What Is The Deal With These Silly Reading/Technique Threads?

con struct

Platinum Member
Heh, yes, well I think my point was about the propability and discussions ending rather than him being anything. Doesn't matter what anybody thinks. It's a dead horse. =P
Exactly! Or maybe it would be better to say that it's a dying horse. The fun is in seeing how long we can keep the horse alive. Some of these threads become epic, legendary even.
 
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Stickit

Guest
Guys, did anyone really not know that original arranger quote wasn't Buddy Rich and that Stickit thought he was going to be clever as if any of us didn't know that.

I'll simply insert a name into a common quote my grandfather makes about suspicious drummers who invoke the name of Buddy Rich.

I knew Buddy Rich.
Buddy Rich was a friend of mine.
But Stickit you're no Buddy Rich.

Continue discussion.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but I got that quote from the Modern Drummer interview Buddy did back in 1978 I believe.

Here it is again....all I did was copy and paste.

MD - I believe there's a music school in the East where the professors prefer that their students do not know how to read music. Their belief is that students can learn more by playing by ear. What do you think about that?

BR - That's right. But, I think it's very important that you read. I think you should read in order to know what the chart is all about. But, I don't think any arranger should ever write a drum part for a drummer because if a drummer can't create his own Interpretation of the chart and he plays everything that's written, he becomes mechanical; he has no freedom.
 

Average

Senior Member
Gotta say, I never met BR personally, but I've shared the stage with some of the people who have played in his band - Bobby Shew being one. These all seem like reasonable guys. I doubt they would put up with much nonsense. I think BR had one persona that he played to interviewers and another that he was in person. I've certainly heard that he was very tough to work with at times, but I honestly think a lot of what he said in interviews was supposed to be provocative and supposed to get you thinking. Maybe I'm wrong though.
 
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Stickit

Guest
It's just occured to me that the topic of this thread does in no way concern you, does it? There are metal drumming threads up here all the time. I don't go to them, much less post on them, because the topics of those threads do not concern me. I know nothing about metal drumming.

And you know nothing about reading music, and that's fine! I'm fine with not knowing how to play metal drums. But if reading music does not concern you then why do you keep even reading this thread? You've made it clear that learning music for you would be a waste of your time, and yet you seem to spend an inordinate amount of time putting posts up on a thread whose topic does not concern you.

Makes no sense.
Oh, I see, only the elite can respond here? The topic was about whether or not reading was important, or what is the deal with these silly reading/technique threads? I find it interesting how those who have a skill others don't, think that everyone should learn that skill.
 

con struct

Platinum Member
Oh, I see, only the elite can respond here? The topic was about whether or not reading was important, or what is the deal with these silly reading/technique threads? I thinks it's interesting how those who have a skill others don't think that everyone should learn that skill.
Oh that's ridiculous. "Elite."

As I said, I don't read or post on metal drumming threads because I don't know anything about metal drumming. Metal drumming threads aren't for the elite, they're for drummers who play metal. And I've never seen where a drummer who has the skills to play metal said that everyone should learn that skill.

So it seems obvious to me that a thread about reading music would be of interest only to those of us who either know how to read or want to learn how to read. If reading music doesn't concern you then why should you care?
 

Average

Senior Member
Jay,
If you're a jazz drummer you know a heck of a lot more about modern metal than you think you do. Modern metal is something to take a look at. It may not be for you but it is nothing to dismiss. I'm quite positive that if you have a jazz background, you'll get very well where modern metal drumming is coming from.
K
 

el_Guapo

Junior Member
The guitarist/slide/banjo/mandolin player in my band is an Eastman grad, he has a lot of private students and he teaches highschool music theory. He's not Mozart, but he's a damned good musician and his opinion hold some weight for me. He doesn't encourage any of his private students to learn music. He believes a developed ear is essential.
I agree. I don't necessarily think it's an either or situation though.
I respect drummers who have learned to read music, but I've always had a lot of trouble with it, so I abandoned it. I have compensated by developing my ear, and I've managed pretty well. So, I don't consider drummers who can't read music to be incomplete in any way.
 

con struct

Platinum Member
Jay,
If you're a jazz drummer you know a heck of a lot more about modern metal than you think you do. Modern metal is something to take a look at. It may not be for you but it is nothing to dismiss. I'm quite positive that if you have a jazz background, you'll get very well where modern metal drumming is coming from.
K
Heck no I don't dismiss metal drumming. I don't dismiss any good drumming. Those guys blow me away with the stuff they're doing. It's just that the music doesn't interest me, it's not my thing. But I have a lot of respect for the abilities of those players.
 

Pocket-full-of-gold

Platinum Member
The guitarist/slide/banjo/mandolin player in my band is an Eastman grad, he has a lot of private students and he teaches highschool music theory. He's not Mozart, but he's a damned good musician and his opinion hold some weight for me. He doesn't encourage any of his private students to learn music. He believes a developed ear is essential.
I agree. I don't necessarily think it's an either or situation though.
I respect drummers who have learned to read music, but I've always had a lot of trouble with it, so I abandoned it. I have compensated by developing my ear, and I've managed pretty well. So, I don't consider drummers who can't read music to be incomplete in any way.
Interesting. I have no idea what an Eastman graduate may or may not learn. So the only question I'd have here is, can the guy read of his own accord and just chooses not to teach the skill.....or can he not read himself and therefore doesn't teach it because he can't? Two different scenarios. Can you clarify?
 

con struct

Platinum Member
Interesting. I have no idea what an Eastman graduate may or may not learn. So the only question I'd have here is, can the guy read of his own accord and just chooses not to teach the skill.....or can he not read himself and therefore doesn't teach it because he can't? Two different scenarios. Can you clarify?
If he's a graduate of Eastman then I guarantee you that he can read.
 

el_Guapo

Junior Member
Interesting. I have no idea what an Eastman graduate may or may not learn. So the only question I'd have here is, can the guy read of his own accord and just chooses not to teach the skill.....or can he not read himself and therefore doesn't teach it because he can't? Two different scenarios. Can you clarify?
He can read music.
His attitude is that if a student wants to learn to read music, fine and good. But when he want's a student to learn a song they must do so by ear. He never uses charts as a teaching tool
 

mattsmith

Platinum Member
Gotta say, I never met BR personally, but I've shared the stage with some of the people who have played in his band - Bobby Shew being one. These all seem like reasonable guys. I doubt they would put up with much nonsense. I think BR had one persona that he played to interviewers and another that he was in person. I've certainly heard that he was very tough to work with at times, but I honestly think a lot of what he said in interviews was supposed to be provocative and supposed to get you thinking. Maybe I'm wrong though.
I was of course too young to have known him personally, but as I've mentioned before my dad and grandfather both worked with him, and although dad especially says that some of the persona was true, they both say that much of the provocative things he said especially were said only to pull the chain of characters who read everything out of context or know just enough to be dangerous.

I shared this story already once before where Rich supposedly fired dad over some kind of nonsense then turned around and paid an entire semester of his university tuition without asking.

I really think that's probably a personality a little too complex to be ignorantly quoted out of context in a goofy thread like this.

Whoaaa...another Stickit quote in another person's post. Creepy.

BTW You know Stickit was an excellent Buddy Rich album, probably my favorite of the RCA series. That "Time Being" was a sensational chart.
 

mattsmith

Platinum Member
I love it when someone says If I brushed up a bit I could play an orchestra gig. HAHAHAHA!!!!!
Yeah this thread has become the gift that keeps on giving, and is maybe my very favorite of the silly ones in 5 years of posting here.

I also admire how the whole thing has after a million posts mostly stayed within reasonable enough boundaries to probably not be locked or erased.

I hope it lasts forever, or at least until I have to go back to work.
 
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Stickit

Guest
I was of course too young to have known him personally, but as I've mentioned before my dad and grandfather both worked with him, and although dad especially says that some of the persona was true, they both say that much of the provocative things he said especially were said only to pull the chain of characters who read everything out of context or know just enough to be dangerous.

I shared this story already once before where Rich supposedly fired dad over some kind of nonsense then turned around and paid an entire semester of his university tuition without asking.

I really think that's probably a personality a little too complex to be ignorantly quoted out of context in a goofy thread like this.

Whoaaa...another Stickit quote in another person's post. Creepy.

BTW You know Stickit was an excellent Buddy Rich album, probably my favorite of the RCA series. That "Time Being" was a sensational chart.
Regardless if Buddy meant it or not, at least concede that he did say it, I mean the quote about the arranger.
BTW, how's your right foot? I mean, do you have a fast right foot? Just curious.
 

JT1

Silver Member
I was observant...observant enough to notice that you were not one of those who celebrated an inability to read music. Now please go back and see if I mentioned you in any way. What I observed was that a reasonable poster had mistakedly assumed we were attacking everyone with the viewpoint that reading was not always essential for what they wanted out of music. I even asked Is that fair so as not to associate you specifically with some of these other guys who are touting their ignorance a positive lifestyle decision.

Did I also actually read someone call music readers Ivory Tower?




Oh I'm sorry you were talking about somebody else?

Look, why not just take your axe to the pms?

Man, this is the single goofiest thread I've ever seen here, and that's saying a lot.

Great post Aeolian.
My apologies Matt, so you did, I realise now that my response is ironic.

I just feel sometimes that if someone choses to do things differently that most members on the forum look down their noses or jump on their backs.

I realise there are a couple of posters who fall into the 'ignorance is bliss' category and this attitude is wrong. But also the 'you do it differently so you are wrong' attitude is equally as bad and simply does not help people on here at all.

Sorry again for the confusion, maybe I need to brush up on my reading =P
 
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