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cDark3r 01-04-2013 07:39 PM

Footwear?
 
I'm trying to learn some new foot techniques but I have a question... I don't wear shoes indoors so i have never played drums with shoes. I've been drumming since i was seven and now I'm fourteen btw. But every one seems to use shoes? I can do doubles. one hit with my heal and one with my toe. but with shoes i cant because the shoes are to big...

So do i have to but on shoes every time i'm going to play drums to be able to get better and if I do what kind of shoes? Sometimes i play with a cheap copy of converse shoes but it don't feel good at all.

What footwear do you use? Have anyone tried different footwear? Do you use footwear? Do you use different footwear for different styles?

jofizzm 01-04-2013 08:00 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
I find I like wearing shoes much more then going barefoot, I like the grip. I recently pick up a pair of Keen Tryon (sp) WP trail shoes, just as a pair of shoes, but came to find out they are excellent for drumming. Tight canvas sides and top, rigid sole on the sides, but flexible underneath. Good stuff.

cDark3r 01-04-2013 08:13 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jofizzm (Post 1093894)
I find I like wearing shoes much more then going barefoot, I like the grip. I recently pick up a pair of Keen Tryon (sp) WP trail shoes, just as a pair of shoes, but came to find out they are excellent for drumming. Tight canvas sides and top, rigid sole on the sides, but flexible underneath. Good stuff.

I googled thoose shoes and they didnt look so flat. does it feel better with "unflat" shoes?

iamjohn 01-04-2013 08:21 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
There are a lot of minimalist running shoes that would probably work for you. I use these and like them for drumming:

http://www.newbalance.com/Minimus-10...=1&cgid=167200

Nickropolis 01-04-2013 10:18 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
IMO playing without shoes can lead to ankle/knee problems later on.

I always have some form of footwear on when I play, although I don't have 'playing gear'.

I feel it's the same as gloves...if one day you happened to forget your gloves, your whole flow is going to be screwed. I don't like relying on stuff like that to help me along.

My preference lies in Vans slip ons, though anything from boots to flip flops is acceptable.

My shoe size is 11, just for comparison. Not monstrous but not tiny.

http://www.cloggs.co.uk/content/ebiz...d_pewter_m.jpg

jofizzm 01-05-2013 12:24 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by cDark3r (Post 1093905)
I googled thoose shoes and they didnt look so flat. does it feel better with "unflat" shoes?

They're not flat. I've noticed I more care about the feel of the sides than the bottom. I like the weight of a heavier shoe, vs, a converse type with a flat sole. Just a personal preference.

rtliquid 01-05-2013 12:35 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
Well, you're 14 now. If you plan on doing this for awhile (I started at 10 and I'm 53 now), I'd suggest SOME type of shoe, and get used to it now. Before I started playing out with bands, I played stocking foot (in my bedroom). Even when I started playing out, I'd take my shoes off while I played, then put them back on during breaks and at the end of the night. That didn't last too long though. The bottom line is ... after years of pounding, without some type of support and cushioning, you'll be doing damage. Those New Balance Minimalist shoes look pretty cool. I'm not sure I'd wanna drop $90 on a pair then go into a dive-bar, drunken-infested, toilet-overflowed, flooded bathroom though (which I do FAR too often).

RickP 01-05-2013 12:43 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nickropolis (Post 1093960)
IMO playing without shoes can lead to ankle/knee problems later on.

I always have some form of footwear on when I play, although I don't have 'playing gear'.

I feel it's the same as gloves...if one day you happened to forget your gloves, your whole flow is going to be screwed. I don't like relying on stuff like that to help me along.

My preference lies in Vans slip ons, though anything from boots to flip flops is acceptable.

My shoe size is 11, just for comparison. Not monstrous but not tiny.

http://www.cloggs.co.uk/content/ebiz...d_pewter_m.jpg


I use these too, love the flexible sole.

Juergen 01-05-2013 02:30 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
Hello,

I began with shoes, then I played without and now without during home practising and with during rehearsals and gigs. Shoes are now Converse because of the rubber sole.

Cheerio
Juergen

huskytool 01-05-2013 04:15 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by cDark3r (Post 1093883)
I'm trying to learn some new foot techniques but I have a question... I don't wear shoes indoors so i have never played drums with shoes. I've been drumming since i was seven and now I'm fourteen btw. But every one seems to use shoes? I can do doubles. one hit with my heal and one with my toe. but with shoes i cant because the shoes are to big...

So do i have to but on shoes every time i'm going to play drums to be able to get better and if I do what kind of shoes? Sometimes i play with a cheap copy of converse shoes but it don't feel good at all.

What footwear do you use? Have anyone tried different footwear? Do you use footwear? Do you use different footwear for different styles?

Wrestling shoes are very thin sole and work for some guys. I am primarily using Adidas commander lites.

Jon B 01-05-2013 04:49 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
I play in a pair of vans. Nothing special, gets the job done. I understand you wanting to stay without shoes because of your technique, but there are lots of double techniques you could try. I use slide, another really popular one is heel toe, kinda like what you've described. Shoes are all about getting used to playing in, look at Gene Hoglan for example, he plays in boots!

GRUNTERSDAD 01-05-2013 05:08 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...ighlight=shoes

http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...ighlight=shoes

http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...ighlight=shoes

http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...ighlight=shoes

http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...ighlight=shoes

Please use the search feature before starting a new thread. Thanks

EarthRocker 01-05-2013 08:00 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by cDark3r (Post 1093883)
I'm trying to learn some new foot techniques but I have a question... I don't wear shoes indoors so i have never played drums with shoes. I've been drumming since i was seven and now I'm fourteen btw. But every one seems to use shoes? I can do doubles. one hit with my heal and one with my toe. but with shoes i cant because the shoes are to big...

So do i have to but on shoes every time i'm going to play drums to be able to get better and if I do what kind of shoes? Sometimes i play with a cheap copy of converse shoes but it don't feel good at all.

What footwear do you use? Have anyone tried different footwear? Do you use footwear? Do you use different footwear for different styles?

Youtube is littered with drummers who play barefoot, and in socks. I dislike this - I think it not only looks goofy, but I hate the feeling of a cold pedal on my feet.But whatever makes em' feel like they play better. As far as what shoes to wear, I really don't think there is a right and wrong. I wear all different types of shoes, sneakers like Adidas Superstars, Vans slip ons, and the very popular Chuck Taylors. It doesn't really effect my playing at all.

The only types of shoes I don't wear are the plain Jane tennis shoes, or running shoes as some call them. Anything that doesn't weigh your foot down is fine. If you're having difficulty playing bare foot, vs wearing shoes, then you just need to practice with shoes on.

In short, I don't think any footwear dominates another for drumming. Those drumming shoes that artists endorse, I tried em', and I think they are just a money making gimmic. I'd rather have sneakers any day

scooter540 01-05-2013 06:28 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
I've used Nike Five indoor soccer shoes for the past few years. They've got grip and they're tight on my feet. I hate drumming in loose shoes. If my shoes are loose even the slightest bit they get kicked off and I go barefoot.I feel that I have less control of my pedals if my shoes aren't moving in complete sync with my feet.

lsits 01-05-2013 11:29 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
Low-top Chucks for me.

mxo721 01-06-2013 12:06 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
I've just started learning to play my bass drum "heel up" been playing only just under 3 years, yeah wish I would have started heel up, but I never thought I'd need anything other than heel down. I seem to only be able to play barefoot/soxs to play heel up, if I have shoes on, I play real sloppy for some reason, so looks like bare feet for me from now on.

Pocket-full-of-gold 01-06-2013 01:13 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
I prefer high heels. Really accentuates my shapely calves.....especially when paired with the fishnets and suspenders.

Since I started wearing them I no longer need to practice either. I definitely play much faster with them on......a miracle cure to slow feet if ever I've seen one. You guys really should give them a try.

BacteriumFendYoke 01-06-2013 02:11 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mxo721 (Post 1094437)
I've just started learning to play my bass drum "heel up" been playing only just under 3 years, yeah wish I would have started heel up, but I never thought I'd need anything other than heel down. I seem to only be able to play barefoot/soxs to play heel up, if I have shoes on, I play real sloppy for some reason, so looks like bare feet for me from now on.

In terms of heel-up or heel-down, I generally encourage others to start playing heel-down, with some heel-up action.

One of the most overlooked areas - especially for beginners - is playing the bass drum with dynamic control. Playing heel-down can help to develop this because it is inherently less powerful. Heel-down playing uses mainly ankle motions whilst heel-up uses mostly leg. Having both in your arsenal is very useful, as is learning to play with the beater 'buried' into the head (more punch, less sustain) and letting the beater off the head (less punch but more sustain and tone).

I switch between the two techniques and the two beater methods depending on what is required (more often, heel-down, off the head at the moment) and it gives you more options. Starting as a heel-down player can develop the smaller muscle movements and allows a player to develop a feel for dynamic control that most heel-up playing doesn't.

I also find heel-down playing more difficult because it requires more small-muscle control and practice to develop a 'basic', solid technique.

So I don't see you starting heel-down as a problem. You know you can play like that and now you can build up the power using heel-up but because you've developed both it also means you can be selective about accenting and excel in low-volume situations, which generally require more control.

As for shoes? Don't care. I generally play better in shoes but I can play without. I can play with Converse trainers on, paratrooper boots and anything in between with similar levels of control and feel (same for driving, actually) so it doesn't make any difference to me as long as I'm comfortable.

jofizzm 01-06-2013 04:09 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold (Post 1094483)
I prefer high heels. Really accentuates my shapely calves.....especially when paired with the fishnets and suspenders.

Since I started wearing them I no longer need to practice either. I definitely play much faster with them on......a miracle cure to slow feet if ever I've seen one. You guys really should give them a try.

Your throne is so pretty, pocket...

Pocket-full-of-gold 01-06-2013 04:17 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jofizzm (Post 1094556)

Ha!! I knew it would catch on. Bet Lux wishes she had my legs though!! :-)

But all in all, it's a fine example of "it's the foot not the shoe" if ever I saw one.

Chromium 01-06-2013 12:19 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
DC Skate shoes for me... comfortable with a nice flat sole.

Dre25 01-06-2013 04:16 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nickropolis (Post 1093960)
IMO playing without shoes can lead to ankle/knee problems later on.

Really? Why do you say that?

I am having ankle/knee/hip problems and my doctor said it was my flat shoes (I have high arches and so my ankles roll in). I was actually wondering if my intense weekend double bass practice was doing damage.

I wear socks at practice, or shoes when gigging/drum shopping.

Aahzz 01-08-2013 03:36 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
Add me to the Vans crowd...

Nickropolis 01-08-2013 04:29 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dre25 (Post 1094715)
Really? Why do you say that?

I am having ankle/knee/hip problems and my doctor said it was my flat shoes (I have high arches and so my ankles roll in). I was actually wondering if my intense weekend double bass practice was doing damage.

I wear socks at practice, or shoes when gigging/drum shopping.

Playing without proper shoes, that is. It might not be a cure but it will help.

It's physical activity on your feet and legs, if your shoes (or feet) lack support or shock absorption then there will be an increased strain put on them through thousands of bass drum and hi hat pedal movements.

Everyone's not the same obviously, and I'm no doctor (Watso...?) but there can be many issues and reasons behind those issues that cause physical pain or degradation.

Simply wearing shoes won't cure a sore knee if it's being torqued by your ankle, you need footwear with more arch and ankle support, and/or a regimen of ankle/calf strengthening exercises.

BacteriumFendYoke 01-08-2013 10:51 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
Shock absorption? That old line again?

Although I don't run barefoot for various environmental reasons - 'shock absorption' is actually something that footwear companies trawl out to sell trainers. The issue is not with the impact of the foot on the ground but with the technique that we use to run. Watch a man run barefoot and he uses a totally different impact point and ankle movement to running with training shoes on. Barefoot runners run on the balls of their feet and allow the knee to flex to its full capability. Most runners wearing trainers run on their heels more than is healthy. After runners have developed a technique to prevent running on their heels - even with shock absorbing footwear - the rate of injury drastically decreases. If nobody wore shoes then the 'natural' running gait that is used by the majority of people would change drastically to one that is more natural and prevents injury.

Of course, I generalise but actually if 'shock absorption' is your main justification for having to wear shoes then I'd hate to see your running gait. Pedals are at the very most medium-impact and more like low-impact. There shouldn't be any 'shock' issues with the ankles or knees.

I wear shoes because the stiffness of the sole allows me to control the pedal movement better but it doesn't make a huge difference either way and - as I said earlier - I'm happy playing without shoes on and can wear a wide variety of shoes and still play comfortably.

EDIT: Here's a partial source. I watched the documentary (probably not available in the US) months ago and it was fascinating.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-18863293

5678...procrastinate 01-09-2013 12:44 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
I think Pocket's combination of heel up, heel down, [ in stilettos ], is positively ground breaking! Seriously, the man is a genius!!
And imagine the percussive posibilities if you nailed a few bells to the heels!
Mind you, that would depend on how much you paid for the shoes. How much did you pay Pocket?
Alignment is something I want to throw into the discussion. If there isn't a comfortable 'through line' that follows down the skeletal structure of the leg, through the knee, ankle and along the foot, then injury awaits. A flat bottomed shoe with flexibility under the ball of the foot would provide a good conduit; but how the 'signal' arrives is just as, if not more important, I'd say.

dholz 01-09-2013 01:24 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
at my house I usually play barefoot, actually sock foot, but whenever im at church playing worship I'm in shoes. i haven't noticed a huge difference though. i play in converse shoes. so there fairly minimalist, but i also have size 13 feet and play heel up mostly so that might be easier than hell down and heel toe stuff.

Nickropolis 01-09-2013 02:23 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BacteriumFendYoke (Post 1095954)
Shock absorption? That old line again?

Although I don't run barefoot for various environmental reasons - 'shock absorption' is actually something that footwear companies trawl out to sell trainers. The issue is not with the impact of the foot on the ground but with the technique that we use to run. Watch a man run barefoot and he uses a totally different impact point and ankle movement to running with training shoes on. Barefoot runners run on the balls of their feet and allow the knee to flex to its full capability. Most runners wearing trainers run on their heels more than is healthy. After runners have developed a technique to prevent running on their heels - even with shock absorbing footwear - the rate of injury drastically decreases. If nobody wore shoes then the 'natural' running gait that is used by the majority of people would change drastically to one that is more natural and prevents injury.

Of course, I generalise but actually if 'shock absorption' is your main justification for having to wear shoes then I'd hate to see your running gait. Pedals are at the very most medium-impact and more like low-impact. There shouldn't be any 'shock' issues with the ankles or knees.

I wear shoes because the stiffness of the sole allows me to control the pedal movement better but it doesn't make a huge difference either way and - as I said earlier - I'm happy playing without shoes on and can wear a wide variety of shoes and still play comfortably.

EDIT: Here's a partial source. I watched the documentary (probably not available in the US) months ago and it was fascinating.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-18863293

Did you have fun focusing on two words from my post and missing the rest?

I'm not trying to start a fight, just make sure you use your eyes before you jump on someone.

BacteriumFendYoke 01-09-2013 05:16 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nickropolis (Post 1096044)
Did you have fun focusing on two words from my post and missing the rest?

I'm not trying to start a fight, just make sure you use your eyes before you jump on someone.

Quote:

It's physical activity on your feet and legs, if your shoes (or feet) lack support or shock absorption then there will be an increased strain put on them through thousands of bass drum and hi hat pedal movements.
Considerably more than two words. An entire sentence and being as it was in the middle of the post and following the traditional 'thesis, explanation, conclusion' format then I think I addressed the thrust of your original post.

Quite simply, if shock absorption is already very contentious in high-impact activities such as running then what evidence do you have that using the pedals is higher-impact and thus requiring the need for shock-absorbing footwear?

I haven't jumped on anyone. I've simply provided an explanation as to why I think that 'shock-absorption' isn't a valid argument for requiring footwear. If you can't handle evidenced and succinct debate then that's hardly my fault.

johnnylaw 04-08-2013 01:53 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
dholz; "hell down"? That's pretty funny for a worship gig. I guess you'd take notice if your soul was melting!

bobdadruma 04-08-2013 02:16 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
Here is a thread that I started about a shoe that I recently found and like for drumming.
http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...d.php?t=104327

schist 04-08-2013 10:04 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
Dunlop Volleys for me (Y)

mortegaboo 04-08-2013 08:07 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by cDark3r (Post 1093883)

What footwear do you use? Have anyone tried different footwear? Do you use footwear? Do you use different footwear for different styles?

rather not get into specifics but here is what "I" prefer; good ol nike tennis shoe

just get a shoe that is comfortable for "you" to play in and your golden :))

i also want to add that playing with shoes laced tight might sub-consciously make you want to play "tight-er" and vice versa.

pic of shoe

Bretton 04-08-2013 10:07 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
http://www.trainersmall.co.uk/images...-mens-0702.jpg

www.vibramfivefingers.com/

sdedge 04-16-2013 12:05 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
just look for dancers foot ware ,with heel ,without ,.
http://www.lepapillon.net/footwear/jazzschoenen

grt

Reggae_Mangle 04-19-2013 01:00 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
I saw Niko McBrain play barefoot in a NAMM video. Didn't look particularly disgusting :/

I've started playing heel-toe and these days I'm leaning toward barefoot playing. I feel there's a connection between my feet movement and the pedal, a really intrinsic motion that a shoe sole wouldn't be able to mimic.

But it becomes problematic if I start sweating, because then you begin to slip and slide. Ok, that sounds disgusting. But just imagine it was Niko's feet :P

- Reggae Mangle

CreeplyTuna 04-19-2013 10:04 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
Socks for me, every time. I like to feel the pedal and I don't thinks it's that gross since you're going to get sweaty either way. At gigs I just take off my shoes and still 'em behind me. There's no way I'll go back to wearing footwear while playing. Just my 2 cents.

Arky 04-19-2013 10:16 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
Some time ago I said footwear creates more punch (now 2.5 years into drumming but 99% still playing barefoot). This perception has shifted a bit. I'm using footwear once in a while, just for variation, but rather light footwear that doesn't feel stiff. The difference in punch feels much smaller now but I still feel there's some stabilisation effect footwear provides so if you're playing for some longer time, footwork might help save energy.
I'm always using socks though. The feel with footwear is a bit different, the motion for e.g. doubles/heel-toe needs to be slightly adjusted but I'm doing this by instinct.

(Future)DWdrummer 04-20-2013 05:25 AM

Re: Footwear?
 
I love drumming in the simple, low-top vans... Not the slip-ons buuut the ones that you actually tie. The rubber soles have great grip and the whole shoe is very flexible. Really, I'd say that any shoe that sits at or below the ankle will do the job

Reggae_Mangle 04-27-2013 01:18 PM

Re: Footwear?
 
"Oh dude, cover up your bare feet, that's gross., ewwwwww" :/

Have been wearing socks over the last couple of days, wonder if there's hope for Tarzan to integrate into high society. I mean seriously, what if you're at a gig where the venue has a no shoes, no shirt, no entry policy?

- Reggae Mangle


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