How fast is your Left hand? (also your right)

[Latin Groover]

I though id try this today so i did it 1.5 hrs ago while i was practicing. I got this idea from when i watched that video with Jim Chapin onn the Vic Virth site. He is demoing the Moeller technique although all hes really doing is proving how good it works he doesnt actually show u how to to it, but anyway.

How fast can you do triplets, eight notes and sixteenth notes with each hand. Remember they have to be evenly spaced, same volume and play the accent on the quarter notes. Imo i have a bit of speed not much average for how long ive been learning i spose, but u have to stay really relaxed the whole time. Oh and you have to hold it going constant for 1min. Try it see how fast you can get, but remeber the main factors.

Evenly spaced
Same volume
Accented quarters
Stay relaxed
1min
Also i tried to have it so the sub-division notes where played as soft as i could which loses some speed but gets them sounding perfect!

Heres my first go at it.
Constant 1min Speed Top Speed (Could only hold for 10sec)
Right hand Eigths 165 BPM 195 BPM
Left Hand Eights 160 BPM 165 BPM
Right Hand Triplets 120 BMP 135 BPM
Left hand Triplets 115 BPM 135 BPM
Right Hand Sixteenth 90 BPM 100 BPM
Laft Hand Sixteenth 90 BPM 100 BPM


Don't cheat either cause ur only cheating urself.

Well i did type it out as 2 columbs but it wont work so the left columb is my constant speed for a minute and the 2nd is my top speed which i could only hold for 10 sec. And when recording ur top speed u have to hold it 4 10sec.

[vince]

You're not talking about music, but just about physical performance... :'-(

[moosryan]

are you playing them all even, or accenting 1, 2,3 and 4. I know its not musical, but it just might be fun to see where everyone else is at?

[DrumNut]

Jo jo mayer has an incredible left hand, Ringo Starr is a lefty too

[Latin Groover]

are you playing them all even, or accenting 1, 2,3 and 4. I know its not musical, but it just might be fun to see where everyone else is at?

Its not really musical i know but yea just a bit of fun to see were everyone else is at.

And this improves your endurance and stamina.

And i am playing them all even but im accenting on the quarter notes.

So example 1 + a 2 + a 3 + a 4 + a

1 e + a 2 e + a 3 e + a 4 e + a

And so on. But this also works on the accurcy of the spreading of your notes.

But i mainly practice them of say setting the metronome at 115 then do alternating bars of triplets. So 1 bar with right hand then one with the left and so on. Thats how i normally do them.

[jonescrusher]

Your speed is good, just need to strengthen the syntax, punctuation and grammar.

In the interests of fair play we would need to post video evidence of performances, no?

[Latin Groover]

Ha i have no idea wat syntax is but im sure ull tell me.

[DogBreath]

Your speed is good, just need to strengthen the syntax, punctuation and grammar.

In the interests of fair play we would need to post video evidence of performances, no?
In your first sentence, the initial comma should either be replaced by a semicolon or it should be followed by a restating of the subject "you" (which I would recommend preceding with a subordinating conjunction such as “however"). Also, I personally would have followed the word "punctuation” with a serial comma, as recommended by both Harvard in the U.S. and Oxford in the U.K., due to the ambiguity so often caused by its omission.

I'll not deign to respond to the pretentious phrasing of your second sentence.

[Ashbash]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[JohnMunsey]

Grammar hammer! lol

Here are triplets at over 200 bpm with the left hand. I am more than half way here lol

http://www.artverdi.com/video/triplets214.wmv

[skaman]

Right hand 120 BPM sixteens for 1 min
Left hand 115 BPM sixateens for 1 min

Just kidding. :o)

But I am aimig for something like that. So I hope that in few years I will achieve the goals.

[jonescrusher]

Hehehe- fair play DB, at least it was understandable on the first take (smiley here). The first post took a few attempts.
As for the second sentence, pretension was never my intention - Latin Groover's idea could be fun. I've never seen people post video's of their playing outside of the Your Place section. Would we be allowed to post videos in a thread like this?
Bosh. Sorted.

[NUTHA JASON]

dats coz knot evry won here is a first language inglish speakers. we does your best.
j

[Latin Groover]

LOL. Coming along nicely NJ, just need a few more lessons.

[jonescrusher]

LatinGroover - syntax is about rules of word combination in forming grammatically correct sentences. Apologies for my earlier post, it was late when i read it and i was getting boggly eyed. I'll post my scores up tomorrow. peace

[Lil' Drummer Boy]

My Left Hand Isn't The Quickest! I Need To Work On It!!!

[Slayer_metal_head]

Not fast enough but i can finally do a grincore blast beat with my left hand riding!!!

[math_metal_182]

I'm not entirely sure how fast my left hand is, but it should be pretty fast seeing as I only use my left hand to play. I'm not left handed, or have lost my right hand or anything, I just think that it is 'cheating' to use both hands, like it is cheating to use double bass. If you only use one hand, in the end you should be a pretty good player. I don't use double bass either, and like my screen-name suggests, I play a lot of math and tech metal, and get by fine. By the way, doesn't it sometimes get to you that there is so much you will never be able to do in drumming...for example, play at the speed of light with one finger, or play along to an infinate number of completely different songs at different tempo's and time signatures and tuplet values, at the same time. You will never be able to play more than 4 different things at once without using electronics because you only have 4 limbs, or play so fast on the bass drum (even with double bass) that all your hits blend together to make a note of a definate pitch and you can play actual melodies on your bass drum (or any drum). You will never be able to even play a groove in exact timing, so you snare lands within the nano-micro-whatever second, right where it is meant to. The ultimate aim of any drummer should be to be able to control time itself, and it is something we will probably never achieve, so what is the point?

[jonescrusher]

By the way, doesn't it sometimes get to you that there is so much you will never be able to do in drumming...for example, play at the speed of light with one finger, or play along to an infinate number of completely different songs at different tempo's and time signatures and tuplet values, at the same time. You will never be able to play more than 4 different things at once without using electronics because you only have 4 limbs, or play so fast on the bass drum (even with double bass) that all your hits blend together to make a note of a definate pitch and you can play actual melodies on your bass drum (or any drum). You will never be able to even play a groove in exact timing, so you snare lands within the nano-micro-whatever second, right where it is meant to. The ultimate aim of any drummer should be to be able to control time itself, and it is something we will probably never achieve, so what is the point?

There's always someone that'll prove you wrong one day. Never say never.....

[Casper "DrPowerStroke" Paludan]

You will never be able to even play a groove in exact timing, so you snare lands within the nano-micro-whatever second, right where it is meant to. The ultimate aim of any drummer should be to be able to control time itself, and it is something we will probably never achieve, so what is the point?
Drumming done by humans is rooted in nature whether you like it or not, and nature was never into nano-second precision.

The rest I just don't agree with. How is anything cheating? I could at least follow your toughts if you said using electronics were cheating, but using both hands is cheating? Way beyond me there. Happy New Year! DPS

[Casper "DrPowerStroke" Paludan]

There is lots of comosion about the dbl bass pedal being cheating or not, but that thread is not called " How fast is your Left hand? (also your right)". So if u want to argue that go to another thread, but what the hell!? "Two hands is cheating." If u have a spare limb y don't u wish to use it. As for the dbl bass pedal sum people say that using it is cheating cause that is not ur left legs main prioty, it's main prioty is the hihat w/f. So its then has 2 tasks, and thats fair to argue that, but what 2 tasks does ur right hand have!? None. Its just beyond me why u wouldnt use 2 hands. Its not like with ur foot. If u don't use a dbl bass pedal ur foot has sumthing else to do, ur hihat w/f, but if u dont use ur right hand hand it has nothing to do. Do u just let it sit there, hanging. Aruge this, but in another thread.

P.S. Whats the heck is Math metal?

Lets stay on topic.
I think math metal, like math rock, is a music that primarily concerns itself with strange meter and tempo changes, unusual subdivisions, anything you can "work out". And I guess it often leads to existential exclamations like "using both hands to play deums is cheating". Well, it takes all kinds...Happy New Year, DPS

[Henry II]

Its not really musical i know but yea just a bit of fun to see were everyone else is at.

And this improves your endurance and stamina.

And i am playing them all even but im accenting on the quarter notes.

So example 1 + a 2 + a 3 + a 4 + a

1 e + a 2 e + a 3 e + a 4 e + a

And so on. But this also works on the accurcy of the spreading of your notes.

But i mainly practice them of say setting the metronome at 115 then do alternating bars of triplets. So 1 bar with right hand then one with the left and so on. Thats how i normally do them.

Actually, my left hand is a little faster and more endurant than my right. I'm not sure why. It's just more relaxed I suppose.

If you're talking about 16 on a hand (alternating 1 bar of 16th notes per hand), I can play up to 116 left and 112 right with the Gladstone method. With the Moeller method I can get up to about 120 with each hand. Danny Gottlieb said in Modern Drummer that he does that exercise for 1/2 hour each day as a warm up at 170bpm. :o

If you're talking about 12 on a hand (1 bar of 8th note triplets), I can get up to about 152/144 with the Gladstone method, and a little faster with the Moeller method.

[DogBreath]

Every time sum1 tries to correct sum1 elses grammer on this forum, DogBreath or Nutha are all over it. They shut everyone down! Ha. So wats syntax, something in grammer i spose.
I just want to point out, in all fairness, that I don't correct mistakes in spelling, punctuation, or grammar except to those who make mistakes while trying to correct others. There's just something funny to me about that. Fear the Grammar Hammer.

[Teejay]

WoW! Dogbreath, i don't post here all too often.... but your Grammar Hammer is too much to pass up! That's hilarious.... and by the way, my left hand is not as fast.

Grammar Hammer.... that completely made my day... I fear that Grammar Hammer something fierce...

Thanks for the good laugh Dogbreath. I love this site!

[jonescrusher]

But surely people could read over their post just to make sure that key words are spelt correctly. Some of the abbreviations that crop up aren't universally understood yet either. Clearly i'm being a complete arse about the whole issue so i'll shut up about it for evermore:)

[Henry II]

But surely people could read over their post just to make sure that key words are spelt correctly. Some of the abbreviations that crop up aren't universally understood yet either. Clearly i'm being a complete arse about the whole issue so i'll shut up about it for evermore:)

Ehem! "Spelt" is a species of grain. You can make bread out of it if you like. Perhaps you meant "spelled."

[theduke86]

Just tested myself, without a decent warmup I could do 112 for as long as I wanted. I'd probably get to 116 if I warmed up properly. I'll try again later. I'm just using fingers to do this, really, no Moeller or Gladstone. Maybe I should look into these grips.

[DruminDan52790]

My left is faster and more endured than my right but im also left handed

[jonescrusher]

Just tried accented 8th notes over a minute - LH = 190bpm RH = 185bpm, am left handed, and I found that accenting the downbeats using Moeller made it easier. I tried over a minute without accenting and scores were about 10bpm less on each hand. Will try 16th next.

[Latin Groover]

Just tried accented 8th notes over a minute - LH = 190bpm RH = 185bpm, am left handed, and I found that accenting the downbeats using Moeller made it easier. I tried over a minute without accenting and scores were about 10bpm less on each hand. Will try 16th next.

Thats sum good speed.

[carlgough]

This was the closest thread I could find.

I'm having a bit of a nightmare tonight (same one as last night).

My band are doing a song with a kind of slow groove feel. It sounds best in 16's and I want to play it single handed because it sounds less wooden.

Ideally I think it should run at 90 bpm but I can't get beyond 85 bpm (which I could play all night). The bass pattern is a little syncopated (nothing too serious) but it's not helping my hand slip into the groove.

I'm practicing at home on my e-kit and the thing that's really pissing me off is that I had it nailed 2 tonights ago - Comfortably - Yet I put 5 hours practice in yesterday and 2 hours tonight and I have regressed.

I don't cope very well with regression - I want to burn everything own and the muscle in my upper forearm wishes it belonged to someone else.

I suspect a technique problem here - I'm using fingers to get the speed and it's not as though much of the work is coming from the elbow and forearm !!!

I wish that something would just click like it usually does when you persist for long enough.

I love my drums but they can be a set of complete bastards also (is swearing allowed on here?)

[centralzeke]

I just want to say there's a clip on this site of Louie Bellson playing sixteenth notes with his right hand (one hand!!) at approximately 174 BPM.

I don't know how this is possible.........................

[Latin Groover]

This was the closest thread I could find.

I'm having a bit of a nightmare tonight (same one as last night).

My band are doing a song with a kind of slow groove feel. It sounds best in 16's and I want to play it single handed because it sounds less wooden.

Ideally I think it should run at 90 bpm but I can't get beyond 85 bpm (which I could play all night). The bass pattern is a little syncopated (nothing too serious) but it's not helping my hand slip into the groove.

I'm practicing at home on my e-kit and the thing that's really pissing me off is that I had it nailed 2 tonights ago - Comfortably - Yet I put 5 hours practice in yesterday and 2 hours tonight and I have regressed.

I don't cope very well with regression - I want to burn everything own and the muscle in my upper forearm wishes it belonged to someone else.

I suspect a technique problem here - I'm using fingers to get the speed and it's not as though much of the work is coming from the elbow and forearm !!!

I wish that something would just click like it usually does when you persist for long enough.

I love my drums but they can be a set of complete bastards also (is swearing allowed on here?)

I know wat u mean. Playing a 16th note groove at a slower tempo can ruin it sumtimes. Using two hands really brings out the minute hitting hradness of each hand and can alter the sound fairly greatly suumtimes. Maybe instead of trying to get your right hand faster, maybe you should try working on getting your singles perfect. (I mean alot better, no1s perfect.) This would help you with the groove and also would get you more progressed in your singles, and rolls.

[Scatman]

most drummers start off with wrists and as the speed gets faster they apply fingers

[bigfatbobby]

What would you define as "fast/good"?

Felix

[jazzsnob]

I'm not entirely sure how fast my left hand is, but it should be pretty fast seeing as I only use my left hand to play. I'm not left handed, or have lost my right hand or anything, I just think that it is 'cheating' to use both hands, like it is cheating to use double bass. If you only use one hand, in the end you should be a pretty good player. I don't use double bass either, and like my screen-name suggests, I play a lot of math and tech metal, and get by fine. By the way, doesn't it sometimes get to you that there is so much you will never be able to do in drumming...for example, play at the speed of light with one finger, or play along to an infinate number of completely different songs at different tempo's and time signatures and tuplet values, at the same time. You will never be able to play more than 4 different things at once without using electronics because you only have 4 limbs, or play so fast on the bass drum (even with double bass) that all your hits blend together to make a note of a definate pitch and you can play actual melodies on your bass drum (or any drum). You will never be able to even play a groove in exact timing, so you snare lands within the nano-micro-whatever second, right where it is meant to. The ultimate aim of any drummer should be to be able to control time itself, and it is something we will probably never achieve, so what is the point?

What the hell kind of music do you listen to if you think those are goals for a drummer?

(i'm half disgusted and half HIGHLY interested)

You seem to be going for a seriously edgy vibe man, great work. Sucks you can't do double strokes though.


As far as my speed goes, I can do low singles at 176 for 5 minutes. Try that on for size, bitchez!*





*i'm kidding, even though that's a good number.

[Latin Groover]

As far as my speed goes, I can do low singles at 176 for 5 minutes. Try that on for size, bitchez!*

*i'm kidding, even though that's a good number.

Whoa i totally forgot about this thread, it was ages ago. Anyway 176 16ths for 5mins...and i know how perfect your strokes and technique would be jazzsnob, thats quite a high number how long did it take you to work the 4bpm increaments up to that?

[jazzsnob]

Whoa i totally forgot about this thread, it was ages ago. Anyway 176 16ths for 5mins...and i know how perfect your strokes and technique would be jazzsnob, thats quite a high number how long did it take you to work the 4bpm increaments up to that?

About seven years, give or take. But I didn't just start at a tempo and go up in increments, I've done two singles exercises over the years. First I would do a bar of eighths and a bar of 16ths, all while keeping it even and low. It took me about 4 years to get that to 208 or whatever, then I went back to 112 or so and did straight 16ths, and I've gotten to 176 after 3 years. I've been working at 176 for 3 months and I probably have three months before I even think about 184.

[Latin Groover]

Great job i wish i can as much control as you have, i do that exercise too. I do a bar of 8ths then 16ths. And also other variations on it. Like 2notes of 8ths then 2notes of 16ths etc. All while keeping low, relaxed and even. Although its getting a bit hard now cause i need some new 7As, cause my tips are starting to sound uneven on the pad, ha i really need new sticks. While im on this. 'Pitch paired' sticks my @ss, Vic Firth are no where near pitch paired, i have a pair of Rock sticks that i sometimes use on the pad, and its like hitting 2 different pads! No stick is ever pitch paired though (that ive had) they come close but there is always that miunte ppitch difference you can pick up on the pad, but Vic Firth are the furthest away from pitch paired IMO...and its their motto

[anthony]

Dave Weckl actually has an excercise for finger control where you have to play 4 series of 8th note triplets with out stopping for 10x each starting with the right hand.

I start out at 130 and work my way up to 160bpm. The great thing about this excercise is that it will build your speed and endurance. You play each excercise 10x one right into the next. After you get finished the first series you rest for about 30 seconds, move the tempo marking on the metronome up and start up again. You play these with no dynamics or accents.

The third set of triplets are in 3/4 quarter time.The excercise looks like this: I count the triplets 1 T L , 2 T L , 3 T L, 4 T L


RRR, LLL, RRR, LLL


RRR, RRR, LLL, LLL


RRR, RRR, RRR, LLL, LLL, LLL 3/4 time


RRR, RRR, RRR, RRR, LLL, LLL, LLL, LLL

This whole excercise is based on bounce and controlling the rebound. It will get your left hand moving as well as your right. They have helped me alot.

Have a great night everyone.
www.anthonyliberto.com

[Tex12]

Does the left hand really get stronger if used more than normal in everyday living
Like shaving and brushing your teeth and eating with the left hand

[zambizzi]

On that note (bwuahaha...ha.....h....ugh) - I once heard a recording of Buddy Rich doing an entire drum solo w/ his left-hand...and it was amazing. I think it's fair to say that's probably the fastest (and most swingin') left or right hand (or any combination thereof) I've ever heard.

Ultimately...speed should be a second-nature thing and not something you force out of yourself while forsaking musicality. Make it sound good...real, real good...then speed it up gradually. It's much more satisfying to sound good and fast....rather than attaining the latter and then trying to go back and achieve the former.

Gramma hamma gonna getchoo! *pow*. I saved that image...that's some funny stuff!

[jazmartin]

zamm
very good musical thoughts
speed is speed
laying down a simple groove musically without forcing funk swing reggea fuzion pop bop rock disco blues gregorian chants in the first ten seconds of the song...
relax and accompany i always say and see what happens in the ABBA format
jaz

[wybasher]

Does the left hand really get stronger if used more than normal in everyday living
Like shaving and brushing your teeth and eating with the left hand

Yes it does. But some activities will more directly transfer to drumming motions than others.

This particular topic I've studied closely so I've tried to place some of the left-hand things you can do into 3 groups of descending effectiveness:

group 1 motions (very close to finesse handling of a drumstick especially with trad grip):

stirring drinks (counter-clockwise and clockwise)
handwriting (cursive writing for legato feel, block lettering for the staccato feel)
coloring a book (seriously! I long plane trips, I take coloring pencils and color in maps of Europe --- kill 2 birds with one stone -- develop the weak AND learn where French Fries come from)
playing a surface such as a conga by by rotating wrist and alternate tapping the pinky and the thumb. On a piano, this might look like a thumb and pinky playing 2 notes octave apart --- not as a unison chord -- but alternating 32nd notes.


group 2 motions (more shoulders & elbows vs finesse of the wrist & fingers)

brush teeth
using computer mouse


group 3 motions (these seem to just help your brain overall vs direct motor control)

eating
opening door knobs (unless you open thousands of doorknobs


Some notes on this...
It takes about 3 weeks for the weak hand muscles to start to adjust and somewhere around 6 months to really get comfortable. I mix a protein drink every morning so watching myself progress on stirring it was fun. Another thing is to really analyze how your left hand is executing the step. The tendency is for the left hand to do an awkward motion instead of the elegant efficient motion that your right hand does. For example, if you stir the cup with your left hand, you may inadvertenly put a lot of elbow into the circular motion instead of using the wrist like your right hand does. Be hyper-aware what your right hand does so well, break the motion apart, and teach it to your left hand. I can now stir a cup with my left hand equally as well as my right. I can manipulate a computer mouse with either hand equally. However, my left-hand handwriting is still only 75% of my right. Handwriting is extremely fine control finesse and it may take some years before I can confidently say my left is equal to my right.

I also want to add some non-drumming trivia. I've made it a habit of signing all my credit-card receipts with my left-hand. About 1-in-10 times at any store, the cashier will blurt out, "cool, you're left-handed too, like me!". It may sound silly, but it seems like I've stumbled onto a parallel universe! Even if I wasn't drumming, I would continue the the left-hand thing just for the satisfaction of getting randomly recognized like that. Since lefthanders only make up 10% of population, when they see me sign receipt, it's like they've discovered a lost friend. I wouldn't have believed it unless I experienced it myself.

If it isn't obvious, these little left-handed activities do not replace deliberate left-handed exercises on an actual drumset (eg GLS sticking exercises). However, you're not always sitting in front of a drumset, so why not strengthen your left hand anyway?

Finally, to insert counterpoint perspective: There are some truly great drummers out there that did none of these little left-hand exercises. Perhaps it's a bunch of bs. You can use this info or ignore it.

[Latin Groover]

Good post, helpful ideas there. If only i had the colouring book idea 2 months ago i was on a plane for 23 hours,lol. But your right about the improvment rate, i think that we all expect things to happen fairly quickly but it seems it doesnt work that way, which sucks because if we all remember to when we started drumming, we all felt like we were improving faster than now? Theres a thread somewhere on that, but it was basically just this. (applying this to left handed hand writting) It would take say 2 weeks to get your left hand to like 25%-35% of your right hand then in 2 months time say around 50% then in about a years time you would still only be about 75% compared to your right. Although that really does depend on how often you used your left, but remember i was relating it to when we started drumming so probably average 40mins a day.

[skinny]

I saw those Art Verdi videos using his left hand
His hand looks very relaxed but I'm confused what fingers really moves the stick
Sometimes it looks like the middle finger and sometimes it looks like the finger nearest the thumb