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Thrash Drummer
07-02-2008, 10:43 PM
I'm trying to record my kick drum with a trigger, but there is a ~5 millisecond delay between the when I hit the drum and when the sampler generates the sound. I'm using a ddrum kick trigger->spds, all cables are pretty short. When I record with a mic the waveform is perfectly in time, so my playing is not the problem. Is there something I can do to eliminate this latency problem?
http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m57/Thrash_Drummer/bassdrum.jpg

rmandelbaum
07-02-2008, 11:13 PM
This is a Cubase / interface configuration issue. Tell us about your interface and a little about your computer and we can try to help but really your best bet is to go here

http://www.cubase.net/phpbb2/

Thrash Drummer
07-02-2008, 11:38 PM
I don't know much about my computer, its a dell from around 2002, its not a bad model.
The interface is a presonus firepod.
This delay only occurs with the trigger, with mics its fine, which leads me to look for other sources then the computer and interface for the problem. I looked in the forum and it seems that there is a "delay compensation" sort of control but if I were to compensate 5 ms for the trigger, everything else running through the interface would be shifted back and out of time.

rmandelbaum
07-03-2008, 12:09 AM
What is the trigger triggering?

PQleyR
07-03-2008, 12:44 AM
Have you tried different samples?

Thrash Drummer
07-03-2008, 01:14 AM
The trigger is triggering a kick drum sample.
I have tried different samples, I have also looked at the waveforms of the samples I'm using and they start at 0s, there is no empty space. There is still however always a delay when recording.

rmandelbaum
07-03-2008, 01:30 AM
I am confused, are you using a MIDI interface and going into Cubase and triggering the sound or do you have a drum brain that is being triggered?

I see an audio wave form, are you recording midi? How are you set up?

mead50
07-03-2008, 01:42 AM
dont wanna take off the focus on the others guys question...but wuts a trigger, wut does it do?

rmandelbaum
07-03-2008, 02:01 AM
a trigger is a small device that creates an electronic signal when the drum is hit and sends it to something to produce a sound.

Thrash Drummer
07-03-2008, 02:25 AM
trigger is going into the sampler which is making the sound, from there is goes to preamp and then cubase.
im not sure if its midi, i guess if its being generated from the sampler then it is.
the delay could just as well be caused by the sampler itself, not the computer or the interface.

mead50
07-03-2008, 04:28 AM
do u need that to record, like to actually record music?

i didnt really get the explanation, ive never really seen one used or anything, ive heard of them but never really seen one :|

Thrash Drummer
07-03-2008, 05:26 AM
You don't need one to record, you can use a microphone instead (most bands do)
but if you use a trigger it will make faster playing sound cleaner because the sound wont change. If you use a mic, fast playing can become muddy because there is less attack/click sound.

just as a mic runs through the PA into speakers to produce sound, a trigger runs into a sampler THEN into the PA and into the speakers to produce sound. You dont need to mic your bass drum if you have a trigger on it because the trigger/sampler is producing the kick sound.

Clear enough?

mead50
07-03-2008, 09:19 PM
You don't need one to record, you can use a microphone instead (most bands do)
but if you use a trigger it will make faster playing sound cleaner because the sound wont change. If you use a mic, fast playing can become muddy because there is less attack/click sound.

just as a mic runs through the PA into speakers to produce sound, a trigger runs into a sampler THEN into the PA and into the speakers to produce sound. You dont need to mic your bass drum if you have a trigger on it because the trigger/sampler is producing the kick sound.

Clear enough?

oooo ok, i get it, thanks dude...i just learned something :D :P

rmandelbaum
07-04-2008, 03:44 PM
interesting, I record with a Roland TD-20 kit. Same thing really Peizo to a sequencer(TD-20) then audio to Cubase.

Try some basic troubleshooting:
Do yo get the same lag if you listen directly to the sequencer through head phones?

If so then there is an issue there. If not it is between the sequencer and the PC.

Have you recorded anything else into this same PC?

Have you adjusted the latency settings in Cubase?

Ben Tormey
07-04-2008, 05:21 PM
Haven't used Cubase, but are there settings for the ASIO drivers (I assume it has proprietary ones) to reduce the number of samples, hence latency?

rmandelbaum
07-04-2008, 07:36 PM
ben is correct.

I am telling you if you post your question here you will get it resolved


www.cubase.net

Thrash Drummer
07-06-2008, 03:30 AM
Sorry for the delayed response I just got back from vacation.

I'll try and isolate the variables, I should be able to go directly into the interface (trigger->firepod->cubase) which would test the latency of the interface and possibly expose the latency of the sampler.

I was not aware that I could change latency settings on certain channels, I will try that.

My latency settings in cubase for mics are fine, everything comes in on time. When I'm triggering the bass drum, it is the only thing to enter into the program late.

There MAY be a lag between when I hit the drum and when I hear the sample. If it is only ~5ms however, I will have a hard time telling.

Thanks for all of the help, I'll post again with a (possible) solution after I've tried to fix the problem.

Thrash Drummer
07-08-2008, 09:31 PM
Alright so basically here is what I did to fix the problem.
I mic'd the kick drum and triggered it. When I hit it the two waveforms appeared on average 7ms away from each other. Without compensating for this difference, together the two hits sounded like a very tight flam.

In order to compensate for the difference, I typed "-7" into the time display shown in the first post under the volume and panning display. This slid the trigger track back 7ms (not shown through the waveform but played correctly). When I played the two tracks together this time, it sounded more or less like one hit, there was no flam effect. If the sampler creates a consistent delay of 7ms, problem solved!