Re: Cream's Ginger Baker trashes legends in Classic Rock Magazine, Issue #142, March
I think the difference in Buddy slamming other drummers and Ginger slamming other drummers...Did Buddy ever slam any of his peers? I'm talking guys like Joe Morello, Tony Williams, Elvin Jones...Buddy slammed "lesser" rock guys, right? and it's kind of understandable, I can see where he could think that. Ginger slamming Bonham...doesn't he have ears? Like if Ginger slammed say Travis Barker or Lars Ulrich, I wouldn't be as miffed, not that I agree with that, but I could understand why he might feel that way. I just can't relate to his statements at all regarding Mitchell, Bonham, et al....
This is it exactly. Rich never went after Jo Jones, Krupa, Elvin Jones, Bellson etc. He spoke of them in the same high terms we do. He used to talk positively about Tony Williams in public all the time. He also spoke highly of rock drummers Carl Palmer, Bobby Columby and Danny Seraphinne.
Name one drummer Ginger Baker has ever been high on other than Ginger Baker.
See that's the difference.
I also agree with Aydee's statement.
2) Does a fantastic musician need to be a fantastic human being to be a credible icon in his field?
In fact I think most of music history is laden with ego.I don't think you can get to that level and not have it. And if you're immature on the side all that probably makes it even worse regarding the opinions presentation. I knew Louie Bellson pretty well, and he was probably the greatest nice guy drummer in history. But don't think he didn't also have ego and strong opinions about what he thought was lesser music. He was just more political about not being around a magazine writer when he was expressing them. Rashied Ali was also a very, very good guy, but he criticized drummers he didn't think were so good all the time.
This is why Baker's opinions are totally cool with me. He's had the career. I might not like it but I'm certainly not going to judge his character over it. And in Rich's case that's X100.
But I think the direction of these discussions that always tugs at me a little is this stuff about how all talent is subjective, when most times you really
can tell the difference in something that is yes///
better. . Ginger Baker was great with Cream. The whole thing was great. But I think this thing we do where we try to make everyone dead equal by saying
Gee, only Ginger could have made Cream that good is plain wrong. And I don't need a subjectivity meter to tell me that. He was no Bonham, Rich, Williams or pick your Jones. And all I need to say that are a set of ears and some objectivity.
I think subjectivity has its place. But I'm only going to go so far with it. And that includes comparing Baker to Rich, Elvin or a guy like Bonham. Still, I'm not going to even say that unless the other guy opens the door. In this case Baker opened that door, so everybody is allowed a say. The same goes for Rich, but past his attitude issues and some nearsighted comments about drum solos and his rock style, I've never heard a negative comparison with someone else that was ever that convincing. It's also why I'm cool with Meg White. She hasn't made negative public comments about other drummers, so why even go there? She's figured out how to make a career, so who am I to say?
I've talked to a lot of older musicians about this
better is all subjective thing, and they just look at me like I'm nuts. One of them told me
How do I hire the better drummer when I can't tell what better is?
Sometimes this so called
hypocrisy is tied in a lot more with the
reality. Baker slamming icons is only silly because he's not as good as some of the guys he's ragging. And that doesn't take away from the legacy of Blind Faith and Ginger Baker's contribution to rock. It just is what it is.
