One handed 16ths on the hat/ride

Duck Tape

Platinum Member
This is just a trivial thread but I've always hated doing this.

It always comes out forced, it's technically demanding and it's laborious trying to stay relaxed and in time and coordinate other limbs. I can't be bothered! You might tell me to speak for myself but I see that other drummers aren't all that great at it either, it's a difficult thing to do well.

I'd probably be okay at it if I'd started practicing it long ago but I just don't wanna. It prompts me to think of how much things like this affect drumming style, avoiding them specifically.

Does anyone share this pet hate? Or is there something else?
 

toddbishop

Platinum Member
I think that kind of felt like work to me in the past-- it's not real fun, and seems kind of banal. I'm more into it recently as a part of 70's funk drumming and bossa nova. I can get into it from that angle.
 

BradGunnerSGT

Silver Member
This is just a trivial thread but I've always hated doing this.

It always comes out forced, it's technically demanding and it's laborious trying to stay relaxed and in time and coordinate other limbs. I can't be bothered! You might tell me to speak for myself but I see that other drummers aren't all that great at it either, it's a difficult thing to do well.

I'd probably be okay at it if I'd started practicing it long ago but I just don't wanna. It prompts me to think of how much things like this affect drumming style, avoiding them specifically.

Does anyone share this pet hate? Or is there something else?
If you use the Moeller stroke then you really don't have to work very hard to play 16th's on the snare, you're really just playing normal 8th notes but adding in the tap on the upstroke. It's actually pretty easy once you get the hang of it.
 
A

Anthony Amodeo

Guest
If you use the Moeller stroke then you really don't have to work very hard to play 16th's on the snare, you're really just playing normal 8th notes but adding in the tap on the upstroke. It's actually pretty easy once you get the hang of it.
agreed ....there is actually nothing to it

same as playing 8ths but you are stealing a note on the way up

absolutely no more effort than playing straight 8ths on the hat

as for how it sounds....Im not always into it ....but certain songs need it I guess

imagine Tom Sawyer without it ...or even Tell Me Something Good

they just wouldn't feel the same without the 16ths
 

double_G

Silver Member
yeap it's seems as tho this is something i need to constantly work on as a "rudiment" to keep speedy. been playing more tower of power & toto lately, so i need to keep this up. 100 bpm is about my limit for a 4-5 min tune. i need to keep woodshedding this to feel relaxed. so i am trying to incorporate j.mayer moeller tech into 95+ while playing boz scaggs, michael mcdonald ("i keep forgettin'"), TOP, toto, etc.

also noticed j.porcaro has an interesting grip when he plays this. you can tell he mastered it. i wonder what his limit was ? (imagining 120 bmp in his practice room - WTF)
 

SticksEasy

Senior Member
My band plays pop punk. I could easily play 4 quarters on the ride, but that looks to easy and leaves to much space in the backbeat to be filled.

The key to 16 notes on ride or hi-hats is perfect placement. Having the hi hats and ride where you can get to them easily and comfortably makes all the difference. For me it's not a problem. But my band usually plays two or three quick tunes, and then a slower one or two, so I get time to reserve myself. If I had to do the 16 notes all night doing our typical NOFX style tunes, I'm sure my arm would be ready to fall off and run away.
 
S

spikeithard

Guest
My band plays pop punk. I could easily play 4 quarters on the ride, but that looks to easy and leaves to much space in the backbeat to be filled.

The key to 16 notes on ride or hi-hats is perfect placement. Having the hi hats and ride where you can get to them easily and comfortably makes all the difference. For me it's not a problem. But my band usually plays two or three quick tunes, and then a slower one or two, so I get time to reserve myself. If I had to do the 16 notes all night doing our typical NOFX style tunes, I'm sure my arm would be ready to fall off and run away.
Sir, you have pop punk and NOFX in the same post. Dare not say you think NOFX is pop punk lol..ok ok, maybe close on their new stuff!!lol

anyways

Im not the most experienced on here so 16th notes on the hats are what most 'punk' beats are?like I mean the fast paced snare driven beats? correct?
 
A

Anthony Amodeo

Guest
most fast punk stuff is just quarter notes or 8ths on the hats....in an extremely rare case of it being a 16th feel most likely it is played hand to hand
 

caddywumpus

Platinum Member
Is it one-handed 16ths on the hats that has you hatin', or is it FAST one-handed 16ths? Tom Sawyer and Tell Me Something Good were examples brought up, and those aren't fast by any stretch, but still groovy. If I ever have to play fast 16ths, like Whip It speed, I can do those one-handed by playing up on the stick, playing the far side of the hats with the tip of the stick and playing the close side of the hats with the butt. It's a gimmick, yeah, but it brings smiles to peoples' faces, and it sure brings the drummers up to the bandstand at the break, asking "How'd you DO that?!?!?"
 

richkenyon

Silver Member
The thing is, two-handed 16s sound and feel rather different than RH-only 16s, so I think of them as distinct feels. I actually just posted a video with a fair bit of RH 16s over in the Your Playing thread section.

For someone wanting to play the style I think I used to work on it to tracks like Sting's "Why Should I Cry For You?" or "Mad About You".
 

Duck Tape

Platinum Member
^ The last time I was asked to do it that's exactly what I did, left hand playing ghost notes on the hats. Obviously you're not able to play ghost notes on the snare this way but you can get a much neater sound and your hand doesn't fall off!

Is it one-handed 16ths on the hats that has you hatin', or is it FAST one-handed 16ths? Tom Sawyer and Tell Me Something Good were examples brought up, and those aren't fast by any stretch, but still groovy. If I ever have to play fast 16ths, like Whip It speed, I can do those one-handed by playing up on the stick, playing the far side of the hats with the tip of the stick and playing the close side of the hats with the butt. It's a gimmick, yeah, but it brings smiles to peoples' faces, and it sure brings the drummers up to the bandstand at the break, asking "How'd you DO that?!?!?"
Unless weren't talking really slow tempo's, 16th notes are pretty fast for my right hand in general, and it's not just the speed, I hate filling the whole grid so to speak because it's somehow harder to place obscure ghost notes and bass hits comfortably. Feels like I'm a drum machine or something.

This video sums up my approach.

http://youtu.be/vqqnHhPhNJg

I was holding back and just trying to groove but I'm not the most energetic of players, heh.
 

SticksEasy

Senior Member
most fast punk stuff is just quarter notes or 8ths on the hats....in an extremely rare case of it being a 16th feel most likely it is played hand to hand
I use quick 16th notes to fill in everything. I can't stand empty space, unless it fits the music... Which in my eyes, it rarely does.

And in reguards to NOFX... Yes, they are pop punk. Just like Bad Religion and Rise Against are Pop Punk. Anything with a Pop style I consider pop.

There aren't any newer bands really that I'd classify as Punk. Bad Religion's 80s music was punk... But as they progressed to the 90s, that Pop gradually slipped in.
 

Mad About Drums

Pollyanna's Agent
I'd probably be okay at it if I'd started practicing it long ago but I just don't wanna. It prompts me to think of how much things like this affect drumming style, avoiding them specifically.
It took me a while to come round doing one handed 16th notes on the hi-hat, like you, in the very first few years I avoided them, it can be difficult to get the feel right, but I've always loved the feel of 16th one handed notes, it's different than the double handed version, and in some songs, it add to the general feel good factor of the song, so eventually, I worked on the approach, listening a lot to Jeff Porcaro, he has a wonderful one handed 16th notes feel.

The key for me is being relax, using the sweet spot (fulcrum) of the stick and a loose grip, letting the stick doing most of the hard work, then speed is relative, the more you practice/play it, the more natural it become, and I like to use some varitions, adding various level of swing into it, somewhere between a straight pulse to almost shuffle like type of feel.

I use quick 16th notes to fill in everything. I can't stand empty space, unless it fits the music... Which in my eyes, it rarely does.
Oh man... we're not living in the same world... space is as important as intensity... and space can be intense.
 
S

spikeithard

Guest
I use quick 16th notes to fill in everything. I can't stand empty space, unless it fits the music... Which in my eyes, it rarely does.

And in reguards to NOFX... Yes, they are pop punk. Just like Bad Religion and Rise Against are Pop Punk. Anything with a Pop style I consider pop.

There aren't any newer bands really that I'd classify as Punk. Bad Religion's 80s music was punk... But as they progressed to the 90s, that Pop gradually slipped in.
yea I guess I could slightly agree.. 90s NOFX was great (stickin in your eye, linoleum etc) and bad religion like along the way and such was punk. (skate punk whatever).

I mainly like Strung out, Pennywise, Millencollin, Pulley, slick shoes, lagwagon of the 90's. THAT was the BEST skate punk, Never did like much the real punk like sex pistols, dead kennedys etc.

sorry to derail a tad here but just had to throw it in there somewhere... back to topic.

I noticed after coming back from about 10 years off, my right hand HH speed sucks lol. even for rock beats playing along to a track, I find myself wanting to play quarter note hats even though the drummer on the song is playing eighth notes. Its hard for my to get my brain make the switch. I know the eighth notes is no where near 16th note playing but back in my skate punk days I had that groove going for 6 songs straight no problem and the kick, ohhhh the kick - the nice ba bada bump on single pedal was off the hook!

poor old me no longer a teen with the speed I had back then and endurance lol
 

larryace

"Uncle Larry"
Practicing your single stroke rolls will by default help with your one handed 16ths. I watched your vid, and unless I missed something, I heard only 8th notes on the hat. I did hear snippets of a dotted feel, but it was not sustained for long
 
Top