DRUMMERWORLD OFFICIAL DISCUSSION FORUM

DRUMMERWORLD OFFICIAL DISCUSSION FORUM (http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/index.php)
-   Pedals (http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=27)
-   -   Double pedal with a smooth surface? (http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=111103)

supermachoman 10-18-2013 05:14 PM

Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
in my young drumming days I loved to play the drums with a double pedal. at some point I ditched it and started playing with a single pedal, to focus more on my hi-hat technique. as a side-effect, my right foot now hits much better, and all that by using the slide technique.

I wanna buy a double pedal again, I kinda miss it. but I wanna be able to slide on it.
the usual fight back in the day was eliminator vs cobra, I'm the guy who would swear by the cobra, but the texture of the pedal is so rough that I can't slide on it.
any pedal with similar feel as the Iron Cobra, but smoother surface? I've seen some Yamahas that are absolutely flat on top, not even carved letters or anything, that seems perfect.

I know it all comes down to feel, and I will go and try pedals out, just asking to be sure I won't miss anything.

flurbs 10-18-2013 05:29 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by supermachoman (Post 1190479)
Any pedal with similar feel as the Iron Cobra, but smoother surface?

Given your previous preference, I would suspect that the Speed Cobra is exactly what you're after.

http://www.tamadrum.co.jp/speedcobra/

JosephDAqui 10-18-2013 05:32 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Try the Yamaha - I use it for exactly the same thing. I have the model 9315 but even the newer ones have a smooth surface and it's really well made. I sold my Speed Cobras to get the yamaha. Just my .02.

TColumbia37 10-18-2013 05:45 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by flurbs (Post 1190484)
Given your previous preference, I would suspect that the Speed Cobra is exactly what you're after.

http://www.tamadrum.co.jp/speedcobra/

The Speed Cobra would probably be a good bet. When I tested one out, it was good, but felt a little sluggish. Probably because I didn't adjust it much.

I've always played DW pedals, and I've never had a problem being able to slide on them.

Emmaticus00 10-18-2013 05:48 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
I would not get the DW 2000 because it is so rough.

supermachoman 10-18-2013 06:56 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
thank you all for the replies.

the speed cobra is considered a "longboard" pedal, right? would that affect my posture or drumseat position on the set? I've heard of people having this issue.

TColumbia37, I searched a bit and the only DW pedal that doesn't seem "rough" is the 9002. is that the one you use?

also thanks JosephDAqui, I'll definitely try the Yamahas then.

TColumbia37 10-18-2013 07:21 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by supermachoman (Post 1190532)
the speed cobra is considered a "longboard" pedal, right? would that affect my posture or drumseat position on the set? I've heard of people having this issue.

TColumbia37, I searched a bit and the only DW pedal that doesn't seem "rough" is the 9002. is that the one you use?

I played 5000s for a couple of years, and recently switched to 9000s. I play with shoes on and never have problems. If anything, my feet slide too much.

Speed Cobras do have a longer board, but that shouldn't affect anything.

Yamaha makes great products. You can't go wrong with their pedals.

scorch whammin 10-18-2013 07:33 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Axis and trick pedals have a smooth surface foot boards as well....I currently own and use Axis Derek Roddy sig. and Vector Axis pedals...love them and actually can't see myself ever changing from them...

Arky 10-18-2013 08:02 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Yes, Axis are quite smooth. (Depending on the version) They have that Axis logo laser-cut and you do feel it slightly but it's neglectable for slide technique. I like the smoothness of Axis pedals (got myself a pair of used Longboards recently).

There's another way to get a smooth surface if you prefer the feel of a certain pedal but the footplate isn't as smooth as you want - modding it to your liking. I never liked that carved footplate on my dw2002 double pedal so at one point I decided to mod it. Sure a mod will probably ruin the reselling value but for me it was worth it - more playing fun and hey, those pedals didn't cost a lot to begin with.

Here's what I did:
http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=97507

The first few days after the mod the pedal felt 'slippery' but I got used to and like it a lot. I also flexed down the heel area so those shortboards would have some more longboard feel.

double_G 10-18-2013 10:17 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
yeah i love the newer Yamaha pedals. i have HH & single (strap). Really great action & fab if you woodshed or play in bare-feet. Agreed on checking Axis as well. more $$ but something to consider if you are looking toward Kollias level speed w/ a bit better hardware.

supermachoman 10-18-2013 10:23 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
thanks again for the responses.

scorch whammin, I've tried some Axis pedals, they feel really smooth and light but I don't see myself ever playing at Kollias speeds, so the extra bucks I'd have to spend on them seem like an overkill!

Arky, I never understood why the 2000s have that rough surface on the heel. Good job on getting rid of them! also nice work on smoothing down the footplate, at first I didn't see it so that means you did a good job (if it also feels good!).
But to be honest I wouldn't buy an expensive Iron Cobra to try to bring it to my own taste the same day.
How about the Chrome Iron Cobra? Looks a bit ugly for my taste, but it must have the slipping surface of a banana. Do they still sell these or should I look for a used one?

/e hehe double_G, I was typing when you posted. nice that we both brought Kollias as an example :p

wildbill 10-19-2013 01:08 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
I tried the Speed Cobra and liked it - but liked the Yamaha better, and that's what I went with.
The DW9000 pedal doesn't really look smooth at a glance. But I think it's because of the slotted heel pad. The actual pedal part is pretty smooth and my foot moves easily on it.

For heavily modifying a pedal, like taking a grinder or sander to it - I'd only do it with something used.

XplosiveDrummer 10-19-2013 01:28 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
You want to know what you can achieve with a DW9000 single pedal? Watch this video of Thomas Pridgen and see. Crazy slide technique. Helps to have a nice thick sock as well lol.

Lets see if this works, I copied the URL with the video at the time he starts to play....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...I6yiIGgo#t=170

supermachoman 10-19-2013 01:45 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by XplosiveDrummer (Post 1190667)
You want to know what you can achieve with a DW9000 single pedal? Watch this video of Thomas Pridgen and see. Crazy slide technique. Helps to have a nice thick sock as well lol.

Lets see if this works, I copied the URL with the video at the time he starts to play....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...I6yiIGgo#t=170

yep, the video worked as you wanted.
call me paranoid but the DW he uses doesn't have the huge 900 letters carved on it, maybe it's a different surface?
Pridgen is such a beast.

v.zarate 10-19-2013 02:17 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by supermachoman (Post 1190676)
yep, the video worked as you wanted.
call me paranoid but the DW he uses doesn't have the huge 900 letters carved on it, maybe it's a different surface?
Pridgen is such a beast.

dw pedals come with a specs stickers on the pedals. that sticker wasnt removed, thats why it looks different. :)

http://vicsdrumshop.com/wp-content/u...2012/11/dw.png

XplosiveDrummer 10-19-2013 02:47 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by supermachoman (Post 1190676)
yep, the video worked as you wanted.
call me paranoid but the DW he uses doesn't have the huge 900 letters carved on it, maybe it's a different surface?
Pridgen is such a beast.

Yeah he is a character for sure. Incredible will and determination to learn his craft. If you so desire you can take a look at these videos as well, just for something to watch. I have to say he's one of the more technically inspiring, free willed drummers out there. He's not afraid to mix it up and fail in front of a crowd while learning new things at the same time. Here is video one and I believe there are three of them. You want to be humbled and inspired at the same time, these are the ones to watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=482mqSNo6E4

As for the pedal. Yes it's the 9000, you can tell by the colors of it and especially the big bulky cam lol. As v.zarate pointed out, the reason you don't see the numbers is because he left the protective plastic "sleeve" on the pedal for that added slippery effect to help with the slide technique lol.

As for a smooth pedal, like others have said and to keep it at a friendly price range, it has to be Yamaha. Next would probably be the Mapex Falcons, followed by the Speed Cobra and DW9000.

I've played the Speed Cobras for about a week until I returned them for the Iron Cobra Power Glides. The pedal was just far too light under my foot, I didn't like the action of the longer footboard and could never find a good position for my right foot. So I went with the IC which is a more standard footboard, although a tad longer than say a standard board like DW's and weighs much more which helps me control it better. Although since playing the IC for many weeks now and trying out my DW3000's again, I feel the IC footboard and build of it is far, far too heavy for me but has the frictionless feel and speed I like. I can do heel toe quite well now on both but find I like the detailed feedback I get from the DW footboard.

To cut this short and yes I too am now a believer as I thought going to the Speed Cobra was going to be the best and final move for a pedal, that you must put your feet to them and play around as much as possible before deciding. I personally don't have the guts to do that in a Guitar Center, so from now on I may have to buy used, test and then return after I'm done. I really wish I could try the Mapex Raptor as that is direct drive, to see how I liked DD and if I do would probably go with the Yamaha such as wildbill did. If nothing else, I believe because of the footboard size and action of the DW9000, that it will be the one I aim for in the end. Perfect footboard and impeccable feel and speed like the Iron and Speed Cobra. Best of both worlds for me IMO.

Dre25 10-19-2013 03:43 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Just about all of them are fine for playing with socks, I even used to play my iron cobra with socks too. I agree that it isn't ideal but I managed to work with it.

I have the dw9000, mapex falcon and also owned the pearl demon drive and they were all smooth as you needed them to be.

flurbs 10-19-2013 03:59 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by supermachoman (Post 1190532)
the speed cobra is considered a "longboard" pedal, right? would that affect my posture or drumseat position on the set? I've heard of people having this issue.

Why on earth would it affect your posture or position? It's a pedal, it doesn't change the way you sit. Sit where you want, use the posture that you want, try the pedal - it'll either work for you or it won't. If it works, buy the pedal. If it doesn't, try something else.

supermachoman 10-19-2013 10:24 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by flurbs (Post 1190837)
Why on earth would it affect your posture or position? It's a pedal, it doesn't change the way you sit. Sit where you want, use the posture that you want, try the pedal - it'll either work for you or it won't. If it works, buy the pedal. If it doesn't, try something else.

well, chill, a friend of mine switched from iron to speed, and he told me he had to change position so that he could feel comfortable again.

all in all, thanks guys, I'm going to the local drumstore on Monday to check their Yamahas. the 9500 series seems really cool!

Dre25 10-20-2013 04:06 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
I kinda know what he means about the posture thing. With long boards, the pedal board gives way under your foot more easily than it does with regular boards. With regular boards your foot rests closer to the hinge where there's more leverage. So keeping your balance or bracing yourself is a little different.

OP, I'll add that I think it's harder to use your slide technique with long boards. I personally don't like it and prefer short boards in that instance, but I think my mapex falcons are excellent pedals.

drumming sort of person 10-20-2013 06:39 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
The current Iron Cobra pedal's surface is much smoother surface than the previous.

EarthRocker 10-20-2013 04:42 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
PDP have a new pedal with a completely smooth, and long footboard. It actually looks like they took a page out of the Speed Cobra's book with it. I haven't tried them, but they're affordable and look really nice. It's called the Concept. Not sure if they're gonna' change it or not.

supermachoman 10-20-2013 06:20 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EarthRocker (Post 1191072)
PDP have a new pedal with a completely smooth, and long footboard. It actually looks like they took a page out of the Speed Cobra's book with it. I haven't tried them, but they're affordable and look really nice. It's called the Concept. Not sure if they're gonna' change it or not.

Yeah I saw that one in another topic, that looks really good. Pellegrom's demonstration was hideous though, haha.
it's really really cheap though, the price is in the DW2002 tier, and I think it's the only double chain pedal to be so cheap (why isn't the double chain a standard for pedals anyway? does it cost that much more to the company to produce it or what?)
eager to try it but I think it won't be in my country until 2014.

v.zarate 10-21-2013 02:11 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EarthRocker (Post 1191072)
PDP have a new pedal with a completely smooth, and long footboard. It actually looks like they took a page out of the Speed Cobra's book with it. I haven't tried them, but they're affordable and look really nice. It's called the Concept. Not sure if they're gonna' change it or not.

Quote:

Originally Posted by supermachoman (Post 1191101)
Yeah I saw that one in another topic, that looks really good. Pellegrom's demonstration was hideous though, haha.
it's really really cheap though, the price is in the DW2002 tier, and I think it's the only double chain pedal to be so cheap (why isn't the double chain a standard for pedals anyway? does it cost that much more to the company to produce it or what?)
eager to try it but I think it won't be in my country until 2014.

damn guys you beat me to it!!!

i was just a GC this afternoon and i was messing around with the PDP concept pedals. they feel good and the footboard is smooth as hell. while i was messing around with them, i was thinking of supermachoman the whole time and how i would recommend them to him. they come with a speed cam??? iirc
i like them alot... enough to change my single dw5000 pedal.

im gonna get them next week cause i dont have a double bass pedal atm.

beyondbetrayal 10-21-2013 03:44 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
the dw9000's are like a boat to me..... big and heavy and slow

demon drives can be changed from short boards to long boards and back. are smooth. hit hard and are VERY fast pedals.

axis are also a great pedal .

i can do heel toe..double strokes. slide. swivel, and fast singles on both with no issues.

but everyone has their own opionions

a few things on the speed cobra. my buddy bought some and they fell apart WAY to fast. I also tried some out for a few days and found them kind of cheaply made. they are also not nearly as responsive as the demons/axis for fast playing / heel toe... once again my opinion but i strongly suggest trying those too out.

on that note... both the pedals I suggest have a much higher pricetag.

MrInsanePolack 10-21-2013 06:21 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dre25 (Post 1190986)
With regular boards your foot rests closer to the hinge where there's more leverage.

Not true. It is easier to push the pedal down towards the top than it is at the hinge. It is a fulcrum, that is how they work. If you don't believe me, try it with 1 finger. You will have an easier time getting the beater to contact the head from the top of the pedal than you will at the hinge.

Dre25 10-22-2013 04:51 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
I think you misread me.

I agree with you, it's easier to push down the further away from the hinge, which is why longer boards are easier again. There is more board for you to get away from the hinge and because they're longer the sweet spot is spread over a larger area.

beyondbetrayal 10-22-2013 03:10 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
With my demons i tried both ways. once they were in longboards i never went back.

Most people who dislike/argue longboards have not sat down with them and used them for a week + straght.

they take a bit to get used to. the feel is MUCH different. they are way faster and you bairly have to push them down to send them flying. I can usually crank my springs max on long boards as i cant when in the short board config. thus generating alot of speed at less effort.

the slide is pretty much the same on both for me though. It helps me to have my batter skin nice and tight for rebound as well.

Mad About Drums 11-06-2013 11:15 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Try considering the Mapex Falcon, it has a smooth surface.

http://www.manchesterdrum.com/avacti...s/1155_lge.jpg

v.zarate 11-07-2013 03:22 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
well i bought the pdp concept pedals and couldnt be any happier with them. built simple and get the job done! the long foot pedals feel great

supermachoman 11-19-2013 07:31 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Look what the cat dragged in!

http://i.imgur.com/trk0ATKl.jpg
(DFP9500, direct drive)

found it used for half the retail price and it doesn't even have a single mark on it, I was quite lucky there. smoothest pedal I've tried.

experimenting a bit with adjustments, but I have a question, what is this:
http://i.imgur.com/al95Y1Ll.jpg

and how do I remove it? I want my beaters closer together and that thing gets in the way.
it has two hex screws underneath, removed them with a key but couldn't move the thing.

wildbill 11-19-2013 10:33 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by supermachoman (Post 1199304)
Look what the cat dragged in!

http://i.imgur.com/trk0ATKl.jpg
(DFP9500, direct drive)

found it used for half the retail price and it doesn't even have a single mark on it, I was quite lucky there. smoothest pedal I've tried....


Lucky guy. I got those fairly recently and already think I'd have a hard time doing without them.

Took a look at mine, and from the factory, the right side beater is tight against the center part that holds the drive link. You've got a big gap in there that could be closed up. Someone must have changed it. Just loosen up the right side beater holder and slide it to the left against the link holder.

About the circled part in your second pic: if you look at the frame from the front or underside, you'll see that it has a reinforcing piece running between the uprights. The circled part is attached to that.
It contains a bearing that the shaft rides on (as well as the bearings on both sides).

You probably could remove it if you disassembled the whole thing, and take the shaft out. But I think you'd lose a fair amount of stability without the center bearing and the attachment to the frame support. Not worth the trade-off, I think.
Plus, if you ever want to use different beaters, they'd probably hit each other.
The beaters on there are pretty narrow, and if I used my regular round felt Yamaha beaters, I'm pretty sure they'd hit.

Great pedals, and you got a good deal on them. Someone must have tried them and decided direct drive wasn't right for them.

supermachoman 11-19-2013 10:42 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by wildbill (Post 1199339)
Someone must have changed it.

yup, me!
they were closer together, but when I mounted the pedal on the bass drum, the right beater was right on center, and the left beater was much further left. I want them to be close (sweet huh?) but I want them to be symmetrical as well.
thanks for the advice regarding that black part, won't touch it for now. maybe when I'm drunk.

the guy had it for a year and decided to quit drumming. dunno how people take such decisions but well, his loss, my gain!

wildbill 11-19-2013 10:54 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
1 Attachment(s)
It might be they're set that way for if you just want to use the single right pedal.

Here's how mine was set when new:

.

supermachoman 11-19-2013 11:00 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by wildbill (Post 1199351)
Here's how mine was set when new:

.

would it be too much to ask for a picture with both beaters touching the bass drum? or just tell me if the "master" beater is much closer to the center than the "slave" is

/e:
Quote:

Originally Posted by wildbill (Post 1199351)
It might be they're set that way for if you just want to use the single right pedal.

got my answer :)

MrInsanePolack 11-19-2013 11:52 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by supermachoman (Post 1199342)
thanks for the advice regarding that black part, won't touch it for now. maybe when I'm drunk.

If you remove the black part, your pedal would be unplayable. Not only does it house the bearings, it supports the two shafts that the beaters mount to. Remove the black piece, no housing for the bearings, no support for the shafts, no workie workie for either side.

You want the beaters symmetrical, move the right one over. You want the right beater centered, no more beater symmetry. It is a case of wish in one hand and poop in the other to see what fills up faster.

BTW, trying to deal with disassembling and assembling that black part is a pain in itself. I would advise to NOT do it drunk.

wildbill 11-19-2013 11:57 PM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Is the pedal surface smooth enough for you?

I've got mine set up on an electronic bass drum pad. They have to be offset from center a bit. I'm sure if I hooked 'em up to my kit, the right pedal would be closer to the center than the left pedal.

Almost all double bass pedals are offset to a certain degree. Just the nature of the beast, I guess. I'm not sure if Yamaha's are offset more than most though.
https://www.google.com/search?q=doub...w=1366&bih=664

Hopefully, they'll work out for you.

Mad About Drums 11-20-2013 12:02 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
The beaters on the Mapex Falcon are evenly spaced on the shaft and will hit the bass drum head at equal distance from the centre (vertically)

https://www.drumworld.com/images/sou...ls/P1000TW.jpg

wildbill 11-20-2013 12:06 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mad About Drums (Post 1199383)

The beaters on the Mapex Falcon are evenly spaced on the shaft and will hit the bass drum head at equal distance from the centre (vertically)...


Oh oh - I see buyer's remorse coming on for supermachoman.



LOL

Maybe you can trade those Yamaha's for a symmetrical Mapex set.

supermachoman 11-20-2013 12:26 AM

Re: Double pedal with a smooth surface?
 
don't mock my OCD issues!

joking aside, couldn't I switch black part's - left beater's places? that would bring the beater in the right place, and keep the black part on the pedal. I'm not sure I understood how that thing works.

wildbill, no remorse! it's a great smooth pedal.
MAD, I tried the falcon in a shop and it felt good; very cobra-like.
I have the mentality on buying only shells new and everything else used; never saw a falcon up for sale in my town, in the last 2 years I'm checking ads.
still the yamaha felt insanely better and a great fit for my needs.


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 01:06 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Bernhard Castiglioni's DRUMMERWORLD.com