DRUMMERWORLD OFFICIAL DISCUSSION FORUM

DRUMMERWORLD OFFICIAL DISCUSSION FORUM (http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/index.php)
-   General Discussion (http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=3)
-   -   Strange little professional problem (http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=109844)

Mighty_Joker 08-29-2013 10:15 AM

Strange little professional problem
 
Just wanted a little input.

As a professional drummer (simply meaning I make my entire living from drumming of some kind), I am playing a gig next week with a blues band at a local festival, as a dep. I've played with the band before, some time last year, and got th call again the other week to dep for them again at the upcoming festival.

Anyway, we had our first of two planned rehearsals last night, just running through the set list to make sure we were all on the same page, no problems. At the end, the main guy, who admittedly is a bit absent minded, started working out the cost of the practice room, and came up with a four-way split between the four of us. I found this very unexpected; as a dep, I wouldn't expect to pay for rehearsal space in the lead up to a dep gig, and didnt have any money with me.

Afterwards, I had a quiet word with a few of the other members, and said I wouldn't usually expect to contribute to rehearsal costs as a dep and a full-time working drummer. They were cool about it, but the band leader had left by this point.

What are people's thoughts about this? I have another rehearsal with them on Monday, and don't want to find myself in that awkward position again. Am I wrong in thinking professional deps shouldn't pay for rehearsal space?

Thanks
J

8Mile 08-29-2013 11:00 AM

Re: Strange little professional problem
 
I had to look up what "dep" means (us Yanks, ya know) :)

I would not expect to have to share rehearsal costs for a band if I'm standing in for their regular drummer. It's just professional courtesy. You're helping them out because their drummer can't make the gig. The least they can do is cover your share of the rehearsal costs. If anything, the drummer you're subbing for should be covering it!

Jeff Almeyda 08-29-2013 11:46 AM

Re: Strange little professional problem
 
Definitely out of the ordinary to ask a sub to pay for rehearsal. Tacky as all hell if you ask me.

konaboy 08-29-2013 11:51 AM

Re: Strange little professional problem
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Almeyda (Post 1175250)
Definitely out of the ordinary to ask a sub to pay for rehearsal. Tacky as all hell if you ask me.

Completely agree on that one. If it comes up again I'd pull the leader aside and explain it to him. Or give him a call before the next practice and let him know.

dmacc 08-29-2013 12:47 PM

Re: Strange little professional problem
 
I don't think it's fair to expect you to pay for a rehearsal space as a sub. If this was a known factor for them going into it, then they should have included that detail as part of the conversation when offering you the sub position.

eclipseownzu 08-29-2013 01:20 PM

Re: Strange little professional problem
 
As a professional you should have some kind of contract, or rider, protecting you from this kind of thing. I would think that every detail of the working arrangement would be spelled out and signed by all parties involved. You have to protect your ass, its business. I can only imagine what else this band leader may try and pull. He may end up trying to stiff you, and you have no way to protect yourself legally.

I would definitely contact him asap and make sure you are on the same page. Then get it all in writing as soon as you can. Remember, they need you more than you need them. Expecially now with only one rehersal left before the gig.

tamadrm 08-29-2013 04:07 PM

Re: Strange little professional problem
 
That's like Sting asking Vinny to chip in for studio time on his next album.

I would hope,you have a contract,which stipulates your duties and salary with the band as a non member.Time is money and if anything,you should be getting paid to rehearse,and certainly not paying to do so.

It should also spell out that you are NOT paying to play,but are in fact,playing to get paid,and for a certain amount in compensation.on such and such a date and time.

This band "leader" seems to have his wires crossed.

Steve B

double_G 08-29-2013 04:46 PM

Re: Strange little professional problem
 
hell no. the sub / dep does not pay for REH space. the full time drummer you are subbing for does. hopefully the singer was spaced & thought you were the full time guy or was speaking broadly. if not, the guy is a d-bag & needs his ass kicked.

WhoIsTony? 08-29-2013 05:22 PM

Re: Strange little professional problem
 
you definitely should not have to pay for rehearsals

as a matter of fact my services occasionally require payment for rehearsals....not always ...but depending on the gigs and the situation of hire it is occasionally the case

if you do end up paying for these two rehearsals it should be worked out that you are compensated for what you put out upon final payment .

just for future reference ...I had a basic little document drawn up by my lawyer presenting me as an independent contractor ...I don't always use it ...but if I suspect a situation like this may occur or if I am hired by someone I have not worked for before and the amount to be furnished is substantial I will have a signature required and it protects both parties.

the thought crossed my mind when this was recommended to me by a friend who is a lawyer that this would push away more work than it would secure payment for .......but the contrary has actually happened.
most I have used it with have respected the professionalism of the situation because the language of the contract protects them as well as far as my obligations to them. and in this day and age of the flakey musician it is comforting for those paying to have security .
I have had nothing but good experiences with the paper work .

and like I said I probably use it for 3 out of 10 jobs ....of course you are not going to pull out a legal document while planning gigs with buddies or people you have worked with a bunch already .
but this is not uncommon practice in the world of professional musicians.

this is a business we need to treat as such.....and if you make your living like I make mine then you need to protect yourself and secure payment for your services.

Muckster 08-29-2013 05:25 PM

Re: Strange little professional problem
 
No way should you be expected to chip in as a sub. Add this to your list of conditions for the next sub gig you take.

KarlCrafton 08-29-2013 08:24 PM

Re: Strange little professional problem
 
NO WAY should you have even been ASKED to chip in for rehearsals as a sub.
It's his gig, and you are being paid to do his show as a sub, not a member of the band.
You are the one providing the service. YOU could do another job, but he couldn't do this show without you doing this for him.

I'd set him straight (nicely of course), and if he insists you pay, I'd tell him to find someone else. You could also let other drummers around town know about his "business practices" if he gets snippy about it.

You don't want jobs that are going to cost you money.

...Of course, it could just have been a "I didn't think of that, sorry" too, so maybe tread lightly before bringing out the big guns :-)

Good luck with it!

ocdrums 08-29-2013 08:33 PM

Re: Strange little professional problem
 
Well, if the gig pays $400 I'd chip in...if it pays $100 No way!

Mighty_Joker 08-29-2013 08:58 PM

Re: Strange little professional problem
 
Hi folks,

Thanks for all of the replies, confirming what I already thought. I've since emailed the whole band and politely outlined how I would not expect to pay for rehearsal space. They were very amicable, understood the situation, and the band leader has said he understands, and was just an absent minded mistake.

The gig doesn't pay much anyway. As ocdrums said, if it paid loads, I'd have no problem chipping in, but it's just about a day's wage for the gig.

Anyway, they seem to be fine with it. I said if they wanted me as a permanent member, then I'd happily chip in, but not as a dep.

I'll look into the paperwork more. I've used contracts before, but don't usually bother for smaller gigs. I might make it standard form to provide a contract, whatever the gig.

Thanks again.

JackoDrummer 08-30-2013 07:26 PM

Re: Strange little professional problem
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by eclipseownzu (Post 1175262)
As a professional you should have some kind of contract, or rider, protecting you from this kind of thing. I would think that every detail of the working arrangement would be spelled out and signed by all parties involved. You have to protect your ass, its business. I can only imagine what else this band leader may try and pull. He may end up trying to stiff you, and you have no way to protect yourself legally.

I would definitely contact him asap and make sure you are on the same page. Then get it all in writing as soon as you can. Remember, they need you more than you need them. Expecially now with only one rehersal left before the gig.

I don't know about a rider, but when the BL said lets split this up equally, he was testing the sub relationship and agreement. He knows it's not right. If you agreed or let him leave without challenging the expectation, then you're partly to blame sorry to say. Next time, you'll know to set that straight upfront.


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 07:34 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Bernhard Castiglioni's DRUMMERWORLD.com