I was thinking...

jondrumming

Senior Member
...About the two bass drums/double pedal argument. The biggest two arguments seem to be:

a) The slave pedal in an average double pedal creates an unbalanced feel, thus hindering your overall performance.

b) The speed of the air moving around inside the single bass drum can choke the head, which can lead to uneven sound.

Well, I was thinking about those two points, and here are my two arguments, based on the principle: Bass drums, although bigger, are still drums.

a) Unless you're ambidextrous, your hands (on the snare drum) are not going to have the exact same performance. If you're a righty, your left hand will be weaker, and vice versa.

b) This would mean that someone playing 32nd notes on a snare drum would be choking it too? I don't think the "choking the sound" argument is true, because if it was, we would need a snare drum and tom tom for each hand, so instead of:

14" Snare
10"Tom
12" Tom
16" Floor Tom
22" Bass

we would need:

14" Snare
14" Snare
10" Tom
10" Tom
12" Tom
12" Tom
16" Floor Tom
16" Floor Tom
22" Bass
22" Bass

One for each hand, to create "the perfect sound".

I may be wrong entirely, but what do you think?
 

GruntersDad

Administrator - Mayor
Staff member
In my opinion, the fact that the bass drum head is much looser, it tends to choke easier.
Just an opinion.
 

eddiehimself

Platinum Member
What you have to remember though is that i think bass drums tend to be "slower" than tomtoms and the snare which is why they're more likely to choke up if you play them fast.

of course i just like using a pedal because i rec that even if you have 2 kick drums, you might as well give yourself a bit of a variety in sound rather than just having 2 drums make the same sound. so then like have a double pedal on one and a single on the other or whatever. I know what people mean about the feel of a double pedal but i just think well y'know your left foot is not your right foot, they're both slightly different as it is so really i don't think it should be a huge issue anyway.

Also JD, what have we told you about thinking!? Lol
 
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DrumEatDrum

Platinum Member
I agree with the basic argument. We play every other drum with two hands, so there is no reason a bass drum can't be player with two beaters.

I still prefer 2 bass drums for feel, but a double pedal is just much easier to take to a gig.
 

cnw60

Senior Member
Have you ever played bass drum in a marching band or drum line?

Even with a mallet/beater in each hand - you just can't get the speed of response from a large drum that you would from a snare or tom (or two bass drums).
 

bermuda

Drummerworld Pro Drummer - Administrator
Staff member
...About the two bass drums/double pedal argument. The biggest two arguments seem to be:

a) The slave pedal in an average double pedal creates an unbalanced feel, thus hindering your overall performance.

b) The speed of the air moving around inside the single bass drum can choke the head, which can lead to uneven sound.

Well, I was thinking about those two points, and here are my two arguments, based on the principle: Bass drums, although bigger, are still drums.

a) Unless you're ambidextrous, your hands (on the snare drum) are not going to have the exact same performance. If you're a righty, your left hand will be weaker, and vice versa.

b) This would mean that someone playing 32nd notes on a snare drum would be choking it too?
If someone is playing 32nds, chances are the kick is muffled up pretty good in order to hear the articulation. In that case, there's not much air moving around in the kick (which probably has a hole in the front anyway) so there wouldn't be any choking using one kick.

With respect to an "average double pedal" creating an unbalanced feel, that can be solved by getting a better pedal with better linkage: Trick, DW9000, or Axis.

Bermuda
 

cdawg

Member
i'd say the slave unit is the most trying part of the equation. i try to get it close, then play it with the right foot to see if it's close to the right pedal's response. i'm sure the drum chokes, but c'mon. like was said before, if you're playing that fast, i'm sure muffling is in order.
 

drumgeek93

Senior Member
I agree with caddy, If you can play it right, they arent going to be worried about it being cool or not. I personally like the feel of a single bass double pedal. Thats just my opinion.
~Justin
 

Average

Senior Member
Most of the guys I see using the double pedal setup a lot are metal drummers. I have yet to see one who doesn't use a trigger, which kindof makes the whole 2 different sounds argument moot.

I just don't want to haul around another bass drum, plus it interferes with setting the kit up ergonomically for my playing style.
 

drumgeek93

Senior Member
Well yah metal drummers are the main arguers in using another bass drum or not. If your not going to use that other kick alot in your playing, or use it just for fills or things, then another pedal is all that is needed. In a picky studio, it might be different. but if its live, no one is going to walk out on you just because you have a double pedal. Its just not that important.
 
M

Mediocrefunkybeat

Guest
Its just not that important.
Really, down with you on this one. Agreed.

It seems drummers spend most of their time arguing about the merits of isolation mounts and double pedals vs. double kick drums rather than doing what they ought to be doing and actually playing. The best drummers I know also happen to be some of the least picky when it comes to their drums (cymbals is another argument all together) but it's just not that important. Hand me a recording of the same drums with isolation mounts and without tuned the same way, and I might be able to tell the difference slightly. Throw that into a mix with the rest of a band going? No. I'm not going to be able to tell and even less will I care.

Radiohead's 'OK Computer' was recorded without isolation mounts. As were countless other albums known for their fantastic recordings. The entire Pink Floyd catalogue (except possibly 'Division Bell') was recorded without them, yet those recordings are lauded with praise for being some of the best. I could name twenty other examples, but that isn't necessary.

Double pedals 'choking' heads? Please. Give me a break. Maybe. But it just doesn't matter at all. We need to stop splitting hairs and actually get down to what is important and stop obsessing and start learning to i) play and ii) tune. So much of your tone is in your playing and that is really where the generation of a good sound starts. I like to think that I actually have a reasonable tone, but I'm not, mechanically, a particularly gifted drummer in any measure. Why is it that there's a constant obsession with the most minute detail of gear, but I have seen so few threads on good sound generation? The last one I remember was an article Finn posted nearly two years ago, yet I see dozens of threads about 'playing faster' and 'playing triplet subdivisions in 5/4' when so little of that stuff is actually ever relevant?

What gets people the gigs is their tone from their playing and unless you're playing extreme metal or hard, hard bop, being able to play above 210 BPM is largely irrelevant to most musical goals. Bass players spend days agonising over the best technique for the best sound on their instrument - I know this, as a bass player. It seems drummers are spoiled for a choice with lots of drums around them and figure that the best way is to worry about their mechanical skills rather than actually letting their ears govern anything. Stop worrying about gear and start worrying about how you put that gear to good use.

/rant.
 

eddiehimself

Platinum Member
What gets people the gigs is their tone from their playing and unless you're playing extreme metal or hard, hard bop, being able to play above 210 BPM is largely irrelevant to most musical goals. Bass players spend days agonising over the best technique for the best sound on their instrument - I know this, as a bass player. It seems drummers are spoiled for a choice with lots of drums around them and figure that the best way is to worry about their mechanical skills rather than actually letting their ears govern anything. Stop worrying about gear and start worrying about how you put that gear to good use.

/rant.
I don't think this is entirely true. Don't forget the big argument about basses with more than 4 strings! Plus you've got like vintage fender vs modern active basses. I just think musicians in general like to argue about their gear because some people like to think they're better than others. It's just what people do.
 
M

Mediocrefunkybeat

Guest
I don't think this is entirely true. Don't forget the big argument about basses with more than 4 strings! Plus you've got like vintage fender vs modern active basses. I just think musicians in general like to argue about their gear because some people like to think they're better than others. It's just what people do.
The serious bass players worry about their fingers, not about what batteries are powering their EMGs. Put a decent bass player on any bass and he'll find his own tone, but drummers seem much much worse at gear arguments than others. Bass players argue about strings the most, but that's understandable seeing as their hands are directly on their centre of sound generation.

Incidentally, you can probably guess which side of the fence I'm on with bass preference. With that said, there's a lot of charm in active electronics AND I'm a modder. But you don't see bass players arguing over which strap acoustically enhances their sound - that's the sort of equivalent I'm talking about when it comes to this 'choking the head' nonsense.
 
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Mediocrefunkybeat

Guest
Press the 'quote' bottom on the bottom right of every post. Alternatively, use type [ quote] and [/ quote] at the end of copy and pasted material. Don't type in the spaces I just did.
 
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