Most Important Grooves?

DrumEatDrum

Platinum Member
Bass drum om 1 and 3, snare drum on 2 and 4. 8th notes on the hi-hat.

That will get you through just about any situation.

Replace straight 8ths with shuffled 8th's to get you through the rest of anything.

But seriously, most important rock groves? Most important types of grooves to be versatile?

A basic rock bear and basic shuffle is minimum for the average bar gig.
Add a basic jazz ride pattern, and maybe a basic bossa-nova to be more well rounded.
 

LukeSnyder

Gold Member
Bass drum om 1 and 3, snare drum on 2 and 4. 8th notes on the hi-hat.

That will get you through just about any situation.

Replace straight 8ths with shuffled 8th's to get you through the rest of anything.

But seriously, most important rock groves? Most important types of grooves to be versatile?

A basic rock bear and basic shuffle is minimum for the average bar gig.
Add a basic jazz ride pattern, and maybe a basic bossa-nova to be more well rounded.
Those are definitely 4 super important grooves. If you think about it, its almost funny how many songs you can play with just a simple straight 8 or shuffle.

I would add the Amen Break to this list, whether you play electronic music or not.
Ah, thats a great one! I wouldn't have thought of that, but you're absolutely right, that should be in every drummer's vocabulary simply because of how influential it has been in electronic music! Thanks for reminding me about that.

Basic swing beat. No amazingly important it's not even funny.
The swing beat should definitely be way up there, no doubt. Do you think its the most important? Or do you think a straight 8 rock feel is?
 

DrumEatDrum

Platinum Member
Surely, you don't mean the (prepares to run for shelter) MONEY BEAT!
Those are definitely 4 super important grooves. If you think about it, its almost funny how many songs you can play with just a simple straight 8 or shuffle.
I was trying to make my post numerous, but it was late, and dang, it's hard to insert a joking tone into plain text.

But yeah, I've done bar gigs where I never really ever had to vary from those those two grooves.
 

LukeSnyder

Gold Member
I was trying to make my post numerous, but it was late, and dang, it's hard to insert a joking tone into plain text.

But yeah, I've done bar gigs where I never really ever had to vary from those those two grooves.
Yup, I think you'll probably get more mileage out of them than any other groove! I wonder who first played them... I'm fuzzy on my drum history, haha.
 

brady

Platinum Member
Off the top of my head, some other important grooves other than the ones mentioned above are:

16th note groove (one-handed and two-handed)

Shuffle (any/every variation)

12/8 groove

Basic Latin beat (or Bossa, Samba, etc.)

Train beat

And, don't hate me, the 'disco beat'.



Don't forget brushes either...
 

LukeSnyder

Gold Member
Off the top of my head, some other important grooves other than the ones mentioned above are:

16th note groove (one-handed and two-handed)

Shuffle (any/every variation)

12/8 groove

Basic Latin beat (or Bossa, Samba, etc.)

Train beat

And, don't hate me, the 'disco beat'.



Don't forget brushes either...
All of those are great, I love disco and train beats :D Its a guilty pleasure for me, haha.
 

JPW

Silver Member
The most important groove is the groove in the pocket.

- Today's aphorism was brought to you by JPW
 

Fishbones

Silver Member
Great thread!
goals that ive made about grooves to learn have been:
fool in the rain: zeppelin (john bonham)
fire on the bayou and cissy strut: the meters (zigaboo modeliste)
50 ways to leave your lover: paul simon (steve gadd)
sprung monkey: stanton moore
tom sawyer... most of it anyway: rush: neil peart
cold sweat: James brown

these have been my biggest challenges to play spot on the entire song
 
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MattRitter

Senior Member
I generally start everyone with 5 basic grooves:

1) quarter note rock
2) 8th note rock
3) 16th note rock (one-handed)
4) 16th note rock (two-handed)
5) 6/8 rock

We take these 5 patterns and go crazy with them - putting the bass drum in every possible place, putting an open hi-hat in every possible place, etc. etc. etc. Seriously, I can basically use these 5 grooves to teach a person almost everything they need to know for playing in a band. Once they truly have a handle on these, then I add in basic jazz, 3/4 jazz, shuffle, and bossa nova. If they make it that far, we'll keep going...Afro-Cuban, linear funk, etc. Of course, the typical hobbyist will NOT make it that far. Most hobbyists just want to skim the surface of the art form and be able to jam a little with friends. That's why I begin from day one with the 5 listed above.
 

LukeSnyder

Gold Member
Luke, you might find this thread of interest: http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=54128

I'd go with Andy's money beat suggestion for rock, pop and their relatives. It's the most important for me, anyway.
Thanks for sharing that Polly!

Great thread!
goals that ive made about grooves to learn have been:
fool in the rain: zeppelin (john bonham)
fire on the bayou and cissy strut: the meters (zigaboo modeliste)
50 ways to leave your lover: paul simon (steve gadd)
sprung monkey: stanton moore
tom sawyer... most of it anyway: rush: neil peart

these have been my biggest challenges to play spot on the entire song
Those are all great classics, definitely good ones to know :D

I generally start everyone with 5 basic grooves:

1) quarter note rock
2) 8th note rock
3) 16th note rock (one-handed)
4) 16th note rock (two-handed)
5) 6/8 rock

We take these 5 patterns and go crazy with them - putting the bass drum in every possible place, putting an open hi-hat in every possible place, etc. etc. etc. Seriously, I can basically use these 5 grooves to teach a person almost everything they need to know for playing in a band. Once they truly have a handle on these, then I add in basic jazz, 3/4 jazz, shuffle, and bossa nova. If they make it that far, we'll keep going...Afro-Cuban, linear funk, etc. Of course, the typical hobbyist will NOT make it that far. Most hobbyists just want to skim the surface of the art form and be able to jam a little with friends. That's why I begin from day one with the 5 listed above.
Thank you very much for sharing your expertise in this Matt! I never thought much about the fact that most students will not progress far past the rock stage, because they're simply pursuing it as a hobby... I'm not sure why its never occurred to me before! How much time do you usually spend with a student at that stage before you move on to more advanced concepts?

Also, on a completely unrelated note, I just looked at the testimonials for your DVD, and WOW! David Garibaldi? Don Formularo and Steve Smith? It sounds like you made quite the splash with your material. I need to get myself a copy...
 

MattRitter

Senior Member
Thank you very much for sharing your expertise in this Matt! I never thought much about the fact that most students will not progress far past the rock stage, because they're simply pursuing it as a hobby... I'm not sure why its never occurred to me before! How much time do you usually spend with a student at that stage before you move on to more advanced concepts?
Glad you enjoyed my post, Luke. The amount of time I spend with the 5 basic grooves will depend on the individual student. I have a whole curriculum based around those grooves. The student learns to move around the bass drum hits, put crashes in different spots, start fills in different spots, and so on, and so on...
It's a pretty challenging curriculum, and I stay on each specific topic or exercise until the student has really mastered the material. They must be able to do all of this along with songs of various tempos, and in a way that seems fluid and natural. It generally takes a person a few years. Keep in mind that, during this time, we're also working on other things as well. We're working on reading, hand technique, foot technique, and learning songs for our recital twice per year. With all of these things together, I can generally get a student playing pretty darn well in about 3 years if they practice. I have one guy now who has been taking lessons with me for 6 and a half years. He is 14 years old, and he plays at a pretty high professional level.

Also, on a completely unrelated note, I just looked at the testimonials for your DVD, and WOW! David Garibaldi? Don Formularo and Steve Smith? It sounds like you made quite the splash with your material. I need to get myself a copy...
Thanks, Luke! Yeah, when I first made my DVD back in 2005, there was very little material out there on the mechanics of playing the bass drum pedal. Of course, we had books with patterns between the hands and feet, but there was very little that really talked about the details of the foot motions themselves. So my DVD filled a unique gap in the drumming community, and guys like David Garibaldi were quick to voice their support. It was really great. These days, there are more resources available. Other DVD's have come out, and there are tons of things on YouTube. However, to this day, I haven't seen anything that covers the exact material covered in my DVD...so I think my DVD is still pretty unique in that respect. Of course, I'm also bound to be somewhat biased! hahaha

Best of luck to you!
 

LukeSnyder

Gold Member
Glad you enjoyed my post, Luke. The amount of time I spend with the 5 basic grooves will depend on the individual student. I have a whole curriculum based around those grooves. The student learns to move around the bass drum hits, put crashes in different spots, start fills in different spots, and so on, and so on...
It's a pretty challenging curriculum, and I stay on each specific topic or exercise until the student has really mastered the material. They must be able to do all of this along with songs of various tempos, and in a way that seems fluid and natural. It generally takes a person a few years. Keep in mind that, during this time, we're also working on other things as well. We're working on reading, hand technique, foot technique, and learning songs for our recital twice per year. With all of these things together, I can generally get a student playing pretty darn well in about 3 years if they practice. I have one guy now who has been taking lessons with me for 6 and a half years. He is 14 years old, and he plays at a pretty high professional level.
I would assume that you try to accommodate students with specific requests though, at least at some level. For example, I have two students who want to play only metal. I've still started them out with the rock beats, but I'm going through it from a slightly different perspective. I'm giving them lots of footwork exercises, and working on all the blasting stuff as well. I also teach some very young kids, which also makes it work a little differently, haha :)

Out of curiosity (I'm working on developing and solidifying my own curriculum) is there any chance that I could see some of your teaching material? Are you writing your own, or do you use other people's texts?

Thanks, Luke! Yeah, when I first made my DVD back in 2005, there was very little material out there on the mechanics of playing the bass drum pedal. Of course, we had books with patterns between the hands and feet, but there was very little that really talked about the details of the foot motions themselves. So my DVD filled a unique gap in the drumming community, and guys like David Garibaldi were quick to voice their support. It was really great. These days, there are more resources available. Other DVD's have come out, and there are tons of things on YouTube. However, to this day, I haven't seen anything that covers the exact material covered in my DVD...so I think my DVD is still pretty unique in that respect. Of course, I'm also bound to be somewhat biased! hahaha

Best of luck to you!
It certainly sounds like a fairly unique approach, and its cool that you got some of the top guys to support it. Heck, If Garibaldi, Smith, Formularo, and others learned from it, I know I'll pick up a lot!
 
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