Remote hi-hat

[Mr. Fanzy Pants]

Hi!
I`ve been thinking lately that the only time i cross my arms when doing something is when i play my drums and that this is maybe not the ideal way of playing drums. Because of this i have been considering a remote hi-hat.

What are u guys thoughts on using a remote hi-hat as a main hi-hat? And what about placement?


All the best

[Guz2]

Um..........What is it?

[basscase]

It is probably better to learn how to play with an open hand technique if you dont want to play traditional, but a remote hat might be the way to go. Remotes are also great for players who use double bass pedals. I have a remote hat that is just set to the closed position that I keep over my floor tom just behind my ride. I dont use double pedals, but I find it easier to use the remote hat sometimes when working with the floor tom a lot. It saves me from having to turn back to my main hats all the time just to return to the floor tom.

[Mr. Fanzy Pants]

I see...i tried to put my regular hi-hat in front of my snare drum and if felt deeelish:) It felt really nice not having to cross my arms and I felt my playing got more fluid. But of course it causes a couple of problems:
1. Where do i put my 12 inch tom?
2. Its almost impossible to control my hi-hat with my left leg when placing it in front my snare.

Do u guys know have much a remote hi-hat costs?

[basscase]

$250 to $300 depending on the brand. Most of them require a rack to mount them on.

[MaDaBe]

I play a DW Cable HiHat. I don't play rack toms however.

[drumguyfromWI]

I play a DW Cable HiHat. I don't play rack toms however.

whoa! interesting set-up!

[caddywumpus]

I considered the remote hat for a long time. Mainly, because I was trying to find a way to stuff EVERYTHING into my suitcase for gigging. When I tried them out, though, I found their response to be a little sluggish for my taste. Plus, the attachment pieces for it would be waaaayyyyy to big for me to fit it in the suitcase, so I opted to not buy one. Mostly for the sluggish response.

I DO like the idea of having a pedal to your left that operates something either in front of you or to your right A LOT, but I don't think it would be right for me. Is there a model out there that's more immediately responsive than the DW ones?

[Mr. Fanzy Pants]

Very nice set-up MaDaBe! Much like the one i`m thinking about converting to.
What made you go for the remote hat?

[jeffwj]

I do not have a remote hi-hat, but I do think it makes sense. A lot of people are playing open handed, meaning that the are basically leading with the left hand when playing a groove. But since the set is still set up right handed, they often perform drum fills using a right hand lead. Most also lead with the right hand on the ride cymbal. That is the puzzling part of open handed playing - switching lead hands. I think that having a remote hi-hat is a better solution if you are intent on not crossing hands.

[scrowder]

Also, if you gig a lot or record, most sound engineers are most familiar and comfortable with mic'ing a kit set up in the standard position. In situations where multiple bands play in one night, moving a hi hat mic to the other side of the drum riser might be a problem, or just a pain in the butt for them. So there's another advantage for being able to play open-handed. Then again...that means LEARNING to play open handed...ughh. The remote does save you some trouble there.

[sticky.widget]

I considered the remote hat for a long time. Mainly, because I was trying to find a way to stuff EVERYTHING into my suitcase for gigging. When I tried them out, though, I found their response to be a little sluggish for my taste. Plus, the attachment pieces for it would be waaaayyyyy to big for me to fit it in the suitcase, so I opted to not buy one. Mostly for the sluggish response.

I DO like the idea of having a pedal to your left that operates something either in front of you or to your right A LOT, but I don't think it would be right for me. Is there a model out there that's more immediately responsive than the DW ones?

I play double bass and bought the Gibraltar Ulta-Adjust Hat Stand in an effort to get my hats closer so I'm not reaching so far because of the slave pedal. The more I play it, the more I hate it. I agree that cable pull vs. direct pull and waaaay to sluggish if you do a lot of hat work.

Thinking of selling it.....and looking for other options.

[MaDaBe]

Very nice set-up MaDaBe! Much like the one i`m thinking about converting to.
What made you go for the remote hat?

I've always kind of disliked playing cross-handed. And I recently decided to go with a no rack toms kit and it just made sense to put the hi hat right in front of me. I had no idea Bruford did this .

The DW remote hat has a fairly wide range of tension adjustments so you can make it sluggish if you want or just as responsive as a regular hi hat. I actually think the DW is better than my previous Tama hi hat stand.

Pearl makes one but it's about as much as the DW. Tama used to make one, Yamaha used to make one and they still might. The Pearl looks pretty cool and I kind of wished I had checked it out before getting the DW.

[Toby_Jackson]

I use the Yamaha remote hat - feel good to me. There's a sense that it may not be quite as responsive as my main, but the difference is slight, and does not affect performance in any way I can detect.

That being said, my remote hat is usually in closed position. It's a lifesaver over on that side of the kit.

[The Parasprinter]

I like 'em a lot. Being able to put your hats in the center and still reach the pedal is great for fast 16th notes where you need both hands on the hats. It's a tradeoff though; leading with the left makes you more ambidexterous on the kit and opens up things you couldn't play before. But if you've already got that down, definitely get the remotes.

[BillBachman]

Does anyone have problems with the cable breaking? If so does the cable generally break at the top or the bottom? What brand?

[Pavlos]

Hi!
I`ve been thinking lately that the only time i cross my arms when doing something is when i play my drums and that this is maybe not the ideal way of playing drums. Because of this i have been considering a remote hi-hat.

What are u guys thoughts on using a remote hi-hat as a main hi-hat? And what about placement?


All the best

I have one that I mess around with sometimes and use a main hat. Mostly for the same reason that I didn't like crossing my arms either. You can see it in one of my setups in the link in my signature. It's fun and promotes some different thinking in relation to setup, but I don't use it to gig out with. It ultimately ends up being more stuff to carry than just the hi hat stand and is kind of a hassle for quick setup.

[bonhamdrummer123]

I just play open handed with my right leading on the ride when I need it. The only problem I have is my stick control with my left on the snare when I'm on the ride...I don't know why since I use my left exclusively on the hats.....I guess that's why I am doing 4000 single strokes a night with my left hand

[ace76543]

In situations where multiple bands play in one night, moving a hi hat mic to the other side of the drum riser might be a problem, or just a pain in the butt for them.

That's their job, if they don't like it they can quit. You shouldn't not try something just because it might annoy a sound tech. Everything annoys sound techs

[cdawg]

i've been thinking of one of these bad boys, just to get the most "direct" feel:

[zambizzi]

I'm seriously considering this more and more lately. The only thing that's been holding me back is the "adaptability" aspect and my own anal-retentive need to stay "standard". By adaptability or standard, I mean the ability to play other peoples' kits as easily as my own. Most people play a "standard" setup w/ the hats in the position that forces you to cross your arms.

This argument is losing out however...since I never can seem to get the hats exactly where I want them and have the perfect spot between my 12" tom and ride. And...well...I rarely play anyone else's drums.

Maybe I'll get a second pair of hats and a remote system and play them both for a while...and the hats on the left will one day mysteriously disappear.

[Meat the beat]

I have a DW remote hat that I use on my practice kit, I have it between my ride usually lives & my floor tom. I use it to prac open handed , moving my ride to my left... I usually last about a week like this!!! :-D
As has been said, for serious gigs, I find it a little unresponsive (3m cable) and may well replace it with a Xhat instead.... good fun tho & great for kit pics!!!!

[Stewed]

I use a remote on the right for main hat. Have for a long time. Currently have the DW 9502 set-up. Sluggish? Not really. I think the cable *can* get dirty and introduce sluggishness, but this is easily avoided or remedied.

Never had a cable break.

[ZLeyba]

That's their job, if they don't like it they can quit. You shouldn't not try something just because it might annoy a sound tech. Everything annoys sound techs

quoted for great justice!!!!

and i've tried the x hat in various places on a kit, and i think frankly unless you're gonna use it as a secondary hat its not worth it, its really hard to get the hat close to the snare, and having two of the most vital parts of your kit apart like that makes the whole thing harder to play

just my two cents

[JENGLISH817]

Does anyone know why Tama quit making an remote hi-hat? With DW and Pearl still making them, I would think a company that prides itself in its hardware as much as its drums would want to keep a product like this going.

[Deathmetalconga]

Hi!
I`ve been thinking lately that the only time i cross my arms when doing something is when i play my drums and that this is maybe not the ideal way of playing drums. Because of this i have been considering a remote hi-hat.

What are u guys thoughts on using a remote hi-hat as a main hi-hat? And what about placement?


All the best

I have always played open handed, left hands on hats and ride, right hand on snare, hats and ride mounted a the 10 o'clock position. Playing open handed seems more natural and ergonomic to me.

I think it is a great idea to put your hihat to your right, near your ride cymbal, so you can enjoy the benefits of playing open. There are additional benefits to having your ride cymbal and hats close together.

[schist]

Yeah, I've been toying with this idea myself recently - moving my main hi-hat to the centre of my kit (above the two front rack toms) and having it remote pedal-operated, Bill Bruford/Danny Carey style. It just seems to make sense to me, not having to cross over (unless absolutely necessary) and being able to play certain parts easier as a result.

I say go for it.

[thelimpingtoad]

I have been playing with a remote on my right side for almost 10 years now. I will never go back to crossing over... I always hated the cross over.... Occassional stick clicks and the whole concept bugs me.
I got a used (from the 70's) cable-driven remote hat from a guy I knew (actually traded my standard hat stand for it :) ) ... it is slightly less responsive for the foot pedal but I've grown to adjust to it. The only real downside is the fact it is harder to do 16th note hat patterns but if you have a scond hi-hat on your left side it would be fine to use for those times.
This is a diagram of my current setup:

http://matthewroy.com/drumming/curSetupAccoustic7_09.jpg
(I also add electronic pads near the snare)

Currently I mount the hi-hat to the tom arm with this jury-rigged set-up using a cymbal boom arm attachment and a standard clamp. I'm hoping to get a decent clamp arm sometime this week because that isn't really too stable... (if anyone has any suggestions I'd for a good one i'd like to hear it, thanks)
The hi-hat slips sometimes and the mounting usually falls apart during tear-down or transport of the kit.

The point is that I HIGHLY recommend using a remote hat on the right side if you can fit it in, and especially if you can keep another hat (maybe with a drop-clutch) on the left.

It also might be worth mentioning that I've never had a problem with the cable breaking... it will need oiled on occasions but other than that it works great!

[thelimpingtoad]

I finally tried just mounting with my clamp to the base of a cymbal stand last night. It seems like i can get it in the right position thankfully. That's awesome because it gives me a stand-alone right side hat.
We're playing a gig at the end of next month at a charity thing and each band only gets 1 set so I'm going to be playing someone else's kit. I'm a little worried about having to get my hat in there.

[pagoda_5b]

Hi guys, I tried the remote-hat solution since starting with a Dave Matthews tribute band. This helps greatly in proposing Beauford's tricky Ride/Hihat patterns.

http://www.tavolarotonda.org/joomla/images/morfeoshow/festa_di_fin-3117/big/GIA_4248.jpg

The hat is held by a Tama stand which I bought with the remote, very stable and solid. Lately I'm clamping it both to the stand and the bass drum with the appropriate clamp (like this one (http://img3.musiciansfriend.com/dbase/pics/products/2/9/0/373290.jpg)).

My opinions after 1+ years of use: you get used really fast and I could see tremendous improvements in the ease of playing interesting figures and rhythms involving the toms and ride/hat combinations.
I place the remote right over the bass drum, in line with the foot pedal, the bass drum is actually oriented at about 15-20 degrees at my right, and not straight front.

The real sucker is response, you can't really play the same way as a standard hat. It lacks the spring tension needed, and I think there's lot of additional resistance from the steel cable sliding in its guide.


http://img3.musiciansfriend.com/dbase/pics/products/9/0/6/226906.jpg

The DW remote cable-less pedal proposed on an earlier post (proposed in the above picture) works only as long as you don't get over you foot pedal... lest the joint piece crosses over the beater. And it gets even worse if you have a double pedal, like myself. =P

I was trying to think about a similar home-made solution, without cables, that could fully maximize the spring tension of a regular coil. I'm thinking maybe a piezo-controlled electronic hybrid hi-hat?

P.S. I suggest trying to learn open-handed playing, it seems to me the natural solution, but I'm no professional drummer and I have not much time to spare for re-learning from the start. If you're like me, I also suggest to stay in touch with your regular cross-stick playing, if you get lots of gigs with many bands playing. I don't think it's fair nor comfortable for anyone if you bring your very unique custom configuration that would get in every other's way. Be adaptive until you can get your own personal gig with your own personal kit configuration. =D

Have a nice day!

[Mikecore]

I'm currently using a DW 9503 cable remote, set up over and between my rack toms. No problem with feel or operation, just a bit cumbersome in transport (and if you are careful and get the 9502LB, for the extra 50 bucks you get a removable cable and a bag for it).

I learned from my first go at this in 1998 (with a DW 5502LB) that you have to try it out in the position you plan to use it to check the feel first. I did not take this precaution and wound up with a VERY sluggish pedal. The cable is usually the culprit with the DWs.

http://drummerworld.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=629&pictureid=4088

The DW 9550 shaft-drive hats SHOULD work with a double pedal IF you are putting them out in front of the racks like I do and IF you use a DW double pedal with the single post remote pedal (I'll get back to you after I get them next year). There's enough angle offset with the hat stand in that position to bring the driveshaft out away from the bass pedal. If it's not enough, you can flip the post casting (with some minor filing of the BD toe clamp area) so that you have nothing but wide open space where the hi-hat shaft comes out of the setup. The 9550 pedal is double sided, so it should accommodate. Terry Bozzio does this for most of his right side remotes.

If all of that strikes you as a tremendous pain in the goods...then shopping for a decent cable remote by FEEL should be much easier. GC makes this easy for me, since most of them in my area seem to have one or more in stock.

[BillBachman]

Centering the hi hat so that there is no crossing and both hands have easy access to it is a game changer for sure. Everything you play is instantly easier and you start to play many new things because you finally can. My remote speedy hat does the trick without any lag or drag--all it does it work perfectly! There's yet another stellar review in the December issue of Modern Drummer.

[Muckster]

Centering the hi hat so that there is no crossing and both hands have easy access to it is a game changer for sure. Everything you play is instantly easier and you start to play many new things because you finally can. My remote speedy hat does the trick without any lag or drag--all it does it work perfectly! There's yet another stellar review in the December issue of Modern Drummer.

I just checked out the review in modern Drummer. Congrats!

[harryconway]

My Yamaha remote ... very nice hi-hat. And I've had 3 very "seasoned" drummers play my kit, and fall in love with it.

[toddy]

do you know what the model number is harry? how old is said remote?

[harryconway]

do you know what the model number is harry? how old is said remote?

I bought it off eBay, it's a few years old. It's the WHS860S. Last NAMM show I went to was 2008. I tried everyones cable remote. Yamaha won my money. They usually do.

[Red Menace]

Wandering off topic a little here Harry, but what size is your kick?

Reading this thread is making me want to go out and get a remote hihat outfit. It seems a great way to economize one's space.

[harryconway]

Wandering off topic a little here Harry, but what size is your kick? 26x16 is the one in the picture.

[Red Menace]

26x16 is the one in the picture.

...I want one...

2020202020

[toddy]

I bought it off eBay, it's a few years old. It's the WHS860S. Last NAMM show I went to was 2008. I tried everyones cable remote. Yamaha won my money. They usually do.

sweet, I'll keep a lookout on the bay for one. if I don't enjoy how it feels I'm blaming it on you!

[rborroto]

Consider the limitations of a remote hi-hat to the right of the snare for a right-handed drummer, namely the nearly impossible task of riding 16th notes on the hi-hat, or any other pattern more complicated than 8th or quarter notes. That being said, there are no hard rules when it comes to arranging your set. If you're playing the standard hi-hat on the left of the snare, and you're hitting sticks or you're having other problems, you should practice control. A remote hi-hat is not the "magic bullet" for fixing anything. Actually it may give you more problems than what you had before. In my opinion the remote hi-hat should be a second option, rather than the only option.

[oaklandrichie]

Consider the limitations of a remote hi-hat to the right of the snare for a right-handed drummer, namely the nearly impossible task of riding 16th notes on the hi-hat, or any other pattern more complicated than 8th or quarter notes. That being said, there are no hard rules when it comes to arranging your set. If you're playing the standard hi-hat on the left of the snare, and you're hitting sticks or you're having other problems, you should practice control. A remote hi-hat is not the "magic bullet" for fixing anything. Actually it may give you more problems than what you had before. In my opinion the remote hi-hat should be a second option, rather than the only option.

Good points all.
If I moved my hi-hat from the traditional spot, I'd lose half my fills.

[jeffwj]

Good points all.
If I moved my hi-hat from the traditional spot, I'd lose half my fills.

Why not have both - a remote hat and a hi-hat in the regular position?

Jeff

[brentcn]

Why not have both - a remote hat and a hi-hat in the regular position?

Jeff

A fair question, answered only by considering how many gigs you play, and how heavy you want your hardware bag to be!

It's a common (and reasonable) sales pitch that having the hi-hat in a more convenient position opens up possibilities, and it's tempting to believe that moving these cymbals around will make us better players. However, consider that, if the drum set were not the way it has been for 80 years or so, we might not have much of the great drumming we do. Would the drum groove in "I Got The Feeling" by James Brown have been played the same way? What about the Purdie Shuffle? The "limitations" imposed by the hi-hat's position may very well be an indispensable aspect of drumming innovation.

If you seek a new sound, that is one thing. If you seek proficiency, that is another.

[BillBachman]

Crossing over to play the hats has many limitations, playing a remote hat to the right side of the kit has many limitations, playing open handed still has plenty of limitations.

I've found that by moving the hats closer to the center where there is no crossing and both hands have easy access to the hats is an absolute game changer. Everything you play now is easier and thousands of new opportunities arise.

[jeffwj]

A fair question, answered only by considering how many gigs you play, and how heavy you want your hardware bag to be!

It's a common (and reasonable) sales pitch that having the hi-hat in a more convenient position opens up possibilities, and it's tempting to believe that moving these cymbals around will make us better players. However, consider that, if the drum set were not the way it has been for 80 years or so, we might not have much of the great drumming we do. Would the drum groove in "I Got The Feeling" by James Brown have been played the same way? What about the Purdie Shuffle? The "limitations" imposed by the hi-hat's position may very well be an indispensable aspect of drumming innovation.

If you seek a new sound, that is one thing. If you seek proficiency, that is another.

Good post. A lot to think about. But even the hi-hat started out as a lowboy (see youtube link).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tYQRpl9NbM

Jeff

[NUTHA JASON]

why cant you play 16ths hand to hand lead from the left?

[harryconway]

I've found that by moving the hats closer to the center where there is no crossing and both hands have easy access to the hats is an absolute game changer.

True that....................................

[brentcn]

Good post. A lot to think about. But even the hi-hat started out as a lowboy (see youtube link).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tYQRpl9NbM

Jeff

Touche! Cool video, thanks for sharing!

But the modern hi-hat being as ubiquitous as it is, much, if not all, of the drumming I admire comes from drummers who dealt with the shortcomings of hi-hat placement.

About a year ago I saw a 9-piece ragtime band at a wedding, and the drummer played no hi-hat (or lowboy) at all. "Open" and "closed" sounds were accomplished by choking and releasing a small crash, which was placed where a hi-hat would normally be. He grooved like crazy, and his set up suited the music superbly!

[addisonyesher]

I found the hats moving toward the center where there is no road and both hands have easy access to hats is an absolute game changer. All that the game is now easier and many new opportunities arise.

[Open Hand]

I've got a DW5000 straight hat stand, a DW5000 remote hat, and a Remote Speedy Hat.

Bachman is right. The Remote Speedy Hat is actually quicker than even my DW5000 straight stand. It seems like marketing BS but its not. I think it moves less weight with less friction than a straight stand.

I haven't been completely comfortable or satisfied with any setup until I centered my hats behind my snare. 2 toms to the left. 2 toms to the right. Game changer for sure. I spent 2 years practicing open handed playing because crossing over isn't quite right and cable remotes suck. (I'm very glad I did!)

I'm selling my DW remote on the cheap. If you don't believe in the RSH buy my DW! $100 plus shipping. virtually brand new. PM me.

All other remote hats are obsolete.

Bachman will make a killing when he sells this patent.

[torsoboy]

Hi guys,

I'm just started using a remote hihat on my right, which I control with my right foot (a little bit like D-Rod uses, although he has a standard hihat), but I still have a traditional hihat on my left, which I play with the open-handed playing technique, i.e. I play it with my left hand without crossing over. I still can't get patterns going smoothly with my left, but I really feel comfortable with straight eighths! I would recommend it over just having a hihat on my right. I also noticed Danny Carey uses a remote hihat somewhere in the middle above the two rack toms, if I'm not wrong.

BTW Beauford also uses the OHP, as do Simon Phillips, Mike Bordin, Gene Hoglan, and the one who started it all Billy Cobham. You might want to check out Claus Hessler's excellent book, written with Dom Famularo, on OHP. For now only vol.1 is out, but it's more than enough to get started.

Cheers!

[BillBachman]

Thanks, I agree! :)

In my opinion open handed is better than crossing, but you're still quite limited as there will be many times where you would have to cross the other way. When both hands can go between the hats and snare with no crossing under any circumstances everything becomes easier and a million new possibilities open up.

Here's a video of my set up: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKxNLxGUt8o


I've got a DW5000 straight hat stand, a DW5000 remote hat, and a Remote Speedy Hat.

Bachman is right. The Remote Speedy Hat is actually quicker than even my DW5000 straight stand. It seems like marketing BS but its not. I think it moves less weight with less friction than a straight stand.

I haven't been completely comfortable or satisfied with any setup until I centered my hats behind my snare. 2 toms to the left. 2 toms to the right. Game changer for sure. I spent 2 years practicing open handed playing because crossing over isn't quite right and cable remotes suck. (I'm very glad I did!)

I'm selling my DW remote on the cheap. If you don't believe in the RSH buy my DW! $100 plus shipping. virtually brand new. PM me.

All other remote hats are obsolete.

Bachman will make a killing when he sells this patent.