

Hansolo 02-25-2014 10:58 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Yeah I can try air-drums with headphones, but that doesn't help Benjo sort out his query.

This Yamaha link provides a comparison of the DTX 400K with the DTX 500 series: http://europe.yamaha.com/en/products...rums/el-drums/

It could also be worth comparing the Alesis e-drums: http://alesis.com/percussion

Dr_Watso 02-25-2014 05:45 PM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hansolo (Post 1234563)
Dear Dr Watso - I need some advice ...........

I want play my ''real'' drums when I can't sleep, so I offered my neighbors some earplugs but they suggested I use them as suppositories.

Can you recommend an alternative to playing my ''unreal'' electronic drums when I need some rhythmic practice, without disturbing others?

I didn't say you couldn't play your toy fake drums, I just said the guy posting was more likely to get help on a dedicated toy drum forum.

Or just get some sleep and play your real drums in the morning like a man.

Hansolo 02-25-2014 09:03 PM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Thanks for the advice Doc - some of us only get to choose between playing e-drums or no drums at all - when acoustic drums aren't an option.

Dr_Watso 02-25-2014 10:52 PM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Any time you need more sage advice, just ask!

toddmc 02-26-2014 12:07 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hansolo (Post 1234824)
Thanks for the advice Doc - some of us only get to choose between playing e-drums or no drums at all - when acoustic drums aren't an option.

Obviously the answer is to play no drums at all and give up on this e-drum pipe dream! : P

Dr_Watso 02-26-2014 03:56 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by toddmc (Post 1234882)
Obviously the answer is to play no drums at all and give up on this e-drum pipe dream! : P

Take up the Ukulele!

Reggae_Mangle 02-26-2014 01:58 PM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
E-drum is better than no drum at all. They play very different from acoustic kits. The biggest difference is the lack of dynamics on most lower end kits. The feel of playing an e-kit is also very different, less bounce, smaller pads, different vibrations in your palm....

If you can look past these shortcomings, you might find e-kits have advantages, such as lower noise, more compact, easier to record. If you hook up to a VST, you'll find a vast improvement in sound vis-a-vis most drum brains. You can practice at all times of day and night.

Of course, you'll have to take what you learn on the e-kit and reapply it to the acoustic kit. But the time taken to do this will grow shorter as you acclimatise yourself to the feel of playing each type.

New Tricks 02-26-2014 08:46 PM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr_Watso (Post 1234739)

Or just get some sleep and play your real drums in the morning like a man.

That explains why my breasts are growing at an alarming rate. I thought I was just getting fat.

Damn E drums!

One of the best things about the E's is how simple it is to record with them. No mics, no acoustic room treatments. I can sit behind the fake kit with my headphones and wireless mouse and do as many takes or partial takes as I want. It's just way too easy to love these things.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a8/...ps1c276000.jpg.




And.....I don't know....I think I could still pick up Dr. Watso by his throat and take his wallet :)


http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a8/...psc7fde517.jpg

Hansolo 02-27-2014 12:09 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Hey New Tricks - I see you're one of those innovative musos who plays both 'real' and 'unreal' drums. I won't ask you to pick a favourite and I wouldn't mind having a similar space for my musical 'toys'.

I can't play ukulele on my 'pretend' Multi-12 setup, but I can play any of the included 100+ GM instrument sounds on the 24 pads, which cover 1 octave per M-12 (with up to 4 notes on each pad).
There are plenty of 'unreal' sounds to pick from using the M-12's 200 user kits, plus some more variety with a midi-controlled synth connected - but they are only a digital version of the 'real deal'.

BTW Benjo - in case you want some more options to consider, check out this Roland comparison: http://www.sweetwater.com/shop/drums...ison_chart.php

toddmc 02-27-2014 12:14 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by New Tricks (Post 1235171)
That explains why my breasts are growing at an alarming rate. I thought I was just getting fat.

Damn E drums!

And.....I don't know....I think I could still pick up Dr. Watso by his throat and take his wallet :)

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a8/...psc7fde517.jpg

Great shot of a REAL MAN behind a fake kit there New Tricks!! : P
I think we need to school the doc on just how MANLY e-drums can be.
Does THIS look like a wussy e-kit to you Dr Watso?? Huh?? Yeah?? Say what??

New Tricks 02-27-2014 01:16 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hansolo (Post 1235241)
I won't ask you to pick a favourite and I wouldn't mind having a similar space for my musical 'toys'.

For what I do, I actually favor the E kit.

1) It allows me to control the volume of the entire band. We play until 11PM and my neighbors never hear a thing unless they are standing on my door step.

2) Recording is a breeze.

Given the appropriate setting and a sound guy, I'll play A's with no issues. They are just drums. All you have to do is hit them at the right time :) Almost every horrible mix I hear in bars/clubs is based on the damn drums being too loud.







Quote:

I can't play ukulele on my 'pretend' Multi-12 setup, but I can play any of the included 100+ GM instrument sounds on the 24 pads, which cover 1 octave per M-12 (with up to 4 notes on each pad).
I have a crap load of things on my SPD-SX so I can play any instrument at any time :) I have to spend the time writing and recording them but, after that it's all easy.

Dr_Watso 02-28-2014 12:58 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by New Tricks (Post 1235171)
That explains why my breasts are growing at an alarming rate. I thought I was just getting fat.

Don't have breast problems of my own, so I'll let you work that one out.

Quote:

One of the best things about the E's is how simple it is to record with them. No mics, no acoustic room treatments. I can sit behind the fake kit with my headphones and wireless mouse and do as many takes or partial takes as I want. It's just way too easy to love these things.
...And it still sounds fake, lacks proper dynamics/feel, and is plagued with triggering issues.


Quote:

And.....I don't know....I think I could still pick up Dr. Watso by his throat and take his wallet :)
If you're smart, you'll take the contents of my wallet and buy some drums that aren't fake.

Dr_Watso 02-28-2014 01:03 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by toddmc (Post 1235248)
I think we need to school the doc on just how MANLY e-drums can be.
Does THIS look like a wussy e-kit to you Dr Watso?? Huh?? Yeah?? Say what??

Yes. See the black disks made of rubber and plastic on top of the kit? The ones that say "roland"?

Also, it looks like a waste of a perfectly good real kit. So sad.

It's okay, guys. Not everyone has what it takes to play real drums. They're big and loud and scary. Quite intimidating when you're used to your rock band kit!

toddmc 02-28-2014 02:17 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr_Watso (Post 1235616)
Yes. See the black disks made of rubber and plastic on top of the kit? The ones that say "roland"?

Also, it looks like a waste of a perfectly good real kit. So sad.

It's okay, guys. Not everyone has what it takes to play real drums. They're big and loud and scary. Quite intimidating when you're used to your rock band kit!

You mean acoustic shells and heads actually produce sounds and don't just serve as a mounting system for your triggers?? Well I'll be....

Hansolo 02-28-2014 07:55 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
So Benjo, if you prefer quiet and relaxing sessions on a compact kit, apparently the Doc suggests you should 'stick' with your unreal e-drum choice.

Dr_Watso 02-28-2014 08:53 PM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hansolo (Post 1235743)
So Benjo, if you prefer quiet and relaxing sessions on a compact kit, apparently the Doc suggests you should 'stick' with your unreal e-drum choice.

Yea. As everyone knows, it's impossible to play relaxing or quiet stuff on a real kit.

Also, I can say from experience:

CLAK - CLAK - (hollow thump) - CLAK - CLAK

Is anything but relaxing to anyone else within physical ear shot.

I'll be open for advice giving on the subject of e-drums all day long. If you want more expert opinion, just ask!

New Tricks 03-01-2014 12:32 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr_Watso (Post 1235613)

If you're smart, you'll take the contents of my wallet and buy some drums that aren't fake.


OK.........I laughed :)

Hansolo 03-01-2014 11:44 PM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Benjo (Post 1234418)
I am a beginner in the world of drumming, and i am currently getting the money together to get my first kit..........(BTW i can only get an electronic drum kit and my budget is about £600)

Hey Benjo - as you get involved with e-drums, you need to be aware they can be very addictive and consume a lot of your time. It starts off as a fun activity playing a basic e-drum setup with a variety of preset kits, but before long you'll probably be tweaking the settings and making your own user kits. The next phase is when you want bigger and better sounding kits and you may get hooked on a quest for greater variety of natural sounding percussion mixed with electronic effects. This has been my experience and I suggest the major music companies should be more accountable for enabling an addiction known as compulsive e-drum tweakers syndrome. I aquired a DTX Multi-12 several years ago thinking it should be easy enough to customize it more to my liking. However I'm still fine-tuning it and creating new kits trying to simulate my favourite drum sounds (eg Alex Van Halen's snare drum is a real challenge: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KH7j185hotE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p24lrvN5XcA)
Whereas some dedicated acoustic drummers will be spared this dilemma as they are satisfied with a single kit that suits their preferred music styles.
So I offer this cautious advice as you enjoy your unreal e-drumming experience.

EssKayKay 03-02-2014 02:55 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Hey Benjo –
I agree with Hansolo but I guess that’s part of the mystic….

SKK

bud7h4 03-04-2014 06:17 AM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr_Watso (Post 1234739)
I didn't say you couldn't play your toy fake drums, I just said the guy posting was more likely to get help on a dedicated toy drum forum.

Or just get some sleep and play your real drums in the morning like a man.


Good grief, somebody turn this kid's mic off already.

JimFiore 03-11-2014 07:23 PM

Re: Electronic Drum kit?
 
e-drums are to acoustic drums what a Strat is to a Martin D-45 or a synth is to a baby grand. E-drums and a-drums are two different beasts designed to do basically the same thing but in different ways with differing advantages and tradeoffs.

I started off in the 70s playing a Gretsch birch rock kit. I expanded it. Then got Roto-toms. Then I got into electronics, first with a Simmons SDS7 analog/digital, then some custom stuff I designed, then MIDI hit. I started using the Roland line, first with rubber pads and a TD7 module, later with a TD20 and custom made mesh pads. Presently I'm looking to get back to acoustics. Here are a few thoughts from 40 or so years of drumming...

The disadvantages of e-drums are:

1. They tend to have a more narrow tonal and dynamic range than acoustics. In other words, they're not as responsive (although the higher end kits are much better in this regard than the entry level kits). For many people this is not a huge issue, especially if you're using a lot of compression on your records or PA. If you're sloppy with set-up or have a cheap module, eliminating false triggering will further erode the dynamic range.

2. Off the shelf look rather like toys. Lots of plastic. This can be an issue if you're the sort of person who is testosterone driven and needs to have their "manhood" validated by appropriately sized inanimate objects. This is not an issue if you're not playing out with the kit. Also, there is a way around this and you can save money in the process. A popular DIY trick among e-drummers is the "stealth" kit. Basically, you buy a basic acoustic kit that looks nice and some cheap cymbals. Then you replace the heads with mesh heads and add triggers. To the cymbals, you add some clear sheet vinyl underneath to damp the sound and add triggers. You get a kit that appears to be a normal acoustic but it requires no mics. And of course, good mics are not cheap so you can save a lot there also. www.vdrums.com is a great resource for DIY stuff.

The advantages of e-drums are:

1. Obviously, they are very quiet! You actually have a volume control!

2. You can completely change kits by turning a knob. One minute you're playing a maple jazz kit, the next minute a birch rock kit, then a kit using all Roto-toms, then a kit made up of various ethnic instruments. And they never go out of tune.

3. Recording (and PA) is easy: No mics, just plug in and go.

4. If you don't make a stealth kit, they are small, light and easy to transport.

5. Because the sound of the drum has nothing to do with the physical size of the trigger, you have greater kit placement choices.

I posted a detailed blog entry about my drum gear journey a few years back here. I hope you find it interesting reading.


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