Vinnie Colaiuta [Archive] - Page 2 - DRUMMERWORLD OFFICIAL DISCUSSION FORUM

Gibbersticks

01-23-2007, 04:26 PM

Well first off sorry about my language in my last post, I shouldn't have done that. Sorry. Basically I didn't like what he had to say. From what he said about hating people asking him how he came up with this, and how do you do that. Calling most drummers today "lazy and non-musical" and that all anyone wants to see or hear is "razzle-dazzle". Yet he talks about himself as having an outlook on drumming that is "very visceral and conceptual and wide". I though he came across as narrow minded and self absorbed. Yes a lot of music today is the same ol' rehash of something that happened 20-30 years ago and is sterile as all hell, but if you don't like it then don't listen to the radio. I don't. I happen to think that there are a lot of crazy talented "musical drummers" out there that make me work harder and harder to be the best that I can. Some of them have forums on this website and they are more than happy to help you with questions about certain concepts and you never get a response like "figure it out for yourself" or "your going to get what you get out of it". For someone who is considered an "innovator" who is complaining about the state of drumming today he isn't doing very much to change the problems he sees other than to complain about it. Doesn't sound very innovative or original to me.

jonescrusher

01-23-2007, 04:38 PM

Well first off sorry about my language in my last post, I shouldn't have done that. Sorry. Basically I didn't like what he had to say. From what he said about hating people asking him how he came up with this, and how do you do that. Calling most drummers today "lazy and non-musical" and that all anyone whats to see or hear is "razzle-dazzle". Yet he talks about himself as having an outlook on drumming that is "very visceral and conceptual and wide". I though he came across as narrow minded and self absorbed.

Well, if almost any other drummer had said that, i'd agree, but Vinnie.... The fact that many other drummers and musicians place him on a pedestal, and that he's clearly a very intelligent person anyway I think sometimes contributes to an, at times, aloof image. That said, many major players have the problem of not being able to analyse the chops they come up with, that's the beauty of their improvisational ability.

Anways, I won't be treated to that MD issue over here for a couple of months at least, so i wait in great anticipation.

Gibbersticks

01-23-2007, 05:13 PM

Well I'm sorry, I'd hate to spoil the surprise for ya!

Womble

01-23-2007, 05:27 PM

From what he said about hating people asking him how he came up with this, and how do you do that. Calling most drummers today "lazy and non-musical" and that all anyone wants to see or hear is "razzle-dazzle". Yet he talks about himself as having an outlook on drumming that is "very visceral and conceptual and wide".

Sounds like a totally accurate appraisal of the current drum scene. Well said Vinnie.

Gibbersticks

01-23-2007, 06:03 PM

Drumming scene or music scene? Music these days is Pro-tooled to death. The drums probably being the most affected by the digital era. In my opinion it all comes down to what you listen to. And it really isn't any different than it has been for the last 20-40 years. Every era has only had a handfull of really special players. I kinda prefer it that way because those guy get to really shine. And it has been awhile since Vinnie did anything really special. I did however agree with what Vinnie said about drumming becoming a sport and guys walking around with their Drum-o-meter. What the hell is that? WFD??? Who cares.....well obviously someone, but you centainly don't have to pay attention to it.

Gibbersticks

01-23-2007, 06:21 PM

And Vinnie also said "you have to play for the song". How many times have we all heard that? Yet when we do play for the song, drummers everywhere jump all over you for not having chops! A drummer can only do so much for a song. If you play and show your chops your over playing, if you lay back and only play what a song needs you have nothing to offer. I don't get it.

vadrum

01-23-2007, 06:25 PM

well, although his words may be a bit brash, if one person has EARNED the right to call it as he sees it, its vinnie. vinnie doesnt need to do anything spectacular, he knows his playing speaks for itself, which i believe is his point. also, why should he give up a secret or allow another drummer to cop a lick w/ a five minute lesson when it took him the better part of his lifetime to be able to play the way he does? i know its very tempting to ask players of that caliber how to play this or that but one day the young drummers out there are going to have to learn to do things the old fashion way....sit w/ a record, tape, cd, or video and put in the hours necessary to find out how NOT to play their favourite lick before they figure out how to play it. when jeff watts is asked "what are you playing?" he usually replies w/ a very cryptic "5's and 7's." this, to me, is a respectable answer. he didn't get the opportunity for a short cut, he put in a lot of work to develop his sound and he had to experiment to get there and once you do the same you will see how much his answer truly relates to the way he plays. dont deny yourself the opportunity of learning thru trial and error......remember its not about the end, its about the journey.

Womble

01-23-2007, 06:33 PM

Yes, Vadrum, YES. If everyone thought like this maybe we'd be spared all those "How did you get such a fast foot?" questions. "Because I practised a lot, you idiot, what do you think?!?!"

Gibbersticks

01-23-2007, 06:53 PM

Gibbersticks

01-23-2007, 06:58 PM

Now yes that falls under lazy and dumb!!!!

Yes, Vadrum, YES. If everyone thought like this maybe we'd be spared all those "How did you get such a fast foot?" questions. "Because I practised a lot, you idiot, what do you think?!?!"

jonescrusher

01-23-2007, 07:09 PM

I don't think its fair to suggest he's lazy or apathetic in teaching his ways to others - some are better than others in explaining clearly their techniques and approaches. Check out his website - he provides a great and simply laid out approach to implied metric modulation; buy the Unreel Drum book for further insights into his playing. The complexity of his playing, and the apparent fact that he's not a natural born educator means that the majority of drummers probably wouldn't benefit from him imparting his knowledge.

wy yung

01-23-2007, 07:54 PM

I think he's probably far too busy recording or touring to devote much time to education. Were I in his position, those would be my highest priorities.

NUTHA JASON

01-23-2007, 08:18 PM

i think vinnie has contribited enough to drumming education just playing on CDs. if he gives us any more its a bonus.

do you know who Larry Finn is? some do a lot of drummers don't...why? becaise he is a great drum educator without huge vinnie like fame. his strength is transferring ideas as well as drumming. check out his DVDs. how many people really knew tommy igoe before the DVDs? not that many.

j

vadrum

01-23-2007, 08:50 PM

I completely agree with the whole trial and error thing BELIEVE ME I KNOW!!! I have 20 years of trial and error ( mostly error ) under my belt. But then if that is the only way learn things and get a little respect from your peers then why would anyone bother to take lessons? Is that being lazy and un-musical too then? Shouldn't we all help cultivate and educate the up and comming to creative and musical? I'm not saying give them all the answers but whats wrong with a little hint or clue. For someone to say "I'm playing 5's and 7's" well thats great!! Your not laying it all out for them but putting them in the right general direction and chances they will come up with something similar but different. And I hate generalizations that all drummers are lazy and un-musical. Are you?

i wouldnt pay for a lesson w/ vinnie to ask about a lick. id take a lesson w/ vinnie to discuss approaches to practicing or playing, technique, or concepts of playing. further, if i were interested in one of vinnies licks, then i would at least attempt to pay the man for his knowledge. i wouldnt expect him to respond when hes never met me b4 and now suddenly im in his face at the club begging for a peek at his tricks.

see the real issue here is that we have students out there trying to find the secret to having a fast foot or playing like vinnie. or they think that the secret to being successful in music is playing all of the flash. but there are no secrets truthfully. its all laid out for you to play it out. you just need to be able to go out there and figure it out. to me thats the real purpose of a teacher. when youre my student, my goal is to get you to the point where you are able to figure things out for yourself. then you can shape your own sound and take music in your own direction.

to me, it sounds like vinnie is running across folks that he feels are focusing on the wrong thing and he meets folks that dont want to put the time in to figure things out for themselves. if you want to get a handle on one of his licks, skip the lesson and dont talk to him about it, go to the club and get a seat right next to the drums and stay there, watching, every night until the gig is over.

syoshii

01-25-2007, 07:40 AM

Yes, Vadrum, YES. If everyone thought like this maybe we'd be spared all those "How did you get such a fast foot?" questions. "Because I practised a lot, you idiot, what do you think?!?!"

I totally agree with you. Vinnie has been practicing real hard. Even now he is saying like "I need to practice paradiddle more!" His play is based on the basics which many of us are practicing as well, just like 26 (or 40) rudiments, Stick Control for the Snare Drummer , 4 -Way Coordination: A Method Book for the Development of Complete Independence on the Drum Set, or Patterns.
And all those are a kind of "scale practice" for drummers. Drummers need to play "music" based on those things. I guess Vinnie wants to talk about music.

Skitch

01-25-2007, 09:27 AM

Well, if almost any other drummer had said that, i'd agree, but Vinnie.... The fact that many other drummers and musicians place him on a pedestal, and that he's clearly a very intelligent person anyway I think sometimes contributes to an, at times, aloof image. That said, many major players have the problem of not being able to analyse the chops they come up with, that's the beauty of their improvisational ability.

Anways, I won't be treated to that MD issue over here for a couple of months at least, so i wait in great anticipation.

And there is a difference between a great drummer and a great teacher. Some drummers are both and, sadly, some of the greatest drummers, because of their lack of ability to communicate, will take everything to the grave with them.

Mike

http://www.mikemccraw.com
http://www.dominoretroplate.com

http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=drummermikemccraw

jonescrusher

01-30-2007, 02:09 AM

Some drummers are both and, sadly, some of the greatest drummers, because of their lack of ability to communicate, will take everything to the grave with them.

Mike

http://www.mikemccraw.com
http://www.dominoretroplate.com

http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=drummermikemccraw

But what you see and hear is what you get on the multitude of recordings and video footage of the man. There's no unfathomable secret to his playing that he's refusing to share....

X22

01-30-2007, 05:17 PM

X22

01-30-2007, 05:24 PM

Drummers jump all over you for not having chops? They do? I wouldn't. Jeff Porcaro wouldn't. Vinnie certainly won't. An experienced drummer won't do that. What does chops have to do with making music? I find Vinnie's playing on "Fields of Gold" every bit as good (if not better) than the hundreds of solo clips that everyone puts up.

And Vinnie also said "you have to play for the song". How many times have we all heard that? Yet when we do play for the song, drummers everywhere jump all over you for not having chops! A drummer can only do so much for a song. If you play and show your chops your over playing, if you lay back and only play what a song needs you have nothing to offer. I don't get it.

KzSgDrummer

01-30-2007, 05:27 PM

I read Vinnie's interview with glee that he was standing up and stating the truth. Bravo.

X22

01-30-2007, 05:46 PM

Bingo. Vinnie isn't hiding a thing. I think 99% of us don't get it and wouldn't get it if he explained it to us.

Given enough time, any of us could master the technical skills required to play what Vinnie plays. There are dozens of drummers that have already mastered this. Probably hundreds. Probably thousands.

It's not about chops. It's about how to use chops. When to do this, when to do that and when NOT. There's also what he brings to the drums that can't be taught or practiced. It was something he was born with. He was born with the ability to be "very visceral and conceptual and wide". That's the ticket right there.

There's no unfathomable secret to his playing that he's refusing to share....

Gibbersticks

01-30-2007, 05:48 PM

And a perfect example of this thinking is right at our fingertips. Read the majority of posts in this forum (or any drum forum) and it's all about speed or someone trying to find a short-cut to "improve" their playing.

The people most offended by Vinnie's criticism are those types of drummers.

Well if you think I'm offended because I'm looking for a short cut your dead wrong! I have been playing for 19 years and I practice everyday for at least 2hrs. I'm not anywhere near as gifted as someone like Vinnie and no I don't consider myself to have all my chops in order. But I happen to think that Vinnie was making a very big generalization when he that statement. Ya sure there are a lot of drummers looking for the easy way (along with guitar, bass, etc, etc, etc) but there are just as many people I'm sure who are passionate about their instrument and music and take the time to learn everything they can. That is what offended me. And there are some absolutely amazing drummers out there right now and Vinnie's comments in MD made me think "Are you living in a hole somewhere?" So who cares if someone wants the "secret" to this or that, let them waste their time trying to find it. So you'll have to excuse me now, I have all day to play my brand new drums.

JayDVee009

01-30-2007, 06:32 PM

The drumming for Megadeath was kinda boring, for metal drumming, but I agree about the Kick the Chair riff...cool.

I saw him on TV with Faith Hill. Perfect Rhythm drumming ;-)

Good morning fellow drummers,

I just wanted to say that Vinnie is an absolute Legend! And also that his drumming on the Megadeth album is excellent aswell! I would never have expected him to do a metal album and it's just blown me away! I'm a huge fan of Frank Zappa & Chick Corea and I'm also a metal fan among other things.

The thing is, metal drumming doesn't have to be fast and complex to sound awesome.

There are many metal bands that play slower, chunkier style music and the drums might be slower but they can sound groovy, powerful, and very cool! (eg. Soulfly, Sevendust)

Vinnie's drumming on "The System Has Failed" is a real treat... to hear a drummer of his quality and capabilities and high level of skill playing hard hitting groovy beats to some fine metal riffs is very cool to say the least and he does it with absolute class and style!

Very cool drumming on a very cool album.

Gibbersticks

01-30-2007, 07:20 PM

I just borrowed "The System Has Failed" from my guitar player but haven't listened to it yet. And I completely agree that metal drumming doesn't have to be crazy and fast all the time. Besides a lot of metal drumming falls into what has been discussed in the thread of late. I personally find blast beats and straight 16ths/ 32nd note double bass boring as hell. There is no imagination or color to it.

Sorry wy yung if I seem to be picking on you. Your comment last week or whenever was the latest one regarding chops and I was getting tired of reading about that stuff all the time. Just venting!!! LOL. Anyway I understand what Vinnie was trying to get across after seeing everyone elses interpretation of his article.

wy yung

01-30-2007, 07:28 PM

I

Sorry wy yung if I seem to be picking on you. Your comment last week or whenever was the latest one regarding chops and I was getting tired of reading about that stuff all the time. Just venting!!! LOL. Anyway I understand what Vinnie was trying to get across after seeing everyone elses interpretation of his article.

Oh no need to be sorry. I tend to agree with you. ;-)

fat in the middle

01-30-2007, 07:58 PM

wy yung

01-30-2007, 08:13 PM

The word Groit [sp] is a term used to describe a type of musician in africa. They mimick sounds of their environment, and tell stories,,The whole topic of chops etc and the analogy of sport Vinnie used, resonated with me. I feel it must be frustrating for someone like him to be bombarded with chop based questions, when he is so inside the music, and feeling it from an artists point of view. That said, i am not a fan per se of him, only because i haven't been that exposed to him. These guys have the ability to pull time bending things off, with the help of a great band in full support.

Perhaps it's more a matter of people forgeting their beginngs once they've become so advanced. I am sure as a youngster Vinnie would've spent a lot of time working on chops. Now of course he's moved beyond chops to a more conceptual level. Perhaps he would prefer more conceptual type questions. But it's hard for people who are not at that level to ask these questions. A person can really only ask a question based upon their own limitations.

Oh well, history has shown that gods rarely have patience when dealing with mere mortals. ;-)

jonescrusher

01-30-2007, 09:11 PM

wy yung

02-10-2007, 05:12 PM

I read the Vinnie interview in MD recently and I was really impressed by it. I know elsewhere it has caused some controversy within sections of the drumming community, but I thought it was right on the money; and it brought to mind the following quotation.

"Beware, all thieves and imitators of other people's labour and talents, laying your audacious hands upon our work"
Albrecht Duerer

X22

02-10-2007, 05:24 PM

Absolutely dead-on accurate. The people that are going to be offended are the ones he was talking about.

dawg

02-10-2007, 06:46 PM

when vinnie speaks,you gotta listen. when the world's greatest drummers express their opinions,you don't have to agree, but we should listen(or read.) i think vinnie's interview was very hearfelt and passionate about the state of music today.

druid

02-12-2007, 05:38 PM

i wouldnt pay for a lesson w/ vinnie to ask about a lick. id take a lesson w/ vinnie to discuss approaches to practicing or playing, technique, or concepts of playing. further, if i were interested in one of vinnies licks, then i would at least attempt to pay the man for his knowledge. i wouldnt expect him to respond when hes never met me b4 and now suddenly im in his face at the club begging for a peek at his tricks.

see the real issue here is that we have students out there trying to find the secret to having a fast foot or playing like vinnie. or they think that the secret to being successful in music is playing all of the flash. but there are no secrets truthfully. its all laid out for you to play it out. you just need to be able to go out there and figure it out. to me thats the real purpose of a teacher. when youre my student, my goal is to get you to the point where you are able to figure things out for yourself. then you can shape your own sound and take music in your own direction.

to me, it sounds like vinnie is running across folks that he feels are focusing on the wrong thing and he meets folks that dont want to put the time in to figure things out for themselves. if you want to get a handle on one of his licks, skip the lesson and dont talk to him about it, go to the club and get a seat right next to the drums and stay there, watching, every night until the gig is over.

I have to agree....alot of what he said too about flash over substance in playing....made me think likewise. I think people need to realize theree are no short cuts to becoming a great player....but I would attribute this to the short attention spans of people sometimes also. You also need to relaize that it is not about ripping off someone's licks and using them...it is about working your own tail end off and discovering your OWN playing...just taking someone's licks always comes across as simply stealing or borrowing with no genuine artisrty behind it....just my opinion.

Gibbersticks

02-13-2007, 04:14 AM

Absolutely dead-on accurate. The people that are going to be offended are the ones he was talking about.

Well I hope you weren't refering to me, and someone else said that to regarding one of my comments. I though a few of his comments were "generalizations" and ya someone in his shoes would probably see it a lot more than I would having people come up to him constantly asking stupid questions about how did you get so fast, how did you do that, blah blah blah....

What I was trying to say for example, regarding what he said about drum clinics and how everyone just wants to see razzle-dazzle and flash. Well not me. I accually get bored watching drum solos, everyone always does the same ol' stuff. I would rather someone come and demonstrate a concept that you can take home, practice, and add to your "toolbox". And since Vinnie says that he thinks "very visceral and conceptual and wide" when it comes to his playing, I would love to have him elaborate on that in a clinic setting.

All his talk about "sensationalism" kinda struck me as strange. Was he saying that regarding just drummers? Hello, that would be more accurate if it was a statement regarding the state of the world we live in. Everything is sensationalized! Why does he sound so surprised? Being a world traveller such as it is that should be pretty obvious.

And as my final statement to this thread (cause the topic lately is getting old), Has anyone looked at Vinnie's artist page? All this talk of sensationalism and razzle-dazzle and flash, if you look at those clips thats all thats there! Or might there be another name for what he is talking about? Entertainment!!!

n2xlr8n

02-13-2007, 04:10 PM

And since Vinnie says that he thinks "very visceral and conceptual and wide" when it comes to his playing, I would love to have him elaborate on that in a clinic setting.

I would too, it just isn't what the majority wants today. I think Vinnie was stating his worry about the future of drumming; I just wish he had taken a more tactful approach. Instead, he came off as bitter. I hate that for him. I hate that for us. I hate that for the kids that worship him, and have no idea what they're hearing beyond the eleventy-billion beats per nanosec.

All his talk about "sensationalism" kinda struck me as strange. Was he saying that regarding just drummers? Hello, that would be more accurate if it was a statement regarding the state of the world we live in. Everything is sensationalized! Why does he sound so surprised? Being a world traveller such as it is that should be pretty obvious.

I agree. WTTL.

SRJ

Womble

02-13-2007, 06:19 PM

I just wish he had taken a more tactful approach. Instead, he came off as bitter.

See I didn't think he sounded remotely bitter. What's HE got to be bitter about? It's not like he's losing work because everyone else sucks.

People seem so worried about causing offence these days, like it's this major crime that will scar people for life. What happened to telling it like it is? Mingus once hit someone in the face because they stuffed up a part!

X22

02-13-2007, 06:59 PM

1) His approach is that he looks at the big picture of a song and his playing fits how he sees that picture. I think he feels he's able to get into the mind of the other musician(s) and play exactly what they think they want to hear.

2) Vinnie didn't post those clips. It's possible that Vinnie wouldn't post any audio/video of himself. (Psst, look at his own page.)

And since Vinnie says that he thinks "very visceral and conceptual and wide" when it comes to his playing, I would love to have him elaborate on that in a clinic setting.

And as my final statement to this thread (cause the topic lately is getting old), Has anyone looked at Vinnie's artist page? All this talk of sensationalism and razzle-dazzle and flash, if you look at those clips thats all thats there! Or might there be another name for what he is talking about? Entertainment!!!

Gibbersticks

02-13-2007, 07:38 PM

Vinnie didn't post those clips. It's possible that Vinnie wouldn't post any audio/video of himself. (Psst, look at his own page.)

I have looked at his web page, but thats not what I meant. Vinnie's playing (from my perspective) is razzle-dazzle and flash even when he is laying back to play for the song. Am I saying that it is wrong? Hell no! He is at a level that quite frankly none of us can touch. So when he is laying back and "serving the song" he is still razzle-dazzle compared to what you, I, or anyone else would play. He may not see it that way, but from the eyes of mear mortals?

X22

02-13-2007, 08:35 PM

The style of music he is playing in those videos is such that it allows him to play that way.

Did you ever get a chance to see Vinnie play with Sting? Two entirely different approaches to playing the gig.

n2xlr8n

02-13-2007, 10:39 PM

See I didn't think he sounded remotely bitter. What's HE got to be bitter about? It's not like he's losing work because everyone else sucks.

LOL. Right!

People seem so worried about causing offence these days, like it's this major crime that will scar people for life. What happened to telling it like it is? Mingus once hit someone in the face because they stuffed up a part!

To clarify: I understood his meaning, I'm just not sure his approach would be understood by the majority of young drummers today (at least those consumed with all things BPM).

I think had he explained his reasoning for not doing clinics in more lay terms, rather than the intellectual-esoteric, it would have been easily understood.

SRJ

Womble

02-14-2007, 03:12 AM

I'm just not sure his approach would be understood by the majority of young drummers today (at least those consumed with all things BPM).

I don't know what approach would get through to these young speed freaks. I doubt anything written in a magazine would manage. I think the best hope is for them to be reached early by a good teacher who can introduce them to true drumming/musical genius.

glen thomas

02-17-2007, 11:20 AM

I read the recent Vinnie article in Modern Drummer and loved it. He's being honest and really, the big picture is that he is a hired gun and only has to impress the people he's working for. Also, he's making a living at it and in my opinion, has nothing to prove.
Sometimes we fans put these pros on such a high platform that it's almost taboo if they slant left or right of popular opinion. That's kinda our fault in a way. Vinnie can play it simple are stretch it to the limit. That's not a fault, that's a gift. There will always be people that believe less is more or more is greater but if you can do it all, (and Vinnie can), no one should have a hang up with what he said in that article or how he plays on recordings or live. That issue of Modern Drummer has to be my favourite in a long while.
An interview with a bit of edge is far more enjoyable than the fluff MD has been printing lately. ;-)

Green and Mean

03-02-2007, 01:04 PM

When I first saw Vinnie(Weckl, Gadd, Colaiuta soloing), I was not so impressed."Good drummer,nice technique" etc. THen I saw his videos on youtube, playing with Jeff Beck. I started to like him more and more. FInally I decided to download his Zappa albums like Joe's Garage and Shut Up Play Yer' Guitar. And he changed my thinking about drums...
I've never thought that someone could do something so diffrent, his drumming on albums is incredibly intresting. When I had listened those albums about 15 times, I started to analyze each and every song. Concluison, my new favourite drummer. Then I asked from my drum teacher(he is a very good drummer and super teacher!) "how is it possible to play something like that"? He said "his echniqual abilty allows him to play everything in every way." This has made me thinking music in diffrent way.

Thanks Vinnie, that you chose drumming!!!

wy yung

03-06-2007, 04:27 AM

I just wish he had taken a more tactful approach. Instead, he came off as bitter.

I agree. WTTL.

SRJ

Hello SRJ.

I used to write for drum magazines. With this in mind I feel it important to mention the editing process. I doubt that what we read in any interview is word for word. I only realized later when editing an interview for the first time how easily it is for one's words to say something other than what was meant. The writer may not even be aware of how the editing may affect readers until after. I tend to take them with a grain of salt and certainly never personally.

My interpretation of much of what was said is that drumming is being denegrated to the level of sport by those running the 3 minute drumming mile. I wholly agree 100%. These people, in my own opinion, are doing an artform a great disservice. It gives us a bad name as non musicians. Something we have always had to battle against since the riverboat days.

syoshii

03-06-2007, 05:01 AM

Hello SRJ.

I used to write for drum magazines. With this in mind I feel it important to mention the editing process. I doubt that what we read in any interview is word for word. I only realized later when editing an interview for the first time how easily it is for one's words to say something other than what was meant. The writer may not even be aware of how the editing may affect readers until after. I tend to take them with a grain of salt and certainly never personally.

Exactly. I'm a drummer and also a Jazz critic, and I once did an interview with a Jazz piano player for an issue of PLAYBOY Magazine Japanese edition, featuring the guide of New York City for tourists. I had a lot of limitations regarding with the number of pages, theme of that issue's feature, etc. so I had to "edit" his words quite drastically. Actually I had to cut the most interesting and deepest part of his talk - it was his opinion about educating younger musicians - because it didn't have a direct link to the theme, i.e. the tourist guide.
I think in many cases what the media wants to publish or broadcast and what the interviewee wants to say is quite different.

fusssion

03-06-2007, 08:31 PM

I'll have to admit when I first read the article I said to myself...."what a jerk!" Then I kept reading,...and tried to realize where he's coming from,...and I wound up enjoying it, and agreeing with most of what he said.

I do believe though that there were times that he didn't need to sound so 'harsh' I guess....but other than that, I can see where he's coming from.

X22

03-07-2007, 02:31 AM

He's paid his dues. He owes nobody anything. He can be harsh if he chooses. Listen to the message, not how it's delivered.

I do believe though that there were times that he didn't need to sound so 'harsh' I guess....but other than that, I can see where he's coming from.

PHIL2007

03-10-2007, 07:17 AM

This guy is the one to watch,man! his phrasing is awesome!

cantstandyourfunk

03-11-2007, 02:55 PM

I can't believe there are SO MANY guys out here actually critiquing Vinnie's playing. If any one of 'em played quarter-way close to what he does, I'd listen in...and probably be devoted...but hey, whatever.
It's Palladium, all the way....

caprisun3484

03-13-2007, 03:38 AM

This guy is the one to watch,man! his phrasing is awesome!

yea Vinnie does have amazing phrasing
that's probably one of my favorite parts about his playing

jonescrusher

03-23-2007, 09:39 PM

I uploaded this a couple of weeks ago, here it is before i forget again:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCg6bQiE_RY

An absolutely exquisite cross-sticking groove from the man (@1.01), for me the epitome of musical voicing. I nearly wet myself the first time i saw this.

toteman2

03-24-2007, 03:43 AM

lastditch

03-25-2007, 08:25 PM

Vinnie practcally has a patent on the word groove and plays in the pocket like no other.Sure there are more progressive and faster guys but for a gnasty lick...Vin can dish.

Mook

03-26-2007, 02:59 PM

Was listening to 'Now you see it now you don't' from Zappa's 'Tinseltown Rebellion' album - it's like he's taking Drumming into high art or something - incredible stuff.

jonescrusher

03-26-2007, 04:06 PM

Mook, how did you get on with the Token of my Extreme part? I've been giving it a go as well since i got hold of the transcription - those 32nd note bits are nasty....

Mook

03-26-2007, 07:42 PM

Gibbersticks

03-26-2007, 09:34 PM

Well I just had been listening to Megadeth - The System Has Failed and I have to say that although I though a lot of the songs were kind of lame the drumming was unreal and beautiful all at once. So clean and precise with great feel.

Ian Ballard

03-26-2007, 10:26 PM

I've had a go at the bits I was most interested in, however I've barely played this year & when I have - it's been in the context of a band. I'm not really one for playing songs the whole way through - I prefer to adapt beats/chops & play them in my own way - which is partly down to laziness. I did manage the 32nd notes (playing them on my knees & the floor) - they're not easy though - I'd put 'Token of my extreme' up there in my top 5 or 10 drum tracks of all time, amazing stuff!

I had to transcribe the thing. "Token" is crazy and smooth, at the same time. "Five, Five, FIVE!" on Shut Up and Play Yer Guitar, is some of the most brilliant 5 work ever. And I think the 19/16 grooves "Keep it Greasy" defied logic at times... in a good way.

Vinnie + Zappa = Musical Singularity.

Mook

03-26-2007, 11:05 PM

This thread is so much more enjoyable when people are discussing what they enjoy about Vinnie's playing rather than the 'Gadd own's Vinnie in that drum battle' or 'you suck ass if you think Vinnie is faster than Buddy Rich' type stuff. I love so many drummers & their work for so many reasons & think it's so much more important than to bring it down to that level...

jonescrusher

03-27-2007, 02:31 AM

I've had a go at the bits I was most interested in, however I've barely played this year & when I have - it's been in the context of a band. I'm not really one for playing songs the whole way through - I prefer to adapt beats/chops & play them in my own way - which is partly down to laziness. I did manage the 32nd notes (playing them on my knees & the floor) - they're not easy though - I'd put 'Token of my extreme' up there in my top 5 or 10 drum tracks of all time, amazing stuff!

Haha, a man after my heart. I've never had much concentration to play through transcriptions end to end, but Token has such great parts that i've made a commitment to see it through lol
Awesome track awesome Vinnie.

Nice to see Ian Ballard make a return too

syoshii

03-27-2007, 03:25 AM

I had to transcribe the thing. "Token" is crazy and smooth, at the same time. "Five, Five, FIVE!" on Shut Up and Play Yer Guitar, is some of the most brilliant 5 work ever. And I think the 19/16 grooves "Keep it Greasy" defied logic at times... in a good way.

"Keep it Greasy" is one of my top 10 favorite drum tracks of all time. Really unusual, and still sounds so natural and smooth...I was just blown away when I first heard it!

dawg

03-28-2007, 06:57 AM

yes! AND ALAN DAWSON'S LEGACY SHOULD BE KEPT ALIVE! RIGHT ON!

Laurent

03-28-2007, 01:56 PM

Vinnie's awesome.... I really like him when he's in a "soft groove" mood... The recordings on Kenny Pore's "Sessions Vol I" and "Sessions Vol 2" are fantastic (smooth/contemporary jazz).

I love his work on Gino Vanelli's "Nightwalker" and, of course, on Karizma's "Document". I think that some of Vinnie best works are found on David Garfield/Karizma's recordings. The things he played on those Creatchy Records albums - for instance for Brandon Fields, Steve Tavaglione and Larry Klimas - are really really good.

I personally never understood the comparison between Colaiuta and Gadd or Weckl. All three of them have different styles and they are all brilliant.

Ian Ballard

03-30-2007, 11:03 PM

I noticed at the beginning of the thread, that "Nutha Jason" wrote that he didn't like Vinnie "as a person", to paraphrase.

I wonder what that's all about.

Ashbash

04-26-2007, 03:45 PM

Must confess I didn't really like the way this guy played, thought he was a bit too choppy (not that I am anywhere near as good as him... anywhere...), but just this tuesday I heard him play with Herbie Hancock.

He's a freaking legend.

He was really tasteful, plays what works, and really well too. Seems like a modest bloke too. It was pretty cool how he wore his black singlet in front of a black background, you saw his arms flailing about like they weren't attached to anything :p

I had no idea he'd be there, luckily managed to get tix for Herbie on the day (!!) and doubly bonus, turns out he was playing!

On the downside, no more concerts till August... my parents have been forking out the dough.

So yeah. New found respect for Vinnie. Anybody else see him on the tour?

karmadharma

04-28-2007, 03:05 AM

YYou're also right in his playing. It's so frickin' subtle yet so amazing. Would I have ever thought of playing a 4/4 pattern in my right hand and a 5/4 or 7/4 pattern in my right? It's so unnatural but when he plays it, it's SO natural that you don't even notice it until someone points it out. And the groove is just so solid. I remember when I first figured it out and went "Duh, that's too easy." Then I sat down and tried to do it. Good God.

hahahahaha, I couldn't have put it better, the other day I was like 'hey, I've been listened to seven days so many times, why don't I ever trying playing it? it sounds like a pretty easy groove'... yeah, right...

trumvirvel

07-07-2007, 04:47 PM

Hi there,

I have a question for those of you who recognize Vinnie's (and Katchés) playing - who plays on which track on Stings "Brand new day"? Been looking all over the net for info, but haven't found it. Anyone who knows?

All the best,
M

EDIT: Later the same day I found on a Wiki page that he is supposed to play on 3 tracks on "Brand new day" - the question still remains which though...

Miron

07-08-2007, 02:46 AM

He is one hell of a drummer...really so much rythmic knowledge...but lately I get disappointed by him...I watched him with Jeff Beck and that was very strange playing...he was playing so complex and unnecessery phrases...Evene Beck himself was so confused during Vinnie's fills...just listen track Stratus!
For me Vinnie's playing is the best on Sting's album...I mean Seven Days, and other tracks are just amazing...I would like to see him again with Sting!

the skin man

07-25-2007, 09:37 PM

There are some very interesting questions and answers on the Vinnie webpage:

Question: Has yours or Steve Gadd's head ever exploded on stage? - ( - 1/23/2006 )

Answer: Once, I think that my head actually 'imploded' and went through a wormhole and back, BEFORE it even happened in linear time, so thankfully nobody noticed! Whew!

Question: Hello Mr Colaiutta: My wife is pregnant ( I think this is the best gift from god for a couple in love like Maria (my wife) and me) and I make my wife listen great music (karizma - document my favourite included). Do you think it is good for the child? I want him to be a musician because I think music is the most wonderful art. Which age do you think is good for children to get involve in music? Thanks a lot. - (Tito Julio - 5/12/2005 )

Answer: Congratulations! And, amen. Yes, I think it is good for the child to be exposed to great music during pregnancy, and always. I think that exposure to great music and art immediately is a good age. And, I would have he or she tell you whether he or she wants to be a musician. I wouldn't force it, but I certainly would foster it.

Question: This ist more a prophetical question :-)
Is it possible to book you for some drumlessons when we are all in heaven? I think in the heaven there will be a drum department, harp playing is not my bussines. - (Beat Kunz - 3/7/2005 )

Answer: :-) Maybe then The Lord will give us ALL more lessons!
Bless ya!

Question: How and when did you give your life to the Lord JesusChrist? - (Cristian Borneo - 3/3/2005 )

Answer: Around March 10, 1998. Amen!

Question: My question is very simple, Vinnie: what's on your mind when you are playing? - (Akira Jimbo - 11/3/2000 )

Answer: Not much, if anything. It also depends somewhat on the circumstances - as they are all different, yet similar. The most important elements in playing music are to trust and surrender with developed discernment.

Check out the page: http://www.vinniecolaiuta.com/faqs.aspx

And keep 'em comin'.

mind_drummer

08-14-2007, 07:41 AM

I found out just recently that Vinnie recorded "The System has Failed" from Megadeth and I'm astounished by his playing. Vinnie may very well be the most versatile drummer out there.

Thumb's up Vinnie !

webstercat

08-27-2007, 10:10 PM

He is just one of those guys that you just can't argue about. I love his playing, but it depresse me to listen to him. He is just that good.

Don't be depressed, be inspired! I have the Unreal Book and even thought it is totally over my head I was able to pull one phrase out of the Jestson's solo here on drummerworld and incorporated it in my playing. I think of Vinnie's solos as paragraphs. I can't remember and play the entire paragraph but I can pull a word or two out and learn from them. There are only so many Vinnies in a lifetime, remember your friends need you as a drummer, Vinnie is not you competition. Have fun with drums!

webstercat

08-28-2007, 10:50 PM

Ok ok i admit....
love him with Sting (enormous)
love him with labouriel at backed potatoe
love him in joe's garage (zappa)
love him with pianist randy waldman
love him with chaka khan
but i can't stand him with karizma (dunno why but that is)
T

I can understand that. While I believe Vinnie is a genius on his instrument I also don't enjoy his playing with karizma. To me it is chops for sake of chops, just a personal taste thing. I find his playing with Randy Waldman beautiful. Seems like he taylors his drum sound to the music he is playing. That has always been an issue with me for Gadd. No to critize his playing, just never like the wet sound in a jazz setting but it wasn't an issue for those who hired him so what do I know?

aegir77

09-05-2007, 07:19 AM

For me he's one of the best, I dunno why i forgot to mention him on earlier posts, but he's amazing. His playing fits perfectly to every song he's played on, no matter the style.

HE MAKES YOU WANNA PLAY THE SONG everytime.... Extremely tasteful. ( except karizma, where he kinda throws everything he knows)-... Great drummer

aydee

09-05-2007, 08:10 AM

Originally Posted by DR.WHOO View Post, with minor changes..
Ok ok i admit....
love him with Sting
love him with labouriel at backed potato
love him in joe's garage (zappa)
love him with pianist randy waldman
ok with him on chaka khan
but i absolutely love him with karizma (dunno why but that is)

webstercat

09-07-2007, 09:43 PM

I got in a bit over my head when I purchased that Unreel book covering his playing.

oops...maybe in 10 years I'll be able to work out of that book.

stu

Me too when you try to understand his time concepts, but still there is a wealth of information to get from the book. I just listen to the CD and when I hear something that makes me grin I find the page in the book and learn the part, even if it is two measures out of sixteen. I don't worry about learning it all, I can't, and even if I did I don't have a place to use it. One of my favorite fills is My Favorite Things 5:55 to about 5:58. It goes by so fast I would have never figured it out on my own. So I'm glad I bought the book and it will keep me busy for the remainder of this life.

Laurent

09-11-2007, 08:56 AM

Originally Posted by DR.WHOO View Post, with minor changes..
but i absolutely love him with karizma (dunno why but that is)

Because that is the best band that ever came out of L.A. That's why! :-) I am a HUGE Karizma/Los Lobotomys and David Garfield fan.

Did you hear "Tune For Tony" from David Garfield's "Giving Back". It features double drumming by Vinnie and Bissonnette. Superb!

aydee

09-11-2007, 09:06 AM

Because that is the best band that ever came out of L.A. That's why! :-) I am a HUGE Karizma/Los Lobotomys and David Garfield fan.

Did you hear "Tune For Tony" from David Garfield's "Giving Back". It features double drumming by Vinnie and Bissonnette. Superb!

This band absolutely, positively kicks butt!

Its a band that does'nt play safe, goes after the truth, has superb musicianship.

Garfield, Stubenhaus, and omygod, Landau are up to Vinnies beautifully strange and incredibly gifted headspace.......

No, Havent heard Tune for Tony, will check it out......thanks

Laurent

09-12-2007, 02:42 PM

This band absolutely, positively kicks butt!

Its a band that does'nt play safe, goes after the truth, has superb musicianship.

Garfield, Stubenhaus, and omygod, Landau are up to Vinnies beautifully strange and incredibly gifted headspace.......

No, Havent heard Tune for Tony, will check it out......thanks

Vinnie is also superb on other Garfield releases such as Brandon Fields's "The Other Place". Check out www.creatchy.com for more info.

One of Vinnie's best recordings IMHO is Karizma's "Document". I've seen the band twice on that tour and they were amazing. Stubenhaus is my favourite bass player ever. He is absolutely amazing and deserve much wider recognition. He's without the shadow of a doubt in the same category as Stanley Clarke or Marcus Miller.

aydee

09-12-2007, 04:46 PM

Vinnie is also superb on other Garfield releases such as Brandon Fields's "The Other Place". Check out www.creatchy.com for more info.

One of Vinnie's best recordings IMHO is Karizma's "Document". I've seen the band twice on that tour and they were amazing. Stubenhaus is my favourite bass player ever. He is absolutely amazing and deserve much wider recognition. He's without the shadow of a doubt in the same category as Stanley Clarke or Marcus Miller.

Yes, Document is fantastic. Vinnie is one of the few guys-i'd-love-to-see-live, that I have not. Someday, hopefully...

slingerland755

09-19-2007, 05:23 AM

http://youtube.com/watch?v=BCzdKdajEIc

Vinnie with Jeff Beck (Scatterbrain). It's a bit rushed but still vinnie.

syoshii

11-21-2007, 06:56 AM

I just knew that Chick Corea is going to start a new project with John McLaughlin next year, and Vinnie will be on drums. Chick referred to that project in the interview with a Japanese Jazz magazine. Here's the musicians;

Chick Corea (p)
John McLaughlin (g)
Christian McBride (b)
Vinnie Colaiuta (ds)

caprisun3484

03-30-2008, 01:41 AM

that line-up sounds sweet

what'd you guys think of Vinnie's work on Herbie Hancock new album River

Vinnysimmo

03-30-2008, 02:20 PM

what'd you guys think of Vinnie's work on Herbie Hancock new album River

Is that a statement or a question?

the baz

05-27-2008, 04:02 AM

I must say that although I wouldn't rate Vinnie as my favorite drummer, I do think he is so far the greatest drummer to have lived on earth. He is just able to do everything with such taste and flare and seem to put his stamp on the stuff he plays without getting in the artists way.
His work on Eric Marienthal's "Upside Down", as someone mentioned previously, is insane. He is all over the place and yet you wouldn't change a note. I woodshed to that tune for a while and gave up. Vinnie is a true master with a bag of tricks for every occasion. He seems to put so much into his playing that at times he looks almost unco, then he rips some impossible fill like he's waved his hands over the kit and the sticks just go where they are supposed to.
The Steve Vai Frank Zappa sushi story tells it all.
The reason he is not my favorite is I guess his playing is hard for me with my ability, (lack of), to identify with, or think of myself ever playing like that. Having said that, I have never heard Vinnie do anything I haven't really liked. While there are a million great drummers out there, and I am not one to think of music as competitive, if Buddy Rich was considered to be the best ever, then I think that status should now be passed on to Vinnie.

Baz

the baz

05-27-2008, 07:00 AM

I just remembered something I wanted to respond to a previous post re Vinnie playing on Gino Vannelli's Nightwalker. I love that song and the drumming on it is fantastic. I looked that up ages ago and couldn't find the drumming credit for it. I have the video clip and it has Mark Craney playing, (miming) drums on the clip. If it is Vinnie, it just shows how versatile he is. It is rock solid and the fills are great while still being quite simple.
Did Vinnie definitely play on this song?

Baz

mlaponsky

06-11-2008, 05:16 AM

I absolutely love Vinnie. Definitely one of my favorite drummers of all time. His sense of time and groove is superb. And I love his philosophy on music and drumming which he briefly described in a Modern Drummer interview a while ago. Just mind-blowing: both what he plays and what he says.

I didn't even realize this when I saw it, but he was playing with Jeff Beck at Crossroads last year. I knew I recognized him at the concert but I couldn't put my finger on who it was. And then a few weeks later they posted the band line-ups online and turns out I saw him live without even knowing it! Great experience. I definitely think everyone needs to see him live at some point.