How good are you at the standard 26 rudiments, and how has this your effected your drum set playing?

lindsayannemusic

Senior Member
Just wondering what other experiences anyone else has had and like to share... also welcome drummers who never study rudiments and why they don't.
 
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bermuda

Drummerworld Pro Drummer - Administrator
Staff member
I'm good-to-great on the basic 26, depending which rudiment! I use several rudiments in everyday playing, and do so pretty much without conscious thought, they're just part of my musical vocabulary. Probably my most-used are single strokes, flams, paradiddles, and open & closed rolls.

I suppose the single rudiment that affects my kit playing is the paradiddle. Again, not in a conscious way and not incorporating paradiddles as beats (as was the fashion in the late-'60s & '70s because it sounded kinda funky cool...) but more as a way to enter or exit a fill, so that one of my hands is where it needs to be for the "1" or maybe the back beat. No thought given when it's happening, it just happens and I'm glad it does.

Bermuda
 

8Mile

Platinum Member
I'm accomplished at all of them and I use the heck out of them on the drum set. I really think of all rhythmic groupings in terms of rudiments or variations of them. By orchestrating them around the set, that's pretty much how I come up with my stuff.
 

lindsayannemusic

Senior Member
I'm good-to-great on the basic 26, depending which rudiment! I use several rudiments in everyday playing, and do so pretty much without conscious thought, they're just part of my musical vocabulary. Probably my most-used are single strokes, flams, paradiddles, and open & closed rolls.

I suppose the single rudiment that affects my kit playing is the paradiddle. Again, not in a conscious way and not incorporating paradiddles as beats (as was the fashion in the late-'60s & '70s because it sounded kinda funky cool...) but more as a way to enter or exit a fill, so that one of my hands is where it needs to be for the "1" or maybe the back beat. No thought given when it's happening, it just happens and I'm glad it does.

Bermuda

Nice response! Thats very true about vocabulary, and eventually not even thinking about what you're doing. Rudiments do help Sticking a lot as well.
 
I am good and stay focus on singles, doubles, paradiddles and triplets. The other rudiments are a bit more demanding to my taste...
 
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Anthony Amodeo

Guest
I worked on them for years and made sure they left a residue

the reason why is because the last thing you want to do while you are playing is think.

you don't want to be saying to yourself....ok I'm about to do a 5 stroke roll into a 9 stroke roll into two paradiddles.......

no

you want these sticking combinations to bleed through in your playing subconsciously

so by residue I mean ....working on these patterns over and over has left me with the ability to access them at anytime without thinking of the specific sticking combination

I would recommend working on them both on the pad and applying them to the kit

experiment with combining rudiments and voicing them on the drums

all diddle rudiments, 6 stroke roll, 5 stroke roll, 9 stroke roll, ratamacue, all lend themselves amazingly to the kit ..... among others

also ...don't just take them for what they are on paper

change them around...reverse the sticking and accent pattern

for example

dont just play paradiddle - Rlrr Lrll (capitals being the accents )

play it - rllR lrrL
and - rrLr llRl
and - rLrl lRlr

keep your metronome on the quarter note and get used to the accent moving....great exercise

and any other way you can twist it...it's just a permutation of the exact same pattern

maybe replace a R or a L with a kick.....anything

think outside the box and have a blast
 

JBoom

Senior Member
When I first started drumming, I steered away from the rudiments because they seemed boring. Of course I was only 6 years old when I started, but I still refused to take them seriously until I was about 14. My drum teachers would give me rudiments, stick control, and other things like that to practice, but they would also give me more enjoyable drum set grooves and exercises. I always used to skip the boring stuff, and over practice the "cool" stuff. I would be averagely progressing in the drum set work, and stuck on the same page for weeks at clip in my rudimental studies. I can't recall when exactly I realized the importance of what they were, but when I started to take them seriously, my world of drumming expanded into endless possibilities. Even just taking a paradiddle and using it around the drum set turns it into a really complicated but nice sounding fill. I also began to look back and realize how so many things I was doing before were directly related if not derived from some or any of the rudiments. I have lately for the past year or so really been into the science behind music, and how creativity can actually be converted into math or science like structures!! I play a few tonal instruments other than drums, and sometimes I listen to licks or figures and either like them - or I don't. The next step I take is taking a step back and saying to myself "why/why don't I like this groove, fill, lick etc."? It really has been improving my music.
All the benefits of rudiments aside, I'd like to take a moment and say you probably learned in the right order for you. That is, especially when new at it, you concentrated on what made it fun. The rest comes after, in my opinion. Plus, as one learns by picking what is fun, it's all too often that the stuff previously thought unfun becomes what is fun.

For me, starting with rudements was fun. I didn't learn drums until I was in my teens but I always had a pair of drum sticks and a pad that my uncle had given me. So when I first started learning I thought it was very cool to finally know what to do with the sticks and pad!
 

Arky

Platinum Member
I'm extremely happy someone "invented" the rudiments and brought so much system and order into the plethora of stuff which can be played. Sure the simplest of them (single stroke roll) is so basic one can't avoid it, but the more complex ones like some flam combinations - I'd never have come up with this on my own, that's why I'm so glad there's a whole "alphabet" to learn.

I stayed away from the rudiments just for a short period of time when I simply needed to get my hands going. Anything more than that would have messed me up anyway. Then I gradually got into the rudiments but haven't all of them down well. I did concentrate on the paradiddle a lot which helped me hit good speed. But now I'm re-learning it a bit to develop more control, less dribbling, and to feel when to close/release the grip and get a better separation of the accented vs. unaccented notes. I've been completely neglecting the other paradiddle variations until recently but have managed to get them up to moderate speed quickly and now work on mixing them up seamlessly.
In terms of bpm, I've done a "speed demo" recently with the paradiddle @ 250 bpm, but that was... I hate to say it, sloppy (dribbling). Just checked with a click - 220 bpm is where I'm at for a clean version. But that's the standard paradiddle - all the other variations are way slower than that (haven't clocked those yet).

I waited with flams for quite a while before I started working on them - I felt I wasn't ready for them at that time. I'm still not good at flams and I'm amazed of the speed many drummers are achieving.

ATM I don't feel I need to come up with my own stickings as there is so much to work on regarding the 26 rudiments, plus a few hybrid ones (as seen on Todd Sucherman's DVD). I'm noticing various issues in my grip so there's enough to work on regardless of the complexity/simplicity of rudiments. I think you can find some "aesthetics" in any rudiment and have quite a challenge getting it down perfectly.

Now if you apply those rudiments to your feet... I can do maybe 5% of what I can do with my hands, haha.

I will continue to work on those rudiments one bite at a time. I feel I need to know all the letters in the alphabet to ultimately build sentences/phrases.
 
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dmacc

Platinum Member
I learned them all and am probably good at them (excluding the single stroke roll). That being said, I don't know which ones I use and when as I have paid zero attention to them for the last 20 or so years. I only "focus" on them in context as they are integrated within the Wilcoxon Rudimental snare solos I do each time I practice. It's all about stringing them together to make something out of them. I do not ever sit down to practice just rudiments.

By doing the Wilcoxon solos since 1980 (almost every time I've practiced) I think they've facilitated the ability to help me execute things I have heard other people do around the set in a musical fashion that I wish to try to emulate as well as my own ideas.
 

BigDinSD

Gold Member
26 eh...? (startled look)

I've been spending the last few months on some, and taking them around the kit. I'd like to just have several of them in my natural muscle memory where I can stick em in a roll or play a part of one as a fill WITHOUT THINKING...

Which one do you guys use the most?

Which ones are hardly used or not as usable?
 
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Anthony Amodeo

Guest
26 eh...? (startled look)

I've been spending the last few months on some, and taking them around the kit. I'd like to just have several of them in my natural muscle memory where I can stick em in a roll or play a part of one as a fill WITHOUT THINKING...

Which one do you guys use the most?

Which ones are hardly used or not as usable?
I use 6 stroke roll (in sextuplet form)
ratamacue, 5 stroke roll, 9 stroke roll, all diddle rudiments, swiss trips, flams, and flam taps pretty much constantly....and of course singles and doubles

now that I think about it single stroke 4 and 7 as well....and probably a bunch more

but I guess those are the ones that really stuck with me

they also translate to the kit very well
 

groove1

Silver Member
Out of the 26, there used to be what was called "The 13 Essential Rudiments"...maybe they
are still called that, not sure. I have found them to be the most helpful in enabling me to be
where I want to be on the drumset. I have played all of them but found some much more useful than others for the way I play. Others have stated it already but being able to have
the hand you want to come down on 1 with, is accomplished easily when you know the rudiments.
 

DrumEatDrum

Platinum Member
There was a time when I knew them all by heart. Not so much anymore.

But the double stroke, the 5-stroke, 6-stroke, 9-stroke, parradiddle and flams are have consistently worked their way into my playing in various bands (sorry, 7-stroke roll, nothing against you personally, I just don't use you that much).

Often, they get worked into grooves as a pseudo marching feel.

I recorded this song way back in 1996 (or was it 1997?) which got some college radio play and lot of record industry buzz at the time. The verses are 5-stroke rolls and flams, and in the middle, one fill is a parradidle between my right hand and right foot.
(please ignore the horrible video footage)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8i2WgbfLmo&feature=results_video&playnext=1&list=PLC2DA0BBA133FC54B

If it weren't for knowing rudiments, that song might never have happened the way it did.

A dozen or so years later, I used another pseudo-marching idea for the guitar solo/bridge of this weird little tune, again based on 5-stroke rolls and flams
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=EY17FnDrhBw#t=153s

And there have been other songs here and there that have used rudiments has part of the groove, or as part of a fill.
 
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Zero Mercury Drummer

Senior Member
I was pretty much self-taught, and taught myself paradiddles just by endless repetition over years. Everything about how I did them was wrong, but over the years I developed my grip, learned how to play them evenly, and move accents around. It was huge for my playing.

The second big breakthrough for me was the five stroke roll. It taught me how to start leading with a double on the left hand, which felt very foreign at first.

Another big eye opener for me was the six stroke roll. I started hearing it in my favorite players' stuff. It's just an incredibly versatile rudiment.

I think if you never explore the rudiments you won't develop so much in your playing. Doing everything with single strokes is not very creative.
 

TakenHigherByU

Senior Member
Being somebody who is just beginning to see the importance of and starting to learn rudiments, they can be very daunting and horribly boring. I'm glad to know that the hard work I intend to put in shall not be in vain one day :)
 

opentune

Platinum Member
I've gone the other way. I started without them, played many years and only really seriously doing them the past year. They are indeed daunting, especially to attain speed, but I can now see their utility in a big way....not just finger/hand control, but what becomes natural to do with your hands.

I have my faves (like paradiddles) but life is short and I doubt I will learn all 26.

So can anybody tell me the top 5 to 'perfect' besides the single and double-stroke roll??
 
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plangentmusic

Guest
I think they're essential but there's a time to let them go. Unless you're planning on being a drum corp driummer sounding too rudimental can come off really corny.
 

Bo Eder

Platinum Member
I think if we get too many people saying 'well I've never studied them' then I think it would give the impression that the rudiments are not important.

I think one should approach it this way: if there's music to play (and these can be the 26 standard rudiments too) and you're a serious percussionist or musician, then I think you owe it to yourself to at least check them out. I haven't met a musician yet who worked alot that had big gaping holes in basic knowledge (on any instrument). Granted, there's probably not alot of weddings or club gigs where you'll be playing Lesson 25's or flam-taps, but as with all basics on any instrument, they're there to help your dexterity with the instrument so when you think of something really cool you want to play, your hands will easier execute that idea. You don't have to be incredibly awesome, but I think you should be familiar with them at the very least. And of course there are lots of unofficial drumset rudiments you should know like the Motown lead-in fill, etc.,...

I'm just saying that you should play everything that you can play. My teacher had me take Ted Reed's Syncopation and we played the heck out of that book, and when I reached the end, he flipped it over and I played it backwards the other way. A high level of competence on the instrument is the least of any music contractor's worries when he's looking for players. If you have the time on your hands, there's no reason why you couldn't tackle anything that shows up on the music stand, right?
 

Stroman

Platinum Member
There was a time when I played all of them quite well. I played marching snare drum at a pretty high level, and you have to know them...

In the intervening 30+ years, I find, like Bermuda, they have simply become part of my vocabulary. I may not use them as written, always, but elements of the rudiments make up the language.
 
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