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-   -   Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals (http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=112332)

TreeClimbingFeet 12-06-2013 12:59 AM

Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
6 Attachment(s)
I recently tried a set of double Demonators at a local music center and after examining the pedals makeup decided that it was possible to make an Off-Set type pedal with a pair (two sets) of Demonator doubles.

The Demonators are pretty good value by themselves - longboards (not Axis longboard length, but the same length as Demon Drives in their longboard configuration, which is pretty much the exact same length as an Eliminator foot-board minus the heel plate, even though it somehow just feels longer), these boards are very thin but with lengthwise reinforcing veins underneath, so they are strong as well, and very very light. The point of an Off-Set type setup is not only to center the body, but to eliminate slave pedal lag and it does this not so much by eliminating it as by halving the load and distributing the lag equally, which is where the extra lightness of the Demonator longboard comes in. The single chain, lightweight cam, and shortened drive-shafts all help minimise the chances of feeling like you are playing two slave pedals (which you are).

Everything you need (apart from a hacksaw to shorten the drive-shafts) comes with the pedal: A drum key, and the two Allen-keys needed for the set-screws. The posts are modular so all that was involved was unscrewing a few screws, flipping the cams around, shift a few things here and there, and screwing things back in place. Everything is symmetrical and It's also possible to make a 'lefty' double kick out of the standard double in a matter of half an hour, with no extra parts needed, due to Pearl making handy symmetrical screw-holes in the foot plates. The beater holders, cams, and beater angle cams were stuck on pretty well and even after removing the set-screws they were a very tight fit and needed a couple of love-taps from the persuader to let go completely.

I previously made an Eliminator double middle pedal set but they were too heavy for my preferences and the chain slack was still there when playing fast. Not so with the Demonators. I found it hard to get the chain to slacken when going fast, which is the complete opposite to the Eliminators. The actual un-modified Demonator pedal by itself is a surprise, faster and more foot-stickingness than expected. And they are cheap (to buy).
It is also possible to swap the cams on the Demonator for Eliminator cams and therefore have a lightweight, longboard, Off-Set type Eliminator with interchangeable cams, although widening and re-tapping of a couple of holes in the footboards may be required.

After making this pedal, from two sets of double pedals, I am leftover with a complete single Demonator pedal, and everything for another complete single pedal, bar a base-plate and clamping mechanism. I am going to custom make an extended base-plate for the leftovers, so I can change the angle of the chain more along the lines of the Tama Speed Cobra pedal, and see how that works (for speed, of course). Along those lines, someone has already made a Tama Speed-Cobra Off-Set type pedal here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHJmlIvdxC0


How does the Demonator middle pedal play? Well, frustratingly, I was not as good as George Kolias the moment I sat down and tried them, and not even two whole days later. But I assume that will happen when I buy some Axis pedals anyway. So even though you are obviously playing two slave pedals, it feels far more responsive than say, a standard pair of Eliminators. The fact that both pedals are equal quickly highlights which foot is weaker, and I can no longer blame the slave for the misdeeds of the master. I am finding the center-pedal setup allows me to train my weaker foot appropriately, instead of compensating for differences in pedal responses.

harryconway 12-06-2013 02:34 AM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
Looks like you did a great job with the fabrication/mods.

MrInsanePolack 12-06-2013 05:39 AM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
Very nice. Can you post a pic of how it looks with the whole set? I want to see how having your kick drum centered effects the floor tom and hi-hat in relation to the rest of the kit.

Bo Eder 12-06-2013 08:02 AM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
Very cool modification work there! I saw that Sonor manufacturers a double pedal like that and saw Will Calhoun play his kit in this manner and I'm still trying to get my head around playing that way. But it looks cool.

harryconway 12-06-2013 09:31 AM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bo Eder (Post 1204488)
.... Will Calhoun play his kit in this manner ....

Will plays a Sleishman. He kinda tipped the scale when I looked into 'em. Before the Sleishman, I had an Off-Set.

Beam Me Up Scotty 12-06-2013 12:03 PM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
Nice job with the configuration. I tried an offset pedal a few times before, but I never could get into it, nor change the way my kit is set up to accommodate said change.

Axis pedals won't make you play like George Kollias ;)

Reggae_Mangle 12-06-2013 01:35 PM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
That is one cool mod. Where did you get the footboard you're using in the middle for the beaters?

wildbill 12-06-2013 11:01 PM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
Nice job.

Too bad they don't make something like that, instead of having to use two doubles to get there.
At least you end up with three useable pedals out of it.
Can you fit a snare stand in the center to have everything nice and symmetrical?

harryconway 12-06-2013 11:48 PM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by wildbill (Post 1204756)

Too bad they don't make something like that ....

Well, not from Pearl. But Off-Set does make something like that.

TreeClimbingFeet 12-07-2013 01:32 PM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrInsanePolack (Post 1204452)
Very nice. Can you post a pic of how it looks with the whole set? I want to see how having your kick drum centered effects the floor tom and hi-hat in relation to the rest of the kit.

As it is I have dismantled my kit at the moment for refurbishing (peeling the vinyl off and then a varnish), but I can tell you the only thing it really changes is the placement of your toms, if the tom mounts are attached to your bass drum. I found it feels like playing involves less stretching/reaching when playing and everything just feels more easily accessible. I think if I ever have to use a standard double kick again (like when I get my Axis pedals and can play like George Kollias a week or two later) I will mount my toms on racks so I can approximate a center-pedal design.

Here is a link to the patent-holder for the center Off-Set pedal brand system with a thorough description and some visual aids:

http://www.off-set.net/Off-Set/Home.html

And here is a video of someone talking about and playing his Off-Set pedal and how it affected his kit and him.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJz7BjIfzOo

TreeClimbingFeet 12-07-2013 01:45 PM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Reggae_Mangle (Post 1204557)
That is one cool mod. Where did you get the footboard you're using in the middle for the beaters?

I used two sets of double pedals to make it. The middle base-plate is from one of the master pedals that housed the two beaters. The two pedals are the slave pedals from both sets. The posts on the middle footboard are both slave posts from both master pedals, the left is the original and untouched, the right is the other master slave post flipped around.

TreeClimbingFeet 12-07-2013 01:55 PM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by wildbill (Post 1204756)
Nice job.

Too bad they don't make something like that, instead of having to use two doubles to get there.
At least you end up with three useable pedals out of it.
Can you fit a snare stand in the center to have everything nice and symmetrical?

Apparently Sonor and another company used to make them too but don't make them anymore because they weren't licensed by the patent holders (http://www.off-set.net/Off-Set/Home.html).

Yeah, snares fit better actually (for me), but it would depend how close you have it to the bass drum.

MrInsanePolack 12-07-2013 05:49 PM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TreeClimbingFeet (Post 1204927)
Here is a link to the patent-holder for the center Off-Set pedal brand system with a thorough description and some visual aids:

http://www.off-set.net/Off-Set/Home.html

That visual aid has some issues. The standard double pedal side, the seat needs to be moved to the right. That will fix the centering issue. Anyone who plays lots of double kick does this already. Just set up like you have two kicks. It isn't that complicated.

The Off-Set side has the right pedal encroaching into the floor tom. This is what I wanted to see. For me this would not work. I would have to move the floor tom farther away because my leg would be hitting it. I can't have that.

harryconway 12-07-2013 06:06 PM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrInsanePolack (Post 1204974)
The Off-Set side has the right pedal encroaching into the floor tom. This is what I wanted to see. For me this would not work. I would have to move the floor tom farther away because my leg would be hitting it. I can't have that.

I think you're reading more into a "poorly drawn illustration" than there is. Any of these center pedals, you move your bass drum to the left. Not your foot to the right. My knee is tight against my floor tom, in my standard 1 up, 2 down configuration (with a traditional single or double pedal). With the Off-Set (or Sleishman), my right foot, the pedal under it, and my right floor tom all remain on the exact same piece of real estate. The only thing that moves, is the bass drum. To the left. To be center with the twin beaters.
A quick Google image search for "sleishman drum pedal" will provide you several pictures.

MrInsanePolack 12-07-2013 06:16 PM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by harryconway (Post 1204978)
I think you're reading more into a "poorly drawn illustration" than there is. Any of these center pedals, you move your bass drum to the left. Not your foot to the right. My knee is tight against my floor tom, in my standard 1 up, 2 down configuration (with a traditional single or double pedal). With the Off-Set (or Sleishman), my right foot, the pedal under it, and my right floor tom all remain on the exact same piece of real estate. The only thing that moves, is the bass drum. To the left. To be center with the twin beaters.

You are probably right about the drawing. Personally I would not be able to do that because my 2 toms to the left of the kick cant be mounted to the kick itself. The stand would get in the way. I would have to acquire a rack. I do think that the OPs pedal is pretty dang cool though.

harryconway 12-07-2013 06:27 PM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrInsanePolack (Post 1204983)
I would have to acquire a rack. I do think that the OPs pedal is pretty dang cool though.

Racks are a definite plus. Being I tend to run my hi-hat centered (Yamaha cable) with my double pedal, a rack certainly makes that possible.
And yeah, the OP did a beautiful job, making those pedals.

Drumsinhisheart 12-11-2013 05:33 PM

Re: Pearl Demonator Off-Set Double Kick Pedals
 
Fantastic job, man. I love to see the DIYers succeeding with stuff like this.

If I wasn't into Drumnetics now, I'd still be using my Off-Set on a single kick. I never had any particular problems with floor tom placement..


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