TOM TUNING

[fijjibo]

Lots of people think they can use a drum dial as the fix all solution to tuning.

I applaud you guys for not being like that.

Allow me to make a few points:

1, As Rob said, heads arent all perfect

2, The sound should come first - ie fine-tune by ear

3, and perhaps most importantly - Make sure you seat the head thoroughly!!!

You would be surprised how many people miss these out...

[fourstringdrums]

Hey man, that was a very good point! Maby the hads are not perfect in it's density, and thickness - So, the tension has to be different to compensate. And when the tension has to be different, the rims get a little twisted...

If that is the explanation, I wonder if other brands of heads could be more even in density and thickness?

It's not that the density or thickness is that much different, it's just the nature of the head material and that it may not require the same amount of tension around the head to achieve the same pitch. The bottom line is that you really just need to ignore the drum dial and ignore what the drum does if you place it on a flat surface once it's in tune. As long as the drum is easy to tune and sounds good, that's all that matters. Also, I think someone pointed out above, you have to make sure that the surface you put the drum on is truely flat. Glass is not flat and if you put it on wood it may not be 100% flat either. You need to put it on a granite or formica counter top. But again, if the drum tunes well and sounds good, this doesn't matter.

[maximusppl]

So I am recording in the studio with my band on Sept 14th thru the 16th. They have a DW kit there, and I listened to other bands who recorded there and the toms dont have much presence! I have listened to other saturn's being recorded in the studio and the toms are very clear and present...so i am thinking of using mine for the studio...

Who has recorded their saturn in the studio and what experiences have you had?

What heads do I use on the toms? kick drum? tuning advice?
Also, have a maple black panther snare, what heads should i record with on that puppy?

My kit:
2006 Mapex Saturn
22x18 bass
12x9 rack tom
13x10 rack tom
16x16 floor tom

[n2xlr8n]

So I am recording in the studio with my band on Sept 14th thru the 16th. They have a DW kit there, and I listened to other bands who recorded there and the toms dont have much presence! I have listened to other saturn's being recorded in the studio and the toms are very clear and present...so i am thinking of using mine for the studio...

Who has recorded their saturn in the studio and what experiences have you had?

What heads do I use on the toms? kick drum? tuning advice?
Also, have a maple black panther snare, what heads should i record with on that puppy?

My kit:
2006 Mapex Saturn
22x18 bass
12x9 rack tom
13x10 rack tom
16x16 floor tom


Howdy!

I have the 2006 Saturns in:

22x18
20x18
8x8
10x8
12x9
14x11
16x13

Recently for recording, I've used Studio-x (and EC1) coated on the 8", and Super-2 (and EC2) coated on the rest of my toms.

I also have a BP snare; it's the BE Maple 13x3.5. I love the Evans Genera Dry and the Super-2 coated.

On my kicks, I'd use nothing else but SK II and Resonator.

Tuning advice: make sure if you use Evans you stretch them; if you use Aquarian, put them on and don't worry about it. I tune my drums to "Here comes the bride" (fourths?).

SRJ

[maximusppl]

What is Super-2?

I had the Studio X Clears on my toms before with the Classic Clears on the bottom and as far as tone, they produced and sang the best out of all of them live! They just dented kind of easily due to some severe beating...but I guess I could put some fresh ones on for the studio and keep a few handy...

Anyone else?

[n2xlr8n]

What is Super-2?

I had the Studio X Clears on my toms before with the Classic Clears on the bottom and as far as tone, they produced and sang the best out of all of them live! They just dented kind of easily due to some severe beating...but I guess I could put some fresh ones on for the studio and keep a few handy...

Anyone else?

Super-2 is a thin, 2 ply head by Aquarian.

Note that I said coated in my examples, lol. The clears are good for live playing but ring a bit much for recording for my taste.

[maximusppl]

so do i need to go with a 2 ply coated head? like super-2 coated? what gave the best tone, making the toms sound really big and powerful in the studio?

[cdrums21]

so do i need to go with a 2 ply coated head? like super-2 coated? what gave the best tone, making the toms sound really big and powerful in the studio?

Max,
If you research artists who record frequently in the studio, no matter what kit they use, most producers and artisits are trying to get maximum tone and resonance from the toms. 90% of the time, they go with single ply heads. They don't last as long, but for the studio, sound wins out over durability. Clear and coated heads are used, depending on the sound characteristics of the shells. If your shells are inherantly warm, you may want to go with a clear single ply head such as an ambassador or G1 to bring out more high end and attack. If your shells produce more highs and attack, then maybe go with coated heads. There are no hard, fast rules and 2 ply heads are used on toms as well, but I myself and most other artists I've read about or talked to use single ply heads on the toms in the studio. As far as snare and kick go, it's not quite as critical to get resonance from these drums, but usually, artisits use a single ply head on the snare to get a nice crack and clear tones. Kick drum is usually muffled pretty good so any quality kick drum head should work. That's my 2 cents worth, good luck and sorry I can't hook you up that weekend.

[sticksnstonesrus]

I agree with the above. Especially in that most "studios" now are smaller, have less isolation rooms/booths, and generally less room for resonanace altogether. Just about anyone running a decent Mac and Pro-tools with half a mind for sound engineering can record nowadays. Granted, technology can bail you out from a poor recording of your drums, but ideally, the better the sound you put in the mics, the easier it is to work boards later when mixing it all down. Running single-ply toms is going to produce more tonality overall. Depending on how many songs you're recording, how hard you play, and how consistent you play...you might require more than one set. Drum sound levels are a lot easier to cut down when in excess, but impossible to create when lacking. I can't tell you how many times I've come out of the studio booth just scared that the drum sound was awful (in the booth and in my headphones while laying down tracks)...but listening to the initial playbacks, not even mixed, I'm usually surprised. It defintely takes a bit of trust in the board engineers and possibly your producer, that they are aiming and achieving the sound that is right for the music. Ahh...such love for producers that care. As long as everyone gets paid, right?

Either way, my humble recommendation is to ask the studio for some product that they have produced from there and listen to what they'ev done and ask how it was recorded. If they care enough, they should be able to tell you types of drums, heads used, mics used, compressors and digital triggers and such. Maybe you already have...but proof is in the puddin'. Good research will help you prepare for what you want to bring with you to the studio before you start paying for it.

Likwise....my 2 cents...

Andy

[maximusppl]

Okay, so I have began some tuning of my kit for the studio...so far i've put on EC2 on the batter and Aquarian Classic Clears on the bottom, and it sounds okay. Not sure if I like them alot yet. I used to have an EMAD on my bass drum on the batter side and just recently went back to the Superkick II. I think its perfect for the studio. It has the perfect amount of punch and bass, very focused. I use a small EQ Pad that is standing up against the batter side and nothing touches the resonant side. I am running a EQ3 resonant bass head but may put in the Aquarian Regulator with hole just to get that extra little bit to help the SKII. Not sure what I will do with the toms just yet, might just grab some Aquarian Studio X clears and see how they do in the studio. So far those have given me the best tone, I would say. Maybe it's tuning...

[imispgh]

Mapex M series 8" tom. The batter is an Aquarian 2 and the reso is a Remo Ambassador. The heads are new. I tuned the set (8, 10, 12, 14 toms) in thirds begining with the 14" at it's lowest point. I get all the toms a 3rd up except the 8" seems "odd". The batter gets to the right note but the reso has to be very loose to sustain it. It is so loose I can see it move. When I tune the reso tighter the sustain goes away and the drum sounds dead. I tried getting the reso to equal the batter as well as make it tighter to no avail. Is it tougher to get tuning right as the heads get smaller? Is it tougher to get sustain when they get smaller? I know double ply heads lowers sustain but shouldn't the sustain be proportional across the set? The other heads seem fine. (Lastly I did tighten all the heads up pretty good over the first 24hrs and use the palm push method to get the heads stretched a bit so I assume they hold tuning well now)

[fourstringdrums]

You'll probably have to go with a single ply head on the 8". Sustain isn't going to be proportionate across the set because the smaller you go, the more the sustain is going to drop off, especially if you're using a 2 ply head.

I don't use that many drums now, but when I did, I found the following setup to be the best in regards to getting as equal tone and sustain across the drums as possible.

8 - Single Ply Heads Top & Bottom
10 - Single Ply Heads Top & Bottom
12 - Double Ply Top - Single Bottom
14 - Double Ply Top - Single Bottom

Of course every set is different and you may be fine with the double ply head on the 10", but this is what worked for me. You could also try as thin of a reso as you can get, like an Evans Resonant Glass, that will help. Ultimately though, remember, it's an 8" tom, you're not going to get a ton of sustain from it. 8"'s usually have a shorter sustain anyway.

[Garvin]

8" toms are tough for me too. I've always switched to single ply heads for them...

As far as the intervals are concerned, have you tried tuning the 8" first, and then working down to the 14"? Sometimes certain drums just don't sound good at a given pitch or note. Nothing against the manufacturers themselves, I just think it's the physics involved (which I don't really understand) of tuning smaller drums. I would just find that sweet spot on the 8" tom and then go down from there. Good luck!

[ermghoti]

I use the same heads across all my toms, but by tuning the 8" a slightly higher interval than the rest, I get plenty of sustain.

[imispgh]

ermghoti - do you use double-ply heads?

[abe]

I had interesting conversation about jazz drum set sound.
I'm right now working on my jazz trio stuff. One profesional sound enginer gave me superficial still very interesting view of his ideas about studio jazz drum kit sound and how to achieve it. He told that thought many drummers from today accoustic jazz scene in studio prefere small bass drumme and toms, he's for big toms and 22'' bass drum. He sad: ''In big drums sound can breath''. I'm really interested of your thoughts. We were talking about bebop hard bop, not big band jazz. I like personaly high pitched toms and quiet high bass drum, not bigger than 20''.
What's this ''breathing '' that big drum can provide while small not so much?
Isn't studio the best place where you can use smaller toms and not to worry about enough sound?

[intooder]

I have never owned/tuned an 8" tom but see if any of these help:
1) Totally theoretical: Tune both heads as tight as you can. Then gradually loosen the reso head till you achieve the tone you like.
2) Like mentioned before, single ply should resonate more. So, you might leave the double on the batter, but switch to a single for the the reso and then try tuning them
3) This is from a Weckl video I watched a while back - If the heads are fairly new, try using a hair dryer to warm up the heads a bit while tuning.
4) Not something I've needed to do - try flip-flopping the batter and reso heads and flip the tom around - there might be something funky with the mechanics of the tom/wood itself.

[fourstringdrums]

He probably means that a larger size has more of a full, airy tone to it. While that might be true, you can get the same out of a small size. I wouldn't imagine playing bebop with a 22" . For me it would have to at least be an 18". A 22" doesn't tune up as well, and it starts to sound boomy or boingy. A smaller drum is more versatile as well. My 18" I can tune up to jazz range and even lower to imitate a 20". I could even get a way with tuning down and not using a 22" with it as well.

[voldak]

I use the same heads across all my toms, but by tuning the 8" a slightly higher interval than the rest, I get plenty of sustain.

Same here. I use EC2 Clear's across all toms (including the 8). I also tune my higher and get a lovely sound with nice sustain.

[Guillermo]

Hmmm... well, the thing is we're only talking daiameter here... and we're talking "3rd's".

But it's not diameter, it's the proportion of diameter/depth/thickness that makes the whole acoustic chamber of a shell... an 8"x12" is different in proportion to a 7"x8", for example.

Now regarding the intervals, all drums need to be the same proportion (theoretically) to have the same note intervals, using the same relative tension... but as we all know this is not always the case... because also SHELL THICKNESS also changes in proportion... a 6 ply 8mm shell is THINNER if the drum is a 14" in proportion to an 8" (hence the use of single ply heads on smaller toms mentioned above).
When Pearl introduced it's REFERENCE series, it was a serious atempt to design a set of drums that would deliver that, with different shell thickness for each tom size.

What's happening to you is that the heads on your 8" tom are CANCELLING each other.

Personally, I like to have nice intervals... but the EXACTNESS of the note is NOT more important than the quality of the tone and overall character... I'd rather have a slightly higher or lower interval on one drum than sacrificing a lot of the overall sound.

The beauty of this, is that it's all subjective... any method that satisfies your wants, is the correct one.

[harryconway]

Using a 2 ply batter head is great if you want to "control" or "lessen" the sustain ond overtones, but if you want to go the other way, might want to try a single ply head on the 8". Also, tuning in 3rds is cool, but your 10" might not be co-operating just because it's "sweet spot" is no where near where you would like it to be.

[abe]

He probably means that a larger size has more of a full, airy tone to it. While that might be true, you can get the same out of a small size. I wouldn't imagine playing bebop with a 22" . For me it would have to at least be an 18". A 22" doesn't tune up as well, and it starts to sound boomy or boingy. A smaller drum is more versatile as well. My 18" I can tune up to jazz range and even lower to imitate a 20". I could even get a way with tuning down and not using a 22" with it as well.

I agree! It looks bit extreme approach from enginer

[Guillermo]

Well... I think I see his point.

When you tune REALLY high a bigger drum will project more than a small one... Tony Williams used big drums after his Lifetime period... he could always play hard... there is a great quiet solo of him on Youtube... snares off just singles.

I think that when you hear that, you'll get it.

Peter Erskine used a 22" for YEARS with great sound.

I for one like the SMALL approach on acoustic jazz... the kit I use for that is an 18"... it's my personal choice, but I see what the engineer meant.

[ermghoti]

ermghoti - do you use double-ply heads?

Yup, coated Emperors.

[Skitch]

Mapex M series 8" tom. The batter is an Aquarian 2 and the reso is a Remo Ambassador. The heads are new. I tuned the set (8, 10, 12, 14 toms) in thirds begining with the 14" at it's lowest point. I get all the toms a 3rd up except the 8" seems "odd". The batter gets to the right note but the reso has to be very loose to sustain it. It is so loose I can see it move. When I tune the reso tighter the sustain goes away and the drum sounds dead. I tried getting the reso to equal the batter as well as make it tighter to no avail. Is it tougher to get tuning right as the heads get smaller? Is it tougher to get sustain when they get smaller? I know double ply heads lowers sustain but shouldn't the sustain be proportional across the set? The other heads seem fine. (Lastly I did tighten all the heads up pretty good over the first 24hrs and use the palm push method to get the heads stretched a bit so I assume they hold tuning well now)


One of the problems faing the 8" tom owner is that th range is also in the range of the snare drum, so sympathetic frequencies are problem to be dealt with. You are probably just going to have to trial and error your way into a suitable tuning. I have used both, single and double ply heads on two different 8" toms (one maple, one birch) and they always seems to be picky. Another thing is that the diameter being so small, the 8" head takes a good beating and just loves to go out of tune rather easily. So you may need to frequently check your 8" tom's tuning more often than you think!

Mike

http://www.mikemccraw.com
http://www.dominoretroplate.com

http://www.youtube.com/drummermikemccraw
http://www.myspace.com/drummermikemccraw

[drumtechdad]

There's a good chance the engineer records rock kits day in and day out, that's what's in his ear. He may have never even heard a jazz kit/tuning before.

And yes, TW used big drums, but he usually tuned them quite high.

[simon.m]

I just bought new heads, Remo Emperor. I had trouble tuning my tom. I have read the Drum Tuning Bible, but I still have problems to get the right pitch. Maybe my resonant(bottom) heads are too old? Cause I've put a lot of time trying to tune them right. Give me a hint!

[Ironcobra]

did you have the same problems tuning your old heads?

[AveyTare]

maybe you should really exchange your reso heads.

i believe that the most vital thing in tuning drums is experience, so...

[simon.m]

When they use to be new, I wasn't tuning them right so..But trouble getting the pitch is a symptom of a head that's too old?

[Salicete]

A more likely sign that your resonant heads need to be replaced would be that you were able to tune your toms, but they quickly went out of tune.

The problem may be poorly matched batters and resos. What kind of resonant heads are your druns sporting?

[simon.m]

Remo Clear Ambassador

[maddrummr]

Size of drum??

You might also want to take the head off and inspect it, the head may be warped or the glue is not keeping the head on.

[Big_Philly]

Some people tune their heads while having both heads on. I'm not sure how you do it, but I'd take all heads off first, then begin with the batter head. Tune that to a pitch where you get a more or less consistent tone (one that does not lower or raise pitch in time). When you get that done, slap the reso head on and adjust the tension once again so that you get a consistent tone. I recently started doing in that way and it helps a lot.
I'm not sure if I have just stated something that should be really obvious.. but for me it has not been the obvious way to work for a long time.

[Rickk]

My suggestion,
assuming your top head is now adjusted , leave it alone and reach under to the reso head and adjust only one tension rod , go up then down and see if it changes the pitch of the drum, if it does then readjust the reso heads , if it doesn't replace the reso head on that tom. I have had to do this and is worth the time it takes to do it.
Rick

[drummer-sam]

i bought a DW collector's a few days ago, and i am having trouble tuning the kit.

i preffer to have the low-end tuning, but when i try and tune liek that it doesnt have any tone to it.

any suggestions??
sam

[Wavelength]

Tune 'em higher. You'll get more tone that way.

[harryconway]

Given any "specific" size and make drum, it has a range of tune. I drive a Ludwig 26x14 kick. Wonderful drum, but I don't ask it to sound like a 20x14. You have to work with and accept the tonal range your drums were designed to produce.

[Wernervonwaltsleben]

hey everyone.
this is actually a realy dumb question but yeah.i havent changed my tom skins for awhile and i finally bought a new complete set.if you tune, what is usually tuned the highest.the bottom skin or the top skin.something just sounds so false to me.

[fourstringdrums]

http://home.earthlink.net/~prof.sound/ Take a look at this for more information on tuning.

I usually tune my resonant heads one tone above the top head (think of the Jaws theme). But you can tune them lower or at the same pitch as the top head, it's all personal preference.

I don't understand what you mean by something sounds "false" to you?

[Wernervonwaltsleben]

Thanx alot for helping.
yeah, sorry for the false word.i just meant "wrong" to me or something.like i dident like the sound, sounded awful.
thanx again

[Jon Cable]

I went to school with a guy called Tom Tuning, he had a sister called Viola. Theres a great video on youtube where Nicko McBrain shows how to tune toms, well worth watching!!

[ledzepjb]

Use the search functionnnn!!!!!!! Anyways, I also tune my resonant head a tone higher than my batter.

[That Guy]

Hi Wernervonwaltsleben,

Your thread is named "Tom Tuning." Here is the "Tom Tuning" Thread ----> http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6029

Welcome to DW buddy.

[That Guy]

I don't know if you will find what your looking for in this thread ---> http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6029 But if you take your time and read through it, you might find your answer.

[maximusppl]

Okay, I ended up using my Mapex Saturn. Used Coated Studio X batters over Classic Clears on the Toms...Aquarian Superkick II on the kick with a Regulator, and the black panther maple received a evans genera hd dry over a clear ambassador....everything sounded killer in there!!! especially the kick and snare....i will post links to recordings once the mixing and mastering is done :)

[Wernervonwaltsleben]

I started tuning my toms and ive been experiencing stuff that so irritating.when tuning, must you tighen the lugs finger titened and then search for the highest sounding lug and tune every lug like that one to get the same pitch on each lug?

ive been getting this problem that one lug is always higher.the other lugs are all the same pitch but the one same lug stays higher and if i tune that one the rest tunes out.it never catches up with that lug.whats happening here?

[ZildjianMan1023]

I started tuning my toms and ive been experiencing stuff that so irritating.when tuning, must you tighen the lugs finger titened and then search for the highest sounding lug and tune every lug like that one to get the same pitch on each lug?

ive been getting this problem that one lug is always higher.the other lugs are all the same pitch but the one same lug stays higher and if i tune that one the rest tunes out.it never catches up with that lug.whats happening here?

ok ok ok, first man relax..


dont tune around each lug like (dont tune in a cirlce) this could cause uneven tunning very fast

try the star method although i think it has a proper name

this is when you criss cross your lugs..

maybe you should look into proper tuning methods..

is it the head or the shell? becaues the head might not be seated properly

hope this helps.

Dom

[ledzepjb]

Have you read the drum tuning bible? If not, google it.

[ULTIMATEDRUMMER]

Are the drumheads new?

[Wernervonwaltsleben]

Hey, yeah, the head is new.
i did the star method, i dident have this problem with the 12" tom but with my 10" tom this one lug doesent go with the other.
i seating of the head went well.if i tighten the lugs finger tightened, how many turns must i give before i must look for the high lug to tune the rest to.

[elpol]

i might have missed this, but what type of sound are you looking for?

[sio_13]

Hey, yeah, the head is new.
i did the star method, i dident have this problem with the 12" tom but with my 10" tom this one lug doesent go with the other.
i seating of the head went well.if i tighten the lugs finger tightened, how many turns must i give before i must look for the high lug to tune the rest to.

For a 10" tom, I'd give it 2-3 full turns, but when after I seat the head I dont necessarily finger-"tighten" the lugs, I just turn them till they barely touch the rim all around, then apply pressure with two hands across the drum using the star method- by that I mean I simultaneously press both of my hands down on the rim directly across from eachother, then work around the drum. Then I check the lugs again and if all of them are barely touching the rim, then the head is well-balanced and ready for tuning. Give each lug 2 full turns and check the pitch, if a higher sound is needed then continue giving full (or even half) turns, then look for the high lug. Sorry if I did nothing more than confuse you- this way always worked easier for me.

Oh yeah, and do a search for threads on tuning on this site, there are many that might already have your answer.

[Wernervonwaltsleben]

I did everything the tuning bible said, tighten the lugs finger tightened.backed off 1/4 turn.then half turns till i get a distortion free tone and when i start looking for the pitch.theres this one lug thats higher, so i tune the rest of the lugs to that one but it never catches up, as soon as i turn one of the other lugs, the higher one gets more higher and higher and the other never catches up.i completely removed the higher lug, like before finger titened and it still has a higher pitch.how do u explain something like that.is there problem with the drum or skin?

[ULTIMATEDRUMMER]

ummm this seems to be untrue bro

u probabaly got the pitches mixed up listen very closly in a silenenced room

otherwise i can only say it a damaged head...

but i dout it.

[Victor_se]

i know, its al about personal preference and all that thing but

wich one is the best way to tune a tom and what are the diferences

if i tune the botton higher thatn top, viceversa, equal...

cheerz

[Rickk]

loosen the top head completely, tune the bottom head about medium not too loose or tight, then when its in tune start with the top until it sounds the way you want it.
Bottom tighter. Learned this from Roy Burns of Aquarian and it's been working perfectly.

Rick

[konaboy]

Here's a great example of what changing the pitch of the bottom head will do, also on how to tune in general.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pH_RoUQyv5A

[d-roc]

Wernervonwaltsleben said, "theres this one lug thats higher, so i tune the rest of the lugs to that one but it never catches up, as soon as i turn one of the other lugs, the higher one gets more higher and higher and the other never catches up."
There are a lot factors that can complicate tuning drum heads. If you have one lug that is higher pitched and just keeps going higher as you tune, then lower it. The trick to lowering the lug tension is to always loosen and then tighten. Never just loosen the tension. This will keep the tension on the head and allow you to hear the tone better. Also try different tension on the lugs beside the one that keeps getting higher. This may lower the head in that area and allow for more even tension on the head. You will know when you get good even tension because the head will "sing".

[NIMBY]

I'm not 100% certain about this, but I believe the true pitch means that the lugs have more threads to them, thus more precise tuning can be achieved.


you are infact 100% correct

[Saleen]

I just change my head on my pearl vision kit, i finally put g2 clear on top and g1 clear on the reso. I spend a lot of time to try to have the best tune possible. Im farly ok for the batter side because i can hear if i love the sound or not but for the reso how i know if im ok because i saw a lot of video on you tube of people who tuning drum but when they ajust the reso side the entire sound of the tom change. What is a average tune that most people use for the reso to be sure that if i tune the batter side i will obtain the best sound possible without thinking all the time to the reso side

Help me

Thanx

[cdrums21]

You can start by tuning the resonant head of the drum to the same pitch as the top head. Mount the tom, play it and see how it sounds. If it sounds good to you, you're there. If it has too much sustain or seems a bit floppy, tune the resonant head up a bit and play it again. You may need to tweak the top head as well to get the drums to sound good as a whole or to reduce snare buzz if you happen to get any. Make sure the pitch at each lug is the same. Good luck!

[Elvis]

Say, since this is the "Tom Tuning Thread", I thought I'd go ahead and post this in here.
It's been posted over at the "Snare Tuning" thread for a couple of years now, but I feel it applies here as well.



Here's my step-by-step tutorial on how to change out and tune up a drum head.
It's kinda long, so get comfy.
Read it all first, THEN do it (refer back, if you need to).



There's a few ways to "break in" a new head.
Over the years, I've tried various methods.
The way I'm about to describe has worked very well for me and is a much faster way of "breaking in" a head than most others:

1) Remove the old head.

2) Take a piece of cloth (old T-shirt works well) and give a quick wipe to the bearing edge, the underside of the collar and the glue ring of the new head and the underside of the hoop.

3) Place the new head on the drum and spin it on the shell.
Make sure it fits on and spins easily.
If not, return the head and get another.
If it does, continue...

4) Place the hoop in the head, insert the tension rods, tighten all rods finger tight (I like to use both hands, turning the 2 rods that are on the exact opposite sides of each other at the same time).

5) Take your tuning key and start applying tension to the head by turning the tension rods.
Use a STAR PATTERN to tension the head, so that it torques down evenly.
If you're drum is a 6 lug drum, look at the end of the drum you're working on and situate the lugs so that you have one lug looking right at you and the one opposite is looking straight away from you.
If you play "connect the dots" with the other 4 lugs, it should make a "box" shape.

6) Now imagine the face of a clock superimposed over the drum, with the number 12 being the lug looking away from you and the number 6 being the lug looking straight at you.
The rest of the numbers on the imaginary clock will be fairly close to the following lug positions;
The lug in the upper right hand side will be "2", the lug in the lower right hand side will be "4", the lug on the lower left hand side will be "8" and the lug on the upper left hand side will be "10".

7) Tighten the head down in 2 steps, or "patterns".
The first one will be:
12,6,2,8,4,10.
The second one will be:
6,12,4,10,2,8.
Repeat these patterns, in the order I just laid out, placing one complete 360 degree revolution on each rod (which I call "a turn") the first time around, then use 180 degree revolutions (which I call a "1/2 turn") there after, until you've put 3 turns on each of the tension rods.

8) At this point, the head is evenly tensioned and fairly taught.
You may have heard some cracking or "popping" at this point, and that's fine.
Place the drum on the floor with the head you're working on looking up.
Now, place the heel of one of your hands in the center of the head and give one very hard, sharp, quick push.
DON'T BE A WIMP HERE! PUT YOUR WEIGHT INTO IT!
You may have heard more cracking at this point or you may not hear more cracking at this point.
Either is fine.

9) Now pick the drum off the floor and place it on a soft surface with the end you're working on looking up.
That old T-shirt (folded) you used to wipe the drum off with in the beginning would work fine.
If your bed has a comforter on it, that would be perfect.
The soft surface will completely muffle the other head so that you only hear the head you are tuning, which brings us to...

10) Remove all of the tension from the head you're working on.
Use the star patterns I laid out in step #7, until you feel the tension on the rods get pretty slack.
By that time, you probably won't need to use the key anymore.
Keep loosening the tension until the rods are no longer tensioning the head (look for an obvious gap between the head of the rod and the hoop).

11) Start tightening down on the head again with the rods, using the star patterns I showed in step #7.
This time, you will tension the head to whatever setting gives you the sound you're looking for.
Once you start to feel a little tension on the head, start tapping it in the middle after completing each star pattern, to see if the head is tensioned where you want it.

12) Once you reach that point, stop tightening and tap on the head at each point that corressponds with a tension rod, about 1/4" in from the edge.
You can use a stick or your finger, it really doesn't matter.

13) Tap each point once and listen to the drum.

14) If you hear a nice, even sound that is the same pitch at all the points, you're finished tuning this head and you may skip to step # 21.
That head is now tuned to where you want it to be and it should hold that tuning for as long as you want it to.

15) If you hear a "wobbly" or "uneven" sound coming from some of those points, then the head is not tensioned evenly.
The sound you're hearing is known as distortion and is caused by the head creating several dissonant frequencies at once, due to the fact that it's seeing different tension in different spots of the head.
Dissonant frequencies are ones that do not harmonize with each other, thus resulting in the distorted sound you hear.

16) At this point, you'll need to "fine tune" the head.

17) Check around the head and see if that distorted sound isn't more prevelent at certain points more than others.
If so, try correcting those first.

18) Correct by tightening that tension rod, slightly.
Tap on the head once, at that tension rod, and tighten the rod as the sound decays.
You shouldn't have to turn the rod more than 1/4 of turn at a time.
If you do, then stop and tap the head at the rod that is on the exact opposite side of the drum and see if you don't hear the distorted sound coming from that one.
If so, do the same thing until the sound "evens out".

19) Tap around the head again and see if the distortion is still heard.

20) If so, do the same procedure at each of those rods as well.

21) Once you have everything sounding nice and "even", pick the drum up and hold it in your hand BY THE TOM BRACKET. NEVER HOLD IT BY THE RIM.
The combination of the weight of the drum, your grip and the thickness of the hoop may be enough to throw the head "out of tune" at this point, if the drum is held by its rim.

22) Hit the middle of the drum while holding it up.

23) If it sounds "good", you're done.
If you still get that distortion, set the drum back down on the soft surface it was on and tap around the head again to see if you didn't miss anything.

24) If it sounds good, flip the drum over and tap around the edge of the other head.
Chances are it may have been out of tune and you didn't realize it until now.

25) If the distortion is heard with either head, correct those problems and perform step #22 again.

26) If you STILL get that distorted sound go back and perform steps 23-25 and check the heads again.
If everything sounds good on it's own, then your heads are "out of phase" with each other (i.e., each head is tuned to a frequency that is dissonant to the other).
At this point, you'll have to pick one of those heads and retune it to a different pitch that will put the heads back "into phase".
Remember, the batter head sets the tone of the drum, the resonant head sets the amount of resonance of the drum.
The change will most likely not have to be that drastic and the sound of your drum may not change all that much.

27) Make the correction, perform step # 22 and see how the drum sounds.


...If everything sounds good, NOW you're done!

Chances are very good that you will NOT have to perform all 27 steps.
I just wanted to cover some basic problems you might encounter while trying to tune up the drum.

One of the most important points in tuning a drum, that most drummers overlook, is the "cracking" procedure.
You MUST find a way to form that head to the bearing edge, and stress the glue that may be holding the head material to the glue ring, or else you will stand a very good chance of encountering (unneccessary) problems with getting the head tuned up.
You can crank up the tension and leave it sit for a week, or use a hair dryer on it, or simply push down on the center of the head (like I do!).
Any of these procedures will form the head to the bearing edge (leaving it sit for a week works the worst, trust me on this one!).


Hope you found this helpful.



Elvis

[Elvis]

...and why aren't this and the "Snare Tuning Thread", sticky's?
Seems like they should be.


Elvis

[osso12]

exactly.
If you tune by ear like most of us,
for the most part your resonant will be a 'tad" tighter (not looser than I had originally wrote) than the batter.
Its all trial and error though. What I like to do is take the drum away from the kit.
Even go out doors with it. Get the fundamental pitch of the drum by striking the bearing edge with a stick without any heads at all on it. Get the drum sounding good out doors, then go back inside and see if it still sounds good. If it does, your in luck. Mount the drum to make sure it still sounds good with the kit.
If its a high end kit, more than likely it will. If its a low end kit, you might need to still tweek on it just a bit, and thats ok. Trust no one's ears but your own.
:)

[Wavelength]

Read this: http://home.earthlink.net/~prof.sound/index.html

I usually tune the resonant heads a perfect fourth higher than the batter -- never lower than the batter.

[mikei]

Read this: http://home.earthlink.net/~prof.sound/index.html

I usually tune the resonant heads a perfect fourth higher than the batter -- never lower than the batter.

What would be considered a perfect fourth???

Do you have an example?

Thanks

[Wavelength]

What would be considered a perfect fourth???

Do you have an example?

Thanks

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interval_%28music%29

A perfect fourth is a musical interval which can be heard in the two first notes of "Here comes the bride", for example.

[osso12]

Read this: http://home.earthlink.net/~prof.sound/index.html

I usually tune the resonant heads a perfect fourth higher than the batter -- never lower than the batter.

Yeah, thanks for helping me realize my mistake. It will always be tighter, not loser than the batter.. ususally anyway.. My bad..
Making it tighter will allow more "bounce" as well.

[bodinski]

Lots of good advice here, everyone.

Just to confuse things, here's my simple method (which assumes you already know the basics of seating heads & the importance of even tension around a head).

Firstly, take your time, relax & pick a time when the room is quiet so you can hear clearly.

I tune the reso first to get the overall pitch of the drum, and then adjust the batter for feel, nuance, or character. Once the reso (when struck) makes the pitch you'd like the drum to have, work the batter tension up very slowly & evenly, starting at finger tight. Play the drum after every adjustment and listen closely. Your ears will tell you what to do. This can be a very frustrating process, but it's very rewarding once you get the drums dialed in.

Do download & study Professor Sound's Drum tuning Bible.

Peace - Jeff

[GRUNTERSDAD]

I have to be reading this wrong:

Get the fundamental pitch of the drum by striking the bearing edge with a stick without any heads at all on it.

Do you really want to strike your bearing edges with a stick???

[fourstringdrums]

I have to be reading this wrong:

Get the fundamental pitch of the drum by striking the bearing edge with a stick without any heads at all on it.

Do you really want to strike your bearing edges with a stick???

That's what I read too. Yikes, no! You NEVER want to strike your bearing edge with anything.

The proper way is to take the heads off and hold the drum by a lug lightly. With a soft mallet or your fist, strike the side of the drum lightly to get the fundamental pitch of the shell.

Personally I don't go through all that trouble. I usually tune my top and bottom heads so they have the same pitch interval between them the theme from Jaws (I forget what that is...a whole step?) I tension my resonant heads until they have a clear resonant pitch first in the area of where I want the pitch of the drum to be within this pitch interval. Then I tension the top head accordingly.

[jking]

I have to be reading this wrong:

Get the fundamental pitch of the drum by striking the bearing edge with a stick without any heads at all on it.

Do you really want to strike your bearing edges with a stick???


That's what I read too. Yikes, no! You NEVER want to strike your bearing edge with anything.

The proper way is to take the heads off and hold the drum by a lug lightly. With a soft mallet or your fist, strike the side of the drum lightly to get the fundamental pitch of the shell.

Personally I don't go through all that trouble. I usually tune my top and bottom heads so they have the same pitch interval between them the theme from Jaws (I forget what that is...a whole step?) I tension my resonant heads until they have a clear resonant pitch first in the area of where I want the pitch of the drum to be within this pitch interval. Then I tension the top head accordingly.


I'll third that. Don't strike your bearing edge.

I also don't think it's worth the trouble to find the fundamental pitch of the shell. You'd need a pitch pipe or something so you can match the pitch. Then you have to write it down until you get the heads on. You still will have to adjust all the drums in relation to each other. Seems like it's simpler to just tune each drum so they sound good & then adjust from there. I suppose if you have trouble finding a good place to start, then go with it.

[drumpy]

Howzit all my fellow drummers out there.

I have a bit a problem, or it feels like a problem. I have three drum kits. One standard size kit ( DB percussion), One fusion size 10, 12, 14 and 20 x 16.5 kick (Gretsch) and the other kit 10, 12, 16 and 22 x 18 kick (DDrum Kit). My problem is that I have no issues tuning either of the kits except the 14 x 12 tom of the Gretsch kit. For some or other reason I struggle to get a good quality sound from the tom. I have changed heads ( by the way I use Evans G2 Clear on all my toms) but it just does not help, I even have the Tam tuning dial , but no good results. The problem is I played on various kits that has the 14" tom and they always sound great.

Could it be my tom? or is it the lack of tuning knowledge? Does any-one have the same problem?

[Wavelength]

My problem is that I have no issues tuning either of the kits except the 14 x 12 tom of the Gretsch kit. For some or other reason I struggle to get a good quality sound from the tom.

What is the sound you are looking for? Are the heads in tune with themselves? How are the heads tuned in relation to one another? Different drums have different tuning ranges, and some might work best with a certain type of pitch relation between the heads. For instance, my drums sound best when I tune the resonant heads a perfect fourth above the batter heads, while some other drums sound best when both heads are tuned to the same pitch.

[drumpy]

The sound I am looking for is a fairly solid but resonant sound. On all my toms I usually tune my bottom heads a half turn tighter than the top head. It works well on all the toms , but the 14" has a personality of its own.

[drumpy]

thanks man, got it . . . . I will print it and study it . . . . happy drumming

[Elvis]

Sounds to me like it may be a quirk of those particular heads and/or that particular drum.
You sound like you're competent with your tuning abilities.
I'd check it against another drum of same make/model/size/heads and see if that's not whats going on here.

But go ahead and see what the Drum Tuning Bible says (I assume that's what you're "studying").
Prof. put lots o' good info in there.



Elvis

[m1ck]

... My point is, try tuning the bottom heads of your toms a minor third higher on the bottom. It helps to control the amount of sustain, has a pitch relationship with the top head so you don’t have dissonance between the two heads, and gives the drum some life. Now, to reduce more unwanted overtones, you should get the drums in tune with themselves. If you have 2 inch differences between your toms (i.e. 10,12,14,16) your drums will probably lend themselves to be tuned a major third (four notes) or a fourth (five notes) apart. If your toms are not 2 inches apart and configured differently, go with an interval that’s appropriate. For instance if you have 12” and 13” toms, you may want to tune them a minor third apart. If your drums are say 10”,13” and 16” like mine, try tuning in fifths.

For the record, here are the tom sizes on my kit, the heads I use and how I tune them. If nothing else, it can be a point of reference, but every drummer that has played my kit, even some famous players, have loved the way they felt and sounded.
Yamaha Maple Custom Absolute Nouveau
10x7.5 tom
13x9 tom
16x14 tom
Heads are usually coated or clear ambassadors, sometimes coated or clear emperors.
NO MUFFLING!!!
The 10” tom has the top head tuned to a “B” and the bottom head a minor third higher to a “D”. The 13” tom has the top head tuned to an “F” and the bottom head a minor third higher to a “G#”. The 16” floor tom has the top head tuned to a “B” and the bottom head a minor third higher to a “D”. They sound and feel great, no overtones or snare buzz. Please post some comments if you try this technique, or if you just want to say stuff about it. Good luck and happy tuning!!

I'm new here and this thread is old, so I don't even know if cd21 is still around anymore...

But what I want to know is this: when you speak of tuning a head to a certain note, are you listening to the dominant tone when you finger-tap by each lug? Or when you strike the head with a stick? I've been experimenting with this. I have a tom sitting on a blanket-covered table, so the reso (for example) is on the bottom and totally dead. The batter is in tune, meaning equal head tension at each lug. If I tap it by the lugs - either with a stick or my finger - I get a certain dominant pitch that can be associated with a note a keyboard. If I strike the drum with a stick in the center of the head, while it's in that same position, I get a dominant pitch that is not identical to the former.

When you say you've got your 10" tom tuned to a B, is it the lug-tap or an open stroke that's a B?

[jay norem]

I probably don't have any business posting here since I'm guessing that you guys are all rock drummers and I'm rather an old guy. But what I do, once the new heads are well placed and stretched on the shells, is to first adjust the tension on the batter head to suit the way I play. I rely on a decent amount of "bounce," so I adjust the tension to give me just the feel I'm looking for. Then I adjust the tension on the bottom head for pitch, and there isn't a great deal a variance there. A good drum will always sound good if you get your heads vibrating correctly.
As far as pitch is concerned, that's not all that important to me. A good drum will "sound" at its natural resonant capacity. If you try to make it too high or too low then you're wasting a good drum.
Look at it like this: you wouldn't want your drum to feel like you're playing on a table, nor would you want it to feel like you're playing on a mattress. You want it to feel like you're playing on a drum, and you want the drum to sound as good as it's made to sound. Head tension is very important, but pitch is rather beside the point as long as you have a well made drum.

[Wavelength]

Head tension is very important, but pitch is rather beside the point as long as you have a well made drum.

The heads' tunings also affect the drum's timbre. With different intervals between the heads one can tune a drum into many different timbres while keeping one pitch. For me, timbre comes first, pitch second and playing feel (=rebound) third..

[Elvis]

I probably don't have any business posting here since I'm guessing that you guys are all rock drummers and I'm rather an old guy. But what I do, once the new heads are well placed and stretched on the shells, is to first adjust the tension on the batter head to suit the way I play. I rely on a decent amount of "bounce," so I adjust the tension to give me just the feel I'm looking for. Then I adjust the tension on the bottom head for pitch, and there isn't a great deal a variance there. A good drum will always sound good if you get your heads vibrating correctly.
As far as pitch is concerned, that's not all that important to me. A good drum will "sound" at its natural resonant capacity. If you try to make it too high or too low then you're wasting a good drum.
Look at it like this: you wouldn't want your drum to feel like you're playing on a table, nor would you want it to feel like you're playing on a mattress. You want it to feel like you're playing on a drum, and you want the drum to sound as good as it's made to sound. Head tension is very important, but pitch is rather beside the point as long as you have a well made drum.
Jay,

Just a quick note to say thank you for posting that.
I couldn't agree more and its exactly what I look for when tuning my drums.
It's nice to hear from someone who actually wants their drums to sound like a drum.



Elvis

[jay norem]

Jay,

Just a quick note to say thank you for posting that.
I couldn't agree more and its exactly what I look for when tuning my drums.
It's nice to hear from someone who actually wants their drums to sound like a drum.



Elvis

Why you're very welcome Elvis. "Great minds think alike" and all that.
Nothing sounds sweeter than a drum that's allowed to sing with its own unique voice.

[m1ck]

Technical obsession blinds us to the magic, doesn't it.

[h3r3tic]

How's it going people?

I've been wondering about some tunning possibilities on drumset... So my biggest question is how to make the drumheads on the toms more muffled without using rings or mufflers... I've learned hot to tune my drumset after beeing at a drumworkshop with an EXCELENT portuguese drummer called Hugo Danin (who studied at the drummer's collective) but the thing that I can't remember from his workshop was hot to make the toms sound "good" without using rings or mufflers....

So should I loosen up my reso heads? like should they be lower or at the same "pitch" as my batter head?

I have them currently tunned a little higher than my batter side and they give the "sound" I want, but not the resonnace I want (I think that's how you say it)...

So any suggestions?

[mind_drummer]

Reso tune lower will reduce the pitch and resonance little bit.

Take a tom and experiment, you will learn by yourself and there's nothing better.

[h3r3tic]

Reso tune lower will reduce the pitch and resonance little bit.

Take a tom and experiment, you will learn by yourself and there's nothing better.


thanks bro! ;) i'll do that

[DamoSyzygy]

I probably don't have any business posting here since I'm guessing that you guys are all rock drummers and I'm rather an old guy. But what I do, once the new heads are well placed and stretched on the shells, is to first adjust the tension on the batter head to suit the way I play. I rely on a decent amount of "bounce," so I adjust the tension to give me just the feel I'm looking for. Then I adjust the tension on the bottom head for pitch, and there isn't a great deal a variance there. A good drum will always sound good if you get your heads vibrating correctly.
As far as pitch is concerned, that's not all that important to me. A good drum will "sound" at its natural resonant capacity. If you try to make it too high or too low then you're wasting a good drum.
Look at it like this: you wouldn't want your drum to feel like you're playing on a table, nor would you want it to feel like you're playing on a mattress. You want it to feel like you're playing on a drum, and you want the drum to sound as good as it's made to sound. Head tension is very important, but pitch is rather beside the point as long as you have a well made drum.
Perfect! I couldnt agree more

[skinner]

I consider myself to be a fairly capable drum tuner. I can get a sound that I am pleased with from my toms (fusion sizes 10,12,14,16). The problem is that when I get my drums tuned to the place where they sound good, the heads are much looser than I would like. I prefer my heads to be really tight. For me it just feels better and I feel like I have much more articulation.

Most drum tuning experts recommend not tuning your toms too tight. Many say to tune just past where the wrinkles are gone. But I just really love to have my heads tight. What can I do ? Are there any certain sizes or shell materials that tend to sound better when tuned really tight ? Does anyone else have this issue ?

[Elvis]

I consider myself to be a fairly capable drum tuner. I can get a sound that I am pleased with from my toms (fusion sizes 10,12,14,16). The problem is that when I get my drums tuned to the place where they sound good, the heads are much looser than I would like. I prefer my heads to be really tight. For me it just feels better and I feel like I have much more articulation.

Most drum tuning experts recommend not tuning your toms too tight. Many say to tune just past where the wrinkles are gone. But I just really love to have my heads tight. What can I do ? Are there any certain sizes or shell materials that tend to sound better when tuned really tight ? Does anyone else have this issue ?
There's two things you can do:

1) Get bigger drums. The larger drums will naturally want to speak at a lower pitch. You'll have to tension the heads tighter in order to enjoy the "sound" you like now.
Don't go too big, either, as there is a range in which any size tom will speak in. You want some overlap between what you have now and the larger size.
Maybe just one "size" up (12,13,16,18).

2) Use a thinner resonant side head. Thin bottom heads give off a darker and more resonant sound. They also seem to lower the pitch a little, thus (just like with the larger toms) you'll need to pull the batter side head up a little tighter to enjoy the pitch that you like.
The sound with a thin bottom head will always be darker and more resonant (more "tympani-like" if you will) compared to a medium weight head or thicker, but you can "balance" that out by pulling the batter side up to higher pitch.


Of the two, I'd say # 2 is the cheaper fix and if you like the sizes you're playing with now, its kinda the only choice.
If you're thinking about another kit, or just don't care, then a combination of both suggestions should give you what you're looking for.

Other than that, the only other thing I can think of is to replace the batter side heads with DOTTED heads.
You don't have to pull them as tight, but playing on the dot will give the drum a more "solid" feel and you might enjoy the same rebound you do with your current heads.




Elvis

[Elvis]

Most drum tuning experts recommend not tuning your toms too tight. Many say to tune just past where the wrinkles are gone.
Oh yeah and I do have an issue with the above statement.
That's so much BS and I'm sick of hearing about it.
That's a Rock Drummer's perspective and people have been playing Rock for too long.
A tom has a range of pitches that it can speak in. One should know how to work with that range and then find a spot they prefer, or use their knowledge to fit the gig.

http://brandsoftheworld.com/brands/0015/5755/brand.gif
..."just past the wrinkles". OOOOOOO!!!!!






Elvis

[cdrums21]

I probably don't have any business posting here since I'm guessing that you guys are all rock drummers and I'm rather an old guy. But what I do, once the new heads are well placed and stretched on the shells, is to first adjust the tension on the batter head to suit the way I play. I rely on a decent amount of "bounce," so I adjust the tension to give me just the feel I'm looking for. Then I adjust the tension on the bottom head for pitch, and there isn't a great deal a variance there. A good drum will always sound good if you get your heads vibrating correctly.
As far as pitch is concerned, that's not all that important to me. A good drum will "sound" at its natural resonant capacity. If you try to make it too high or too low then you're wasting a good drum.
Look at it like this: you wouldn't want your drum to feel like you're playing on a table, nor would you want it to feel like you're playing on a mattress. You want it to feel like you're playing on a drum, and you want the drum to sound as good as it's made to sound. Head tension is very important, but pitch is rather beside the point as long as you have a well made drum.

Although I respect your opinion, I must disagree with the pitch not being important statement. I agree with your point that the drum has to feel good and have the proper tension. That is absolutley correct. But, there is more to it than that in my opinion to truly get the toms to sound musical as a whole. Just as two keys on a piano struck together don't always sound good, some do and some don't, the point is that there is a pitch relationship that can be achieved between the toms and within the parameters of the tension and feel of the drum being right, to make the toms sound better as a whole. Having a correct pitch relationship helps to reduce unwanted overtones and allows the drums to compliment each other when played together or in a pattern. It is a technique used by many drummers (Gavin Harrison gives a detailed example of this tuning on his kit in his posts here on Drummerworld) it's practical, makes sense and truly does make a diffence.

[skinner]

Thanks for the suggestions Elvis. I'll give #2 a try.

[GRUNTERSDAD]

Although I respect your opinion, I must disagree with the pitch not being important statement. I agree with your point that the drum has to feel good and have the proper tension. That is absolutley correct. But, there is more to it than that in my opinion to truly get the toms to sound musical as a whole. Just as two keys on a piano struck together don't always sound good, some do and some don't, the point is that there is a pitch relationship that can be achieved between the toms and within the parameters of the tension and feel of the drum being right, to make the toms sound better as a whole. Having a correct pitch relationship helps to reduce unwanted overtones and allows the drums to compliment each other when played together or in a pattern. It is a technique used by many drummers (Gavin Harrison gives a detailed example of this tuning on his kit in his posts here on Drummerworld) it's practical, makes sense and truly does make a diffence.

Agreed CDrums. There is a lot of space between a drum feeling like a table and feeling like a mattress. My drums are tuned to no specific pitch, that I aim for, but they are tuned to each other. ALL FOUR of them.

[mind_drummer]

...

2) Use a thinner resonant side head. Thin bottom heads give off a darker and more resonant sound. They also seem to lower the pitch a little, thus (just like with the larger toms) you'll need to pull the batter side head up a little tighter to enjoy the pitch that you like.
The sound with a thin bottom head will always be darker and more resonant (more "tympani-like" if you will) compared to a medium weight head or thicker, but you can "balance" that out by pulling the batter side up to higher pitch.


Elvis

I thought too that thinner reso would resonate more until I saw the Bob Gatzen "forgotten head" video.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=P2ibBol23hs

Watch and conclude by yourself

[GRUNTERSDAD]

I think the terms he uses are "less mass, less resonance." There is simply less material to resonate.

[m1ck]

It took some time - basically all day - but I think I finally got a grip on CD's tuning method. I must admit, the kit sounds good - round and punchy with a nice, natural interval between toms.

At first I tried matching the pitch to a keyboard, by ear, but that wore me out. My ears started playing tricks on me. I resorted to an acoustic guitar tuner, WHICH, as it turns out, was not only useful but taught me a lesson about tuning and what to listen for. This entire experiment was educational.

I tuned the 10" batter to a B, and the 12" and 14" batters down a major 3rd each. The resos are all up a minor third from the respective batters. The tension on the heads for that range of pitches seems to be what the shells want: between 70-75 on the DrumDial.

The 10" tom still rattles the snare - hence the next technical obsession begins.

[jay norem]

But any well made drum will have a natural resonant frequency that can only be fully exploited by the proper tensioning of the heads, both heads. The two must work together. Looking at it this way you can see that both heads are actually "resonant" heads.
A drum is one vibrating system. All the components in that system have to work together for the whole to achieve its full resonant and tonal potential. No magic, just physics. Very simple.

[Elvis]

I thought too that thinner reso would resonate more until I saw the Bob Gatzen "forgotten head" video.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=P2ibBol23hs

Watch and conclude by yourself
I think the terms he uses are "less mass, less resonance." There is simply less material to resonate.
Sorry guys, I think I didn't make my point clear enough.
When I stated that a thin weight bottom head would give off a darker and more resonant sound, I meant its impact on the sound of the drum, as a whole.

Your statements are absolutely correct (as are Bob's). I just didn't convey my point clearly enough.

Again, sorry about that and I am in complete agreement with you guys.






Elvis

[Elvis]

But any well made drum will have a natural resonant frequency that can only be fully exploited by the proper tensioning of the heads, both heads. The two must work together. Looking at it this way you can see that both heads are actually "resonant" heads.
A drum is one vibrating system. All the components in that system have to work together for the whole to achieve its full resonant and tonal potential. No magic, just physics. Very simple.
"Resonant Head", "Batter Head", "Snare Side Head", Bass Drum Head"...these are all technical terms to convey the purpose and/or the POSITION of the head, when its placed on the drum.
It has nothing to do with how resonant the head is or isn't.




Elvis

[sssssssss]

I just got my beautiful new Mapex M Birch Cherry Red kit (22", 14", 8", 10", 12", 14"). Nice drumset, really (not only for the price!). I got a nice sound for the bass drum, snare, 8" tom and 10" tom, but I'm not completely satisfied with the 12" & 14" toms. They're inherently OK, but I can't seem to get a really clean sound out of them. Any tips or tricks that you use to do that? How do you obtain your clean sound from 12" & 14" toms?

[Doug Masters]

Are you using the stock heads? If so, I'd start by putting quality heads on top and bottom. While doing that carefully inspect the bearing edges. Make sure they are smooth with no nicks or dings. If they are not perfect, return the kit. Good luck.

[Wavelength]

You need to figure out the tuning range of your drum and the tuning ranges of the heads you're using. Tune each head into an even tuning within its optimal tuning range, and you shouldn't get any funny overtones. Also experiment with different pitch invervals between the batter and resonant heads -- usually I tune the resonant head a tad higher than the batter in order to further diminsh the overtones emanating from the resonant head.

[Guillermo]

OK... there's a couple of things here.

FIrst off, JUST DIAMETER should not be considered... the size of a drum is it's ACOUSTIC CHAMBER... for example I use a 10" and a 12"... but they're both 8" deep... and my floor tom is 14"x14" this setup was custom made that way.

If in your case the drums are 6"x8" it's very different than a 8"x8" and so on.

So after you consider THAT, you should then figure out what INTERVALS you want between toms...

REMEMBER the drumset is an instrument COMPRISED of instruments... it's like a small ensemble, in which all sounds combine in harmony... sometimes a drummer gets a tone they want from a tuning on ONE tom that DOES NOT MATCH the other toms sizes WITH THE INTERVALS you are going for.

I'd say, start WITH the 14", then the 12"... and BUILD UP instead of build down the tuning.

A good starting point is MEDIUM tension and both heads equal.. and move on from there.

A good tip id to tap the shell WITH A MALLET or your finger and catch the inherent tone of the shell... quality drumsets are tone MATCHED... sometimes you get a drum with a fundamental tone that's higher or lower than what you want to tune it so start with the fundamentals and correct from there... maybe the 10" will not be EXACTLY where you wanted, but you will have a HARMONIOUS drum sound.

AND THEN TINKER... you need to do that to KNOW your drums... each drum is different... if you want to have good tone for each drum and a similar resonance and sustain, you may need to tweak the tuning... ont reso head could be higher than the batter on one drum... another could be equal on both heads, but with a lower tension... stuff like that... get to know your drums, it takes time and patience, but once you do it's like a whole world opening up.. you can sopund anyway you want... it's better to deal with this in principle, instead of just slapping some heads and muffling that will give the tone for you, instead of the shell.

[zzdrummer]

Also experiment with different pitch invervals between the batter and resonant heads -- usually I tune the resonant head a tad higher than the batter in order to further diminsh the overtones emanating from the resonant head.

I'm getting new heads soon and I really haven't expiramented much with reso tuning. Anyone else have any suggestions? That's the most common I've heard and I think I'm going to go with that. It would be no use trying now because my stock Gretsch batters are pretty crappy and it would useless toying with the reso's.

[zzdrummer]

I probably don't have any business posting here since I'm guessing that you guys are all rock drummers and I'm rather an old guy. But what I do, once the new heads are well placed and stretched on the shells, is to first adjust the tension on the batter head to suit the way I play. I rely on a decent amount of "bounce," so I adjust the tension to give me just the feel I'm looking for. Then I adjust the tension on the bottom head for pitch, and there isn't a great deal a variance there. A good drum will always sound good if you get your heads vibrating correctly.
As far as pitch is concerned, that's not all that important to me. A good drum will "sound" at its natural resonant capacity. If you try to make it too high or too low then you're wasting a good drum.
Look at it like this: you wouldn't want your drum to feel like you're playing on a table, nor would you want it to feel like you're playing on a mattress. You want it to feel like you're playing on a drum, and you want the drum to sound as good as it's made to sound. Head tension is very important, but pitch is rather beside the point as long as you have a well made drum.

Dang man, never thought of it like that. That's genius because I too like the feel playing on tight toms but don't so much like the sound of the point where I can get some good rebound on my kit. Will definitley keep that in mind.

[drumdruid]

Hi folks,

Ok its not writen in stone but to heres how I do it , as a pro drum tech my work reputation relies on tuning so here you go...

Resonant heads first as this is where the tone comes from - Baater heads 2nd as thins where the attack comes from

Take the batter heads off
Turn all the toms resonant head up and place them on a piece of carpet
tune the bottom heads so they cascade with an even tone ( internation is everything if you want them to sit musicaly in a band situation)
Now hang the toms and start on the batter heads , decide if you want a rise in tone after the strike or a falling tone - batter head lower in pitch and the tone will fall - batter head higher in pitch and the tone will rise.
If the batter heads are properly seated it should only take a turn or 2 of the drum key before they start to work .
You may need a small piece of gaffer tape or moongel to control overtone or ring depending on the make of drum / wood type / head type

Only my oppinion

- Remo Heads are like cheap tyres - they work everywhere but need constant correction after an hour or 2 of playing - will last for years

Evans heads are just a pain in the Arse to get right

Aquarian heads are the Rolls Royce , only ever needs a little tweak , sound very musical and will last if your a good player - Not good for metal punk ect

[Wavelength]

- Remo Heads are like cheap tyres - they work everywhere but need constant correction after an hour or 2 of playing - will last for years

I've never had such experiences with Remo heads. I can dial in the tuning I want and it will stay right there -- unless I'm constantly hitting loud rim shots on a loosely tuned drum.

[drumdruid]

I think it depends on the kit , and its only a general observation as actualy I also rarely have had problems with snare drums only with toms . I have founs that a lot of remo heads need to have the folds where the skin is fixed in the hoop `cracked`out properly before you seat them. climate is also an issue over here , moving from warm rehearsal room to cold transport , where as the aquarians are constant.

[Big_Philly]

decide if you want a rise in tone after the strike or a falling tone - batter head lower in pitch and the tone will fall - batter head higher in pitch and the tone will rise.


I'll see if that is correct as soon as I can; I have had some tuning issues with my 14" tom, I can't get the low rumble I want out of it (I used to be able to) without a very unwanted downward pitch bend. The resonant head might be out of shape somehow but it appears to be fine.
I don't want any pitch bending in my toms, just a clean tone... I can get that from every drum just how I want it except from the 14x11" one, unless I tune it to a higher pitch (that I don't like). Very frustrating. If anyone has any helpful ideas on this that would be great. Batter head is fine, reso head is a stock tama batter head, quite similar to a clear ambassador.

[drumdruid]

14x11 shouldnt be tricky .. what did you do last time ? did you replace all the heads and then find the problem? Maybe take the pitch up a tick on the higher toms or space the tuning out a bit more.... often a problem between 14 floor and the reso head of the 16..
great looking kit , what did you make the octobans from?
Simon

[shepfu1]

i don't know how everyone else feels about this but I just bought a Drum Dial from a guy off of Craiglist for $40 and it was a wise investment. I have been playing drums for 20+ years and always fought with my tuning. I guess I don't have the best ear in the world, although I can tune a guitar by ear in about 2 minutes. Weird I know but I spent about an hour with this drum dial today and trusted the readings, my ear told me that once I mounted all the drums and actually played them they would be way out of tune but I just went to the suggested settings that came with it and I was shocked how good my drums sounded. I now know what it is like to have drums that are actually tuned properly. It was like night and day. I have had my new set for about 6 month's now. It is Mapex Pro M 6 piece and although I thought they sounded good before they sound like they should now. I am so happy with sound of my toms now I could burst. I want to go play them right now but my baby is sleeping and my wife frowns on waking him up with my drumming. LOL
I must say that if you are having problems tuning your drums or you are not sure about how to do it buy a Drum Dial. They really work.

[Will.ftw]

Hey all, long time reader first time poster.

I've been pulling my hair out trying to get my two toms to sound decent. I've read the tuning bible and most of the posts in this thread but I have no idea whats causing the dead sound on my toms.

I'm looking for a more deep and sharp sound but can't tune it correctly. I'm also not sure if the problem is due to my heads either. The heads are pretty old, they are "Remo - Weatherkings" but are in good condition. Are the 'weatherking' series a bad head? If so what are some decent ones that are available these days?

Thanks in advance :)

[Shaggy Alonso]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLUkDXSfPCc

[lukas]

hey all, i haven't read the whole thread so i might be repeating something but......i've found a great way to tune kick and floor toms!

i recently helped a friend purchase a drumset for an organization he runs and we bought a used yamaha oak custom. the set was almost new and only been rented by the store a few times so it couldn't be sold as 'new'

anyways, the kit sounds amazing!
i didn't have to tune it at all...it's a 22" kick, 10" & 12" toms, and a 16" floor tom.
i wanted to find out how the drums were tuned because they sounded full, deep, and very even. we have a piano near the set so i hit the res. and batter head on the kick a few times, went to piano and it turned out to be a G major... batter hear was a D and the reso. side a G below that D. the floor tom is the same intervals just a different pitch...haven't bothered to check what note exactly,....

the sound is very rich and punchy, but with lots of bottom end and definition - kind of like a well eq'd bass thick but not muddy...

so the moral of that story is? tune the heads a "5th apart" ... if you don't know what that is it's time to learn some basic theory and u even use a guitar tuner when tuning the heads.

btw. the batter were Evans Clear EC2's and the reso were very thin single ply yamaha heads...the kick is a EVans EQ2 on the batter and i think an EQ3 on the reso.

hope this helps.
God bless y'all!
lukas.

[oldrockdrummer]

That is cool because I tune with a drumdial and always tune the batter 5 tighter than the reso. ie: my 11x12 is 82 batter and 77 reso then I adjust it by ear .

[Zoofie]

Hey guys
I use Pinstripes on batter and clear abassador on resonant head and i play primarily heavy stuff. Slipknot , metallica etc.
I've been having some difficulty in tuning my toms to have a short decay and a 'thud' sound to them. I can get a nice 'thud' when i dampen them by sello-tapping a small bit of kitchen roll to the head , but when you see Joey Jordison and Lars Ulrich playing live , you can't see any dampening on the top heads.
Please could i have some help with achieving the short decay 'thud' sound without dapening?

Also , i have a 14" floor tom , and no matter how i tune it , it gives a huge amount of echo. Any tips on tuning or how to fix this?
Thanks very much :)

[Ironcobra]

Tune your resonant head lower, and your batter higher. If you have the resonant head at a low enough tension, it will resonate at a lower frequency, giving you that deep 'thud' sound, this will also die out sooner giving you the sound you desire. JJ has a slappy sound from his drums, that could be achieved from both high and low tuning. Think of the resonant head as a subwoofer.

[Zoofie]

Hey guys
I use Pinstripes on batter and clear abassador on resonant head and i play primarily heavy stuff. Slipknot , metallica etc.
I've been having some difficulty in tuning my toms to have a short decay and a 'thud' sound to them. I can get a nice 'thud' when i dampen them by sello-tapping a small bit of kitchen roll to the head , but when you see Joey Jordison and Lars Ulrich playing live , you can't see any dampening on the top heads.
Please could i have some help with achieving the short decay 'thud' sound without dapening?

Also , i have a 14" floor tom , and no matter how i tune it , it gives a huge amount of echo. Any tips on tuning or how to fix this?
Thanks very much :)

[Zoofie]

Thanks mate , any more ideas?
Thanks

[raje.a]

Before i ask my question i would like every one to know that i have read the drum tuning bible, watched the bob gatsen( and other ) videos on you tube, and i've also been reading the great threads on this site...now thats out of the way... i would really be grateful for some advice on tuning my 14" floor tom.

My toms are tuned relatively high for a jazz sound. The 14" is tuned to a D top and bottom. It sounds a bit boiney. I want it souning more controlled. What did the old masters do? ie Art Blakey or Tony Williams. Those gretch drums had internal muffling maybe they used those?

[harryconway]

An old trick was to run a felt strip under the drum head. Or make a ritchie ring, which is what the Powerstroke 3 has/does. The internal mufflers, lots of vintage drums are missing those because cats took them out. They'd un-adjust themselves, come loose, vibrate and make noise, etc. Depending on what make/series drum you have, Ambassador, Emperor, Powerstroke 3, or Fiberskyn 3 make for good batters. And an Ambassador reso.

[raje.a]

thankyou harryconway.

The drums are yamaha MCAN and I'm using renaissence batters with ambassodor reso's.

[harryconway]

Well certainly, the Yamaha Maple Custom shell is a good shell. A tad more "bright" than a vintage Gretsch, I think the Fiberskyn 3 will get you the "traditional" jazz tone you're after.

[Wavelength]

Do you tune the heads to the same pitch? Tuning the batter head a minor third -- perfect fourth lower (or the resonant head a minor third -- a perfect fourth higher) tends to eliminate the boinginess and makes the sound a lot more focused and controlled

[The popes love child]

I really found the opposite of what I used to think was a vintage tuning style worked. I cranked up my batter head a couple turns above its lowest point, and tuned the reso. head at its lowest tuning point. This gives a very quick and focused sound. The batter head being higher doesn't produce as much of a rumble, and the reso head being lower creates a very fast decay. I am using Aquarian modern vintage on both sides.

[2bsticks]

I'm with Wavelength on this one. I'm using a Yamaha Oak 14 x 11. Clear Emperor on top ambassador on reso. Top head tuned to a D and reso tuned to an E. Tom really growls. With your head combo maybe try the batter tuned to an E and the reso up a minor or major third?

[aboylikedave]

As far as minor thirds go, that is just a relationship between two notes. A minor third is three notes apart (from a B to a D is three notes...B to C is one note, C to C# is two notes and C# to D is the third note)), a major third is 4 notes apart, a perfect fourth is 5 notes apart, etc. Hope this helps.

Hi guys due to this thread I've really got stuck into tuning, but have a question: I'm just getting a bot confused between thirds, minor thirds and intervals of three notes.
Am I correct in saying that some of you are are suggesting a good difference between batter and reso is a minor third (3 notes) and some of you who suggest the wedding march are suggesting a 4th (5 notes)?

When CD drums says "If your drums are say 10”,13” and 16” like mine, try tuning in fifths. " does he mean five notes (perfect 4th) or perfect 5th?

Man, I'm learning alot!
Cheers

[ermghoti]

I think intervals are always used, eg fifths means perfect fifths. Otherwise, one would say "five half-steps," which would be a perfect fourth. Actually, either wold work, since drums are not tuned harmonically, unless one tries to match the key of a song for a recording.

[MadJazz]

The complexity of drum tuning stems from the many variables which define the sound. The trick is to isolate these variables, first and foremost by concentrating on the batter side which sets the initial tone, then by tensioning the reso side and listening how it alters the initial hit.

1. Remove heads on both sides.

2. Inspect and clean the head, bearing edges and inside of the drum with a soft towel. Inspect the hoop and lugs and replace where necessary.

3. Place the batter head and finger-tighten the lugs.

4. Tension the head ½ on each lug, in a star pattern, preferably using two keys which speeds up the process.

5. Hold the drum by the rim and hit the center of the head. Listen. You should hear a dull thud, void of tone and sustain. This means the head isn't stretched and should be tensioned higher. Repeat steps 4 and 5 until you hear some tone, then continue in smaller increments, tensioning ¼ of a turn.

6. The closer you get to the tone you like, the smaller increments you should use: 1/8 and even 1/16 of a turn. Remember that if you have for ex 8 lugs, 1/8 of a turn on each of them results in a total increase of one full turn (8x1/8=1). To get a quick idea to where a higher tension will take you, give one single lug a full turn and listen. Then detune.

7. When detuning, lower the tension below the point where you want to be, then tune it up. After detuning, press firmly on the centre of the head with your palm, to stretch the head in place. Do not press on the snare reso, this head is too thin to support such pressure!
Should you ever note some wrinkles in the head, you didn't tension the head evenly and should detension all the lugs and start over from step 1.

8. Repeat steps 4 and 5, keeping in mind steps 6 and 7, until you reach a tone you like. When the drum starts to ring and when you hear too many high tones, you know you tuned to high. When, to the contrary, the drum has a muddy, dirty tone, you tuned too low. Of course, you might like that kind of tone and remain there.

9. Note that the higher the tension, the higher the tone and the shorter the sustain. The lower the tension, the lower the tone and the longer the sustain. What we're aiming at for toms in most musical styles is a low tone and short sustain, meaning that you have to find a trade-off between a too low or too high tension. Tone and sustain will be strongly influenced by the choice of heads. In jazz, toms and kick are usually tuned to an opposite effect: higher tone and longer sustain. Nevertheless, a trade-off still exists.

10. Once you've discovered the limits of the batter side and you're satisfied with the result, do not touch the batter anymore! Mount the reso side and repeat all previous steps with this exception: do not hit the reso, hit the batter and listen how the reso affects the hit on the batter. Probably you'll want both heads pretty close to each other but not necessarily equal. As long as you're not using identical heads, you'll never get a perfectly equal sound on both heads anyway. If both batter and reso have extremely different tension, you'll hear two voices. This can actually be a good listening exercise.

Once you've reached a certain level of familiarity with tuning, you can try to tune the batter ½ turn up and the reso ½ turn down for ex, or vice versa, and listen to the effect. Also try different head configs as the heads determine a large part of the drum's character. Don't be shy of trying the weirdest combinations! This doesn't need to cost a lot of money. Buy a single head before procuring an entire set, preferably in a size which you can use both on a tom and a snare. Or simply switch batters with resos.

[Smitty]

Help Needed!!!
My new drums:
Gretsch Catalina Club Rock Kit
16"x26" bass drum “wish Evans made the EMAD head on a 26” drum”
6.5"x14" snare drum, 9"x13" rack tom with 16"x16" and 16"x18" floor toms
Currently using all the stock heads – Evans G1 Coated on top and a factory Gretsch clear on bottom.

These drum shells look great however I think they sound flat.
Is that because these are a Mahogany shell?
Can someone suggest the correct drum head combo before I decide to start sanding the inside of the shells or point me in the right direction for light sanding techniques?
I'm back to playing my Tama Birch kit but would rather be playing the Gretsch drums.

Thanks,

Smitty

[CASP3Rdrummer]

The complexity of drum tuning stems from the many variables which define the sound. The trick is to isolate these variables, first and foremost by concentrating on the batter side which sets the initial tone, then by tensioning the reso side and listening how it alters the initial hit.

1. Remove heads on both sides.

2. Inspect and clean the head, bearing edges and inside of the drum with a soft towel. Inspect the hoop and lugs and replace where necessary.

3. Place the batter head and finger-tighten the lugs.

4. Tension the head ½ on each lug, in a star pattern, preferably using two keys which speeds up the process.

5. Hold the drum by the rim and hit the center of the head. Listen. You should hear a dull thud, void of tone and sustain. This means the head isn't stretched and should be tensioned higher. Repeat steps 4 and 5 until you hear some tone, then continue in smaller increments, tensioning ¼ of a turn.

6. The closer you get to the tone you like, the smaller increments you should use: 1/8 and even 1/16 of a turn. Remember that if you have for ex 8 lugs, 1/8 of a turn on each of them results in a total increase of one full turn (8x1/8=1). To get a quick idea to where a higher tension will take you, give one single lug a full turn and listen. Then detune.

7. When detuning, lower the tension below the point where you want to be, then tune it up. After detuning, press firmly on the centre of the head with your palm, to stretch the head in place. Do not press on the snare reso, this head is too thin to support such pressure!
Should you ever note some wrinkles in the head, you didn't tension the head evenly and should detension all the lugs and start over from step 1.

8. Repeat steps 4 and 5, keeping in mind steps 6 and 7, until you reach a tone you like. When the drum starts to ring and when you hear too many high tones, you know you tuned to high. When, to the contrary, the drum has a muddy, dirty tone, you tuned too low. Of course, you might like that kind of tone and remain there.

9. Note that the higher the tension, the higher the tone and the shorter the sustain. The lower the tension, the lower the tone and the longer the sustain. What we're aiming at for toms in most musical styles is a low tone and short sustain, meaning that you have to find a trade-off between a too low or too high tension. Tone and sustain will be strongly influenced by the choice of heads. In jazz, toms and kick are usually tuned to an opposite effect: higher tone and longer sustain. Nevertheless, a trade-off still exists.

10. Once you've discovered the limits of the batter side and you're satisfied with the result, do not touch the batter anymore! Mount the reso side and repeat all previous steps with this exception: do not hit the reso, hit the batter and listen how the reso affects the hit on the batter. Probably you'll want both heads pretty close to each other but not necessarily equal. As long as you're not using identical heads, you'll never get a perfectly equal sound on both heads anyway. If both batter and reso have extremely different tension, you'll hear two voices. This can actually be a good listening exercise.

Once you've reached a certain level of familiarity with tuning, you can try to tune the batter ½ turn up and the reso ½ turn down for ex, or vice versa, and listen to the effect. Also try different head configs as the heads determine a large part of the drum's character. Don't be shy of trying the weirdest combinations! This doesn't need to cost a lot of money. Buy a single head before procuring an entire set, preferably in a size which you can use both on a tom and a snare. Or simply switch batters with resos.

when you say 1/2 step lower or higher you mean to turn each lug half turn ?

[GRUNTERSDAD]

I think a half step is one-half note.
What is it you are sanding on?? Is this an attempt to make the drums sound better??

[CASP3Rdrummer]

pff how the hell im supposed to know whether i tightened a half note ore one whole note higher or the same for loosening ? :(

[m1ck]

CASP3R,

Tuning to specific notes requires a tuning device. I have been using a guitar tuner, but others here report success with pitch pipes. A half step is basically the pitch difference from a white key on a keyboard to an adjacent black one, or vice versa. Hope that makes sense; perhaps someone can explain it better.

[CASP3Rdrummer]

CASP3R,

Tuning to specific notes requires a tuning device. I have been using a guitar tuner, but others here report success with pitch pipes. A half step is basically the pitch difference from a white key on a keyboard to an adjacent black one, or vice versa. Hope that makes sense; perhaps someone can explain it better.

yeah i know whats a half note... but i cant tell the difference with my ears only :/

[Elvis]

Casp3rdrummer,

2 things...

1) A single octave is made up of 12 notes.
Using a bass or guitar tuner will only avail you to a certain number of those notes, but not all of them.
The best tuner to use, if tuning your drums to a specific note, is a CHROMATIC tuner.
This type will show all 12 notes within the range of a single octave.
Back when I worked at the local music store, I sold a couple of drummer friends a Korg CA20 and they were very grateful, having finally found nirvana in the sound of their drums.
The Korg unit is fairly inexpensive and works very well. It's also fairly easy to use.
The CA20 has since been superceded by the CA30.
I'm not sure if that model is still in production, but last time I checked, that's what they were making.

2) MadJazz stated a 1/2 TURN, not a 1/2 step. Look back and read the part you highlighted again and you'll see your error.

This also brings up a point about the evils of agonizingly long threads.
The same answer keeps being repeated several times by different people because no one has the patience to read back over all the prior pages of dialogue that have already been written.
I posted step-by-step instructions on how to mount and tune a head, earlier in this thread.
MadJazz's instructions differ slightly from mine and don't go into quite as much detail, but its still pretty much the same post (no worries MadJazz, I probably wouldn't have looked back through the entire thread either).

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Help Needed!!!
My new drums:
Gretsch Catalina Club Rock Kit
16"x26" bass drum “wish Evans made the EMAD head on a 26” drum”
6.5"x14" snare drum, 9"x13" rack tom with 16"x16" and 16"x18" floor toms
Currently using all the stock heads – Evans G1 Coated on top and a factory Gretsch clear on bottom.

These drum shells look great however I think they sound flat.
Is that because these are a Mahogany shell?
Can someone suggest the correct drum head combo before I decide to start sanding the inside of the shells or point me in the right direction for light sanding techniques?
I'm back to playing my Tama Birch kit but would rather be playing the Gretsch drums.

Thanks,

Smitty
Smitty,

Part of the phenomena you're experiencing may have to do with the shape of the beaering edge.
Those drums feature a modern version of the Gretsch bearig edge, which is a large 1/4 round on the outside of the shell with a 35 degree angled cut on the inside of the shell.
The large roundover can have a tendency to give a drum a drier sound because it helps quell some of the sustain of the head.
The phenomena is more apparent with toms than any other drums because of their proximity to your ears and their size already has a lot of "built-in" muffling present (believe it or not).
The thicker than "traditional Gretsch shell thickness" shells of the Catalina series only highten this phenomena.
I don't know how tight you tension your heads, but if you're using the typical "Rock tuning" for your toms, try going a little tighter and try to achieve a point of maximum sustain.
It won't sing for a week, like a lot of modern drums will, but you should notice a difference over the typically very loose tuning most rock drummers tend to use.
Another thing you can do is to place a weight in the middle of the head. This will actually promote sustain.
The most common form of doing this (in fact, its the only one that I'm aware of) is to use a dotted head, like a Remo CS.
The extra layer of mylar in the middle of the head was originally meant to quell sustain, but later tests show that the extra material actually does the opposite, because the added weight acts like a pendulum and keeps the head in motion longer than if it were never present.
Another trick which may help "wetten" those toms are to use a thin head on the resonant side.
While in reality, this actually shortens the total sustain experienced when energy is imparted on the drum, the thin bottom head will actually increase resonance and give the drum a bigger sound.
The result is a trick of the ear that makes the drum seem like its gained some sustain.

..btw, are you absolutely sure that the stock batter side head on a Gretsch Catalina drum is a coated Evans G1?

For the BD, try a coated EQ3. According to Evans' chart ( http://www.evansdrumheads.com/EVAProductsDS.aspx?ID=11 ) its a little brighter than the EMAD, but fairly close.
...or you could try placing masking tape or black electrical tape around the edge of the head, right inside of the hoop.
If using masking tape, use several short sections whose ends overlap slightly. On my 18, it took 5 strips. You have a 26, so it may be more like 8 or 10 strips.
If using black electrical tape, work in small lengths and while holding the roll in one hand, use the other hand to form the tape to match the curve of the head / hoop. Its a rubbery plastic, so you can do this.
Masking tape is more like paper and will tear if you try doing it that way.



Elvis

[Elvis]

Another thing you can do is to place a weight in the middle of the head. This will actually promote sustain.
The most common form of doing this (in fact, its the only one that I'm aware of) is to use a dotted head, like a Remo CS.
The extra layer of mylar in the middle of the head was originally meant to quell sustain, but later tests show that the extra material actually does the opposite, because the added weight acts like a pendulum and keeps the head in motion longer than if it were never present.
...btw, Smitty, if you're not into Remo heads, the black dot that appears in the middle of the CS can be bought separately, so you can "dot" any make / model of head you choose.
The dots are sold through "Cannon" and are stick-on items.
Check with your local music retailers and see who can deal with Cannon.
Also, forgot to mention that a dotted head may sound a little brighter, because the reinforced middle increases the presence of the attack of the stick hitting the head.


Elvis

[Nunu2324]

i have a pacific fxr kit. it says it has true pitch tunning. the 22x18 virgin bass drum has A stamped inside the shell under the date. the 16x14 floor has an A aswell. the 12x9 doesnt say anything under the date, nor does my 14x6 snare, mabee they forgot to stamp them??? anyways, how can i achive these notes with my drums? i tried actually using a guitar tunner but that didnt work well. any suggestions?i love my new kit but tunning is a little off and i know they would sound sweeeet if they were tuned up a bit better.

True Pitch Tuning means the tension rods have more threads on them so you can tune them to the pitch you want easier. They are'nt Timbre Matched like DW's.

[B9891]

i've tried tuning the toms but i dont really know what they're supposed to sound like. any ideas?

[Elvis]

i've tried tuning the toms but i dont really know what they're supposed to sound like. any ideas?
Wow, talk about a broad question. =()
You sound like you're just starting off. My advice, get with a teacher. You can find one at pretty much any music store.
Take some lessons. They can show you the ins and outs of playing and answer all your questions.



Elvis

[Rimshot1]

One of the problems I often face when doing a live gig is that my toms almost never sound the same as they did at the previous gig. This is because of the layout of the hall, higher ceiling perhaps, room construction size, whether the gig is in the open air etc etc.
This bugged me and "my way" of ensuring that my drums were "roughly" the same tension and sounding to the way I liked to hear them, I bought a drum dial.
This little contraption ensures that your toms are tuned to the same tension every gig, so hopefully they should be sounding the same as when you last played them, but of course you have to remember the size of the venue, the points I've already made and also often the weather, a long drive to a gig in the heat of summer will require a re-tune perhaps, or your toms will sound flat.
I have actually got used to the way I like to hear how my toms sound and I think they sound the same everytime I now play.
A professional drummer friend of mine tunes his toms (including the floor tom) to the tune My Dog Has Flees.(from left to right). It works for him!.

Rimshot1

[drumhead61]

I just got this thread and wanted to thank you for the information that I know I will soon be needing...I am new and need all the advice I can get along these lines...reading this made great sense and I cannot wait to give a try! Thanks again


The complexity of drum tuning stems from the many variables which define the sound. The trick is to isolate these variables, first and foremost by concentrating on the batter side which sets the initial tone, then by tensioning the reso side and listening how it alters the initial hit.

1. Remove heads on both sides.

2. Inspect and clean the head, bearing edges and inside of the drum with a soft towel. Inspect the hoop and lugs and replace where necessary.

3. Place the batter head and finger-tighten the lugs.

4. Tension the head ½ on each lug, in a star pattern, preferably using two keys which speeds up the process.

5. Hold the drum by the rim and hit the center of the head. Listen. You should hear a dull thud, void of tone and sustain. This means the head isn't stretched and should be tensioned higher. Repeat steps 4 and 5 until you hear some tone, then continue in smaller increments, tensioning ¼ of a turn.

6. The closer you get to the tone you like, the smaller increments you should use: 1/8 and even 1/16 of a turn. Remember that if you have for ex 8 lugs, 1/8 of a turn on each of them results in a total increase of one full turn (8x1/8=1). To get a quick idea to where a higher tension will take you, give one single lug a full turn and listen. Then detune.

7. When detuning, lower the tension below the point where you want to be, then tune it up. After detuning, press firmly on the centre of the head with your palm, to stretch the head in place. Do not press on the snare reso, this head is too thin to support such pressure!
Should you ever note some wrinkles in the head, you didn't tension the head evenly and should detension all the lugs and start over from step 1.

8. Repeat steps 4 and 5, keeping in mind steps 6 and 7, until you reach a tone you like. When the drum starts to ring and when you hear too many high tones, you know you tuned to high. When, to the contrary, the drum has a muddy, dirty tone, you tuned too low. Of course, you might like that kind of tone and remain there.

9. Note that the higher the tension, the higher the tone and the shorter the sustain. The lower the tension, the lower the tone and the longer the sustain. What we're aiming at for toms in most musical styles is a low tone and short sustain, meaning that you have to find a trade-off between a too low or too high tension. Tone and sustain will be strongly influenced by the choice of heads. In jazz, toms and kick are usually tuned to an opposite effect: higher tone and longer sustain. Nevertheless, a trade-off still exists.

10. Once you've discovered the limits of the batter side and you're satisfied with the result, do not touch the batter anymore! Mount the reso side and repeat all previous steps with this exception: do not hit the reso, hit the batter and listen how the reso affects the hit on the batter. Probably you'll want both heads pretty close to each other but not necessarily equal. As long as you're not using identical heads, you'll never get a perfectly equal sound on both heads anyway. If both batter and reso have extremely different tension, you'll hear two voices. This can actually be a good listening exercise.

Once you've reached a certain level of familiarity with tuning, you can try to tune the batter ½ turn up and the reso ½ turn down for ex, or vice versa, and listen to the effect. Also try different head configs as the heads determine a large part of the drum's character. Don't be shy of trying the weirdest combinations! This doesn't need to cost a lot of money. Buy a single head before procuring an entire set, preferably in a size which you can use both on a tom and a snare. Or simply switch batters with resos.

[annihilator]

hi, I wanna tune my drums to a deep heavy sound... like on red hot chili peppers' latest album, stadium arcadium

so, I guess my question is whether modestly bolted lugs are enough or is it a question of tom sizes or different heads....

my kit is an untouched tama imperialstar, of 10", 12" and 16" floor

[Rimshot1]

hi, I wanna tune my drums to a deep heavy sound... like on red hot chili peppers' latest album, stadium arcadium

so, I guess my question is whether modestly bolted lugs are enough or is it a question of tom sizes or different heads....

my kit is an untouched tama imperialstar, of 10", 12" and 16" floor

When you say untouched I take it you mean as in new and unmodified. I don't know what the standard heads are on an Imperial Star but I would go for Remo Pinstripes all around including the bass drum. I tune mine to a medium high (tuned to my liking) and then I use rings on all the tomes. You can get these rings in a kit for all the toms and they are made by Evans and I think Remo also do them.They muffle the toms slightly so you can tune them high but with the rings it gives them a flat sound. :-)

[Ian Williams]

The tuning experiment takes time and patience per tom and snare (also bass drum) by loosing/tightening each lug 3/16 - 1/4 of an inch, while hitting at the same time. The resonance/rattling should go away and the sound will be clean and clear on all your drums. Each drum should sound different. If you like the big sound, heavy and powerful drumming as I do, my drum-set has: Tom-Toms 12"x10", 13"x11", Floor Tom 16"x16", they sound heavy as Children of the Grave from Black Sabbath.

Good luck & Regards,

Ian

[TheArchitect]

Everyone has their methods. It takes time for a player to determine the sounds they want and what heads and tuning will get them there. To complicate matters it usually changes from one kit to the next. :)

My birch Mapex kit is 7pc with 8/10/12/14/16 toms. White suede ambassadors for batter and clear ambs for reso. Both heads are tuned to the same pitch. On the drum dial the 8/10 are 75. The 12/14 are 74 and the 16 is 73. The intervals all work well together allowing the drums to resonate together in a musically pleasing way. I like my toms tuned higher and with a lot of resonance and sustain which makes getting the intervals right that much more important.
The kick is 22" and has PS3's front and back tuned to 74 on the batter and 72 on the reso with a 5" port.

My Maple PDP kit has 10/12/14/16 toms and a 24" kick. Same heads except the tom batters are clear Ambs. The toms are tuned to the same pitches/intervals as the Mapex kit but because of the different heads and more low end from the shells they sound completely different. The Kick also uses PS3's front and back with a 5" port. I tune this drum a bit higher reading 75 on the dial for both heads. The bigger diameter still keeps the pitch deep and punchy at the higher tension.

I know some people feel you need to "fine tune" after using the drum dial. I did initially as well until I found some tricks to get the reading to be more accurate. You need to tweak by hand and possibly use a pitch pipe to zero in on the tuning you want. Once you have your tuning documented, its not difficult to accurately reproduce with the dial. Obviously make sure the dial is calibrated with the needle precisely on zero before starting. This also assumes the heads are seated and stretched in

1)Use the included spacer to make sure you accurately locate the dial the same distance from each lug,
2) Bring the head up to pitch no more than 2-3 points of the dial per trip around the drum.
3) Once you make a change on a lug, tap the rim of the drum gently a few times. This wobbles the dial just enough to reset itself on the new tension of the head. Sounds weird but it works.
4) After you do your last pass fine tuning lugs to pitch, do another pass checking the readings until they are all on the money without having to tweak anything

It works for me. Hopefully it will be useful to others.

[TheArchitect]

I did everything the tuning bible said, tighten the lugs finger tightened.backed off 1/4 turn.then half turns till i get a distortion free tone and when i start looking for the pitch.theres this one lug thats higher, so i tune the rest of the lugs to that one but it never catches up, as soon as i turn one of the other lugs, the higher one gets more higher and higher and the other never catches up.i completely removed the higher lug, like before finger titened and it still has a higher pitch.how do u explain something like that.is there problem with the drum or skin?

That sounds like a shell that's out of round or a bent hoop to me

[TheArchitect]

Most drum tuning experts recommend not tuning your toms too tight. Many say to tune just past where the wrinkles are gone.

I consider that advice nonsense. That's one way of doing it but there is no reason you can't tune a good bit higher and still have a fine sounding drum. Only you can decide if that's a sound you like and if its stylistically appropriate for the music you are doing.

[Rimshot1]

In reply to TheArchitect, I agree with you, as you suggest, if using the drum dial, remember that depending on the heads being used, you have to adjust the tuning of each head to the previous ones used and tuned. I congratulate you on using the drum dial for tuning your toms. I have found this very useful and as you say once you have written down your settings, the job become easier for future tune-ups. :-)

[Victor_se]

The Architect!!!

Thanx man.... that information is gold!

[Stuntsunlimited]

Hi everyone, Tuning my toms have boiled my p*** for the last 2months or so... I have a 8" 10" 12" and 14" yamaha stage custom kit... I have got remo Pins on them... they sound 'milky and thick' if that makes sense... Now I got these because they sounded great with my old kit so i thought the same applied... but that was a 7pc rock kit 10" 12" 13" 14" 16". I could tune that to what I liked. Now is it the tom intervals? or shall I try another type of skin... I play rock mainly but a bit of everything.

Thanks for the help

[paul_creedy]

Howdy,
For all you guys who are struggling with tuning toms, I have a few tips that I've learned over my 30+ year career, along with some things shared to me by several well known artists. I’ll assume that you know the basics of tuning, putting a head on the drum and making sure the lug points on the head are all tuned to the same pitch, that stuff. Ok, here goes. First of all, I see a lot of posts about drummers using hydraulic oil filled heads, or heads that have duct tape or foam insulation taped on them, etc. Heads such as these are rarely, if at all used by professionals in live or recording settings. As a start, try to find what heads your favorite artist uses and see if they work for you. Experiment until you find what you like. Most of the time, well known drummers play their drums wide open with no muffling (with the exception of the bass drum). With that being said, here are tips that I have found to be used by most professionals I have come in contact with.
.
Some drummers like to tune by ear, while others tune to specific notes. Both ways are acceptable, as long as the kit sounds good as a whole and you don't have any weird frequencies causing excessive snare buzz or fighting each other when you strike two drums at the same time. As far as head tension goes, most drummers either tune their top and bottom heads to the same pitch, or bottom head tighter. Bottom head looser is rarely used. Both heads tuned to the same pitch produces a pure, full tone. Bottom head tighter shortens the sustain a bit and gives a firmer surface for the sound to reflect off of and “throws the sound back up at you” so to speak. Different drums and materials sound different, you just have to experiment. Both heads tuned the same might sound good on a tom from one kit, but it might have too much resonance if it’s the same size tom from a kit made from a different material.

If you want to tune by notes and have your toms be tuned to specific intervals (thirds, fourths, fifths) buy a pitch pipe. It helps a lot and you’ll know that your heads will be in tune every time. If not, just go with whatever sounds good to your ear. Famous drummers who do tune by their ear still end up having their drums be a specific pitch, whatever that may be, they just don’t consciously tune to that same pitch every time.. Put the heads on your toms, tune them up way tighter than you would play them, making sure the lug points are all the same pitch, and let them sit overnight. This allows the heads to stretch and properly seat themselves on the bearing edge. Next, start with the top head and go around the drum loosening the lugs, pressing on the center of the head until you reach the desired pitch. Too tight and the head feels like a table top, too loose and the head feels to floppy. Once you find the desired pitch, do the same to the bottom head.

Now here’s the cool stuff. Once the toms are tuned to the pitch you like with both heads the same, see how the whole kit sounds together. If you are getting a lot of weird overtones and snare buzz and you’ve tweaked the tuning of the drums a bit and still have a problem, here’s my suggestion.
With a pitch pipe, find what note your floor tom is tuned to on the top head. Most floor toms that I have heard seem to sound good at a “B” or “C”. If both heads are tuned to say a B, the drum will sustain a lot and feel a tad mushy. If you tune the bottom head up three notes higher (a minor third) the sustain will be a bit less, and the drum will feel about right. My point is, try tuning the bottom heads of your toms a minor third higher on the bottom. It helps to control the amount of sustain, has a pitch relationship with the top head so you don’t have dissonance between the two heads, and gives the drum some life. Now, to reduce more unwanted overtones, you should get the drums in tune with themselves. If you have 2 inch differences between your toms (i.e. 10,12,14,16) your drums will probably lend themselves to be tuned a major third (four notes) or a fourth (five notes) apart. If your toms are not 2 inches apart and configured differently, go with an interval that’s appropriate. For instance if you have 12” and 13” toms, you may want to tune them a minor third apart. If your drums are say 10”,13” and 16” like mine, try tuning in fifths.

For the record, here are the tom sizes on my kit, the heads I use and how I tune them. If nothing else, it can be a point of reference, but every drummer that has played my kit, even some famous players, have loved the way they felt and sounded.
Yamaha Maple Custom Absolute Nouveau
10x7.5 tom
13x9 tom
16x14 tom
Heads are usually coated or clear ambassadors, sometimes coated or clear emperors.
NO MUFFLING!!!
The 10” tom has the top head tuned to a “B” and the bottom head a minor third higher to a “D”. The 13” tom has the top head tuned to an “F” and the bottom head a minor third higher to a “G#”. The 16” floor tom has the top head tuned to a “B” and the bottom head a minor third higher to a “D”. They sound and feel great, no overtones or snare buzz. Please post some comments if you try this technique, or if you just want to say stuff about it. Good luck and happy tuning!!

Tried this last night and I'm very pleased with the results - my set up at present has 10" / 12" and 16" floor and I've gone for Bb / F / Bb to start with.

I can't annoy the neighbours on the weekend by hitting the toms properly, so I'll have to wait until Monday to give them a proper try, but my initial feeling is good. I've got a 13" tom upstairs which I'll try adding to the setup, tuned to D, but might have to splash out on a 14" if it struggles.

I have used the drum dial previously but this seems a more "musical" way of tuning, I'll let you know what I think once I've had a better play ..

[paul_creedy]

Oh, and for those that care about such things, I'm currently using EC2s on top of EC resos, which replaced the stock heads on a Mapex M Birch kit, so far I'm very impressed with them, the resos make the EC2s sound much deeper and fuller than the stock resos could manage.

[peggerk]

Hi everyone
I have a 2004 rockstar with mahogany and innerply basswood shells. 12-13-14-16.
I just replaced the batters with coated ambassadors and last year replaced the reso with clear ambassadors.
I have read that these drums have a small tuning range, and can be difficult to tune.
My questions are;

1. do you think these shells would be best tuned the same on both heads or the reso higher with amb/amb heads?

2. the 12 inch tom sounds good at a G and it is seems choked at B flat. Should I never tighten the reso past a "A note" if I have the reso a minor 3rd higher than the batter side?

I have been reading a lot of info here, my tuning is getting better!
thanks.

[GRUNTERSDAD]

I just had to post this bit from the MusiciansFriend web site on what one guy did with his new Pulse drum set. Pretty funny.



I got this set like 3 days before the holidays. Its ok but I put a sheet and pillow in the bass and it sounds great. I put shirts in both toms and the floor tom got a sweater and a shirt and it sounds cool. I got some SABIAN cymbals and they rock. I definately plan on replacing the tom heads ASAP. But other than a few customizations its great!!!!

[Elvis]

I just had to post this bit from the MusiciansFriend web site on what one guy did with his new Pulse drum set. Pretty funny.



I got this set like 3 days before the holidays. Its ok but I put a sheet and pillow in the bass and it sounds great. I put shirts in both toms and the floor tom got a sweater and a shirt and it sounds cool. I got some SABIAN cymbals and they rock. I definately plan on replacing the tom heads ASAP. But other than a few customizations its great!!!!
...well..his drums will never be cold, I suppose. =)


Elvis

[Elvis]

It seems a number of drummers have recently posted about a preference for tuning to a note, and that's fine.
In lieu of a pitch pipe, I'm re-submitting part of a post from the last page, that may interest those wanting to tune their drums to a specific note...

The best tuner to use, if tuning your drums to a specific note, is a CHROMATIC tuner.
This type will show all 12 notes within the range of a single octave.
Back when I worked at the local music store, I sold a couple of drummer friends a Korg CA20 and they were very grateful, having finally found nirvana in the sound of their drums.
The Korg unit is fairly inexpensive and works very well. It's also fairly easy to use.
The CA20 has since been superceded by the CA30.
I'm not sure if that model is still in production, but last time I checked, that's what they were making.

Hope anyone wanting to tune their drums to a note, finds that helpful.



Elvis

[airsmunch1]

Heads matter. Try Evans Oil Filled or Hydralic. They dampen without taping the crap out of your toms!

www.wolvesatthedoor.net

[topgun2021]

I have a Gretsch Catalina Maple. I have had it for 2-3 weeks now. Currently I have the heads that came with it. I tone to the resonance, that is I tone one head until I could hear the head resonate, then the same with the lower head. In the near future I would like to by the Evans hydraulics or EC2's. I have used hydraulics in the past for school and I liked them.


I also heard that is important to tone both heads the same. It gives the lower head a longer life, I think due to less stress, don't have the exact physics why.

[wickydeviking]

lol, I just retuned my Tama Starclassic Performer Burch/Bubinga toms like this:

1) untighten every bolt until it is about to seperate the bolt washers
2) put your fist (or for smaller toms just some fingers) in the center of the drumhead and give a little pressure so you can see the wrinkles in the drumhead
3) get rid of the wrinkles by slightly turning the bolts where the wrinkles are
4) make sure every bolt has the same tension/sound (by hitting with a drumstick the head near that bolt)

With these four steps (costed me like 10 minutes per tom) they now sound amazing! I can't stop laughing (while playing them)

hehe

[tard]

i posted this in another section earlier but it might be helpful here too

http://www.youtube.com/watch.php?v=5XmylwcLrNk

[shawnguess]

Casp3rdrummer,
A single note is made up of 12 octaves.
a CHROMATIC tuner.
This type will show all 12 octaves within the range of a single note.
Elvis

just to clarify for those that may have been confused by this (i think you just mistyped, Elvis):

there are 12 pitches in the range of one octave (in western music). if you want to go further, you can say that all individual pitches generally are comprised of subharmonics and hyperharmonics that include all multiples of the particular frequency at diminishing degrees as they leave the tonic in both directions.

i hope my correction is not misconstrued as being a smartass, i just wanted to clarify and provide a bit more info.

[Elvis]

WHY YOU LITTLE #%^$*&!!!! DON'T YOU EVER.....



(just kidding =) )


Shawn,

Nice catch and a good example of why I will never succeed as a professioinal proof-reader.
I did mix up the words "note" and "octave".
I've corrected that mistake in the post.


Elvis

[Elvis]

Well, we're on page 11 and its been a while since I posted this, so, I'm reposting it, in case anyone has any questions concerning how to go about doing this.

As Joe Friday used to say, "just the basics"...



There's a few ways to "break in" a new head.
Over the years, I've tried various methods.
The way I'm about to describe has worked very well for me and is a much faster way of "breaking in" a head than most others:

1) Remove the old head.

2) Take a piece of cloth (old T-shirt works well) and give a quick wipe to the bearing edge, the underside of the collar and the glue ring of the new head and the underside of the hoop.

3) Place the new head on the drum and spin it on the shell.
Make sure it fits on and spins easily.
If not, return the head and get another.
If it does, continue...

4) Place the hoop on the head, insert the tension rods, tighten all rods finger tight (I like to use both hands, turning the 2 rods that are on the exact opposite sides of each other at the same time).

5) Take your tuning key and start applying tension to the head by turning the tension rods.
Use a STAR PATTERN to tension the head, so that it torques down evenly.
If you're drum is a 6 lug drum, look at the end of the drum you're working on and situate the lugs so that you have one lug looking right at you and the one opposite is looking straight away from you.
If you play "connect the dots" with the other 4 lugs, it should make a "box" shape.

6) Now imagine the face of a clock superimposed over the drum, with the number 12 being the lug looking away from you and the number 6 being the lug looking straight at you.
The rest of the numbers on the imaginary clock will be fairly close to the following lug positions;
The lug in the upper right hand side will be "2", the lug in the lower right hand side will be "4", the lug on the lower left hand side will be "8" and the lug on the upper left hand side will be "10".

7) Tighten the head down in 2 steps, or "patterns".
The first one will be:
12,6,2,8,4,10.
The second one will be:
6,12,4,10,2,8.
Repeat these patterns, in the order I just laid out, placing one complete 360 degree revolution on each rod (which I call "a turn") the first time around, then use 180 degree revolutions (which I call a "1/2 turn") there after, until you've put 3 turns on each of the tension rods.

8) At this point, the head is evenly tensioned and fairly taught.
You may have heard some cracking or "popping" at this point, and that's fine.
Place the drum on the floor with the head you're working on looking up.
Now, place the heel of one of your hands in the center of the head and give one very hard, sharp, quick push.
DON'T BE A WIMP HERE! PUT YOUR WEIGHT INTO IT!
You may have heard more cracking at this point or you may not hear more cracking at this point.
Either is fine.

9) Now pick the drum off the floor and place it on a soft surface with the end you're working on looking up.
That old T-shirt (folded) you used to wipe the drum off with in the beginning would work fine.
If your bed has a comforter on it, that would be perfect.
The soft surface will completely muffle the other head so that you only hear the head you are tuning, which brings us to...

10) Remove all of the tension from the head you're working on.
Use the star patterns I laid out in step #7, until you feel the tension on the rods get pretty slack.
By that time, you probably won't need to use the key anymore.
Keep loosening the tension until the rods are no longer tensioning the head (look for an obvious gap between the head of the rod and the hoop).

11) Start tightening down on the head again with the rods, using the star patterns I showed in step #7.
This time, you will tension the head to whatever setting gives you the sound you're looking for.
Once you start to feel a little tension on the head, start tapping it in the middle after completing each star pattern, to see if the head is tensioned where you want it.

12) Once you reach that point, stop tightening and tap on the head at each point that corressponds with a tension rod, about 1/4" in from the edge.
You can use a stick or your finger, it really doesn't matter.

13) Tap each point once and listen to the drum.

14) If you hear a nice, even sound that is the same pitch at all the points, you're finished tuning this head and you’ll need to flip the tom over and perform the same procedure on the other head.
The head is now tuned to where you want it to be and it should hold that tuning for as long as you want it to. At this point, with each head sounding good on its own, you can skip to step #21.

15) IF you hear a "wobbly" or "uneven" sound coming from some of those points, then the head is not tensioned evenly.
The sound you're hearing is known as distortion and is caused by the head creating several dissonant frequencies at once, due to the fact that it's seeing different tension in different spots of the head.
Dissonant frequencies are ones that do not harmonize with each other, thus resulting in the distorted sound you hear.

16) At this point, you'll need to "fine tune" the head.

17) Check around the head and see if that distorted sound isn't more prevelent at certain points more than others.
If so, try correcting those first.

18) Correct by tightening that tension rod, slightly.
Tap on the head once, at that tension rod, and tighten the rod as the sound decays.
You shouldn't have to turn the rod more than 1/4 of turn at a time.
If you do, then stop and tap the head at the rod that is on the exact opposite side of the drum and see if you don't hear the distorted sound coming from that one.
If so, do the same thing until the sound "evens out".

19) Tap around the head again and see if the distortion is still heard.

20) If so, do the same procedure at each of those rods as well.

21) Once you have everything sounding nice and "even" pick the drum up and hold it in your hand BY THE TOM BRACKET. NEVER HOLD IT BY THE RIM (you can also cradle it in your hand, if there’s bracket on the tom).
The combination of the weight of the drum, your grip and the thickness of the hoop may be enough to throw the head "out of tune" at this point, if the drum is held by its rim.

22) Hit the middle of the drum while holding it up.

23) If it sounds "good", you're done.
If you still get that distortion, set the drum back down on the soft surface it was on and tap around the head again to see if you didn't miss anything.

24) If it sounds good, flip the drum over and tap around the edge of the other head.
Chances are it may have been out of tune and you didn't realize it until now.

25) If the distortion is heard with either head, correct those problems and perform step #22 again.

26) If, when you hold up the drum, you STILL get that distorted sound, go back and perform steps 23-25 and check the heads again.
If everything sounds good on it's own, then your heads are "out of phase" with each other (i.e., each head is tuned to a frequency that is dissonant to the other).
At this point, you'll have to pick one of those heads and retune it to a different pitch that will put the heads back "into phase".
Remember, the batter head sets the tone of the drum, the resonant head sets the amount of resonance of the drum.
The change will most likely not have to be that drastic and the sound of your drum may not change all that much.

27) Make the correction, perform step # 22 and see how the drum sounds.


...If everything sounds good, NOW you're done!

Chances are very good that you will NOT have to perform all 27 steps.
I just wanted to cover some basic problems you might encounter while trying to tune up the drum.

One of the most important points in tuning a drum, that most drummers overlook, is the "cracking" procedure.
You MUST find a way to form that head to the bearing edge, and stress the glue that may be holding the head material to the glue ring, or else you will stand a very good chance of encountering (unneccessary) problems with getting the head tuned up.
You can crank up the tension and leave it sit for a week, or use a hair dryer on it, or simply push down on the center of the head (like I do!).
Any of these procedures will form the head to the bearing edge (leaving it sit for a week works the worst, trust me on this one!).

One thing you don't wanna do is to push in on the SNARE SIDE head (that's the clear one on the bottom of the snare drum). It's too thin and doing that will leave a large depression in the head (it won't sound good).
Those heads are so thin, that you can just slap them on and tension them to where ever you like.


Hope you found this helpful.


Elvis

[wickydeviking]

thanks Elvis! I guess we can close this topic now ;)

[therak]

I have a problem with my two floor toms. One is a 14x14 birch yamaha stage custom and the other is a 16x16 maple mapex. My brand new 14 tom it sounds like I am hitting a inflated ball every time I hit the drum. The first thing I thought was bad heads. So i switched them out but still this pinging noise still occurs. I tried tuning the heads super tight and down super low just past the wrinkle point. I found out that even if i lay the head on the drum without tightening it at all it still makes this terrible ping. Like I said it sounds like an inflated plastic ball is being hit. The heads I have on both toms are Evans Hydrualics as my batter and Evans EC2 coated as the resonant cause i like super damp and warm. The drums are tuned how i like them but this ping just ruins it. So I am wondering whether its because there is too much air inside the drums and if i should make another hole? Any suggestions???

[tard]

it cant be too much air as my radial pro 1000's have no holes in the shells at all

[Elvis]

thanks Elvis! I guess we can close this topic now ;)
Oh, I don't think we have to get that drastic.
Its just, when people start asking basic tuning questions, again, in this thread, that tells me that my tutorial is too far back for anyone to bother to look, so I repost it in an effort to help them.
Its been posted in this thread probably 4 times now.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

therak,

How close is that tom to a wall and/or corner?
Is there a cymbal that sits very close to the tom, partially covering it?



Elvis

[Art Vandelay]

Looking for some general guidance here: What pitches should I be going for with these shell sizes: 12x7 rack tom, 16x14 floor, 24x18 kick, and 14x6.5 snare. They're the shallow hyperdrive toms and I'm not sure what affect that has on their fundamental or natural pitches. I'm all ears so please give your suggestions - I play basic rock, blues, funk and like a lower end out of my drums. TIA
-AV

[Wavelength]

Don't worry about the shell's pitch; it's the heads that matter. Start tightening the resonant head in very small increments until you end up with a pitch that resonates clearly without any strange rumbling. Then tune the batter side up: if you want a wet rock sound, tune it below the resonant's pitch, or if you want an open sound, tune it to the same pitch with the resonant. Sometimes the batter head needs to be tuned a bit higher to sound clear, and if that's the case, don't forget to tighten the resonant head accordingly.

The method I described will bring out the lowest projecting pitch the drum is able to produce. Depending on your taste, the room and the situation you may want to tune the drums higher.

[Elvis]

Looking for some general guidance here: What pitches should I be going for with these shell sizes: 12x7 rack tom, 16x14 floor, 24x18 kick, and 14x6.5 snare. They're the shallow hyperdrive toms and I'm not sure what affect that has on their fundamental or natural pitches. I'm all ears so please give your suggestions - I play basic rock, blues, funk and like a lower end out of my drums. TIA
-AV
On top of Wavelength's wise words, here's something else to remember.
The head's diameter is going to determine the note value of the tom.
The tom's depth is going to determine where in the note's range the tom will speak (i.e., high C, middle C, etc.), so I say treat it like every other drum you've owned in those diameters, and work from there.
Also, shallow drums?...the bass drum and the snare drum are actually a little on the deep side. The floor tom is actually an old parade snare size and the rack tom is only 1" shorter than the only depth 12" toms came in for many years.
I'd say tune them how you normally would and you should end up fine, but if for some reason you don't like what you hear, try Wavelength's suggestion.
Its definately a sound one. =)


Elvis

[spirit]

yes welcome to the forum...such informative posts are far more important than high post counts so...respect to you.

my advice on tom tuning follows yours but i add that care taken when you first put new heads on will save you loads of time and heart ache later. i have a tension watch and torque key but neither of them worked on my old heads because some of them had not been properly seated ... this meant that at some of the lugs there was tension even though the screws were barely tightened and when i followed the recommendations on the box i got horrible sound...so i tuned by ear and got acceptable sound.
nowdays i wax the bearing edge (with normal candle wax), very carefully seat the head, following the advice given in the tuning bible about pressing the head down in the center and cross torque tuning the whole head until it is slightly higher than i like it, leave it overnight and then down tune it and then retune it up to my normal pitch preference.

Yes I agree with waxing the bearing edge- I have said thid b4 in posts here- its most important to have the heads seated correctly- without that tuning is a waste of time.
I use Aquarian performance 2s on the top, 12, 13, 16, 22 and I tune the top and the bottom heads using an Evans torque key......BUT I make sure that my rods and lugs are clean and lubed lightly with 3 in 1 oil b4 anything at all.
Using the torque key I tune my top heads to 1for 22, 2-16, 4-13, 5-12, my snare is way higher at 8. My reso heads are G2s all round and I tune them a tad higher .5 extra using the torque key.
I finish by ear and never tune at home- its best to tune in a large room b4 a gig is best to fine une by ear as you will have a sound that is true to the situation you want to use them in.
I bung a little moon gel- half a square in the middle of each head and tap an inch from each tension rod and tune to make sure they are all the same in pitch...whilst playing I never use moongel of any muffling on my drums as I get just the right amount of ring and sustain. My bass drum is the only thing muffled with an Evans eq pad for front and rear heads.

Tune to- here come the bride... is the other way if you dont have a torque key and will get you in the ballpark if you have the same size toms as me.
It is a matter of experiance really and also the typ of music you play in the main, Low is good for Rock and blues rock- I play that a lot..For general covers gigs I takeit all up by one cept for the snare.
Take your time and seat the heads well to start- using wax is an old trick that many people have forgotten now but it does help!

Regards
H

[Elvis]

Another trick, if you're using a 12-13-16 tom setup and are not satisfied with the separation you're getting between the two high toms, is to use medium weight heads on the resonant side of the 12 and 16, but use a thin weight head on the resonant side of the 13.
It'll give the effect that the 13 to speaking a little lower, adding more difference in the sound of it, compared to the 12, but not so low that it steps all over the 16.
Tune it the same as you normally would.


Elvis

[Carol]

Another trick, if you're using a 12-13-16 tom setup and are not satisfied with the separation you're getting between the two high toms, is to use medium weight heads on the resonant side of the 12 and 16, but use a thin weight head on the resonant side of the 13.
It'll give the effect that the 13 to speaking a little lower, adding more difference in the sound of it, compared to the 12, but not so low that it steps all over the 16.
Tune it the same as you normally would.


Elvis
Hi Elvis
I want to tunne my Toms & Snare for Worships Songs What caN i DO???

[Elvis]

Carol,

What's wrong with how they're tuned now?


Elvis

[spirit]

Hi Elvis
I want to tunne my Toms & Snare for Worships Songs What caN i DO???

I think a kinda mid range tuning will work well. Also in my previous post I forgot to write that when fine tuning the lugs, start with tapping with a drum stick evenly around an inch from each lug to get them sounding the same for tune- then as you get closer, move the stick closer to the rim and listen- the closer you get to the rim the more you will find any variation, also be slow as the slightest turn on the lugs at this point in the tuning, makes a lot of differance and its dead easy to get sharp with less than a quarter turn! If you overshoot- sont panic! just take that lug down lower than the intended note and press down on the head firmly infront of that lugs- this will release any grab between the head and the bearing edge and ensure consistant true sound.

Its mega important to take your time, small key turn on opposite lugs are the way to do it- in time you will get used to the way well tuned drums sound and develope a feel for how to achieve that sound you like again and again.

Never forget- dont tune at home if you gig out- tune it in a large room very like the place you would play in- IE, not a lot of curtians, carpets, soft furnishing that will and do effect sound in a dramatic way.. I guarantee if you tune at home- when you go out to play in a large hall- your drums will sound flat and dead because the life has been tuned out in error!

Good luck- if I can help in any way- please ask.
Let us know how you get on with the tuning ok?

[spirit]

Hi Elvis
I want to tunne my Toms & Snare for Worships Songs What caN i DO???

I think a kinda mid range tuning will work well. Also in my previous post I forgot to write that when fine tuning the lugs, start with tapping with a drum stick evenly around an inch from each lug to get them sounding the same for tune- then as you get closer, move the stick closer to the rim and listen- the closer you get to the rim the more you will find any variation, also be slow as the slightest turn on the lugs at this point in the tuning, makes a lot of differance and its dead easy to get sharp with less than a quarter turn! If you overshoot- dont panic! just take that lug down lower than the intended note and press down on the head firmly infront of that lugs- this will release any grab between the head and the bearing edge and ensure consistant true sound.

Its mega important to take your time, small key turn on opposite lugs are the way to do it- in time you will get used to the way well tuned drums sound and develope a feel for how to achieve that sound you like again and again.

Never forget- dont tune at home if you gig out- tune it in a large room very like the place you would play in- IE, not a lot of curtians, carpets, soft furnishing that will and do effect sound in a dramatic way.. I guarantee if you tune at home- when you go out to play in a large hall- your drums will sound flat and dead because the life has been tuned out in error!

Good luck- if I can help in any way- please ask.
Let us know how you get on with the tuning ok?

[Abyssul]

I have a 10", 12", 13" toms and 16" floor tom. They are currently tuned as followed:

10" Tom
Top = C♯
Bottom = E

12" Tom
Top = B♭
Bottom = C♯

13" Tom
Top = A♭
Bottom = B

Now I want to keep the minor third difference on the tom heads as cdrum21 said, but my problem is that I want it tuned like him since I'm a beginner.

The 10” tom has the top head tuned to a “B” and the bottom head a minor third higher to a “D”. The 13” tom has the top head tuned to an “F” and the bottom head a minor third higher to a “G#”. The 16” floor tom has the top head tuned to a “B” and the bottom head a minor third higher to a “D”.

Now I have to modify my set because I still want to keep that correct interval between the different inches in size if you know what I mean.

So if I start with my 10" top as B/D, then what will my other toms be? Im not really musical literate hehe.

[JoseV]

Can some1 tell me how to reduce some overtone on my toms without having to buy o rings?

[Marky B!]

Hi all!

I was wondering if someone could help me out with a little problem i'm having. I just bought a mapex saturn kit and i'm finding the toms really hard to tune. I love the tone of these drums but the initial attack is horrible, it kind of sounds like the head is barely on (plasticy slap sort of sound) but the head is clearly on a lot tighter. At the moment i've got coated G2's on top and clear G1's on the bottom. Is it the heads or something in the way i'm tuning it? I've tried some spare clear Emperors that i had and it didn't seem to make that much difference. I was thinking of getting some Pinstripes for the top and Ambassadors for the bottom to try and fix it, any good?

Thanks for any help.

[Elvis]

MarkyB,

Your problem is most likely with the twin ply heads you're using on the batter side.
My experience was always that they tend to offer a mellow attack, compared to most other types of heads.
Check around your area, or online and get some "Dots", which are marketed by Cannon.
These are the same mylar dots you see on the Remo Control Sound heads.
Apply the dot to the center of the head and you should notice an increased presence of the attack.



Elvis

[Reilly98]

when i hit my 12 and 14" toms i get a very long ringing after that sounds awful and ive been forced to put e-rings on them, how do i get rid of this?

i use a pearl forum hkit with evans black onyx heads

[Elvis]

Coated Remo PS3 (or similar type head) on each end of each drum.
That's going to yield a pretty dry sound.
You have to realize, though, that some of the "ringing" you hear is the resonance of those drums.
They're hollow chambers with flexible membranes on each end of them. You're going to pick up some semblence of the "bong", short of filling those drums with clothes.

Have you ever changed out a head before?
I've posted a step-by-step tutorial in this thread several times.
Please use it, if that's something new to you, or if your not too sure on how to do it.


Elvis

[Elvis]

Reilly98,

Just noticed you seem to like Evans, so if you want to stick with that company, maybe try the EC2 head.
Almost as thick as the Onyx, but includes a muffling ring. This will quell the sustain, as it does on the PS3.



Elvis


Coated Remo PS3 (or similar type head) on each end of each drum.
That's going to yield a pretty dry sound.
You have to realize, though, that some of the "ringing" you hear is the resonance of those drums.
They're hollow chambers with flexible membranes on each end of them. You're going to pick up some semblence of the "bong", short of filling those drums with clothes.

Have you ever changed out a head before?
I've posted a step-by-step tutorial in this thread several times.
Please use it, if that's something new to you, or if your not too sure on how to do it.


Elvis

[Hurlza]

hey guys. im a drummer of 10 years and i have a "worn in" mapex m series kit its abou 3 years old. i have genuine PinStripes on them (1year old). my 8 10 14 and 16 are all good but my 12 inch sounds choked. is there a technique in tuning to de choke drums when tuning?

[Elvis]

Yes Hurzla, there is a technique for "de-choking" a drum.
Its called swapping out the bad head for a good one. =))
Back in the mid-late 90's, Remo got busted by the EPA and had to change how they were making their heads.
The result is what is now sometimes known as the "pie head", because of the segmented circular icon that appears under the stamp.
Ever since they started producing them, I've noticed some of those heads will end up giving off a choked sound.
Since all of your other toms do not exhibit this problem and you didn't relate any similar problems with the 12 in the past, that's the first thing I'd look at.
Get another set of heads for the 12 and see if that doesn't cure the problem.

...and if this post has now made you wary of using Remo heads, Aquraian's Performance2 is supposed to be similar to the Pinstripe.




Elvis

[Sc00by]

i use a gauge for the pressure

[oops]

Hey guys,
I've modified my kit a little to play jazz, so I'm using my 16" floor as a kick drum and my 13" tom as a floor tom. I've got "standard" sizes, so I'm also using a 12" as a rack tom.

In terms of tuning to pitches between the heads, I'm struggling getting a perfect 4th between the 12 and 13, do you have any suggestions?

I'll find I can get my 12 to where it's sounding really good (pitch B) but struggle with getting the 13 to work with that (it'd need to be an F#). Should i try and tune my 12 up higher to accomodate, or change the pitch difference to a minor 3rd instead?

In normal 12, 13, 16 configurations does anyone do a 4th between the 12 and 13?

Thanks.

Also, I'm starting a funk band, and looking for a different sound, basically more punchy. Would Evans EC2s and an E-mad be a good choice?

[Elvis]

oops,

Personally, I think you're asking a lot of your 12/13 toms, trying to get a 4th between them, but then, I don't tune my drums to any specific pitches either.
However, the reason for my post is to ask if you've tried different head combo's on those individual toms.
If you're doing a coated medium weight head over a clear medium weight head on the 12, then the 13 might come off a little "lower" if you use a coated thin weight head on the resonant side of the 13 and something heavier on the batter side, like a Fiberskyn (FD).
Besides that, the only other thing I can think of would be to either change out the 12 for a 10 or change out the 13 for a 14.

Hope that helped.



Elvis

[Dom Daviault]

Hi.
I play Remo Coated Ambassador on top and Remo Clear Ambassador on bottom on all of my drums. Normally, I tune the bottom head of my toms a minor third lower or higher than the top head, but now, I'm so confused...
I play a lot of jazz, funk and a bit of pop. I'm looking for a precise, fat (but not too much) sonority, with sustain and sort of crescendo when hitting the head.
Should I also try a more open and warm sound by tuning all heads in unison? Which is the best tuning?

[Elvis]

Dom,

This might help.
A friend once told me about a cool little trick.
Line the edge of the head with electrical tape, but place it so that the middle of the tape, widthwise, is sitting right on the peak of the bearing edge, as it shows through the collar.
The sonic enhancement he mentioned, sounds similar to what you appear to be looking for.
If you need illustrations, Mail Me (gundorps@yahoo.com) and I'll send you a pic or two.



Elvis

[MadJazz]

Nothing as frustrating and rewarding as tuning toms. If you know how to tune toms, tuning a snare or bass drum becomes easy. Here's my approach.

There are six steps in getting a good drum sound:

- room treatment
- head selection and muffling
- tuning the heads to itself
- bringing the batter to the desired pitch or where the shell sounds fullest
- bringing the resonant to the same pitch or a 3rd or 4th higher than the batter
(on snare drums tuning the resonant a 3rd or 4th lower than the batter is also OK)
- tuning all drums in intervals to each other

I won’t go into the first step but it has a bigger impact on the sound quality than any of the other five.


HEAD SELECTION
Contrary to a snare and bass drum, heads on toms should be muffled reasonably because the deep, quintessential tom sound is achieved by free vibration. The trick is in eliminating only unwanted overtones, getting a clean note and finding the correct relation between both heads and between the shells. How that's done, I explain in the next chapter. But first a word on heads.

You want to choose heads that eliminate the highest overtones and nothing more. By muffling I not only mean external devices but also coating and multiple ply heads. They all muffle the drum, more or less subtly, which is a good thing if done in the correct amount. The more muffled the head, the shorter the sustain, the lower the tone but also the lower the volume, the less sensitive the reponse and the stronger the attack. That is especially true for muffling the batter. If you want to reduce sustain but keep a sensitive stick attack, it's better to muffle the resonant instead. Dropping an O-ring inside the shell (shorter sustain) or using an extra thin (shorter and brighter sustain), a two-ply (darker sustain) or coated resonant (dryer sustain), will alter the way the drum sounds.

However, as the resonant is completely muffled or removed, you will also get a strong attack and a percussive tone. If you muffle too much (batter or resonant), you will hear more of the bright plastic attack than the warm wooden shell. So muffle reasonably. The default head that drums are sold with, being a single ply clear, is one of the worst choices because the open and bright tone is so present, that it overshadows the shell's dark and woody charactersitics. The first reaction is to muffle the head excessively and by doing so not only eliminating the unwanted overtones but also subdueing the shell's character. The only muffling needed in my experience is single ply coated or double ply clear head. The latter is more focused but has a brighter attack. A double ply coated might have a dull attack unless you tension it higher. Generally, the thicker or more muffled the head, the higher you have to tension it to open up the sound, which of course raises the pitch and is redundant if you want a throaty and low tom sound.


TUNING
I prefer the term tensioning because you don't tune drums like you tune a guitar or piano. Even when "tuning" the heads to a pitch, once the head vibrates together with the shell, you get a richer and completely different tone. Pitch also changes over time (called pitch bend) and in space (distance from the drum) and depending on whether you hit the drum in the centre or the edge.

First of all, buy two drum keys. You have two hands, why not use both. I start by removing the bottom head and finger tightening the batter. Using two keys, I tension opposite lugs in 1/2 turn increments to where the head starts to open up (usually 2x1/2 turn). I check the drum by holding it by the rim and hitting the centre of the head.

Once it opens up, I bring the head in tune with itself to get a clean tone. I do this by tapping near opposite lugs, not adjacent lugs. You have to hit them quickly to hear and remember the pitch. Tapping once doesn’t help. If two lugs have a different pitch, bring one up or the other down by 1/8 to 1/4 of a turn. Then continue with another pair. Only after the pairs are in tune with themselves will I tune the pairs to each other. Remember that drums don't hold perfect pitches so don't get too serious about it. If you listen for too long, you will get confused and should take a break.

I continue tensioning the head with 1/2 turns. After a few such turns, the tom shrieks with an unpleasant high pitch or becomes choked. That’s when I back up 1/2 turn and continue in smaller increments of 1/4 turn. Whenever I’m too high, I back up and check the head is still in tune with itself (again, without nitpicking). Then I continue in smaller increments of 1/8 and 1/16. Eventually, I will find a balanced spot I’m satisfied with. If the drum suddenly sounds fuller, you found its sweet spot. Instead of tensioning to this spot, you can tune to a certain pitch.

After I found the sweet spot, I check the head’s pitch with a piano (a pitch pipe is a cheaper device). To do this, I put the drum on a surface to muffle the shell and hit the batter. Listening closely, I try to find the corresponding note on the piano. If it’s off between two notes, I will bring the pitch up to a clean note using very small turns. Sometimes it's enough to tension only one or two lugs. This step is not necessary and you can just tune to the sweet spot but it’s useful to know where a particular head sounds best. Write that note down. The relation between the two heads is particularly important. Thats' where the resonant head comes into play.

Once the batter is done, I mount the resonant, finger-tighten it, bring it in tune with itself and raise the pitch to the same pitch as the batter. That’s where the drum sounds fullest and the resonant will now support the sweet spot. If the drum is very deep, you might need to tune the resonant slightly higher to support the batter. To distinguish a head’s pitch, hold your hand against the opposite head. Contrary to popular belief, tuning both heads equal does not give me the longest sustain. In fact, tuning the resonant lower increases sustain, as well as lowering the pitch, making the tone muddier and stick attack/rebound less articulate. That's actually good on a snare where the batter is tuned very high and if you don't want a very bright and precise snare response. However on toms that are generally tuned low to medium, these aren't good traits.

Let's consider the other option: resonant higher than batter. If the sustain is too long, I bring the resonant up to a 3rd or 4th above the batter because these intervals sound the most musical. With a tighter resonant, the drum will also sound rounder and feel more articulate. Having both heads at different pitches can make the pitch bend, where you first hear the higher pitch that fades away into the lower pitch, irrelevant of which head is higher or lower. On larger shells, it’s hard to discern a pitch and therefore it might be impossible to achieve a pitch bend. That’s why I sometimes leave the resonant on floor toms the same pitch as the batter. With smaller toms, you have a broader tuning range.


INTERVALS
As a guideline, a central C on the piano corresponds to a floor tom batter. Depending on the shell’s dimensions and on the heads, it might be off a few notes, up to a 4th but generally not more. 10" toms will also be around a C but an octave higher. Snare drums will be around an A higher. I suggest tuning the batter first and then altering the resonant. This order is also logical because the batter produces the main sound and the resonant alters or supports it. I don't necessarily tune toms to specific pitches. Rather, I tune the batter to where it sounds best and then tune the resonant to a certain interval (minor 3rd, major 3rd or perfect 4th). Neither do I tune bass drums to pitches because a bass drum is more felt than heard.

[bigtom59]

Just wanted to say thanks to everyone for this thread! I found the answer to my question just by reading the post! Thanks

[ChrisRoks25]

It may sound a little dumb, but do you need the same head on both sides of the tom to not get a sharp sound after striking the tom? Not only that, but I cant seem to get the same sound without rings than with rings. I've seen it done on the same set before, but no luck. I own a Gretsch Catalina Club mod set. =D (please reply in message)

[Sopranos]

Hi Folks!

So I recently purchased a couple sets of new heads (I have Vintage Emp and Evans G2).... both of which will be new to me after using EC2 over Ambassadors. I just found the EC2's to be a little too muffled and dead sounding.

I have started with the Vintage Emp's and since I was going to have to tune anyway I also tuned/tightened the reso Ambassadors (which I did not replace the reso's)... about 9 months old. To my surprise, they sound even more dead and don't sing like I heard them in the store on my exact kit. I'm wondering if tightening the reso head just a hair had this affect and if I should go with a looser or even new reso's. Instead of singing they just die out.

For what its worth, I have a Pearl Masters MCX (6ply all maple) w/ virgin kick. I used the assistance of a drum dial and I am in the neighborhood of 75-78 on batter and 80 on reso. I have used Bob Gatzens techniques and read all his stuff... I think for the most part I have them in tune but they don't resonate/sing quite long enough.... they dont sound very full.

Any help or suggestions? Thanks in advance!!

[keep it simple]

Hmmm, difficult one. The drum will always produce the greatest sustain when both batter & reso are tuned exactly the same, so maybe a slight detune of the reso will help. Sometimes I take the reso a little below the batter. This dous introduce a pronounced roll off but often gives a nice mid frequency sustain.

Agreed on the EC2's. Far too dead, but maybe they partnered especially well with your reso choice and shell. I'd try detuning the reso & potentially the whole drum. If that doesn't work, you may well be into changing the reso's for something that better partners the batter heads.

Good luck!

[audiotech]

You should be alright with that combination, although I usually use a G2 clear over a G1 clear (10 mil) resonant head. What I would do is to take the resonants head's tension complete off and start over. What you may have done is to chock the life out of your drums. You should have at least the same resonance and sustain with the G2, if they are clear, than what you had with the EC2's. I would also check the tensioning on your new batter heads. Start with everything loose and start by re-tensioning the reso head. Keep in your mind "evenly" when tensioning and tuning your drums. After all tension rods are just sitting on the drum's rims finger tight, a turn of one rod should yeild the same amount of turn on the opposite rod across the drum to keep things "even". A very slight turn of each tension rod (1/16) multiplied by the number of rods on each head will make a significant difference in their sound, especially the smaller diameter drums when you're getting close to the sound you want. The shells will usually let you know where you can achieve the greatest resonance and sustain for any given size. For the resonant head this is usually just above the "no wrinkle" state, maybe about another 1/8 th turn of each rod (very relative). When checking your heads for wrinkles, just place you index finger lightly in the center of the head, at first you'll probably see wrinkles at some of the tension rods, just slightly tighten those rods untill the wrinkles disappear. When you get the tone that you want, make sure both heads are in-tune with themselves having the same pitch from about an inch in from each tension rod. As already mentioned, you'll get the greatest resonance and sustain if both the batter and resonant heads are close to the same pitch.

I could go on, but you probably know how to tune and there are dozens of good sites to get you in the ball park. If you still have problems, get back to us.

Dennis

[Sopranos]

Thanks so much!!

I guess I should mention that I am in an acoustically treated home studio so I don't really have unwanted overtones or ringing. That's why I really want to open these drums up and let them sing. It does sound like I have perhaps choked the reso head a bit. I still want to stick with a double ply batter (like G2 or Vintage Emp) cause I really like the warmer sound... but I could use a little more sustain so they sound really full and fat (if that makes sense).

Thanks again!

[Coldhardsteel]

I would like a little help with tuning floor toms.

I've retuned the toms on my high school's drum set, and right now I have to say I'm proud of myself when it comes to the 12". It has a nice, even decay, it holds a pleasant note, and as many people have said to describe a good-sounding tom, it just sings.

This isn't the case with the floor tom. No matter what I try, the tuning doesn't seem to work. I don't seem to understand what I'm supposed to get out of the drum: Is it something thunderous? Boomy? Is it supposed to sing like the 12"?

Any advice would be appreciated.

[Elvis]

Coldhardsteel,

This is why drums are tunable and why there are so many different drum head choices.
It allows you to tailor the sound of any drum to how you like it.
How that floor tom should sound is entirely up to what you want it to sound like, or (taken another way), how you intend to use it.
That's really about the best advice I can give you.
Maybe someone else will interject with some setup that works for them.
There's no harm in trying it, to see if it works for you.


Elvis

[Spectron]

I was used to tuning my floor tom to its lowest possible note.
(A little bit above jaw) but just last week I decided to tune all my toms up
a little bit higher.

Man this really opened the drums up, talk about thunderous AND singing.
this is the loudest and fullest my toms have ever sounded. My 16x16 floor tom is about 2 notes higher in pitch but the drum has a fuller rounder tone.

Personally i love the way a coated vintage emperor over a Evans ec resonant sounds on floor tom.

[jamest]

I have 10x9, 12x10, and 14x12 toms, but sometimes have trouble finding a tuning that I really like. Anyone got any tips?
__________________

"When the going gets tough, the tough get going!"

http://www.excellent-offers.com/gravy1.jpg

[Spectron]

First of all how are you tuning now?
what shape are your heads in?
are you seating the heads properly?
are the lugs tones matched?
Is the resonant head close the the same pitch as the batter?

1. Really old heads may never sound good, so unless you know that age and condition of your heads plan on replacing both the batter and resonant especially if the heads are dimpled or the stock heads that came with the kit. Get a new batter and resonant head for one drum at a time if you can't afford all new heads but get new heads. It will be easier to hear tones with clear heads - to start I recomend 2ply clear over one ply clear (remo emperor over ambassador or evans G2 over G1)
I personalyl prefer coated batters but it's harder to heear lug tones so for me they are harder to tune...just a thought

If your heads are fine and it is about tuning alone...
keep experimenting, try to match the lug tones as best you can
and then try to match the pitch of the resonant head to the batter.

The things to keep in mind are:
1. is the head tensioned high enough?
If the head is too loose it will produce all sorts of sounds that aren't too wonderful
Best to just loosen the head all the way and start from scratch and with a new head is even better:) start with one head on the drum and finger tighten the lugs in star pattern.
now put about 1 full turn on each lug (star pattern again) press down firnly
on the center of the head to seat it ( you will hear some crackling noises it's fine)
now when you hit the drum you should hear a somewhat distortion free tone. If there is rumbling or visual wrinkles you shoudl put another half turn on each lug. The idea here is to get the head at a reasonable tension (not too high not too low) and the drum should make a somewhat clear resonant tone.

2. are the lugs tones matched?
When the lugs tones are not matched you will hear 'overtones' that are disonant
when the head is struck in the middle. Here is how to lug match:
You tap the head about 1" from the rim at each lug and hear the over tone
compare it to adjasent or opposite lug tones and try to match tone(notes)
by making SMALL adjustments at each lug.
When all the lugs produce the same tone (or are pretty close)
the head is tune with itself; when struck in the center will produce a clear defined
resonant TOOM! This takes practice and patience so give yourself time!

3. is the resonant head close to the same pitch as the batter?
Once you get lug matching down go ahead and put the resonant head on
seat it and tension it the same way as you did the batter. After finger tight 1-2 full turn on each lug 1 being low tuning and 2 being high tuning so somewhere in the middle is usually what works for me.

Just remember if your batter is a thicker head IE: 2 ply it will need more tension than a single ply head to achieve the same pitch. Now lug match the resonant head with the batter head muted. I usually place the drum on a carpet or towel so I can isolate just the head I working on. After the head is tune with it self (lug matched) check to see if the batter and resonant heads are in tune with each other (same pitch)
This also takes practice and patience so give yourself time:)
Flip ther drum over tap the head, flip the drum over tap the head
and try to get both heads close to the same pitch. SMALL adjustments here can dial it in - sometimes just 1/4 turn on one or two lugs can do it and it is a good idea to decide before hand which head your going adjust. IE: I like to tune the batter where I like it then match the resonant head to the batter.
When the two heads are lug matched and in tune with eachother you will hit the drum and it will go TOOOM with a nice resonant clear focused sound with very little (if any at all) overtones.

3. mount the drum to your kit and fine tune it again
If you have standard mounts like me it can rob some of the sustain by absorbing
vibrations. So I have to mount the tom and hit it - if it still sounds round and full I leave it. If it sounds sort of choked off I play with one or two lugs on the batter until the sound opens up again. (I usually loosen one lug 1/4 - 1/2 turn) and it does the trick


Experiment with low and higher tunings, practice lug matching.
With enough experimantion you will soon start hear what works.
You'll eventually get a sound you like so remember how you got there.
Be patient and have fun:)
Good luck:)

[EuroDrummer]

Hi guys,

I am writing here to have a piece of advice concerning heads for a Maple PDP X7 I am about to purchase.
It has 8 10 12 14 16 toms, but I am interested in using the 8 12 and 16 ones only.
I want a warm but controlled sound because I play acoustic music with rods as well as Metal with heavy drumsticks. I have been interested in Suede Emperor, but they are not available for all sizes (only Ambassador in 8" ),
In your experience, what skins could be recommended?
Regards.

[Isaac A]

Hi guys,

I am writing here to have a piece of advice concerning heads for a Maple PDP X7 I am about to purchase.
It has 8 10 12 14 16 toms, but I am interested in using the 8 12 and 16 ones only.
I want a warm but controlled sound because I play acoustic music with rods as well as Metal with heavy drumsticks. I have been interested in Suede Emperor, but they are not available for all sizes (only Ambassador in 8" ),
In your experience, what skins could be recommended?
Regards.

i recommend Aquarian, if you also want a rich warm sound make sure the top and bottom head sound the same, in recordings they would sound amazing!

[Elvis]

Hi guys,

I am writing here to have a piece of advice concerning heads for a Maple PDP X7 I am about to purchase.
It has 8 10 12 14 16 toms, but I am interested in using the 8 12 and 16 ones only.
I want a warm but controlled sound because I play acoustic music with rods as well as Metal with heavy drumsticks. I have been interested in Suede Emperor, but they are not available for all sizes (only Ambassador in 8" ),
In your experience, what skins could be recommended?
Regards.
Remo Fiberskyn 3.
Ambassador weight (FA) will have similar sound and feel to Emperor, but with a little added resonance and an ever so slightly sharper attack.
Diplomat weight (FD) will play more like Ambassador.
If you want one for the BD and SD, there's a PS3 version, as well. I once had a pre-pie FA/PS3 on the batter side of my BD. Sounded great!


Elvis

[Elvis]

I have 10x9, 12x10, and 14x12 toms, but sometimes have trouble finding a tuning that I really like. Anyone got any tips?
Try tensioning all of the tom heads to the same number of turns.

For instance, I like the way my drums sound when the heads are tensioned to 1.5 turns of the tuning rods.

...also, are you setting up those toms correctly, when installing new heads?
Here's my tutorial, in case you think you may be missing something from the start...


There's a few ways to "break in" a new head.
Over the years, I've tried various methods.
The way I'm about to describe has worked very well for me and is a much faster way of "breaking in" a head than most others:

1) Remove the old head.

2) Take a piece of cloth (old T-shirt works well) and give a quick wipe to the bearing edge, the underside of the collar and the glue ring of the new head and the underside of the hoop.

3) Place the new head on the drum and spin it on the shell.
Make sure it fits on and spins easily.
If not, return the head and get another.
If it does, continue...

4) Place the hoop on the head, insert the tension rods, tighten all rods finger tight (I like to use both hands, turning the 2 rods that are on the exact opposite sides of each other at the same time).

5) Take your tuning key and start applying tension to the head by turning the tension rods.
Use a STAR PATTERN to tension the head, so that it torques down evenly.
If you're drum is a 6 lug drum, look at the end of the drum you're working on and situate the lugs so that you have one lug looking right at you and the one opposite is looking straight away from you.
If you play "connect the dots" with the other 4 lugs, it should make a "box" shape.

6) Now imagine the face of a clock superimposed over the drum, with the number 12 being the lug looking away from you and the number 6 being the lug looking straight at you.
The rest of the numbers on the imaginary clock will be fairly close to the following lug positions;
The lug in the upper right hand side will be "2", the lug in the lower right hand side will be "4", the lug on the lower left hand side will be "8" and the lug on the upper left hand side will be "10".

7) Tighten the head down in 2 steps, or "patterns".
The first one will be:
12,6,2,8,4,10.
The second one will be:
6,12,4,10,2,8.
Repeat these patterns, in the order I just laid out, placing one complete 360 degree revolution on each rod (which I call "a turn") the first time around, then use 180 degree revolutions (which I call a "1/2 turn") there after, until you've put 3 turns on each of the tension rods.

8 ) At this point, the head is evenly tensioned and fairly taught.
You may have heard some cracking or "popping" at this point, and that's fine.
Place the drum on the floor with the head you're working on looking up.
Now, place the heel of one of your hands in the center of the head and give one very hard, sharp, quick push.
DON'T BE A WIMP HERE! PUT YOUR WEIGHT INTO IT!
You may have heard more cracking at this point or you may not hear more cracking at this point.
Either is fine.

9) Now pick the drum off the floor and place it on a soft surface with the end you're working on looking up.
That old T-shirt (folded) you used to wipe the drum off with in the beginning would work fine.
If your bed has a comforter on it, that would be perfect.
The soft surface will completely muffle the other head so that you only hear the head you are tuning, which brings us to...

10) Remove all of the tension from the head you're working on.
Use the star patterns I laid out in step #7, until you feel the tension on the rods get pretty slack.
By that time, you probably won't need to use the key anymore.
Keep loosening the tension until the rods are no longer tensioning the head (look for an obvious gap between the head of the rod and the hoop).

11) Start tightening down on the head again with the rods, using the star patterns I showed in step #7.
This time, you will tension the head to whatever setting gives you the sound you're looking for.
Once you start to feel a little tension on the head, start tapping it in the middle after completing each star pattern, to see if the head is tensioned where you want it.

12) Once you reach that point, stop tightening and tap on the head at each point that corressponds with a tension rod, about 1/4" in from the edge.
You can use a stick or your finger, it really doesn't matter.

13) Tap each point once and listen to the drum.

14) If you hear a nice, even sound that is the same pitch at all the points, you're finished tuning this head and you’ll need to flip the tom over and perform the same procedure on the other head (ONLY if you're changing that one, too. If you're not, don't worry about it). The head is now tuned to where you want it to be and it should hold that tuning for as long as you want it to. At this point, with each head sounding good on its own, you can skip to step #21.

15) IF you hear a "wobbly" or "uneven" sound coming from some of those points, then the head is not tensioned evenly.
The sound you're hearing is known as distortion and is caused by the head creating several dissonant frequencies at once, due to the fact that it's seeing different tension in different spots of the head.
Dissonant frequencies are ones that do not harmonize with each other, thus resulting in the distorted sound you hear.

16) At this point, you'll need to "fine tune" the head.

17) Check around the head and see if that distorted sound isn't more prevelent at certain points more than others.
If so, try correcting those first.

18) Correct by tightening that tension rod, slightly.
Tap on the head once, at that tension rod, and tighten the rod as the sound decays.
You shouldn't have to turn the rod more than 1/4 of turn at a time.
If you do, then stop and tap the head at the rod that is on the exact opposite side of the drum and see if you don't hear the distorted sound coming from that one.
If so, do the same thing until the sound "evens out".

19) Tap around the head again and see if the distortion is still heard.

20) If so, do the same procedure at each of those rods as well.

21) Once you have everything sounding nice and "even" pick the drum up and hold it in your hand BY THE TOM BRACKET. NEVER HOLD IT BY THE RIM (you can also cradle it in your hand, if there’s no bracket on the tom).
The combination of the weight of the drum, your grip and the thickness of the hoop may be enough to throw the head "out of tune" at this point, if the drum is held by its rim.

22) Hit the middle of the drum while holding it up.

23) If it sounds "good", you're done.
If you still get that distortion, set the drum back down on the soft surface it was on and tap around the head again to see if you didn't miss anything.

24) If it sounds good, flip the drum over and tap around the edge of the other head.
Chances are it may have been out of tune and you didn't realize it until now.

25) If the distortion is heard with either head, correct those problems and perform step #22 again.

26) If, when you hold up the drum, you STILL get that distorted sound, go back and perform steps 23-25 and check the heads again.
If everything sounds good on it's own, then your heads are "out of phase" with each other (i.e., each head is tuned to a frequency that is dissonant to the other).
At this point, you'll have to pick one of those heads and retune it to a different pitch that will put the heads back "into phase".
Remember, the batter head sets the tone of the drum, the resonant head sets the amount of resonance of the drum.
The change will most likely not have to be that drastic and the sound of your drum may not change all that much.

27) Make the correction, perform step # 22 and see how the drum sounds.


...If everything sounds good, NOW you're done!

Chances are very good that you will NOT have to perform all 27 steps.
I just wanted to cover some basic problems you might encounter while trying to tune up the drum.

One of the most important points in tuning a drum, that most drummers overlook, is the "cracking" procedure.
You MUST find a way to form that head to the bearing edge, and stress the glue that may be holding the head material to the glue ring, or else you will stand a very good chance of encountering (unneccessary) problems with getting the head tuned up.
You can crank up the tension and leave it sit for a week, or use a hair dryer on it, or simply push down on the center of the head (like I do!).
Any of these procedures will form the head to the bearing edge (leaving it sit for a week works the worst, trust me on this one!).

One thing you don't wanna do is to push in on the SNARE SIDE head (that's the clear one on the bottom of the snare drum). It's too thin and doing that will leave a large depression in the head (it won't sound good).
Those heads are so thin, that you can just slap them on and tension them to where ever you like.


Hope you found this helpful.

Elvis

[alexsewell]

Hey guys, I'm just wondering, what would be a good tune, (as in notes - A B C Csharp etc.) for a rock tom set?

I have a 10", 12" and 14" and I'm wondering what tuning is usually used in rock / indie music. Thanks!

Edit: Also, my toms sound completely different when theyre on the rack, compared to when theyre off it - such as in my hand playing. When I hold it, I don't hold it by the heads, just by the rim, and they sound completely different to when theyre on the rack. Any suggestions?

[Hellwyck]

I never tune my drums to notes, I do it by pitches that compliment each other.



tuning all heads in unison?
That'd mean tuning every lug on every head at the same time.
How many hands do you have?

[TheCaptain]

Hello everyone!
So, I have a 16" floor tom, but it only has 6 lugs on it, instead of the (as far as I have seen) usual 8. With a drum that size, is that going to affect it's ability to tune very much?
And, if that turns out to be the case, is there anything I should take into consideration when tuning it?
Thanks in advance for any help :)

[Elvis]

Captain,

6 lug drums are usually indicitive of lower cost kits.
Student/Beginner sets almost always feature 6 lug shells.
I've had a slew of them over the years. Even the BD's were 6 lug on a few of those.
As the lug count goes down, the distance between each point in which force is applied to the rim increases.
This means the rim has more room to flex in those areas between the lugs.
Tuning can thus become a bit less precise.
Most people tend to prefer 8 lug shells over 6 luggers, but having owned both types, I don't really see much of a difference in the ability to tune.
The only time I ever wished I had more than 6 lugs available to me, is when a drum was difficult to tune, and in that case, sometimes other factors were at work to make that task difficult.
Lastly, if it really concerns you that much, there's three things you can do to eliviate the problem,

1) Switch from Triple Flanged Rims to Die-Cast Rims.

2) Cut the shell down to the point to where the mounting holes for the lugs no longer exist and redrill for however many lugs you prefer.

3) Sell it and get a 16" drum that already has more than 6 lugs.

...OR...

Simply accept the drum for what it is, tune it to a sound that works for you, and enjoy the fact that you have the freedom to express yourself in such a way as to bring much happiness into your life.



Elvis

[TheCaptain]

Elvis,

It is a low-end kit, an older Mapex V series, from when their logo didn't have the swoosh/circle around it.
I think I might try the Die-Cast Rims for a solution. I've been thinking about doing that for a while anyways.
And, of course, thank you very much for the help!

[TMB]

Yes also using a coated head for the resonance will help : )

[Paulmcxxx]

Here is something I did, it sounded good to my ears, maybe it isn't right so if someone could clue me in on something better...

I tuned my kit to the G major scale: Snare and Kick to the root, 10" to the 3rd, 12" to the 5th and 14" to the 7th.

The band I was playing in played pretty much everything in G, occasionally in A so I thought I was being clever...

[Typo]

Most floor toms that I have heard seem to sound good at a “B” or “C”. If both heads are tuned to say a B, the drum will sustain a lot and feel a tad mushy. If you tune the bottom head up three notes higher (a minor third) the sustain will be a bit less, and the drum will feel about right.
Aren't you contradicting yourself here? You say floor toms sound good at a B or C, but by tuning a B over B tom up to a B over D, the overall pitch isn't B or C, but an E. It does for me, at least.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think tuning the resonant head higher than the batter head produces a perceived overall pitch that is higher than either of individual heads' pitches. Maybe it seems like I'm just nitpicking, but I really want to understand, and thus master, the tuning of my drums. I tuned my 10" tom to a B over D, resulting in an E. I tuned my 12" tom to an F sharp over A resulting in a B. They sound great! I'm just a little confused about what two pitches make what and why.

[wsabol]

Aren't you contradicting yourself here? You say floor toms sound good at a B or C, but by tuning a B over B tom up to a B over D, the overall pitch isn't B or C, but an E. It does for me, at least.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think tuning the resonant head higher than the batter head produces a perceived overall pitch that is higher than either of individual heads' pitches. Maybe it seems like I'm just nitpicking, but I really want to understand, and thus master, the tuning of my drums. I tuned my 10" tom to a B over D, resulting in an E. I tuned my 12" tom to an F sharp over A resulting in a B. They sound great! I'm just a little confused about what two pitches make what and why.

I think I understand your problem. You have to understand, when you are tuning and have the opposite head sitting on carpet or something, the pitch you hear when you are tuning is the second harmonic - a fifth up. If you try to excite the first harmonic by playing in the center while tuning, you get a really dead sound.. the 100% damped reso head is preventing the whole head from resonating, hence the 2 harmonic while sound because it only needs half the head to resonate. Then when you pick the tom up and a hit it, you hear the first harmonic. Thats why you are hearing E when you tune to B, and B when you tune to F#.

I am fairly certain that the drum resonates at the pitch of the lowest head. So if you tuned the reso head lower than the batter, you'd hear the pitch of the reso, and the batter pitch will just be an overtone.

[Typo]

I think I understand your problem. You have to understand, when you are tuning and have the opposite head sitting on carpet or something, the pitch you hear when you are tuning is the second harmonic - a fifth up. If you try to excite the first harmonic by playing in the center while tuning, you get a really dead sound.. the 100% damped reso head is preventing the whole head from resonating, hence the 2 harmonic while sound because it only needs half the head to resonate. Then when you pick the tom up and a hit it, you hear the first harmonic. Thats why you are hearing E when you tune to B, and B when you tune to F#.

I am fairly certain that the drum resonates at the pitch of the lowest head. So if you tuned the reso head lower than the batter, you'd hear the pitch of the reso, and the batter pitch will just be an overtone.
Oh, okay, so if I wanted my tom to resonate at a D I would tune the batter (assuming it is looser tensioned than the resonant) to a fifth lower, which would be an A? And that would be because A is the only pitch I am hearing with the resonant head muffled, correct?

Does this mean that if I wanted to have a B over D floor tom, I would have to tune it (with opposite head muffling method) to what I hear as a F# over A?

Bear with me, as I'm having a lot of trouble grasping this concept. Every time I think I've gotten it, something else confuses me, and then the whole thing falls apart.

[wsabol]

Oh, okay, so if I wanted my tom to resonate at a D I would tune the batter (assuming it is looser tensioned than the resonant) to a fifth lower, which would be an A? And that would be because A is the only pitch I am hearing with the resonant head muffled, correct?

Does this mean that if I wanted to have a B over D floor tom, I would have to tune it (with opposite head muffling method) to what I hear as a F# over A?

Bear with me, as I'm having a lot of trouble grasping this concept. Every time I think I've gotten it, something else confuses me, and then the whole thing falls apart.

Yes, you are getting the concept perfectly. Remember, the second harmonic is a fifth above the fundamental. So, yes, if you want your fundamentals to be B over D, the second harmonics would be F# over A.

[Typo]

Okay, at this point I've tuned my 10" tom to several pitches from a B up to an E (the first harmonic this time, not the second harmonic) and all of them suffer from the same problem to which I don't know the solution: instantly after a hard hit, there is an ugly upwards pitch bend for maybe half a second, and then it calms down to the beautiful note that I want to hear. Is this an equipment problem (head, actual drum) or can this be fixed with tuning?

[dustindb]

hi, i have a 8 years old Tama Rockstar kit..recently i want to re-tune my 12" tom and 16" floor tom on my rockstar kit..do you have any suggestion about the drum heads i have to use?id like to use it for blues music, which is IMO required warm sound, and medium or long sustained sound..i thought of remo emperor coated (batter) - ambassador coated (reso) for my 12" and 16" toms..is it cool with that? :D thanks

[Mr.L]

hi, i have a 8 years old Tama Rockstar kit..recently i want to re-tune my 12" tom and 16" floor tom on my rockstar kit..do you have any suggestion about the drum heads i have to use?id like to use it for blues music, which is IMO required warm sound, and medium or long sustained sound..i thought of remo emperor coated (batter) - ambassador coated (reso) for my 12" and 16" toms..is it cool with that? :D thanks

The head combo sounds good for that warm, sustaining sound. Tuning accounts for 70-80% of the sound, but that combo should help you get there. Good luck.

[dustindb]

The head combo sounds good for that warm, sustaining sound. Tuning accounts for 70-80% of the sound, but that combo should help you get there. Good luck.

thanks for the advice!!ill give it a shot soon

[PearlDrummer1995]

Okay, at this point I've tuned my 10" tom to several pitches from a B up to an E (the first harmonic this time, not the second harmonic) and all of them suffer from the same problem to which I don't know the solution: instantly after a hard hit, there is an ugly upwards pitch bend for maybe half a second, and then it calms down to the beautiful note that I want to hear. Is this an equipment problem (head, actual drum) or can this be fixed with tuning?

I believe this is due to lack of changing of the resonance head, as this happened to me and now that I have changed my resonance heads. it sounds a lot better.

[Sjogras]

Hey, I have purchased a 16" floor tom, and I could really need some help with this one. I tuned the 14" and 16" quite low, which is how I want them, but they "growl" way too much for my taste. When I tuned them up a bit the growling was reduced, but that sound would fit a jazz kit better, I mainly play rock.

Is there any specific note thats "good" for the batter heads? If I just get in to the ballpark on the batter I can easily tune the reso until the drum sounds nice.

Also, is there any application online that plays notes for reference?

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

I tuned the 14" and 16" quite low, which is how I want them, but they "growl" way too much for my taste. When I tuned them up a bit the growling was reduced, but that sound would fit a jazz kit better, I mainly play rock.

Is there any specific note thats "good" for the batter heads? If I just get in to the ballpark on the batter I can easily tune the reso until the drum sounds nice.

Also, is there any application online that plays notes for reference?

Try pitching the reso head up a bit.

A "good" note for the batter head will be determined by each individual drum.

Even many cheap metronomes have reference tones for tuning. Google may lead you to an online version.

[Typo]

I believe this is due to lack of changing of the resonance head, as this happened to me and now that I have changed my resonance heads. it sounds a lot better.
I changed and it does sound better. But I only had the old ones on for six months, would that be enough? I also wonder how pre muffled heads affect pitchbend, because these new heads are clear Emperors as opposed to my previous heads, which were the muffled Super 2's with SX ring. One difference I have noticed is that these Remo's seem to have quite a bit more attack than the Aquarians. They sound great, though.

[jorn]

My kit is 10, 12 Tom, 14, 16 floor, 22 kick, 14 snare.
I would like to tune them to a piano with the reso 1/3 above the batter for the Toms.
Also with the appropriate interval between the toms.
I would appreciate if some one could advise me the correct note for each drum(batter and reso).

Thx

Jorn

[jorn]

Bumpage - I would really appreciate your help.

thx

jorn.

[Jamie the drummer]

Hey guys I'm just getting into learning as much as I can about how different factors influence the sound of a drum (tuning, head type, dimensions of the shell, types of wood(s) used in the shell, plies, number of plies, bearing edges etc. Could any one recommend some useful websites etc that I could go to to start me on my quest? All help is much appreciated.

[mikeo]

i would just like to post my recent findings on my club jazz kit... the 12 inch tom was always suffering with serious overtones when i tried to pitch it up... i have now found that tuning the reso lower and the batter higher on that drum is how to get the pitch of the drum to come through... whereas on the 14 inch floor tom, reso higher and batter lower works... experimenting is the key i guess...

[Doctor Dirt]

I tune my drum heads to the sound of the drum. I knock on the middle of the drum shell then tune the bottom head to what I hear. Then I go to the batter head and repeat the process. This is helpfull with top toms especially if their in conflict with the snare wires as long as the snare is set up correctly. After I tune the shells to themself, I go for my overall sound but don't stray to far from the drums individual sound. I don't see people using this technique when they buy drums. It sure makes buying them easier when you know that the shells are IN tune to your liking. Doc

[checodrum25]

Yeah to me tuning is fun I like it its a mystery its self
I try to choose heads depending on the sound and music
iam playing usually overall remo emperor coated or clear
works for me , and I never used a drumdial unitl today it does
wonders for us drummers , honestly , I had gotten alots of
comments on my tuning before using the drum dial , every where
I played studio or live , when I check the tension last week on my
tuning rods I was a little off , these thing really works , tells you
the correct tension on each rod believe me , it works

[tard]

A drum dial will get you close but you still need to do it by ear. Just because it says the head tension is the same at each tension rod doesnt mean they will sound the same, I have tried them and it now sits in my bag unused. Its faster to finger tighten all the rods the same then turn each one the same amount till you get where you want and do the tap test. Drum dials and torque keys can lie to you. I have seen drum dials say the head is tight at a tension screw but you can screw it out with your finger and I have seen torque keys say tension rod is not tight yet but the tap test says it way too tight. In theory they should work but inconsistencies in the thickness of the head material, tension screws and lugs render them unreliable. Like I said my drum dial now sits in my bag unused and the only thing I use a torque key for now is in between songs at a gig to quickly tighten a tension rod on a snare that has come loose from an overabundance of rim shots. The only thing I have seen that actually can tune a drum faster and easier than your ear is the resotune but its $350 and unnecessary in my opinion unless your tuning drums on a daily basis.

http://www.resotune.com/

[bobby2stix]

Hi all....I personally tune the reso head to the shell itself, then repeat with the batter head.....that gives me a baseline sound with the heads in pitch with the shell....after all that I leave the batter alone for the most part and just pitch the reso head to get the desired effect, for example, I like a little sustain with a sharp dropping finish...so I go about 1/2 to 3/4 turn upward on the reso head. Thats my own personal method and Ive heard pros and cons to it, but for my money, this method always gets me where I need to be tonally without a whole lot of hassle. Thats my 2 cents anyway
Bob

[GRG]

I tune my drum heads to the sound of the drum. I knock on the middle of the drum shell then tune the bottom head to what I hear. Then I go to the batter head and repeat the process. This is helpfull with top toms especially if their in conflict with the snare wires as long as the snare is set up correctly. After I tune the shells to themself, I go for my overall sound but don't stray to far from the drums individual sound. I don't see people using this technique when they buy drums. It sure makes buying them easier when you know that the shells are IN tune to your liking. Doc

This is a great "fool-proof" technique for getting a good sound. It allows the drum to vibrate in its most nature manner. It is the technique advocated by John Good of DW, who Neil Peart calls "The Wood Whisperer." Two guys that know a bit a drums. Once Good gets the reso head tuned to the drum's fundamental sound/pitch then he repeats this with the top head and even takes the top head above the reso head by a crank or so. Best part is it only takes a couple of minutes- time that is better spent playing rather than tuning/retuning/tuning again...

I am blown away by the over-thinking that is going on in this thread. Rarely is it wise try to force a drum to a particular pitch. The drum will tell you when it's ready to be played.

[scarlit]

I've been using that "fist" method lately. Very easy and quick. Finger tight, then press your fist lightly in the middle, tune up just so the wrinkles are gone. Same thing with the resonant, but I add a quarter or half turn to get a little pitch bend going. Fine tune if needed. This is what you would probably call medium-low tuning, I am not a fan of high pitched toms.

[scoopyx]

Well seeing the wrinkles disappear is all right for clear heads, but what do you guys do when installing coated heads?
Wrinkles aren't as easy to see, are they?
Just wondering...

scoopyx.

[StephensDrumShed]

Here's a short video I posted on tom tuning. It's not the perfect way...it's my way. There are certain rules and guidelines to follow, but in the end your ear is your best guide.

Hope some of the tips in this one help

How To Tune Your Drums: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iZv_MOKtxc

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

How To Tune Your Drums: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iZv_MOKtxc

Nice vid mate. I subscribe to a very similar school of thought regarding tuning. Good to see the relationship between batter and reso explained. That one is often skimmed over or overlooked altogether. Your observations on keeping the hoop and tension screws in the same position was interesting too.

I can see this being useful to many. It'll make a nice addition to the frequently referenced Gatzen videos too. I'll certainly recommend it.

Great job!!

[tard]

I stopped watching when he said to press down 4 or 5 times in the center of the head, which is old school seating and not recomended by head makers anymore except for remo and only on their vintage polyester heads, doing this to the new mylar heads with new construction processes can damage heads as well as reduce their life expectancy, trust me, i stopped "seating" heads several years ago after ruining 5 out of 9 new heads before calling the head company only to have them tell me this.


Here's a short video I posted on tom tuning. It's not the perfect way...it's my way. There are certain rules and guidelines to follow, but in the end your ear is your best guide.

Hope some of the tips in this one help

How To Tune Your Drums: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iZv_MOKtxc

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

I stopped watching when he said to press down 4 or 5 times in the center of the head, which is old school seating and not recomended by head makers anymore except for remo and only on their vintage polyester heads, doing this to the new mylar heads with new construction processes can damage heads, trust me, i stopped "seating" heads several years ago after ruining 5 out of 9 new heads before calling the head company only to have them tell me this.

I still seat my heads....purely out of habit as that's the way I was taught to do it. I tend to agree, it's a step that has been more or less rendered obsolete in this day and age. But personally speaking, I've never ruined a head by seating it. Whilst probably not necessary, I've never found it detrimental either.

Outside of the seating preference though, I still reckon there's some good info and explanations for newer players or those with little tuning experience.

[Sjogras]

Some time ago I found this, http://www.seventhstring.com/tuningfork/tuningfork.html which is a software that plays notes. Obviously, a guitar or piano does the same thing but a software is always in tune :)

Knowing the pitches that work well for different drums has really helped to increase my knowledge about tuning, and for me it's much easier to aim at a specific pitch than simply hearing when the head itself sounds best, but I guess this will gradually change over time, as the routine for tuning gets better.

[Doctor Dirt]

GRG; I don't know either of the fellows you meantioned but I've been tuning this way since 1960 I was taught this by my first teacher and I know it works for the DRUM, not just for ME!!! This is the best way to buy drums too, the drums talk to to you and tell you what they sound like. Its so simple no one gets it, sad state of affairs when drummers don't know how to tune their instruments and are afraid to ask a soundman to set their monitor mix up they way they need it to be. Man some cats just need to "grow some"!! Doc

[THC]

Frustrating to say the least.

Wondering if you guys can give some further direction.

I bought a Mapex Meridian Birch kit earlier this year and I've been having a hell of a time getting what I think is a good sound out of them. They always seem dull and lifeless.

I've tried a few different types of heads along with countless hours of tweaking. I've used the stock Mapex heads, Remo Powerstroke 3's and Evan's EC2's over G1's, which is what I have on there now. I also played around with different combinations of all these heads. I don't use any muffling, gels, or rings.

I think I have the basic process down, but for some reason can't seem to get a sound I'm happy with.

Last night I followed this video tutorial after seeing it in this thread and I tried it again. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iZv_MOKtxc

Here's my process simplified.
1. Remove both heads
2. Clean bearing edges.
3. Starting with batter head, I put the head and the hoop on, finger tighten the lugs.
4. I push down in the center of the head, and using a star pattern, I tighten each lug to the point that the wrinkles diappear. Usually about 1-1.25 turns from first contact.
5. Then I tune each lug so they sound as close to the same tone as possible.
6. I turn over the drum and repeat the process for the reso head.
7. Once they are individually tuned, then I try to tune the reso head to the same tone as the batter head.
When I say tone, I am listening to both the initial tap sound, but more than that, the overtone ring that follows immediately after the hit. I try to match those tones.

This process usually takes about an hour per drum. The longest time being tuning the individual lugs to one another.

After all that, I put the drums back on the kit and am usually disappointed with the first whack. Still just doesn't sound right, AND the drums never sound good together. So then I start making small tweaks on the kit to try and get them sounding good and end up making it worse. It's very possible they are perfectly tuned and it's just the driver seat sound that doesn't sound right to me. As far as I know, I've never played a properly tuned kit, so I don't have anything to compare it to. I also don't really know what sound I'm looking for, or even how to describe what I currently have.

Questions:
When I first get the initial tension set and I start to tune individual lugs, I go around the drum and tap about an inch in at each lug. Initially there could be 3-6 different tones coming from all the lugs if they are at different degrees of tension. How do I know which one to choose as the tone I want to tune all the remaining lugs to?

Are my head choices so far too thick? Should I be using thinner ply heads?

I see a lot of guys in YT videos making 1/4 and 1/2 turn adjustments at a time. When I make lug adjustments, I seem to have to work in micro increments. Usually a 1/12th of a turn at a time. It seems like one setting is too lose and the head is flappy and dull, I'll make a small 1/8th turn maybe, then it sounds too tight and choked.

I've tried tuning the batter up/down. I've played with the reso up/down. Just trying all different combinations of tension on both heads.

One method I've tried is the "approach method". I get the lugs finger tight, then I make a tiny 1/12th of a turn adjustment around the head and give it a couple hits. If it's too loose, I make another micro adjustment and test it again.
I'll keep doing this. Inching it up a tiny bit at a time until the sound goes too tight, then I back it off a bit and re-approach the setting it sounded best at. Even then it's not great.


If it matters, It's going to be a long time before I have any real concerns about projection, cutting through other instruments, overtones getting buried under other instruments, or how the "audience" is going to hear my kit. I am my only audience 99% of the time, and I'm usually playing at lower volumes in my basement. I mostly want my kit to sound good from the drivers seat.


Any advice is much appreciated. Thx

[tard]

Ive never been able to get the sound I like from a 2 ply head. I use aquarian studio-x over classic clears. After I finger tighten them I work them up a 1/2 turn at a time to 1 full turn which seems to be the sweet spot on my drums (you can find it by holding the drum by the mount and tapping the shell with no heads on it to get the pitch of the shell), then I tap tune to the lowest pitch lug on the batter head and the highest pitch lug on the reso, which leaves the reso just a bit higher in pitch than the batter, steve gadd used to tune his batter and reso the same and let the batter detune after playing it for a while but I find the newer mylar heads dont seem to stretch as much or as quickly as the older polyester ones and roy burns suggests tuning the reso a bit higher in pitch than the batter as well. Plus its easier and faster than trying to get them both exactly the same anyway. This usually takes me about 10 min to tune a drum this way.

[Sjogras]

Any advice is much appreciated. Thx

What are the sizes, approximately which pitches are you tuning to? I came to a point where
I realized I was tuning all my drums too low, after which everything just got a lot easier, I had been tuning my 12" to a G or lower for instance, when A or B was a lot better for that size.

If you have been tuning and retuning the heads a few times I've noticed they get harder to tune too, you might just want to restart all over, get new heads and do some investigation regarding which pitches should work for your drums.

At your step #4, I never push down, use two drum keys instead. I do like you however, tune up (but with 2 drum keys) with 1/16 or 1/8 turns at a time, and carefully check for pitch differences even when the drum isn't even near the desired pitch. My goal is to keep the head evenly tensioned at all times, this seems to work for me.

Good luck!

[Netz Ausg]

THC - the heads you mentioned are all the pre-EQ sound control types. Try a more open/natural head - G1 or G2 for instance.

[moojii]

hey

i was having a hard time tuning my meridian birch using my drum dial (i know, lazy method) so i watched the bob gantzen video and a few others.

i decided to give it a go tuning by ear, it took a while.

eventually i have managed to get a great sound out of the toms and i am proud that i did it all by ear.

anyone want a drum dial??

[tard]

anyone want a drum dial??

No thanks, got one I dont use now...lol