22" x 12" bass drum - 2015 Origin photo's / spec's

T

The SunDog

Guest
At last! Someone finally filled the piccolo bass drum niche. No offense Andy but it looks like a parquet floor and a Peavey Radial had a bastard offspring.
 

keep it simple

Platinum Member
No offense Andy but it looks like a parquet floor and a Peavey Radial had a bastard offspring.
How could I possibly take offence to such a well considered analogy.

As for niche, there's certainly no attempt involved. This isn't the first time we've built an Origin series kit with a 12" deep bass drum, but it is the first 22" x 12" one we've built. The earlier one was 20", & produced more bottom end than 99% of 22" x 18" bass drums you'll ever encounter. Anyone who's heard / played it will testify to that. This one shares the same DNA, & will out bass drum most bass drums out there. Piccolo in nature, it certainly is not :)
 

beyondbetrayal

Platinum Member
What a beauty!!!!

those bass drum hoops are amazing too.

Looks like great planning, thought, and execution went into this.. very nice
 
T

The SunDog

Guest
How could I possibly take offence to such a well considered analogy. Piccolo in nature, it certainly is not :)

Sorry :) just having a little fun. It's another beauty and your drums always sound incredible. Even to an old ply shell fan. The quality of your drums is beyond dispute.
 

gallonsloth

Senior Member
Very beautiful looking set.
Question though....
I know that reducing the overall mass will leave the drum much more resonant. How does it affect the volume of the drum though? Does adding/decreasing mass through hoops and shell thickness affect volume dramatically?
Basically, I'm quite interested in what the volume is like on some of the Origin series, since it's hard to tell with videos alone.
 

keep it simple

Platinum Member
Very beautiful looking set.
Question though....
I know that reducing the overall mass will leave the drum much more resonant. How does it affect the volume of the drum though? Does adding/decreasing mass through hoops and shell thickness affect volume dramatically?
Basically, I'm quite interested in what the volume is like on some of the Origin series, since it's hard to tell with videos alone.
Great question :) There's certainly no dramatic reduction of volume associated with the Origin design. If I compared it to our Tour series (pretty much the opposite end of the spectrum), I'd say the difference is fairly small, but it depends on the volume of what. In terms of tonal production, Origin's are very big sounding. The sheer overall resonance (as distinct to head sustain) sees to that. The biggest difference is how easily they open up to full tone at low dynamic. In terms of bright projection in an acoustic environment, they're not as explosive as the Tour series. Origin's overall distinguishing feature is the purity of it's fundamental. There really is nothing else out there that approaches it in that regard.

Sorry :) just having a little fun.
I know, I'm cool ;)

What a beauty!!!!

those bass drum hoops are amazing too.

Looks like great planning, thought, and execution went into this.. very nice
Thank you, & yes, every aspect is designed to offer a whole instrument.
 

larryace

"Uncle Larry"
Andy...after everything you've learned from shell construction, it would be interesting to have you build a drum that flys in the face of everything you've learned, but still with first quality craftsmanship. Just to see what would happen. Like using your know how, yet designing for the most unpure note you can get for instance. You never know it might sound cool. I'm sure you have much better things to do with your time, but I can't help but wonder if you could even build a bad drum.
 

keep it simple

Platinum Member
Andy...after everything you've learned from shell construction, it would be interesting to have you build a drum that flys in the face of everything you've learned, but still with first quality craftsmanship. Just to see what would happen. Like using your know how, yet designing for the most unpure note you can get for instance. You never know it might sound cool. I'm sure you have much better things to do with your time, but I can't help but wonder if you could even build a bad drum.
That's a good angle Larry, & I have the answer. We've built plenty of "bad" drums that were constructed to a high standard. This was mainly during the R&D phase. Ok, non of them were terrible, but they all had issues. When you push the boundaries, you end up with stuff that just doesn't work. The flip side to that is, if you build conventionally, & keep an eye on quality, then you're fairly certain of producing an acceptable sounding instrument. That's fine, but you end up with generic sounding instruments. That's also fine, but it's not what we do. There's enough generic drums out there already. In that arena, we have little to offer.

You have to know pretty much every way of building a bad drum before you can truly build a spectacular drum :)
 

larryace

"Uncle Larry"
You have to know pretty much every way of building a bad drum before you can truly build a spectacular drum :)
Well this pretty much sums it up for me.

I loved the prototype kit

I love my steambent Origins

The InTense stuff is amazing

The segmented drums make me want them, especially Jeff's set. Holy crap on a cracker is that a work of art.

The walnut stave drum liquefy's my nuts

These Zebranos have grabbed me by the ear and made them sit up and take notice.

How do you keep topping yourself?
 

GetAgrippa

Platinum Member
Dang dude another kit "pieced" together from scraps-you should spray paint it grey. LOL Dang Andy that is a beaut of a kit- love the 22X12 size too. And by the way it would be "heresy" to ever cover such beauty. You've been busy my man. I just can't fathom how the heck you make such thin shells-must be magical elves come in the shop late at night chipping away.
 

GetAgrippa

Platinum Member
What next Andy tunable drum kits with a throttle like a timpani? A single throttle to control the whole kit-man that would make for some interesting drumming options.
 

keep it simple

Platinum Member
I loved the prototype kit
Actually Larry, the prototype kit goes into the bad drums category I described earlier. Spectacularly good at one thing & at one tuning, but crap at everything else. A true "one trick pony", but a thoroughbred one ;)

I just can't fathom how the heck you make such thin shells-must be magical elves come in the shop late at night chipping away.
Those elves are a real PITA. I need my sleep ;) ;) ;)

What next Andy tunable drum kits with a throttle like a timpani? A single throttle to control the whole kit-man that would make for some interesting drumming options.
No plans for straying into the avant garde side for us - yet ;)
 

larryace

"Uncle Larry"
Actually Larry, the prototype kit goes into the bad drums category I described earlier. Spectacularly good at one thing & at one tuning, but crap at everything else. A true "one trick pony", but a thoroughbred one ;)
Oh wow I didn't know that. Is it because of the cage?
 

singing drums

Senior Member
...as always, original thinking, design and execution...great job!...

...would you classify the design as a hybrid segmented/stave shell?...
 

Drumsinhisheart

Silver Member
Thanks Neal :) Biggest issue with this kit is getting players to try it. The automatic assumption is its only suitable for jazz because of the depths. Wrong, wrong - WRONG! All doubts are dispelled the moment you touch it :)

The shallow floor tom is included for a reason too. Believe it or not, & especially at lower tunings, a shallow floor tom can often produce more bottom end than a deeper one, especially on an ultra pure fundamental kit like this. There's a number of reasons for that, but a big one is the drum's proximity to the floor, & that's where a shallow floor tom really scores.

As for niche, there's certainly no attempt involved. This isn't the first time we've built an Origin series kit with a 12" deep bass drum, but it is the first 22" x 12" one we've built. The earlier one was 20", & produced more bottom end than 99% of 22" x 18" bass drums you'll ever encounter. Anyone who's heard / played it will testify to that. This one shares the same DNA, & will out bass drum most bass drums out there. Piccolo in nature, it certainly is not :)
So true. I've made all kinds of different depths in floor toms, though maple plywood shells. Still, the more shallow the drum, in my case my favorites have been half toms for years now, set into customized snare stands, the more pure the tone and defined fundamental. I believe they record better, as well.

My current bass drums are 12x24 and 11x22 and I love them, and I am not a real lover of 22" kicks. I like the flex of larger heads. But, the feel of the shallow depth and the wallop of the drums is quite thunderous. Just as powerful as any deep shelled drum. In some respects more so simply because of sympathetic vibrations between the heads.

I made a 10x26 which I played for years back in the 90s in a concept set (everything 10" deep). I loved that drum. It did look "odd," comparatively speaking but, no one ever said it sounded odd.

I tend to believe, like cannons, the deeper the shell the longer the throw of energy, but the more shallow the shell, the wider dispersion of energy.

Just a handsome looking set of drums, Andy. Just beautiful craftsmanship.
 

keep it simple

Platinum Member
...as always, original thinking, design and execution...great job!...

...would you classify the design as a hybrid segmented/stave shell?...
Thank you :) No, there's no vertical grain element in these Origin shells, they're purely segmented.

I tend to believe, like cannons, the deeper the shell the longer the throw of energy, but the more shallow the shell, the wider dispersion of energy.

Just a handsome looking set of drums, Andy. Just beautiful craftsmanship.
Thank you. You do have a point on throw & dispersion, but it's more related to near field resolution than anything else. Unless constructed specifically for it's depth, a deeper bass drum produces more overtones, & in many cases, they dominate the fundamental to the point where projection of tone is actually quite poor.

Oh wow I didn't know that. Is it because of the cage?
It's because of many things Larry. I'll bore you with detail when I visit. Don't get me wrong though, it's still spectacularly good at doing what it does :)
 

Drumsinhisheart

Silver Member
"Thank you. You do have a point on throw & dispersion, but it's more related to near field resolution than anything else. Unless constructed specifically for it's depth, a deeper bass drum produces more overtones, & in many cases, they dominate the fundamental to the point where projection of tone is actually quite poor."

That has been my experience with floor toms. The deeper they are the more overtones, even to the point of sounding higher in pitch, from a distance, than smaller rack toms.
 
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