Hipgig vs. Gretsch Jazz

[tbmills]

I have been wanting a club kit for a while now. I have been looking mainly at the Yamaha Manu Katche Signature Jr. Set and the Gretsch Catalina Club Jazz Kit. I need something for a jazzier context. I have played the Yamahas a good bit but havent ever heard them outside guitar center. I have also only played the Gretsch kit in guitar center but over a year ago. From what I remember the Gretsch kit felt and sounded more vintage. The Yamahas feel tight and punchy.

Im wondering which of the two sets can do both sounds; basically vintage and modern, or to me jazz and funk.

Has anyone played these?
Does anyone here own either of these sets?

What would YOU get?

These are the links and sizes:
Yamaha Manu Katche Hipgig (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Yamaha-Manu-Katche-Signature-Jr.-Drum-Set?sku=491030)
16" x 16" kick
10" x 7"
13" x 13"
5" x 12" snare

Gretsch Catalina Club Jazz (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Gretsch-Drums-Catalina-Club-Jazz-4-Piece-Shell-Pack?sku=445682)
18" x 14" kick
12" x 8"
14" x 14"
5" x 14" snare

To be honest, I am leaning towards the Yamahas...

[jay norem]

There's a jazz club here in Atlanta that has a Hip Gig kit as the house kit. I like it just fine. I bring my own snare and cymbals (I don't think much of the Hip Gig snare drum) but the bass and toms sound quite good, and the hardware is just fine.
There are a couple of very good jazz drummers in town that use a Hip Gig kit. If it's a bop sound you're after I don't see how you could go wrong, given the price. But as I said, the snare drum leaves a lot to be desired, in my opinion.
I've never played a Catalina kit so I can't comment on that one.
Myself, I'd get the Hip Gig, but I'd also get a good snare drum. But then you're looking at spending close to a grand at least, for the whole kit, unless you have no problem with the snare drum.

[gentrydrum]

I bought a gretsch jazz set and gave it to a group i work with for use on our concerts, i changed the heads to fibraskin and i do not use the snare ( i think its ok but i have ones i LOVE) the drums are very warm and blend w/ the band an i think it was a good decision to purchase, as for the hip gig, i have played one in a g center w/ remo vintage heads and they also are warm and for their size sound bigger than they are, as for cost its a wash, so either or!

[tbmills]

Myself, I'd get the Hip Gig, but I'd also get a good snare drum. But then you're looking at spending close to a grand at least, for the whole kit, unless you have no problem with the snare drum.

I honestly didnt mind the stock snare. I have a 13" x 6" spaun steel snare but i think that i bit too much drum for jazz. I might look into getting something else. What do you suggest? Id be willing to spend around $200.

[Signals]

Have you checked out the City Jazz kits from GMS? They look and sound pretty good:

http://www.indoorstorm.com/Gms_4pc_Cl_City_Jazz_Maple_Shell_Pack_Walnut_Gloss-p-3303.html

[jay norem]

I honestly didnt mind the stock snare. I have a 13" x 6" spaun steel snare but i think that i bit too much drum for jazz. I might look into getting something else. What do you suggest? Id be willing to spend around $200.

Well I'm rather a snare drum snob, sort of. But for $200, I don't know. Seems you could pick up a pretty good metal one for that price, but I've never spent that little for a snare drum. Other people here would be far more knowledgable than I am about that.
Actually I did buy a new 5 1/2 x 14" Pearl Brass Alloy about 10 years ago for about $250 if I'm remembering that correctly. Good drum, I still have it.

[tbmills]

Have you checked out the City Jazz kits from GMS? They look and sound pretty good:


They do look great, but i dont have that kind of money... im looking for something around the $6-700 mark.


Well I'm a snare drum snob... I've never spent that little for a snare drum.

Oh look at you! Making fun of somebody on a budget huh?
Ha, Im just playing. Took the opportunity to play around with your words... sorry.

But seriously, what kind of snare would be good for jazz? What wood? What size? What brand?

Let me know,
Taylor

[jay norem]

But seriously, what kind of snare would be good for jazz? What wood? What size? What brand?


Hey Taylor,
There's no one snare that's good for jazz, as long as it's a good snare. I play a DW Craviato solid shell maple, but you don't want to go there, believe me. Too expensive. Look for a good metal snare drum, not a huge rock one but just a basic 5 1/2 x 14" metal snare drum by one of the big companies. Those aren't very costly, they're well made and they sound great when you tune them right.
I've always liked Pearl metal snare drums, but there are a lot out there. Pick up one that's used as a display in a music store and get them to give you a good deal on it. Use Ambasador heads, tune 'em up and there you go.
Wood snare drums, if they're any good, are quite expensive.

[tbmills]

I crank my spaun snare...
How should I tune a snare for a good jazz sound?

I new at this jazz thing, like many others.
I play alot of jazz/funk/rock (kinda gospelish) but no jazz...

Im also trying to learn traditional grip

[jay norem]

I crank my spaun snare...
How should I tune a snare for a good jazz sound?


Entirely up to you. Listen to a lot of jazz and you hear all kinds of different snare sounds. I like a high and tight sound, but that's just me.
Why do you think you can't use your Spaun snare to play jazz? I'm not familar with that drum but I know they have a very good reputation.

[tbmills]

it is just very loud...
but i do play mostly rimshots.
that probably has alot to do with it.

[jay norem]

it is just very loud...
but i do play mostly rimshots.
that probably has alot to do with it.

In that case it's simply a matter of technique. You really don't want to be slamming the hell out of a snare drum, rock fashion, or any drum for that matter, when you're playing jazz!
I'll bet your snare drum would work just fine. All I'd say is to work on a nice controlled, light touch.
Get that Yamaha kit and use your Spaun snare, see how it goes. There isn't any one way to do this, you know.

[tbmills]

In that case it's simply a matter of technique. You really don't want to be slamming the hell out of a snare drum, rock fashion, or any drum for that matter, when you're playing jazz!
I'll bet your snare drum would work just fine. All I'd say is to work on a nice controlled, light touch.

I agree, ever since ive been playing traditional right hand my snare has been alot more smooth and quiet. It sounds good light and its always sounded good for rock. I cant wait to get this set even if it wont be until this fall!

[jay norem]

I agree, ever since ive been playing traditional right hand my snare has been alot more smooth and quiet. It sounds good light and its always sounded good for rock. I cant wait to get this set even if it wont be until this fall!

Well I've always played matched grip so I'm not sure it makes much difference. But playing jazz with traditional grip just looks so elegant! Makes me jealous sometimes.

[tbmills]

Well I've always played matched grip so I'm not sure it makes much difference.

Im not sure it does, but when I play rock I have the snare tuned to play rimshots... sounds crazy but Im not playing many hits. I rimshot all of my single hits. the trad grip lets me not rimshot. its kinda nice but it feels weird. I find myself not using my index or middle fingers.

By the way I play lefty if you were wondering... thats why I said "right snare hand."

[jay norem]

By the way I play lefty if you were wondering... thats why I said "right snare hand."

Hey I'm a south-paw too! But I set up my kit right handed, the "normal" way.
Question: do you listen to a lot of jazz music?

[tbmills]

Im actually right-handed but play lefty (I couldnt switch my stepdads set when i was learning)

I dont listen to much jazz anymore. Lately i have been listening to alot of stanton moore, galactic, and soulive. What is the best stuff to learn jazz drums?

[jay norem]

I dont listen to much jazz anymore. Lately i have been listening to alot of stanton moore, galactic, and soulive. What is the best stuff to learn jazz drums?

Hmmm...to be perfectly honest with you I don't dare go there. There are plenty of people here who can tell you all about what you need to listen to if you want to learn jazz drumming.
PM me if you want my input on that.
Hey it's been cool talking with you Taylor. Best of luck man!

[byebyepanda]

Never played a Hip gig but I own a Gretsch Jazz Club. I love my kit, its exactly what I wanted and I couldn't be happier. I'm in the process in finding some better cymbals (used to own Zildjian ZBT's) so I'm sure my kit will sound a lot better with great cymbals.

You should check out ebay. They sell the Grestch Jazz Club with double braced hardware and ship for free.

[tbmills]

thanks alot! .

[MusiQmaN]

Dont forget that the Manu isnt the real hip gig and hg sound. It a cheaper kit ment for kits and when theres noting else a portable gron up set.

But the sound isnt near the real full hg sound. Simply because of the sizes (especially the Al foster but still also for the Marotta) portabillity (actually it is just as much to take away as a normal set, as for the ''real'' hg's that are a 2 bag take away) and material (and price offcourse)

So, the Manu is a great kit but nothing like the "real" hip gigs. Better to say, a whole other sound.

Good luck with youre decission and keep us in touch.

Here are the differences:

Manu Katche:


http://www.yamaha-europe.com/picture_archiv/products/10_Musical_instruments/drums/drum_sets/drumsets/manukatchejunior_medium_jpg.jpg

The bass drum is 16”x16” and 9-ply while the 13”x13” floor tom, the 10”x7” mounted tom and 12”x5” snare drum are all 6-ply. The shells are all made from Philippine mahogany which gives a loud, warm and open tone. Like all our shells the mahogany plies are laminated using the exclusive Air Seal System, which ensures that every drum shell is perfectly round and of uniform thickness. The shells are covered with a tough polymer wrap, available in a choice of four cool colours.

The hardware includes a pro-quality ball-clamp tom holder, bass drum and hi-hat pedals, alongside two lightweight but sturdy cymbal stands. There’s also a newly designed low-cradle snare drum stand. The bass drum is fitted with our special floating system, which enables the bass pedal beater to strike the centre of the head for maximum punch. Also, by raising the drum off the floor, the maximum resonance is obtained.

The Hipgig Junior is a genuine Yamaha drum set, very affordable and perfect for the young player just starting out. But its outstanding quality also makes it ideal for any drummer looking for a truly compact and easily transportable kit that delivers a great sound.

* Bass-Drum 16"x16"
* Tom 10"x7"
* Floor Tom 13"x13"
* Snare 12"x5"

Hardware:

* HS630
* 2x CS641
* FP7210
* SS642 (for 12" Snare)
* CL940A
* DS640



Rick Marotta:


http://www.yamaha-europe.com/picture_archiv/products/10_Musical_instruments/drums/drum_sets/drumsets/rick_marotta_hipgig_medium_jpg.jpg

Shells: HG6T4RM, (Shell Kit), HG15DCARM, (Hipgig Set), BD16HG, TT10HG, TT13HG, SD12HG, TT, SD Soft Case, BD Soft Case, (Additional), TT12HGARM
Hardware: TH-HG, CL940LAx2, CH735x2, HS-HG, FP700, HG15DC, (Drum stool doubles as hardware case), DC Soft Case, (Additional), CSAT926, CL940A

“In all the years I’ve been with Yamaha I have never put my name on any one product because I could never make up my mind. I could not, however, resist the HipGig kit. It is one of the great drum innovations by Yamaha and Takashi Hagiwara (Hagi). I have been using it live and in the studio for all types of music. Every time someone hears or plays it they are surprised that such a small kit has such a diverse sound. It is also the most intelligently designed portable kit I have ever seen.” Rick Marotta.

Available Colours:

mellow yellow

mellow yellow

cherry wood

cherry wood

white marine pearl

white marine pearl

Ask any drummer what’s the worst part of gigging and they’ll tell you setting up, tearing down, and carting home the drums. The ingenious HipGig is a compact four-piece drum set which can be set up in five minutes, needs the minimum of floor space, and can be carried from car to stage in one easy trip. The snare and two tom toms are stored inside the hinged bass drum during transport, then mounted off it when set up. And all the stands, pedals and brackets fit into the ‘throne’-style canister seat. The whole caboodle fits into the two supplied soft bags.

The Hipgig shells are made from a 7-ply sandwich of high quality birch and mahogany. Toms come equipped with Remo Pinstripe heads, the bass drum with Remo Renaissance PowerStroke-3s and the snare with a Remo coated Ambassador batter. This combination supplies attack alongside control and body. The 10"x6" and 13"x7" toms may be small, but they sound surprisingly full and loud. In addition there are now two more tom-toms which can be bought separately. These measure 8”x5.5” and 12”x6.5” and both are supplied with soft carrying cases. The 12"x5" snare is suspended rather than placed on a normal stand, resulting in an extra liveliness and a huge reverberant cross-stick sound.

The 16”x20” bass drum is fitted with our special floating bass drum system, which enables the bass pedal beater to strike centre for maximum punch. What the bass drum loses in diameter it makes up for in its 20" depth; and by raising it off the floor, resonance is again maximised. The sound is deep but articulate, works well tuned low or high and doesn’t require any damping.

The Hipgig comes in three distinctive finishes: the original eye-catching Mellow Yellow lacquer, White Marine Pearl and Rick Marotta’s signature Cherry Red lacquer. While the portability and speed of set-up/break-down are obviously big attractions, the Hipgig ranks alongside our other top lines. It displays all of the craftsmanship, sound quality and durability that has made Yamaha a worldwide professional's choice. With its unmistakable incisive sound the Hipgig has found a place in the hearts of everyone from small group jazz drummers to cutting edge jungle and drum ‘n’ bass stylists.


Al Foster:


http://www.yamaha-europe.com/picture_archiv/products/10_Musical_instruments/drums/drum_sets/drumsets/al_foster_hipgig_medium_jpg.jpg

Shells: HG8T4AL, (Shell Kit), BD18HGAL, TT14HGAL, TT12HGAL, SD13HGAL, TT, SD Soft Case, BD Soft Case, (Additional), TT10HGAL
Hardware: CS641 x 2, CL940LA x 3, HS650, FP700, DS750, Hardware Soft Bag, (Additional), CSAT926, CL940A, CH740

The new Al Foster Signature Hipgig Sr. takes the original Hipgig formula and applies it to larger sized drums. The drummer gets a bigger, deeper tone from what is still a compact and easy to transport kit. The bass drum has increased two inches from the original 16”x20” to 18”x22”, while the 14”x8.5” and 12”x6.5” tom toms and the 13”x5” snare drum are all one size larger than before.
In addition you can now buy a 10”x6.5” tom as a separate item supplied with its own soft case carrying bag.

Available Colours:

white marine pearl

white marine pearl

jaguar pattern

jaguar pattern

gold marine pearl

gold marine pearl

The Hipgig shells are made from a 7-ply sandwich of high quality birch and mahogany. Toms and snare drum come equipped with Remo Ambassador Coated batters, the bass drum with Remo Renaissance PowerStroke-3s. This combination supplies plenty of attack alongside control and body. The snare drum is suspended rather than placed on a normal stand, resulting in an extra liveliness and a huge cross-stick sound. The bass drum is fitted with our special floating bass drum system, which enables the bass pedal beater to strike centre for maximum punch. The exceptional 22” depth gives the bass drum a cavernously deep sound, which is further amplified by raising it off the floor.

Because of the larger drums the hardware set-up has been slightly modified from the standard Hipgig. So there are now two separate CS641 cymbal stands which allow the use of bigger cymbals and wider variation in positioning. Like the standard Hipgig, the snare and two tom toms are stored inside the hinged bass drum during transport, then mounted off it when set up. But instead of the canister throne the Al Foster Hipgig has a normal drum stool. This and the other hardware pack easily into the supplied soft carrying bag. To add further distinction, the Al Foster Hipgig has its own sharp ‘jazzy’ finishes: Jaguar and Gold Marine Pearl, along with the more traditional White Marine Pearl.

While setting up and breaking down in five minutes is obviously a big attraction, the Hipgig also displays all of the craftsmanship and sound quality that has made Yamaha a worldwide professional's choice. The Hipgig is perfect for the busy gigging jazz drummer. But, with its larger sizes, the Al Foster Hipgig is a versatile kit which will find a place in almost any style of music.

Or try to get the first model Hip Gig (wich also is a practice set) it has a very deep dry kick.

http://a743.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/91/l_e3657540358ba7c8abff943ac1fac946.jpg

[bojangleman]

i played a hipgig at guitar center, and it had a really big sound...

haha..it was funny,..my mom was with me, and she was like, wow...that is a really expensive kids kit...i was like...its not for a kid mom...its a small kit for gigging...and i explained to her...but i thought it was funny..

Alex

[tbmills]

Dont forget that the Manu isnt the real hip gig and hg sound. It a cheaper kit ment for kits and when theres noting else a portable gron up set.

But the sound isnt near the real full hg sound. Simply because of the sizes (especially the Al foster but still also for the Marotta) and material (and price offcourse)

So, the Manu is a great kit but nothing like the "real" hip gigs. Better to say, a whole other sound.


I played a Foster HG last year and honestly I like the Manu better. The Foster was way nicer, and the drum nesting was badass (not gonna lie.) However, the Manu fit me better. I think that Im just better know than then. The bad thing about the Foster I played with the kick. It wasnt tuned right.

They dont have any lefty sets at the guitar center I go to. The drum guys all know me and have a Manu kit broken down in a corner that i set up lefty almost everytime i go in.

The main problem is money. I cant afford a Foster or Marotta hipgig.

Note: I wish you could nest the Manu

[nigel_fighter]

Oh man, I played a gretsch when i was in school, absolutely loved it. Gretsch is my favorite way to go for jazz.

Most every Yamaha i've ever played seems built for a stadium. Punchy, loud but they seem to lose tone when you play with some touch.
but that's just my taste

[crlujan]

As far as snares go in the $200 range... check out Pork Pie's Big Black snare. 6.5x14 brass with tube lugs. It's basically a Black Beauty copy but for only $240 at Guitar Center. I've got it cranked up and it sounds great. And I pretty much only play jazz.

www.guitarcenter.com/Pork-Pie-Big-Black-Brass-Snare-Drum-with-Tube-Lugs-102134301-i1165948.gc

And I'd go for the Gretsch Catalina Jazz. It's a pretty good kit.

[swing_set]

As far as snares go you could always buy second-hand...
or
you could do what is near in the future for me and build one
just a thought...