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-   -   Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare (http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=110407)

Captain Bash 09-19-2013 09:55 PM

Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Hi I just got to say that I think that Ludwig Supraphonic snares and specifically the std. ludalloy 5 1/2 depth way over rated. I sold mine and now use a Pearl Ultracast similar depth, now that's a drum, so much low end tone for a skinny drum. Any one else agree or am I the only one who thinks this way.

The Old Hyde 09-19-2013 10:01 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
The Supra isn't the only snare out there. Everyone has a sound they like in a snare. Im sure Ludwig never put anyone out of business because of the supra.

bermuda 09-19-2013 10:08 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Just to be clear, the Supras and Acrolites are 5", not 5.5".

I don't think Supras are overrated, but they are ubiquitous, and for good reason: they sound great. Tuning obviously has a lot to do with the resulting sound, and the drum can't be faulted if a pleasing tuning isn't achieved. But it's not hard to get a great sound without much work. Is it the best snare in the world? I don't know, like anything, it depends on who you ask. there are many great sounding snares from several manufacturers.

It's like asking if the Shure 57 is the best snare mic. I don't really know, I'm not an engineer. But I do know that I see one pointed at my snare about 80% of the time on live gigs and in the studio. Then again, there's also the McDonald's hamburgers analogy. :)

My snares of choice are all 6.5", and there are two Supras in the mix. Although I have several 5" Supras, they don't see much action. nothing to do with their sound, I just prefer a 6.5" snare.

Bermuda

8Mile 09-19-2013 10:12 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Different strokes for different folks. I would never try to hang "best" on any drum, because sound preferences are subjective. But I think the Supra does what it does extremely well.

Also, if you're playing a similar snare drum by another manufacturer, it's worth pointing out that it's probably a copy of the Supra.

But, of course, if you don't like it, you shouldn't play it. There are a lot of alternatives.

Captain Bash 09-19-2013 10:20 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
[quote=bermuda;1181980]Just to be clear, the Supras and Acrolites are 5", not 5.5".

Hey Bermuda, my apologies for getting it wrong, you are right Supras are 5".

KarlCrafton 09-19-2013 10:59 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
I like the 402 when I hear people play it, but when I do, I get nothing from it. Might sound great out front, but behind it, not for me.

Same with the 400.

Are they able to get a great sound for any music? Yes.
That's why they are so highly rated.

I prefer my Brass and Bronze 6.5's TBH, but I have owned the 402 (3 different times), and 400. They are well performing snares, but not the sound for me.

The Ultracast snare is a whole different animal than a 400 or 402.
A heavy die cast shell, and die cast hoops are going to perform a lot differently than a 1.2 spun aluminum shell, and thinner hoops. Apples and oranges.

Bo Eder 09-19-2013 11:29 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
I'd answer this one, but Bermuda has again said what I was going to say ;)

Red Menace 09-19-2013 11:45 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
I'm with Karl although I really have not had a chance to put a 402 through its paces. I sold an Acrolite after giving up on trying to get it to sound how I wanted and recently parted out a 400 keeping the lugs for another project. I also tried a very nice Drumcraft cast aluminum snare that was 14x6.5. Something about that drum was just too dry and "modern" sounding for me.

Eventually I want to get a 402 and really try it out as my tastes lean toward deeper drums but I am finding that I prefer brass and wood snares to aluminum. There really is a much different tone going from a spun shell to a cast aluminum snare. A guitarist friend described it as "woody" sounding. For that money though I'd rather just get a wood snare.

mandrew 09-19-2013 11:50 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
I think it safe to say that the supra has earned its reputation, not because a few say so, but because a generation or two have voted that way with their money, from drummers to engineers. Best is impossible to define, but they HAVE earned their reputation, to the point that other companies felt the need to copy.

iamjohn 09-19-2013 11:56 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
For me it's more a matter of the fact that there are a whole lot of crappy snares out there and the Supra is a very safe bet. Buy one, tune it up and bang, you've got a classic, reliable snare sound.

LanceMCA 09-20-2013 03:10 AM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
All drums sounds are subjective... I have a Supra and its just like what everyone else says, its consistently consistent. Always in the pocket. They're not the most AMAZING snare in the world by all means, but they are loved and enjoyed by more people than pretty much any other snare in the world...literally...

digibird 09-20-2013 05:10 AM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bermuda (Post 1181980)

My snares of choice are all 6.5", and there are two Supras in the mix. Although I have several 5" Supras, they don't see much action. nothing to do with their sound, I just prefer a 6.5" snare.

Bermuda

I agree with this :-). I love the 402. My other favorite is a 6.5x14" Ludwig Vistalite snare from 2004. And it may sound like heresy, but I like the supra and the vistalite better than my 6.5x14 Black Beauty.

But not everyone has to love a Supra 402 or 400. Pearl Sensitones are great - I also still have a Pearl Export steel snare that has a great crack to it. And a DW Classic series snare is a beautiful thing...there is lots to love...

BGH 09-20-2013 05:30 AM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by LanceMCA (Post 1182069)
All drums sounds are subjective... I have a Supra and its just like what everyone else says, its consistently consistent. Always in the pocket. They're not the most AMAZING snare in the world by all means, but they are loved and enjoyed by more people than pretty much any other snare in the world...literally...

Well stated. I've used a Supra for my main gigging snare since the late 70's. I've used others to be sure, but I keep coming back to the Supra. And, mine have always been the 5". I currently own a smooth Bronze, 2 aluminum (a 60's and an 80's) and now a 1980ish Acro-all in 5" depth. They are versatile, crisp, responsive and are my sound. If they are not someone else's sound, so be it, and that's perfectly fine. That's why Howard Johnson had 36 flavors-to each, his own.

Les Ismore 09-20-2013 05:37 AM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mandrew (Post 1182021)
I think it safe to say that the supra has earned its reputation, not because a few say so, but because a generation or two have voted that way with their money, from drummers to engineers. Best is impossible to define, but they HAVE earned their reputation, to the point that other companies felt the need to copy.



This is true, but partly by default. In the 60's 70's there weren't as many competing snare drums on the market, there were truckloads of LUDWIGS, everyone had one and by default gigged, recorded with them hence their popularity on vinyl of the era.

That being said and the fact the drums design virtually hasn't change makes the drum dated sonically IMO. I was over, tired of the sound in the 70's.

Any up and coming drummer's snare sound is not going to be heard as new/original if they play a 400/402, their sound is old news already IMO.

If you want ('need') to sound like a million other drummers past, than do get a 400/402.

The BUDWISER of snare drums.

BGH 09-20-2013 05:44 AM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Les Ismore (Post 1182096)
This is true, but partly by default. In the 60's 70's there weren't as many competing snare drums on the market, there were truckloads of LUDWIGS, everyone had one and by default gigged, recorded with them hence their popularity on vinyl of the era.

That being said and the fact the drums design virtually hasn't change makes the drum dated sonically IMO. I was over, tired of the sound in the 70's.

Any up and coming drummer's snare sound is not going to be heard as new/original if they play a 400/402, their sound is old news already IMO.

If you want ('need') to sound like a million other drummers past, than do get a 400/402.

The BUDWISER of snare drums.

I hear you, but haven't things gone full circle? Vintage is back, big time. Every company has a new 'vintage-like' line of drums. I see many drummers using vintage Ludwig kits and the like. Of course, you can use any snare with any kit; they are interchangable. But, it seems that vintage is the new trend.

Les Ismore 09-20-2013 05:48 AM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BGH (Post 1182097)
I hear you, but haven't things gone full circle? Vintage is back, big time. Every company has a new 'vintage-like' line of drums. I see many drummers using vintage Ludwig kits and the like. Of course, you can use any snare with any kit; they are interchangable. But, it seems that vintage is the new trend.



That might be the case, if it is then 400/402 is the snare to get, but every Tom Dick and Harry has one, or will be getting one and Im perfectly OK with that, works for me.

I've been around the circle more than once. The drum is too light for me, the playing feel is not comfortable IMO, plus the dated sound... Im out, been out for years. Too many other good choices to try, find to love.

mandrew 09-20-2013 09:07 AM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
I don't think that a drum has a dated sound. I do think we have dated perceptions. I can change the sound of a drum by changing heads, tunings, snare wire configurations, etc.I can make a supra sound like a respectable concert snare with the right parts and tuning. If I use the same drum set up as was used for vintage recording, yeah, it will sound vintage. I think it is a matter of setup and part selection.

Juniper 09-20-2013 02:23 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
It's a very versatile and dependable snare. It's not got bags full of character and is a very well known sound but I would put it as the ideal workhorse snare.

I have a 1968 Ludalloy 14x5 which I bought around 2 years ago now but I have only recently started to have an attachment to it if I'm honest. I really wanted a dependable shallower snare that I could use as an option at the rockier gigs, so in that respect it does its job and does it very well.

It sounds good live with no/little dampening as it does have a cutting 'bite' but for studio work I tent to use other, deeper snares either brass or maple.

All about preference though!

larryace 09-20-2013 02:41 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by KarlCrafton (Post 1181999)
I like the 402 when I hear people play it, but when I do, I get nothing from it. Might sound great out front, but behind it, not for me.

.

My experiences to a "T". I like the drum a lot, but not for my particular bands I'm in. Kind of thin and dry sounding from the throne. I like to play mine in my studio, but not at my gigs. Funny that.

bermuda 09-20-2013 03:05 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by larryace (Post 1182166)
My experiences to a "T". I like the drum a lot, but not for my particular bands I'm in. Kind of thin and dry sounding from the throne. I like to play mine in my studio, but not at my gigs. Funny that.

I haven't found a single snare (or kick or tom or cymbal or tambourine) that does everything well. But the Supra does most things well.

Ludwig's been through some interesting changes in the last 35 years or so, but the one constant has been their snare drums, and the Supras are hard to beat.

Bermuda

brady 09-20-2013 03:10 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Les Ismore (Post 1182096)
This is true, but partly by default. In the 60's 70's there weren't as many competing snare drums on the market, there were truckloads of LUDWIGS, everyone had one and by default gigged, recorded with them hence their popularity on vinyl of the era.

That being said and the fact the drums design virtually hasn't change makes the drum dated sonically IMO. I was over, tired of the sound in the 70's.

Any up and coming drummer's snare sound is not going to be heard as new/original if they play a 400/402, their sound is old news already IMO.

If you want ('need') to sound like a million other drummers past, than do get a 400/402.

The BUDWISER of snare drums.

I agree. It's actually why I sought out a Supra. Or at least something "vintage-y".

I play mostly jazz and blues; I don't think I play a song recorded after the mid-60's. When I take something other than the maple snare, it's my 400.

It's funny, when I was looking for a metal snare a few years ago, I didn't really want something every other drummer had. I asked a friend of mine to pose the "Which snare?" on one of his recording/engineer forums. By far, most of the responses came back with a Ludwig Supraphonic.

I believe I would have ended up with it anyway. I have always really dug the sound of it even before I knew what model it was...even before I played drums. That goes for both the 400 and 402.

SgtThump 09-20-2013 03:40 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Only the Sith deal in absolutes...

The Old Hyde 09-20-2013 04:01 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by larryace (Post 1182166)
My experiences to a "T". I like the drum a lot, but not for my particular bands I'm in. Kind of thin and dry sounding from the throne. I like to play mine in my studio, but not at my gigs. Funny that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bermuda (Post 1182171)
I haven't found a single snare (or kick or tom or cymbal or tambourine) that does everything well. But the Supra does most things well.

Ludwig's been through some interesting changes in the last 35 years or so, but the one constant has been their snare drums, and the Supras are hard to beat.

Bermuda

Bermuda and Larry, have either of you tries the 6.5 supralite? I know its not the same alloy, its steel, but I think its a very close representation at a crazy low price.

steverok 09-20-2013 04:07 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Les Ismore (Post 1182096)
That being said and the fact the drums design virtually hasn't change makes the drum dated sonically IMO. I was over, tired of the sound in the 70's.

Any up and coming drummer's snare sound is not going to be heard as new/original if they play a 400/402, their sound is old news already IMO.

If you want ('need') to sound like a million other drummers past, than do get a 400/402.

The BUDWISER of snare drums.

Am I wrong to take offense to this post ? Which snare drum one uses does not dictate what they sound like. The drummer is mainly responsible for that. Supra's are great snares, loaded with character, IMO. And even if you don't think so, using one isn't going to automatically make you sound like everyone else. Is a guitar player going to sound dated, and like everyone else, if he plays a Strat ? This is just silly.

BGH 09-20-2013 05:03 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mandrew (Post 1182132)
I don't think that a drum has a dated sound. I do think we have dated perceptions. I can change the sound of a drum by changing heads, tunings, snare wire configurations, etc.I can make a supra sound like a respectable concert snare with the right parts and tuning. If I use the same drum set up as was used for vintage recording, yeah, it will sound vintage. I think it is a matter of setup and part selection.

Here's a story about perception, related to snare drums:

I bought a cheapo Yamaha steel snare, the model you used to get with a Stage Custom kit. I bought it because it included one of those nice Yamaha plastic cases and a nice stand and it was $50 shipped. I didn't really want the drum; I was going to strip the hardware and use the hardware for a project. So, the price seemed right for what I wanted.

When I rec'd the kit I had to give the snare a try, even though my plan was to part it out. To my surprise, I loved the way it sounded. It had a real nice crack to it-very solid, sharp, woody crack. It was the sound I would expect to get from an expensive stave snare. As a result, I bought another similar kit. I think the 2nd one was $62 shipped-same stuff included. This way, I could use one for my intended plan (parting it for a project) and keep the 2nd one as another snare in my arsenal.

The moral of the story relating to this thread is (as mandrew said): when it comes to perception, perception may not be reality. And, price doesn't necessarily equal any 'quality of sound.' A snare drum is what one makes of it. We should keep our minds open, when it comes to drum choices.

opentune 09-20-2013 05:08 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by steverok (Post 1182189)
Am I wrong to take offense to this post ? .

Not at all. Dude's on my "don't bother reading" list ;)

Your post is absolutely correct. I love my Supra, but like my Gretsch too, or my maple drum.....etc. And ultimately its the drummer not the drum.
Honestly, can there be a 'best' or of anything as personal as a musical instrument, or as and subjective as its sound?

The Old Hyde 09-20-2013 05:15 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by opentune (Post 1182205)
, but like my Gretsch too, or my maple drum.....etc. And ultimately its the drummer not the drum.
Honestly, can there be a 'best' or of anything as personal as a musical instrument, or as and subjective as its sound?

a friend bought a Gretsch kit back in the late 80s and the snare was freakin amazing. Don't know what it was but all of us were in awe of this snare. chrome snare. also my brother in law has a rogers chrome snare, sound amazing too.

KarlCrafton 09-20-2013 07:24 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
I am not offended by anyone liking a different sound than I do. Nothing works for "everyone".
You like what you like, and there's nothing to argue about in that regard.

I'm with Les on the feel of the 402. It's not the sound, I like it, and it's not really dated to me, but I haven't been playing them since the 60's either (to get "sick" of it).
I just didn't get the feel for the 402 and I tried 3 different times. I do like my HAMMERED 402, so go figure.... The 400 did ZREO for me.
I just like a heavier snare.

I dig my Acrolite Classic 6.5 though! It's weird, but it feels more solid to me for some reason than the 402. The sound is a lot more to my liking. It has elements of the 402, but it has a fatter sound overall to me.

The cosmetic splay stuff on Ludwig (or others) I could give 2 craps about really. The price (has been discussed) has gone up, but so has everything else, so whatever.

I LOVE the sound of the Supralite 6.5. It's a heavier shell than a 402 also. The lower price is great, and I don't care that it's a seamed shell. It has a slightly more controlled sound than a seamless to my ear, with nice singing overtones.
ALL the seamed shell snares made by companies that copy Ludwig's shell do. MOST people put dampening on their snare anyway, so what's the difference?

I saw a lot of nice stuff at the Chicago show last May, and TBH, the Supralite was my favorite sounding snare. I have so many dang snares now (that don't get into the rotation) that I haven't bought one (yet).
I may sell something in the near future, so I may justify the purchase of one. One friend said, "if you don't have to sell something, why do it" but, I'm just at the point of not wanting a bunch of stuff that just sits and isn't used. It's not really the $150 bucks or whatever.

drumming sort of person 09-20-2013 07:30 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
I got my first 400 back in the late 70s. Very nice drum. Next I got a Supersensitive in 6.5 depth, and that was awesome. Then I went for a 5" Hammered Bronze and loved that for a long time.

I picked up a 6.5" COB with tube lugs and Millenium strainer a few years ago. Incredibly versatile snare drum. Love it.

More recently, I picked up a new 5" a few months ago. It sounded okay, but nowhere near as nice as my COB with tube lugs (or my 6.5" Gretsch USA Custom), so I got rid of it. No more aluminum Ludwigs for me.

The Old Hyde 09-20-2013 07:36 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by KarlCrafton;1182243

I LOVE the sound of the Supralite 6.5. It's a heavier shell than a 402 also. The lower price is great, and I don't care that it's a seamed shell. It has a [I
slightly[/i] more controlled sound than a seamless to my ear, with nice singing overtones.
ALL the seamed shell snares made by companies that copy Ludwig's shell do. MOST people put dampening on their snare anyway, so what's the difference?

I saw a lot of nice stuff at the Chicago show last May, and TBH, the Supralite was my favorite sounding snare. I have so many dang snares now (that don't get into the rotation) that I haven't bought one (yet).
I may sell something in the near future, so I may justify the purchase of one. One friend said, "if you don't have to sell something, why do it" but, I'm just at the point of not wanting a bunch of stuff that just sits and isn't used. It's not really the $150 bucks or whatever.

Will you get a supralite already!!! I got mine because of a discussion with you and I thank you for the advice on it.

tamadrm 09-20-2013 08:38 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
I think if you want to sound like everybody else,you can.But with the right tuning,heads,selection of drum sticks(which has a lot to do with your "sound") and touch of a particular drummer,you'll sound completely different using a supra 400/402.

Example:Bonham,Carl Palmer,Ian Paice,Carmine Appice and Cozy Powell........all used a 402...basically at the same time.

Can you really tell me that they all sounded the same?Not even close.

One of the most versitle snare drums ever made,barr none.

Steve B

Captain Bash 09-20-2013 08:40 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by opentune (Post 1182205)
Not at all. Dude's on my "don't bother reading" list ;)

Your post is absolutely correct. I love my Supra, but like my Gretsch too, or my maple drum.....etc. And ultimately its the drummer not the drum.
Honestly, can there be a 'best' or of anything as personal as a musical instrument, or as and subjective as its sound?

Ohhh come on now. This was a mildly provocative post but I certainly never set out to offend anyone, just my own thoughts to the community. Actually if you look at the responses some like others don't, that's fair enough. But please don't discount my opinions. I never mentioned 'best' in the original post.

Pocket-full-of-gold 09-20-2013 08:50 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Love my Supra's....both of 'em. Really not fazed what others think of them at all.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Bash (Post 1182276)
Ohhh come on now. This was a mildly provocative post but I certainly never set out to offend anyone, just my own thoughts to the community. Actually if you look at the responses some like others don't, that's fair enough. But please don't discount my opinions. I never mentioned 'best' in the original post.

I do believe he was referring to another poster. Quite possibly the poster that was originally quoted in the post he responded too, I'd imagine.

steverok 09-21-2013 12:03 AM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Yes, I was referring to the guy who misspelled "Budweiser".

Les Ismore 09-21-2013 12:14 AM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tamadrm (Post 1182275)
I think if you want to sound like everybody else,you can.But with the right tuning,heads,selection of drum sticks(which has a lot to do with your "sound") and touch of a particular drummer,you'll sound completely different using a supra 400/402.

Example:Bonham,Carl Palmer,Ian Paice,Carmine Appice and Cozy Powell........all used a 402...basically at the same time.

Can you really tell me that they all sounded the same?Not even close.

One of the most versitle snare drums ever made,barr none.

Steve B


If they sounded different its not b/c of the 402's construction/edge profile and to a lesser degree heads/tuning, it would most likely be b/c of recording technique.

To make it easier to understand, If all things were equal, recording, heads, drummer (we'll use Bonham as mythical demonstration example)...

If Bonham were demoing four different 6.5 metal snare drums under the same recording conditions, one of them being a 402, blind sound test, just say "Look, we'll play you 4 examples, tell us which one is the LUDWIG" wouldn't even have to name the other 3, nine out of ten drummers would be able to pick out the LUDWIG example no problem.

The 400/402 are easily the worlds most recognizable metal snare drum sounds. No more versatile than a PEARL SENSITONE, or 50 other steel snares out there.

People shell out the $ for a LUDWIG 400/402 b/c they want that sound, not b/c they want versatility, you can get versatility for a lot less money. They're not putting up the cash for the cheap pot metal lugs and strainer(s) LUDWIG put on those drums. As an example one would put out $ for the materials and workmanship for something like a GMS, or AYOTTE first, LUDWIG 400/402 its sound first, then just reconcile to live with the cheap materials.

The mystique is you really have to own a 400/402 to realize this, once you do and accept the reality its easy to play something else and be happy for less money.

steverok 09-21-2013 01:49 AM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Les Ismore (Post 1182354)
If Bonham were demoing four different 6.5 metal snare drums under the same recording conditions, one of them being a 402, blind sound test, just say "Look, we'll play you 4 examples, tell us which one is the LUDWIG" wouldn't even have to name the other 3, nine out of ten drummers would be able to pick out the LUDWIG example no problem.

That is some kind of reverse psychic prediction capability. I too am absolutely 100% certain that 9 of 10 would pick the Ludwig without zero uncertainty. Without a doubt ...

drumming sort of person 09-21-2013 01:59 AM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Les Ismore (Post 1182354)
I
If Bonham were demoing four different 6.5 metal snare drums under the same recording conditions, one of them being a 402, blind sound test, just say "Look, we'll play you 4 examples, tell us which one is the LUDWIG" wouldn't even have to name the other 3, nine out of ten drummers would be able to pick out the LUDWIG example no problem.

What if the question was "Of these four examples, which do you prefer?"

:-)

Dirtysticks 09-21-2013 04:10 AM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
In my opinion, they are known for being so good, because they all seem to be able to achieve a good usable sound with minimal effort, and it just sort of "works." IMHO, it is one the most distinctive and unique sounding snares, and they always seem to sound nice. They aren't everyone's cup of tea, as some want more distinction in their snare sound. I wouldn't mind having one in my snare arsenal eventually, but the sound isn't such a need right now, as I have a nice sized collection of snares that all have their own distinct sound. To me, Supras are also pretty versatile, ad are a great choice for someone who wants a nice all purpose versatile snare.

KarlCrafton 09-21-2013 03:08 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Les has talked about "cheap pot metal", and things breaking in the past (not just with Ludwig to be fair), but to this day, I have yet to have anything break, or a lug come apart. What gives? I take care of my stuff, but I hardly "baby" it either.

The lug walls on an Imp, large Classic, Bowtie, seem pretty dang thick to me.
Maybe they changed the thickness or metal in the mir-70's when I started playing?
The Mach lugs could knock out some concrete.

I compared a DW TB12 mount to an Elite mount, and the Ludwig had thicker walls.

Compared to a SOLID GMS or Ayotte lug, that's apples and oranges.
If the lugs on a Ludwig were solid, then the sound would change--and I don't think anyone would debate that.

Personally, I don't think the parts used on Ludwig snares are "cheap". They aren't as fancy, or thick or whatever like a Trick throw or something, but, I don't care for Trick throws. They work smoothly, but they have no style, and are a giant hunk of metal stuck on a snare to me.
I have a few P-85's in a bin, that I changed over to P-86's (I like the 86's styling, how it works) and all the 85's work fine.
The (9) 86's I have work like a charm.

They aren't THICK parts, so if the drum was abused, they might need replacing, but no one but me is handling the drum anyway.
Once in a while, a stage crew is moving my gear, but it's on a stand at that point.
If someone dropped the drum then, no brands strainer is gonna survive.

Comparing type of sound, a friend of mine has a Pearl Steve Ferrone sig snare. It's basically a BB copy. It sounds great, but there are differences. The sound of it is more controlled than my BB's--and I have tuned his snare a few times for his bigger shows, and he wanted it to sound like mine. The seam in the shell could contribute to that, and the lug type, and the different edge, and the snare bed, and...

I think that Pearl snare is probably as nice as anyone could want, and told him a few times "if you ever want to sell..'

But, I wouldn't give up my BB's either. I think they are a bit more open, and have a sound that just isn't like other drums. The Ludwig is more sensitive as well.

The amount of lip extending off the bend from the edge inside on a Ludwig shell is more than the other shells I have looked at--and a LOT more than my WorldMax Brass snare--that I do like a lot.

I use a wide open snare, and I like and use the ring I get (on purpose) of the snare. If it's too much coming off the drum for FOH (with their mic choice, the venue, etc...) I just move the mic off the head a bit more. Problem solved, and I get the sound I want.

A lot of people put Moongel, a ring, or whatever to damp down the ring, so IMO, at that point, what's the difference in brands of snares people would use?

You're just going to get a smack, and short sound out of any brand drum anyway. If someone is doing that, then use anything that they think is a good drum, and isn't going to have parts failing on them.

bermuda 09-21-2013 03:42 PM

Re: Are Ludwig Supraphonics really that good a snare
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by The Old Hyde (Post 1182187)
Bermuda and Larry, have either of you tries the 6.5 supralite? I know its not the same alloy, its steel, but I think its a very close representation at a crazy low price.

I don't have one (yet) but it's a sufficiently different drum than a comparable new Supra (which is why I want one!) And the price is pretty amazing for a new drum that sounds so good, I think Ludwig is doing very well with them right now.

Bermuda


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