Knowing yourself - sometimes it's -------------

Andy

Administrator
Staff member
better not to take the gig, even if it seems good.

I went to an audition last night. Strong original material, great vocalist / songwriter, good players, own rehearsal studio, well financed. I was offered the gig - I turned it down.

I think I'll let the subsequent email exchange say the rest:



Hi Karen, thank you so much for the warm welcome last night. I really enjoyed playing with you all. Great bunch of people, & I believe there’s some real depth to the songs.

I’ve given this much thought, & although I believe I could carry the gig, I don’t think it’s right for me. I think you need a player who’s more experienced / comfortable in a lighter dynamic playing environment, as well as someone who leans more towards the jazz / popular / easy listening spectrum than me. I would frequently be thinking that the songs deserve drum parts that I’m not equipped to provide with any depth & credibility, & I would find that personally very frustrating.

I hope you understand my decision, & that you find the right player. I believe it’s worth the effort in persevering until you find that certain person. You have a good friendly team, & that makes it much easier for the right person to fit in.

My fondest regards, Andy.




Hi Andy

Thank you for your warm email and honesty, I always appreciate both, and thank you for making the long trip over on a cold February evening.
I am not surprised by how you feel, and I quite understand where you are coming from. I didn't necessarily see us as a fit when I saw your links, but thought perhaps you were looking for something a little way removed from what you normally do... It's got to feel right for everyone though. I feel I can speak for the rest of the band when I say we also enjoyed meeting you very much AND having your fantastic drumming even if only for one night, so it's a bit of a disappointment, however, on the bright side it only serves to demonstrate how great our songs will eventually sound with a full compliment, and makes me more determined to try and find someone. Your feedback on the material is also very much appreciated...

Warm wishes
Karen
 

Tommy_D

Platinum Member
You may have been able to play the parts and done a fine job, but someone may be able to play them better because they dig the vibe better. Ain't nothing wrong with that. At least you were up front and honest with them. For all they know, a perfect fit drummer may be looking at their "drummer wanted" ad right now.
 

alparrott

Platinum Member
This is a classy interaction on both sides, and a good model of the way professionals communicate. Well done to both parties (although no surprise at all from you, Andy).
 

Andy

Administrator
Staff member
You may have been able to play the parts and done a fine job, but someone may be able to play them better because they dig the vibe better. Ain't nothing wrong with that. At least you were up front and honest with them. For all they know, a perfect fit drummer may be looking at their "drummer wanted" ad right now.
My take on it exactly. I was tempted - very, simply by the number of boxes ticked, but sometimes you have to detach from the moment a little, & be utterly honest with yourself. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.

The big caveat however is recognising that I didn't need the gig to put food on the table. That's a whole 'nuther decision basis, although this was unlikely to be an earner in the short term.


This is a classy interaction on both sides, and a good model of the way professionals communicate. Well done to both parties (although no surprise at all from you, Andy).
Thanks Al. No bridges burnt, & hopefully a genuinely good opportunity for another player who feels the music better than I did, or at least has a greater appropriate repertoire. I think I acquitted myself quite well considering (well, they did offer me the gig :). Quite a lot of latin content, brushwork, & the need for intensity at very low dynamic. Non of these skills are alien to me, but to say I'm rusty & limited is an understatement. That said, I think most of you would be quite surprised with what I came up with. Hell, I even surprised myself!
 

Andy

Administrator
Staff member
Very professionally done on both sides.

As opposed to:

"Sorry but I can't play the light s$%t!"
Hahahaha, Jeff, you're a very naughty boy! ;)

The audition was blind. They just played through their set, & I had to chime in on the fly. TBH, I like that, it pushes you big time.

First song in though, I stared at my sticks & thought "oh crap, I should have brought pencils"! Hey, at least I found out I've got a light touch backbeat / comp & grace notes with a pair of 1A's! Even worse, I brought a Tour series kit (22", 16", 12", 14" x 7"). Not exactly designed for the gig!
 

Anon La Ply

Renegade
It's a funny old world when a mature and reasonable exchange between two intelligent adults is noteworthy.

Interesting decision, Andy. Maybe there was a touch of the gig not quite being your cuppa as well? Your adventure with the other band showed that you're prepared to take on musical challenges.

I think Jeff hit the nail on the head :)
 

larryace

"Uncle Larry"
This thread only raises questions for me.

Like what's going on with Fired Up? You guys still together? Or not enough gigs?

What kind of band, if you could pick, are you looking to join?

Was the music not really in your comfort zone? Or didn't appeal to you?

Sorry, Mr. Q. Rious here.
 

MaryO2

Member
I wish all of my searching for the right bandmates could have been as civilized as this one. And...way to know yourself and what you really want to be doing. I'm sure you were more than capable of the job but if the feels not right for you, no matter the instrument you play, it's just not going to be it's best. Nicely done.
 

Andy

Administrator
Staff member
Interesting decision, Andy. Maybe there was a touch of the gig not quite being your cuppa as well? Your adventure with the other band showed that you're prepared to take on musical challenges.

I think Jeff hit the nail on the head :)
Jeff kinda did hit the nail on the head, but only with reference to my own abilities. The "cuppa tea" angle didn't really apply either. I've found that things can become my cuppa tea quite easily from a playing enjoyment POV, even if it's stuff I ordinarily wouldn't listen to.

Although I'm happy to take on musical challenges, I'm seeking them even, I have to be realistic about how far away I am from the playing goal, & the level of work it will take to get there. I suppose I'm looking for something I can transfer my existing skill set to with mainly work on interpretation.

Yeah I was kinda disappointed by that.

Andy, have you learnt nothing from Rogue's travails?
Sorry for the lack of drama. Next time, I'll make sure I post something involving gnashing of teeth, blood & snot, multiple references to questionable parentage/inbreeding, etc, etc ;)

This thread only raises questions for me.
Like what's going on with Fired Up? You guys still together? Or not enough gigs?
Fired Up are going fine. Sure, not enough gigs (but there's a solid (temporary)health related reason for that), it's more about me scratching a creative itch. I miss original material & the creative process of recording.

What kind of band, if you could pick, are you looking to join?
A two part answer. Right now, I'm gently looking for something offering original material, an edge, & a leaning towards recording. In my dreams, I'd be putting together a high energy funk act with full brass section but rock foundations, but that's not happening anytime soon. I think I'd struggle with the local musician pool on that idea :(

Was the music not really in your comfort zone? Or didn't appeal to you?
Sorry, Mr. Q. Rious here.
Pretty much, although relating to my playing repertoire, & consequently my ability to do the best possible job of serving the songs.


I'm sure you were more than capable of the job but if the feels not right for you, no matter the instrument you play, it's just not going to be it's best.
In a nutshell Mary, yes!
 

Mad About Drums

Pollyanna's Agent
I’ve given this much thought, & although I believe I could carry the gig, I don’t think it’s right for me. I think you need a player who’s more experienced / comfortable in a lighter dynamic playing environment, as well as someone who leans more towards the jazz / popular / easy listening spectrum than me. I would frequently be thinking that the songs deserve drum parts that I’m not equipped to provide with any depth & credibility, & I would find that personally very frustrating.
What you wrote in your email has a taste of "deja vu" for me...

... that was exactly my thoughts when I auditioned for "Compartiment Fumeurs" back in the 80's, a jazzy/funk/french variety type of band with a horn section didn't seemed right for me, since I was coming from a heavy rock type of music at the time, I was literally shocked when they offered me the drummer position in the band... and although I had the same reservations as you did, I thought "why not? it could push me forward and expend my musical career"... so I accepted their offer and I never regretted it, I had a 4 years trip with this band, including some studio recordings... if anything, this band opened my view on drumming and made me more confident about myself drumming wise... I still do not understand why they hired me though, so out of style, so out of my confident zone.

While I think it's strange that a band offer a position to a musician which is not the right type musically, it can be beneficial for both, at the end of the day, they played their music and you played like you, if they offered you the position, it mean that they like/loved what you did and that perhaps you wouldn't had to make has much adjustment/work on your style of playing as you thought it would need. That was your interpretation of what type of drummer's needed for them, obviously, not their views, they've seen something in you that you haven't seen yourself :)

On the other hand, I really like the dream idea of your high energy funk act with full brass section but rock foundations, it would be my kinda band too :)
 

no talent

Senior Member
dude you almost fooled me this time. until I read the "return" email. total fabrication on your part. No one, and I mean no one would compliment your playing. I know it feels good to pat yourself on the back once in a while but to make up a story like this just to put it one the forum is just childish! its not even april fools day, you could have at least saved it for then.
 

bermuda

Drummerworld Pro Drummer - Administrator
Staff member
Personal and professional integrity are so crucial, in every aspect of life.
 

mikel

Platinum Member
I can completely understand your point of view, but If it was enjoyable, and the band sounded like they enjoyed your playing, then why not?

If it was only cos it was not your usual thing, but you enjoyed it, then surely it could have become your thing and also expanded your experience and ability.

Just a thought, as you seem to have a good time and liked the songs and the people.
 

Andy

Administrator
Staff member
While I think it's strange that a band offer a position to a musician which is not the right type musically, it can be beneficial for both, at the end of the day, they played their music and you played like you, if they offered you the position, it mean that they like/loved what you did and that perhaps you wouldn't had to make has much adjustment/work on your style of playing as you thought it would need. That was your interpretation of what type of drummer's needed for them, obviously, not their views, they've seen something in you that you haven't seen yourself :)
I can only agree with this Henri, but without appearing to be arrogant, I think I know what they need to serve the music long term, & it's not me. I understand exactly where you're coming from re: your previous band, & to me, the fit was obvious. I think if you'd been at the audition with me, you'd probably come to the same conclusion as I did. Ultimately, it's an effort vs. reward thing. If the opportunity was absolutely stellar, then maybe I could have taken the journey. The opportunity was very good, but not a game changer. Now the dream band with full brass section, that's a whole 'nuther basis for a decision :)

dude you almost fooled me this time. until I read the "return" email. total fabrication on your part. No one, and I mean no one would compliment your playing. I know it feels good to pat yourself on the back once in a while but to make up a story like this just to put it one the forum is just childish! its not even april fools day, you could have at least saved it for then.
I could begin to take you seriously if your punctuation ability exceeded that of a 5 year old ;)

Personal and professional integrity are so crucial, in every aspect of life.
Absolutely Jon. It always pays in the end. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. Being true to others is a great life mantra, but being true to yourself if often the hardest path of all.


I can completely understand your point of view, but If it was enjoyable, and the band sounded like they enjoyed your playing, then why not?

If it was only cos it was not your usual thing, but you enjoyed it, then surely it could have become your thing and also expanded your experience and ability.

Just a thought, as you seem to have a good time and liked the songs and the people.
Mike, if it was only the fact that the music wasn't ideal for me, or that a degree of work on my part would equip me for the gig, I would have taken it. I recently took a gig exactly as I've just described, & I'm enjoying it. This was different. I just knew in my bones that I would need a lot of work to deliver the kind of performance I would be happy with. Sure, this band would have been fine with me as I am, but I wouldn't. I'm fairly self critical.
 
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mikel

Platinum Member
I can only agree with this Henri, but without appearing to be arrogant, I think I know what they need to serve the music long term, & it's not me. I understand exactly where you're coming from re: your previous band, & to me, the fit was obvious. I think if you'd been at the audition with me, you'd probably come to the same conclusion as I did. Ultimately, it's an effort vs. reward thing. If the opportunity was absolutely stellar, then maybe I could have taken the journey. The opportunity was very good, but not a game changer. Now the dream band with full brass section, that's a whole 'nuther basis for a decision :)

I could begin to take you seriously if your punctuation ability exceeded that of a 5 year old ;)

Absolutely Jon. It always pays in the end. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. Being true to others is a great life mantra, but being true to yourself if often the hardest path of all.


Mike, if it was only the fact that the music wasn't ideal for me, or that a degree of work on my part would equip me for the gig, I would have taken it. I recently took a gig exactly as I've just described, & I'm enjoying it. This was different. I just knew in my bones that I would need a lot of work to deliver the kind of performance I would be happy with. Sure, this band would have been fine with me as I am, but I wouldn't. I'm fairly self critical.


Is it because it would have taken you outside your comfort zone? Surely thats a good thing?
 

larryace

"Uncle Larry"
Frankly, I can't believe you have the time to even consider a 3rd band. You continue to be my hero.
 
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