Advanced Filling - Need Recommendations

[zambizzi]

So I'm feelin' pretty good about the progress of my drumming which means I can also spot my weaknesses and low-points more easily now.

I'm really in need of some deep, thorough instruction on filling and accenting. Lately I feel very uninspired when it comes to filling and I'm really looking for something that will dig deep into the topic.

I really like the book + DVD combos. However, when it comes to DVDs I'm disappointed that I haven't found one that takes time to break down fills & accents and explain how to put phrasing together in an interesting way, while grooving. I like the Steve Smith and Steve Jordan videos but there's nothing in there, on this topic, that makes me go "wow! if only someone had explained that lick that way before!". I'm not knocking either of them...they're great...just not enough of what I'm after.

Can anyone make some recommendations? I think I'd prefer a DVD as opposed to just a book...but as I said...a combo of the two would be even better.

Thanks all!

[CtrStDrumSchool]

I would reccomend Mel Bay's Complete Modern Drum Set by Frank Briggs. Book and DVD are available.

[zambizzi]

I would reccomend Mel Bay's Complete Modern Drum Set by Frank Briggs. Book and DVD are available.

It just to happens...that I have both the book and dvd! I *love* the book but I think the DVD is horrible. Frank's playing is fantastic, of course, but there isn't anything instructional about the DVD at all. Everything is played way too fast and completely lacks explanation, which is likely because of the sheer volume of playing on the disc. I have, however, worked out of the book extensively. It's a little hard to make the book come alive w/ a bad DVD though.

[reddrum]

I feel the same way about most of the DVD's out. There is not enough breakdowns of fills. I have found some of the best lessons by searching on Youtube for "drum lesson" or "drum lick"

[Tomtom123]

You MUST get "Hands, Grooves, & Fills" by Pat Petrillo (Hudson Music). It's absolutely the BEST DVD/Book/CD package that demonstrates some amazing fills, not to mention the groove ideas.

Unlike other DVD's, he breaks them down slowly, and demonstrates many orchestrations, and they are all written in the Book. It has improved my fill vocabulary incredibly. He has so many combinations, it's sick, and he's a great teacher. Off the chain. I'm sure Bernhard would agree.

http://www.drummerworld.com/drummers/Pat_Petrillo.html

There's a link on the main page to get it in Amazon.

[Casper "DrPowerStroke" Paludan]

There's also Rick Latham's Advanced Funk Studies. A lot of cool fills (which I frankly never studied) that sound awesome, at least when Rick plays them :-) Casper

[dea]

Don't forget to employ multi level accents, i.e. 2in, 4in, 6in, and even 8in ( for those metal styles. hehehe... ).

Try striking at 2, 4, 2, 4, 6, etc.

You'd be surprised just how challenging this is.

Try doubles, varying the second strike as 2, 4.

R R L L R R L L R R L L
2 4 6

You get the picture.

[dea]

Ooops, my advanced transcription method is not in synch. hehehehe....

I hope you all understand what I'm getting at.

Remember, these can be employed by your feet as well.

These exercises will build control beyond your wildest imagination.

[Drummertist]

HANDS, GROOVES, AND FILLS by Pat Petrillo is the best!

It really is a complete curriculum.

I'm taking lessons from him right now at UNCPembroke and he's a great guy!

[zambizzi]

I was eyeballing Pat's book/video combination, it sounds like a lot of folks really dig that one...I'm sold! It was one of the few that had the combination book & DVD and the little bits I've seen look great.

And, thanks Doc, the Rick Latham videos I've seen here on DW look great too, maybe I'll check that out too.

Thanks!

[zambizzi]

Doesn't David Garibaldi have a book/dvd combo out, as well?

[Multiverse]

Wow already lots of support for Pat Petrillo; as a student of his at UNCP I can attest to his experience and knowledge of drumming. Clearly a master of hand technique, grooving, and fills, (hence his great book "Hands, grooves, and fills") he chooses not to throw everything he can do into any fill situation but rather tastefully and musically carry the groove along. I have also found Marco Minnemann material inspiring but it is a little bit more off the wall than Pat's; the book 4-way coordination by Marvin Dahlgren and Elliot Fine is good but hasn't maintained my interest the way Pat's has. One more idea for fills: Pete Lockett (petelockett.com) is an amazing world percussionist and on his website he has tutorials for just about every percussion instrument in the world - one really interesting idea is to appropriate a line of traditional rhythm from say Indian tabla or the middle eastern dumbek and lay that down as a fill on the set. My first post weee! Hope this helps.

[jasonmwnf]

"Lately I feel very uninspired when it comes to filling and I'm really looking for something that will dig deep into the topic."

Hey, i'm doing a lick of the month type series on youtube. Check it out. Although no substitute for an instructional package (such as mr. Petrillo's fantastic work), you might get some ideas to help with your inspiration.

heres the link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5GYLekdYqQ

[zambizzi]

"Lately I feel very uninspired when it comes to filling and I'm really looking for something that will dig deep into the topic."

Hey, i'm doing a lick of the month type series on youtube. Check it out. Although no substitute for an instructional package (such as mr. Petrillo's fantastic work), you might get some ideas to help with your inspiration.

heres the link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5GYLekdYqQ

Thanks, I'll check it out!

[mr_hayward_99]

if you are looking for advanced filling do not buy pat patrillos book

the section on ratamacues is pretty good but all in all there is not much material there to warrent buying the book for fikll alone

you are better of buying 4 way co ordination ( pats book has a section on split triplets) if this thing interest you then 4 way co-ordination is a great book.

Also learning linear drumming is a great exercise for fills.(chaffee system in the patterns book rock ostinatos or linear time playing for more detailed explination)

2 4 6 8 note groupings have 2 bass drum hits as the last 2 notes i.e. 6 note grouping would be 4 hands 2 feet
3 5 7 note groupings have 1 bass hit at the end i.e. 5 = 4 hands 1 foot.

you then take any mixture of note groupings and add them up to 16 (in 4/4)
i.e. 4 6 6.
play around with these combinations

Alternativly you could buy a reading book like 4/4 reading exercises by louie belson play through a couple of pages and this should spur some creativity for phrasing ideas. Again you can use the same book for accent ideas whiole playing a linear idea

hope this helps

[zambizzi]

if you are looking for advanced filling do not buy pat patrillos book

the section on ratamacues is pretty good but all in all there is not much material there to warrent buying the book for fikll alone

you are better of buying 4 way co ordination ( pats book has a section on split triplets) if this thing interest you then 4 way co-ordination is a great book.

Also learning linear drumming is a great exercise for fills.(chaffee system in the patterns book rock ostinatos or linear time playing for more detailed explination)

2 4 6 8 note groupings have 2 bass drum hits as the last 2 notes i.e. 6 note grouping would be 4 hands 2 feet
3 5 7 note groupings have 1 bass hit at the end i.e. 5 = 4 hands 1 foot.

you then take any mixture of note groupings and add them up to 16 (in 4/4)
i.e. 4 6 6.
play around with these combinations

Alternativly you could buy a reading book like 4/4 reading exercises by louie belson play through a couple of pages and this should spur some creativity for phrasing ideas. Again you can use the same book for accent ideas whiole playing a linear idea

hope this helps

Too late! While it's not quite as advanced as I had hoped, it's a very good DVD/Book set to have in the library and Pat's a killer drummer, it's inspirational just to watch the video. I have found myself doing similar fills w/ sextuplets and none of the fills on the video seem overwhelming.

It'd be nice if there was a video out there that just demonstrates a bunch of crazy licks...whether they be fills, accents, solo material, etc. It'd be cool if there was a resource that broke down crazy-complex licks in a simple manner. If there is such a thing, I'd like to know about it!

I decided to go back and spend more time with the Frank Briggs book, as Matt Scurfield suggested earlier in the thread. There are tons of great exercises in there that have already helped my independence and new ideas for filling/soloing.

I have the 4-Way book and have been working out of it almost daily for a couple of months now...it's indispensable and I wish I would have started using it sooner!

I think I'll check out the Rick Latham and David Garibaldi learning material out there since funk drumming has always been a big influence on me.

[Korompay]

Check it out!
http://www.drummerworld.com/Drumclinic/Rick_Gratton.html

[zambizzi]

Check it out!
http://www.drummerworld.com/Drumclinic/Rick_Gratton.html

That's why I love drummerworld! Thanks!

[Tomtom123]

If you want 'crazy", over the top fills, check the Shed Sessionz DVD. If you could figure those out, you'd have what you need..
http://www.drummerworld.com/News/Shedsessionz2.html


Mr. Hayward, not sure if everyone would agree about your assessment of Pat Petrillo's "FILLS" section, and I certaintly wouldn't recommend drummers to NOT buy it, because difficulty is all relative, and usefulness is also very important. What I get most out of it is the fact that he gives you the methodology, then it's up to YOU to put them together as best you can. Then, you watch the DVD, and they come to life, in a musical way.

I also think "FILLS", and "LICKS" are two different things, and most musicians like creative, musical fills, not "licks". Not that "licks" aren't fun :)

Just my two cents.

[jasonmwnf]

If you want 'crazy", over the top fills, check the Shed Sessionz DVD. If you could figure those out, you'd have what you need..
http://www.drummerworld.com/News/Shedsessionz2.html


Mr. Hayward, not sure if everyone would agree about your assessment of Pat Petrillo's "FILLS" section, and I certaintly wouldn't recommend drummers to NOT buy it, because difficulty is all relative, and usefulness is also very important. What I get most out of it is the fact that he gives you the methodology, then it's up to YOU to put them together as best you can. Then, you watch the DVD, and they come to life, in a musical way.

I also think "FILLS", and "LICKS" are two different things, and most musicians like creative, musical fills, not "licks". Not that "licks" aren't fun :)

Just my two cents.

I'm actually in the proccess of transcribing some of those "FILLS" from shedsessionz. I'll post em up if anyone is interested?

Jason
www.drum-fu.com

[samthebeat]

Get into stickings and accents. A good way to practice accents is to read figures from a book like new breed and accent the notated notes. There is so much scope once you get into, start writing stuff out, playing around with parardidles etc, and just try and figure where you can put accents and crashes etc.

[zambizzi]

I'm actually in the proccess of transcribing some of those "FILLS" from shedsessionz. I'll post em up if anyone is interested?

Jason
www.drum-fu.com (http://www.drum-fu.com)

Absolutely, please do!

[Korompay]

Check this out! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bat9k3MNXY0