13 15 18 Toms

[RodneyZepa]

I'm putting together Tom sizes for Ludwig Classic Maple or, after reading excellent thread on Ludwig Legacy, possibly Legacy...Classic Maple will probably be within my price range though...However...I'm going for larger size Toms and can anyone tell me what they think a 11x13 Rack 13x15 Floor and 16x18 Floor would sound like with 14x26 or 16x24kick...Enough of a spread ? Too much of a spread ? Why is a 16x16 Floor the standard ? Thank you and I appreciate the advice...RZepa...

[MikeM]

Alright! Someone else hit on that idea, too!

My last 3 kits have had the 13/15/18 configuration. 9x13, 14x15, 16x18 to be exact. The first was a Ludwig Classic from '95, which I sold recently because I wasn't using it. I briefly had a Tama Starclassic that I jettisoned because the re-rings I ordered with it destroyed their sound (other threads have addressed this and the collective jury is still out, but I will NEVER do re-rings again). My current set up is a Keller-shelled locally made custom kit by a guy named Jerry Garcia (my second of his creations).

Back in the late '80s, I used 13/16/18 and I just though the two floors were too close together sonically. I was really tough getting enough separation between them. When I got rid of that kit, I got my first Garcia which was the now standard 10/12/14/16 two up, two down configuration, and after a couple years I thought they were just too small. I just couldn't get the power I was looking for, so I went back to larger sizes.

I always thought that the 13 to 16 jump was pretty big, so downsizing the 16 by an inch seemed to fill in that hole (and it was still adding an inch from my 14). Adding two inches from the 13 to the 15, followed by adding 3 from the 15 to the 18 is closer to proportional than what you get from a 13/16/18 setup.

But I must admit, that there's something about a 16" floor tom that I miss. It's an itch the 15" can't quite scratch. It can also be a challenge tuning an 18 not to sound like a kick drum. I'd recommend a thicker shell for the 18 if possible just to help fill out the tone.

There is one famous drummer who hit on this combo a while back whose initials are NP and who plays with Rush. His set now goes 13/15/16/18. I'm a little confused about the whole 16 thing sandwiched in there. Perhaps he had that 16" itch as well.

Last thing: an 11x13 is pretty freakin deep to be sitting on a 26" kick. I'm far too lazy to be making that kind of reach: either between snare to top of rack tom, or if rack is off set, from rack to 1st floor. Something to consider.

[latzanimal]

I have a kit with those sizes and I love it. 6-ply luddys w/ 24 kick. There is something about that combo......

[volvoguy]

Looks like you're getting your Bonzo on! :-)

I ordered my CM's with a 9x13 rack and a pair of 16x16 floors (tuned differently):
http://oak.cats.ohiou.edu/~ridgely/Drums/images/3.jpg



The 13" to 16" works fine. Not too big of a jump by any means. A friend has a vintage 4-pc Slingerland with a 12" to 16". That works too.

In fact the 9x13 and 16x16 was a super common set up for four-piece kits in the '60's and '70's, and there are piles of five piece kits from as far back as you can think with a 13 to 16 transition. So it's a pretty well thought out configuration.

-Ryan

[MikeM]

The 13" to 16" works fine. Not too big of a jump by any means. A friend has a vintage 4-pc Slingerland with a 12" to 16". That works too.

In fact the 9x13 and 16x16 was a super common set up for four-piece kits in the '60's and '70's, and there are piles of five piece kits from as far back as you can think with a 13 to 16 transition. So it's a pretty well thought out configuration.

I wouldn't dispute anything you're saying. Especially if you're only looking at two toms. My dream 4 piece would be a 13/16/24.

I love 16x16 floors, but the quandry, at least in my mind, is optimizing separation between floors while keeping them tuned to their sweetest spots. In some ways I like the 14/16 combo better, but the 14 as a 1st floor just doesn't do it for me. So if a 16/18 is too close for my comfort level, then a 15 is the only other option.

My first kit from the early '80s was the first to get me thinking about tom intervals because it was the old 12/13/16 set up. It always struck me that there was only a 1" gain between the racks followed by a 3" gain (with a bunch of extra depth) in getting to the floor.

[RodneyZepa]

You all have made my day...Holiday in Canada but I've been working all day and to see Drum info come in...Yah.!.I guess I'm on right track with these sizes...Yeah...Kinda sucks that I can't go to Drum Shop and play these sizes...'specially in small berg where I live...So...Thank you all so very much...Excitement is getting greater thinking about my Dream Kit..The 11x13...on 26 kick..I'll have in snare stand, lowest I can get my hands on...but...yeah...Why stand when you can sit.!.Peace guys...RS...

[razorx]

I think it will sound great.

[KarlCrafton]

Hey RodneyZepa,

I have all the sizes you mentioned. I also play 26" bass drums. Ludwig Classic Maple.

The 13x15 floor tom is a great one, BUT, going from it to an 18, not what I would consider the best option. It is a great sounding drum, and I've use that size as a hat side floor tom for almost 5 years (go between it and a second 14x16).

11x13....I had that size for a few years and I found it a little lacking in one thing or another. It was either too tubby, or too tight.

When I had it cut down to a 10x13 it sounded much better. It had a nice tone, but it didn't sound too open or thin at all tunings I wanted to use.

9x13 is a fatter sounding drum actually.

If you want good tuning options on the tom, but a 'bigger', "little more air to it" sounding drum, I'd say go 10x13.
If you want a beefy, solid, clear tone, I'd say go with a 9x13.

On the floor tom, instead of a 13x15, I'd suggest a 14x16", because you still get the deep tone (and better sound all around between the 2 ft's), but a 14x16 (IMO/E) will have a slightly quicker sound all around (compared to the 16x16) and you'll get cleaner multiple strokes.
I've been using the 14x16 for many years, and I get as beefy a sound with it as I did with a 16x16, but it's cleaner and clearer through PA's in big and small places.
The tone separation between the 14x16-16x18 is very nice also.

If you really just want a big difference in tone separation between all the toms, I'd suggest a 9x12, 13x15, 16x18.

Even with a 26, a 12 will cut through and sound great. I have an 8x12 on my kit (8x12, 13x15 hat side ft, 14x16-16x18 20x26 kick) and it's NOT a small sounding drum at all.

Just my 2 cents/suggestions...good luck choosing!!

[RodneyZepa]

This advice / suggestions have really helped me out bigtime...Drummers are the coolest.!.Goes without saying doesn't it though...I'd rehearsed with band I've been with for few months and kit set up isn't mine...So, I got tape measure out and one of the Rack Toms measures 11x13 and has very deep, boomy tone so the 10x13 Rack is what I more than likely go with...Most definite 9x13 at very least...Floor Tom's.?.In order to possibly get a natural range of sounds, 14x15 and 16x18 with 14x26 kick...I failed to say that I've a Gretsch Renown 8x12 16x16 20x22 6.5x14 which I really like...So, also would like to not get these sizes in Ludwigs...I know I'll be mixing kits up to see what combination will do...Plan on putting order in for Ludwigs in couple of weeks...Finish is another issue and I've chamged my mind on this issue so many times...Leaning to the classic...WMP...or Vintage Black Oyster...Yeah...Ringo type...But VBO, I dunno...Considered the newer Vintage Mod Citrus Sparkle but would have to see first...Decisions decisions decisions...Also, 2nd kit I had when 12 years old, was WMP and loved that kit...1st kit was beauty green sparkle so considered that as well...Your interest and advice is so appreciated...Thank you Gentlemen...