Just a rant....

larryace

"Uncle Larry"
If we were all stubborn and immoveable about using our own kits they would have to work around us. But that won't happen. We allow ourselves to be walked over by accepting something most of us don't want. If time is the only constraint, that can be dealt with by the drummers providing people to help with the switchover. Think of a Pit crew changing 4 tires and fueling a car in 30 seconds. Same attitude.

I realize that this procedure (sharing a kit) is pretty much dyed in the wool at this point, but that doesn't mean I like it. I'm tired of sacrificing when nobody else has to, there are ways to keep everyone happy, you just need some people to help. With 4 guys I could get the other guys stuff off and get my stuff up and miced and ready to play in 5 minutes. As far as playing a different set, not when I'm performing. I'd rather do that on my free time. The stage is no time for that.
 

turbojerk

Senior Member
Wrong attitude, but that's just my opinion.

Do what you want.


"Ha,... Pro! LoL. Not going to happen...."
Exactly.

Good luck in the future.
No opinion that is all. Reading down thru this thread it’s apparent that some "do" mind and some "do not". All good. I'm not trying to make it sound like its gotta be my way, just saying that I would "prefer" for it to go as I planned for the last 2 months of rehearsals...

Usually it only takes one bad experience for someone to form an opinion on things. Case in point; One of my friends was held up at gun point getting on the subway coming home from a baseball game last year. Do you think that he's ever going to take the subway again? No he won't and he'll be glad to tell you why. Another extreme example but a bad experience all the same. I had a bad experience and couple that with some embarrassment makes things worse.

Are you a "pro"?
 

Mark_S

Silver Member
This is pretty much the norm over here in the UK. It's always something I worry about a little on the way to the gig, wondering what is going to be waiting for me. At my last gig, we used the house kit. I went to set it up and it went something like this : -

Where is the 3rd tom? Oh it's a 4 peice.. okay I'll manage.

Where is the tom arm? I'm sure it'll turn up.

What's that thing that looks like the broken top half of a snare stand and why is it attached to the rack tom? Oh.. no...

Where's the bottom of this snare stand? Oh, here's something random it might fit in - nothing to tighten it in place but it'll do..

Why is the tom LOWER than the snare? Mr sound-man please help.. "Oh I might have something taller"... Soundman comes back with something. Doesn't fit. Goes away and comes back with something else, it fits but now it's too high.. "Hold on I think I have a tom arm"..

Soundman comes back.. oh hold on, the tom has no bracket... oh..

Oh sod it, I'll just do the soundcheck without any rack toms.

Where's the floor tom.. oh, it's that thing that sounds like I'm hitting a cardboard box with some tissue taped to it.

Oh boy... Luckily for the actual gig one of the other drummers has a snare stand, so I could at least get the rack tom set up somewhere vaguely in place.

It really gets to me how the drummer is always treated like crap, like it just doesn't matter. And if you do bring your own kit and there's one already set up, you get looked at like you're a snob.

I remember even one of the guys out of a different band could see the disgust on my face as I hit the floor tom and just said "oh as long as it goes bang bang bang right?"..

I'm all worked up now! Calm.. calm...
 

larryace

"Uncle Larry"
Exactly Mark. All the time wasted trying to breathe life into a dead kit could have been spent moving your "already set up and adjusted" kit into place. I mean it's all about time, right? Maybe space, but I think time is the real reason for all this kit sharing fiasco. That is a problem with an easy solution. A crew of 4 men dedicated to the drums. There are plenty who will do it free, just to be a part of things.
 

Rock Drummer

Senior Member
There is no reason you shouldn't be allowed to adjust a backline kit.

Support slots are a huge help to local bands that are trying build a following. Is your band really prepared to pass on these gigs because their drummer refuses to adapt? If you don't,someone will.
+1 You got that right. It hasnt happened to me but it has to other people
 

turbojerk

Senior Member
This is pretty much the norm over here in the UK. It's always something I worry about a little on the way to the gig, wondering what is going to be waiting for me. At my last gig, we used the house kit. I went to set it up and it went something like this : -

Where is the 3rd tom? Oh it's a 4 peice.. okay I'll manage.

Where is the tom arm? I'm sure it'll turn up.

What's that thing that looks like the broken top half of a snare stand and why is it attached to the rack tom? Oh.. no...

Where's the bottom of this snare stand? Oh, here's something random it might fit in - nothing to tighten it in place but it'll do..

Why is the tom LOWER than the snare? Mr sound-man please help.. "Oh I might have something taller"... Soundman comes back with something. Doesn't fit. Goes away and comes back with something else, it fits but now it's too high.. "Hold on I think I have a tom arm"..

Soundman comes back.. oh hold on, the tom has no bracket... oh..

Oh sod it, I'll just do the soundcheck without any rack toms.

Where's the floor tom.. oh, it's that thing that sounds like I'm hitting a cardboard box with some tissue taped to it.

Oh boy... Luckily for the actual gig one of the other drummers has a snare stand, so I could at least get the rack tom set up somewhere vaguely in place.

It really gets to me how the drummer is always treated like crap, like it just doesn't matter. And if you do bring your own kit and there's one already set up, you get looked at like you're a snob.

I remember even one of the guys out of a different band could see the disgust on my face as I hit the floor tom and just said "oh as long as it goes bang bang bang right?"..

I'm all worked up now! Calm.. calm...

LoL!

A similar thing happened to me a few weeks ago. We had a gig at a local bar/restaurant that caters to original live music. They had house sound and a house kit. I was told that I could use the house kit or use my own. As you may expect I opted to use my own. But as soon as we got to the gig the sky grew dark and a thunderstorm set in. At that point I was like “screw it” I’ll just use the house kit. So we walked inside and I assessed the kit and I was horrified! It was some no-name kit that wasn’t even wood. It was like some sort of practical wood. Snare stand had duck tape holding it up in position. Two planet Z crash cymbals and both had at least a 3” crack in them. Two 16” crash cymbals for hi-hats. That’s all I can remember making out. I backed my truck up to the front door and unloaded in the rain… True story!
 

turbojerk

Senior Member
+1 You got that right. It hasnt happened to me but it has to other people
Ahh, they do acoustic shows all the time so it would be just another show for them without me... Lets not get started on gigs that don't allow drums. Another rant all in its own! Haha!

BTW, If I had time to tune and adjust like some have mentioned, I'd probably save time just using my own.
 
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KarlCrafton

Platinum Member
Are you a "pro"?
Not a touring pro, no.
I've done some very cool things, and have had nice things said to/about me about my playing by touring pro's that you have heard of.
Next show with one of my bands is with Ace Frehley. Ty Stone is on the bill as well.
I'm not nationally known, all of it at this point is fun. No drama in any of the (4 different) bands, which is a BIG PLUS.
Plus, I get cash.

Haha! I know all about rain...and flash downpours.....eesshh.
They don't mix with fiber cases with foam inside at all. The hardware case was involved, but it's still going strong after 20 years.

Having your own kit is obviously the preferred senario, but in festival cases it's not going to happen unless you are direct support.

One "many bands in one night" show we were asked to play (finally said yes to the promoter) last year was on a BEAT PDP something. Heads of course were mis-matched...but a Coated Pinstripe sounds good on a POS floor tom.

It had 2 stands and a messed up boom (just a clamp and arm) for the ride, or crash...whatever it would hold. The hat stand I think was semi-OK.
I actually laughed.
I had my snare, pedal, cymbals (and sticks).
I just used 2 cymbals and hats. I set the toms, & I had my pedal/snare so I was comfortable.
We did a ripping set, people loved it, and I had fun on that kit for 50 minutes.

I use a 20x26 bass drum. NO backline EVER even has a 24. OR 2 floor toms, let alone 3, which is what I use on my gigging kit. Whatever, it's a gig.
I adjust my parts.
If it was 3 or 4 sets...well, you'd obviously bring a kit.
In a "use yours, or the house kit", yeah, use yours.

I'm not trying to get snarky, but if you grab a different sick, so what?

If you hit a ride instead of a crash, so what?

If you didn't switch them in your hand, would anyone have even known the difference?
Is a different sized stick really going to f*k up your performing the rest of a song?

I just think you are wasting too much mental energy getting stressed, or angry over a kit.
Worst case, bring a couple stands too, just in case and leave them (hidden) in the vehicle.
That was you're covered.
As long as you have your snare, pedal, etc... I hardly see any big deal.
You said you play a 4 piece, so if it's a 5 piece, take down one tom.
It's gotta be at least a 4 piece kit anyway.

I get that it was a rant, and then reality sets in...

NASCAR... I still have family that races. My Dad's whole side raced from late 50's into the 80's locally/regionally. One became a pit crew chief for a big name driver, then became an industry consultant.
:)
 

theindian

Senior Member
I don't like using other peoples kits or house kits either. It sucks but I will do it if necessary.

If your playing original music at bars with 3 or 4 other bands on the bill, just go with it. You can use your own kit when you headline, coverband gigs or play orig. gigs without openers.
 
M

mediocrefunkybeat

Guest
If you're whining about playing another kit that isn't your's, then you don't care enough about the gig. I've played some really funny backline kits - ones that you couldn't adjust in case they fell apart, ones that moved forward three inches each time I hit the bass drum because the bass spikes weren't there, we even had one that was missing an entire bass spur and we had to prop up with a chair.

Of course I prefer playing my own kit at gigs. Recently, I've been lucky that the 'gig' kit has been my kit (the advantages of limited space in cars for other people and a 16" bass drum) but I've done plenty of gigs on kits that I thought were awful, or just not to my taste. To be honest, I couldn't care less. There is no rant to be had. If you want to whine about using other kits, that's fine - but just try and do one gig behind the sound desk. I've done a few of those as well and nothing is worse than some little drum hero coming up to you and asking you to totally re-mic your set because they don't want to use what's provided. It's not the sound engineer being lazy, either. It takes a long time to set up and soundcheck a kit properly and frankly, other parts of the band are far more important.

EDIT: I just re-read your original post and it actually made me more irritated. Your ignorance of what sound engineers put up with knows no bounds. Do you know how hard it is to deal with a Pri Madonna who doesn't understand that it's not all about them? If that's your attitude, then no wonder you haven't liked the engineers much, because they probably don't like you much either. And trust me when I say that the ball is usually very much in their court.
 
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cobamnator

Senior Member
Hey turbo Jerk,
How hard would it be to get there a couple minutes early and tune / adjust the drums to your hearts content? How much time do you have to do this? Seems like a simple solution but I'm sure something else would Probably make this near impossible...

BTW, I use 2 16" crashes for hi hats...and I'll tell you something else THEY SOUND GREAT!!!

Point is, you can make anything work out.
 
A

audiotech

Guest
Do I like using some one else's kits, not particularly, but it comes with the territory and the more often you do it, it becomes second nature. If I sit in on a song or two, I make it a practice to move only what I need to and that's usually just tipping the snare drum away from the throne and adjusting the heigth of the throne. If I have to use a different kit than my own for an entire gig or session, which I haven't done in many years, I'll bring my bass drum pedal, key and cymbals.

The thing is, really try to work with people. In the long run you'll be known to be cooperative and just being easy to work with will help get you more work and respect. This also works very well when wearing the hat of the sound tech.

Dennis
 

Fishbones

Silver Member
I had to play a 4 hour set on a house-owned first act kit a few years ago. Wasn't permitted to use my own kit. Ever since then I've organized to bring in my own kit in advance - you might wanna try to do the same. Most event organizers are pretty leniant about it - not sure about your specific case. It's worth a shot, right?
 

brady

Platinum Member
You can use your own kit when you headline, coverband gigs or play orig. gigs without openers.
The catch with this is that when you finally headline-- and finally get to play your own kit at a gig--the opening band (or bands) are using YOUR kit. A much worse predicament if you ask me.
 

Deathmetalconga

Platinum Member
I've faced this before. Here is what you can do to make it so you get what you want:

1. Find out who is the stage manager and call them. Don't text - texting when you could be calling suggests you lack confidence and social skills.

2. Show up very early and assess the stage, what it is like to load onto the stage, what the sound guy has available and what he has to deal with in terms of other instruments and vocal mics. The easier you make his job, the better your chances of pulling off the kit swap.

3. Get your kit set up and ready to load onto the stage. Cymbals, stands, toms, pedals, everything in its place and ready to put up.

4. Bring so help so you can move the house kit aside quickly and get yours up. Put everything back exactly as it was when you leave. Thank people who help you and thank the sound man.
 

Pocket-full-of-gold

Platinum Member
Ideal? Nup, agree with you. I much prefer my own rig.

Does it have to be done? You bet. We have to suck many things up and just roll with it. This is just another example.

It isn't always bad. I've got to play some great kits that I would otherwise have no exposure to, by sharing. Who knows, you just might find the diamond in the rough.
 

turbojerk

Senior Member
If you're whining about playing another kit that isn't your's, then you don't care enough about the gig. I've played some really funny backline kits - ones that you couldn't adjust in case they fell apart, ones that moved forward three inches each time I hit the bass drum because the bass spikes weren't there, we even had one that was missing an entire bass spur and we had to prop up with a chair.

Of course I prefer playing my own kit at gigs. Recently, I've been lucky that the 'gig' kit has been my kit (the advantages of limited space in cars for other people and a 16" bass drum) but I've done plenty of gigs on kits that I thought were awful, or just not to my taste. To be honest, I couldn't care less. There is no rant to be had. If you want to whine about using other kits, that's fine - but just try and do one gig behind the sound desk. I've done a few of those as well and nothing is worse than some little drum hero coming up to you and asking you to totally re-mic your set because they don't want to use what's provided. It's not the sound engineer being lazy, either. It takes a long time to set up and soundcheck a kit properly and frankly, other parts of the band are far more important.

EDIT: I just re-read your original post and it actually made me more irritated. Your ignorance of what sound engineers put up with knows no bounds. Do you know how hard it is to deal with a Pri Madonna who doesn't understand that it's not all about them? If that's your attitude, then no wonder you haven't liked the engineers much, because they probably don't like you much either. And trust me when I say that the ball is usually very much in their court.
Seriously dude,... Seriously... "I'm" not allowed to have an opinion and you are? Real mature of you...

Truth be told I've played under MANY excellent sound engineers and very few FEW bad and the ones that where bad where just lazy. Thanks for taking just a rant to a new level! Some of you guys are worse than some of the auto racing forums that I frequent.
 
M

mediocrefunkybeat

Guest
I never said you weren't allowed to have an opinion. Please point out the part of the post where I said that.

I’m just real jacked that Drummers always have to deal with this schitt just because the sound guy is F’in LAZY!!! They keep playing the “change over” time card and I soooo sick of hearing about it….DO YOUR F’IN JOB! Christ, I only have a 4 pc set.
Maturity is, as maturity does.
 

Deathmetalconga

Platinum Member
Seriously dude,... Seriously... "I'm" not allowed to have an opinion and you are? Real mature of you...

Truth be told I've played under MANY excellent sound engineers and very few FEW bad and the ones that where bad where just lazy. Thanks for taking just a rant to a new level! Some of you guys are worse than some of the auto racing forums that I frequent.
Yes, you are allowed to have an opinion, to post it here and ask for comment. You just might not like what people have to say about your opinion.

Read the suggestions I have. You may be able to pull this off with initiative, politeness, humility, consideration, hard work and cashing in some favors.
 
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