What Drum Kit is right for me?

[Mike Richards]

Hey guys,
I've been drumming now for about 3 years. My drum kit is a "Ludwig Accent Combo" 5 Piece set.

Bass (Evans eQ3 Batter): 16" x 22"
Snare (Evans Genera G2 Coated): 6.5" x 14"
Tom1 (Remo Weatherking Pinstripe): 10" x 12"
Tom2 (Remo Weatherking Pinstripe): 11" x 13"
Floor Tom (Remo Weatherking Pinstripe): 16" x 16"
Sabian (Solar) Hi-Hat: 14"
Sabian B8Pro Thin Crash: 15"
Sabian (Solar) Crash/Ride: 18"
Gibraltar Double Pedal
NOTE: Im using Evans e-rings (Muffle Rings) on the Toms.


It sounds pretty decent, I have a nice big pillow in my bass drum. but my snare always sounded horrible and to sloppy with bad overtones. i always wanted a nice TACK! so what i did was i lowered the snare untill the snare bed is touching the stand. that made it sound better with less rattle.

also my toms (all of them) are tunes very low on the top and im almost unable to get a decent bounce with my sticks, thats the only way i can get it too sound how i want. the bottom heads are tuned medium/normal tighness.

the sound im aiming for everywhere is the same sound as Mike Portnoys Kit. and i am thinking of just getting a Tama Starclassic Birch kit. Is that a good idea? and what shell ply/thickness gives that kind of sound? the deep rich DOO!!

any suggestions on what i could do to fix my snare/toms. or if you could advise me on what ply is better for that kind of stuff?

thanks

[drumbuddy105133]

a head change would probably work. are you sure about the starclassic? they are awesome drums, but really expensive. but if you can afford it, I say go for it.

[Mike Richards]

Thanks for the reply, actually my heads are fairly new (3 months), and my bass drum head i got about 5 days ago. my bass drum sounds very good compared to the rest of the kit.

My kit is sounding fine enough for now. but thats only because im using strange workarounds to make it sound like that. like my snare drum, the snare beds are touching the botom of the stand, that the only way i could make it sound less crap. not even sure how it made it sound better, although its still not what i want. i want a nice TACK! with mild overtone in it. good examples of the sound i want are Opeth and Dream theater. I love the toms on Portnoys kit, and both snares are exelent, but i think i like Lopez's snare, its a more tight, high-pitch Tack!!

And as for my toms, they are tuned very low, but there is still resonance. They sound alright, but im not sure if its the proper way. i mean will they brake/wear out faster if they are too loose or too tight?

anyway, if anyone can help me with tuning techniques to get Mike's sound that would be great.

adventually though, i would like to get a good, new kit. and im wondering what would be the most suitable for this type of stuff. progressive metal. i was thinking the starclassic maple. but for the mean time i just want to get my current setup sounding/working how it should.

BTW: lets say i get a new kit, how long does a typical Tama maple kit last? if i play the average amount of drums. (say 5-8 hours a week)

[harryconway]

...but for the mean time i just want to get my current setup sounding/working how it should.

BTW: lets say i get a new kit, how long does a typical Tama maple kit last? if i play the average amount of drums. (say 5-8 hours a week)

O.K...now you show a glimmer of understanding. How "your kit" should sound. Forget about Mikey's kit. Trying to chase down someone elses sound is always a slippery slope. Pro level drums in a properly EQ'd drum room, couple hundred thousand dollars worth of pro audio gear, professional sound endineers and a producer. Here's a link to M.P.'s web site and one of his drum kits. http://www.mikeportnoy.com/about/drums/albino.asp?menu=about Notice it doesn't say anything about Pinstripes with e-rings on the toms, pillows in the kick drums, etc. Making "your" Luddies sound good. Trial and error, experiment, listen to other drumkits, read, this site alone has thousands of ideas posted on "how". And a good drum kit should last you a lifetime. A good prog. metal kit. Really, any pro level kit. Gavin Harrison http://www.drumset.demon.co.uk/studio.htm is a forum member here. He play's Sonor.

[Mike Richards]

harryconway, thanks a lot for the reply. im going to take your advice to heart and really start playing around with my drums, retune both the batter and resonance heads and experiment a bit.

are you being serious about a decent kit lasting a lifetime? that's awesome, actually i believe it, cause my kit is 3 or 4 years old and its in excellent condition. sounding like it always did. although i though eventually it would get worn out, but i guess only the heads need replacing once in a while.. and sticks, but thats a whole other story.. any suggestions on good sticks? i used Vater 5B and they broke in about 2 weeks. they should last longer no? i like the feel of 5A sticks, but wouldnt they break faster than 5B?

also, could it be that my technique is wrong? cause when i hit my cymbals it reallly chews up the stick, thats what makes them break so fast. i also think my finger technique is wrong to, the way i hold the stick. cause i get MAD blisters and calisis on both my "right index" and "right middle" fingers.

another thing, how do i tell if my heads are too tight or too lose, cause the way i have them now, it doesnt sound that bad actually. but the heads feel like they are really loose, although im not sure if its normal..
and Gavin Harrison is amazing, Porcupine tree is such a great band. i didn't realise how many professionals are active in this forum. its great.

thanks in advance guys, and sorry for all the questions. you've been of great help so far.

[hauk]

For the deep sound I would consider maple over birch, it's a little warmer. And really there's no "best" kit for any particular genre. I also agree that you should be searching for your sound rather than Mike's, his will be impossible to replicate in a live drums situation.

As for sticks, I suggest trying Pro-mark Japanese oak 5As. I use them because I liked the size of a 5A with a bit more weight. They are denser than the typical hickory (or even lighter maple) which gives them a little more heft and durability. I've had my current pair for about a month and they hardly show any damage at all. My last pair lasted me about 2 months. Granted, I don't play for long periods each day, but still.

Your cymbal technique may be off, first of all make sure your sticks hit the cymbals at a fairly flat angle, not at anything close to a right angle. Also try to hit the cymbals with a glancing blow. Those tips are meant to prolong the life of your cymbals, but will probably also help your sticks. As for hand technique, I can't really tell you anything without seeing your hands.

Also, yes a good kit will last a lifetime if maintained well, and your heads are probably okay if they don't have wrinkles. It's normal for tom heads to be pretty loose for a rock (or prog/metal) sound.

And finally, I have to agree that Porcupine Tree is an amazing band and Gavin Harrison is a truly great drummer. I can't get enough of them.
Good luck in your quest for your sound, I hope I've helped somewhat.

[ermghoti]

You can buy a new snare and heads for a lot less than a new kit...

I have an oldish Supraphonic, it will pretty much do anything a snare should, and I paid $150 at GC for it.

Before you even bother buying heads, I don't think your tuning will promote the sound you want. The resonant head should be tuned as low as it can go and still ring, with the batter head tuned so that it rings a fourth or so higher (think going from one guitar string to the next, the trumpet that starts horse races, My Dog has Fleas, whatever). That would fix both the sound, and the feel problem, having the top head loose causes a thwacky attack to the note. You couldalso tune both heads the same, and then add tape to control ring, but that strikes me as an inelegant solution compared to just tuning them right.

It does sound like you have some technique isses. Spend some of the cash you had earmarked for a kit on lessons from a reputable instructor, if only for a couple months to concentrate on basic grip and foot techniques.

[hauk]

Good advice, but I feel compelled to say that there is no "right" way to tune drums, and there are many good ways. In fact, the majority of people I have encountered tune the resonant head higher than the batter head. Right now, I tune the resonant head lower. Still, I want to experiment some to find out if that's the best method for me. Mike should try out many different methods to find the tuning that makes HIS drums sound best to HIM. There is no catch-all universal best tuning.

[Mike Richards]

alright, so i've been giving it some thought, and im pretty certain about getting a new kit now. if i can sell my current setup, then i will be buying a new kit. my dilema so far is that i cant choose between "Tama", "DW", and "Sonor". and i cant decide between "Sabian" or "Zildjian".. i know the sound i want. but the only way i know to describe what tone/sound im looking for is to name drummers with similar sounding kits.
(Gavin Harrison, Mike Portnoy, Martin Lopez).

so, what i want to know, is how do i find out what sizes of drums make what sounds? should my toms have more depth? or bigger radius? what about the snare? 20" or 22" bass drum? how thick ply? maple or birch? coated or clear? i dont know what the difference is in sound between everything. is there a chart that describes what each property is good for? and what the diffence in sound is between them?

thanks again for the replies.

[ermghoti]

You'd do better to go to some well-stocked shops and hit some things. For instance, one of the major manufactuers had the kind of chart you're talking about for drum construction, comparing the relative highs, lows, resonance or openess of different materials, depth, etc. Guess what? Somebody found a copy of the same chart, from the same company, from Japan. All the same items were listed, but the supposed properties were all different.

Maple may be warmer, but birch is said to have a deeper low note. I have seen birch described as both warmer and brighter than maple. It's all highly subjective, and the descriptive terms are not uniformly standardized.

Regarding getting a pro drummer's sound, the fact is, you're hearing recordings, which have been heavily massaged by mics, pres, compressors, eqs, reverbs, or perhaps replaced totally by samples. The same is basically true of a live performance through a PA. To make matters worse, your kit will sound much different from out front than it does from the throne. By the time you've choked all the sustain out of your heads to your satisfaction on the throne, someone 10' away will hear little more than stick attack. Your Ludwigs are not terrible drums, but I can't imagine you're getting the best possible tone with Pins and muffle rings. Get an instructor, have him show you some tuning tips, try different heads if need be.

[Mike Richards]

ermghoti, i just dont want to get a new kit, and then a week later find out that the reason why its not sounding how i wanted it is because i should have gotten 9 ply instead of 7, or that i should have gotten birch instead of maple, etc.. i want to find out as much as possible about how i can get the sound i want. im sure you dont need computer processing and mics to get a nice TAK!! sound. im just trying to avoid that loose BASH!! snare sound. over the years i will get my drums mic'd as well. but i am almost certain that certain depths and heads will get me that sound as well. i just need to find out what they are, thats why im here.

thanks for the reply ermghoti. hope im making sense. i really want to get a kit that ill be happy with, i want it to last me a good long while.

[Velimor]

First, I don't mean to sound demanding or like I'm trying to force you to do anything. Just giving some advice from my point of view.

With that said, I would focus on getting a good sound with the kit you have and possibly upgrade your cymbals. It's been countless times- you can dramatically change the sound of a drum with heads and tuning, but there's not much you can do for cymbals. Even a beginner/intermediate kit like the Accent can sound really good with proper heads and tuning. I'd ditch the e-rings first and give it a good tuning. There are plenty of resources on the 'net to help with tuning. Hell, even buy a Drum Dial if you want/need. $50 is nothing compared to what you'd spend on a new kit. For the snare, throw on an Evans Genera Dry and crank that sucka way up. Personally, I use a G1 Genera and tune it very high, with the resonant head a bit lower to retain a little fatness.

If you're set on a new kit, though, give us a dollar amount to work with. How many piece kit are you looking for? We can steer you in the right direction, but ultimately you'll have to go into a shop and decide what sounds best to your ears. Keep in mind there's always ebay and craigslist as well.

PS. I still think new cymbals are in order before new drums.

[Mike Richards]

im looking at more or less $1,500.00 CAD for a 6 peice set (should that be including cymbals?). i want to get a good set that will last me many years, and that ill be happy with.. as for the sound of the kit. i dont know how to explaine the sound i want.. i dont even know what the difference is between worm/cold, dry/wet, punchy/open, deep, etc.. so here is a good example.

http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/gavinharrisonfutile.html

and im not looking for that exact sound as its not possible. but whatever characteristis meet it. i know most of those drummers i mentioned earlier have a similar sound.

so when i go to the music store this weekend, and when the guy asks me what sound im looking for, what music do you play, etc.. how do i explaine that sound?? is it punchy or open? warm or cold? etc..
and if my budget is too low for the kind of kit im looking for, then i will wait till i can raise my budget, i wont settle for a lesser kit than what im looking for. (adventually i will mic the kit and buy processing equipment)

sorry for all this questions, i just really want to get my preferences set strait, so i know what im looking for.

thanks again.

[Budiesel]

Try Evans Coated G2, or if you like Remo heads, Remo Coated Ambassadors. Just from my experience, the Evans coating will last longer than the Remo, but I have heard that Aquarian coated heads will last the longest.

[rendezvous_drummer]

Gavin Harrison uses a Sonor Delite or S Class kit.....not entirely sure which model, but either way the kit he uses is VERY expensive new, but you might be able to find a good price on Ebay. To get that kind of sound on an Accent kit would be very difficult...near impossible I'd imagine, unless you have some sort of excellent tuning technique. I wouldn't think that it would be possible to get that sound. But try things out. Try some new heads, try retuning, try everything possible first, and if you still can't find that sound that you're looking for, then you can invest in another kit if you wish.

You're budget is 1,500 CAD eh? Right then. To find a kit and cymbals for 1,500 is going to be very difficult unless you buy used. I'm sure you can find a Yamaha Tour Custom kit which is all Maple Asian Shells for a good price used, then find some used cymbals if you want quality. If 1,500 is your budget, you will have to go used if you want professional quality.

[Mike Richards]

Maybe i should raise my budget then. by the way, im not looking to get Gavin's kit. i just want to know what atributes the shells and heads need, to acheive a similar overall sound.

What if i decide to go the Tama route? isnt a good Tama kit generally cheaper than a good Sonor kit? i was even thinking Mapex, could i get a nice sound like that with a good Mapex kit? maybe i should start off with a 5-peice set, and only a hihat, ride, and 2 crashes. and even that isnt very far from the full kit setup im looking at.

any insight on how to describe the sound of gavin's and mike's kit would be great. i want to know how to explaine it in words, that will make it much easier when i go to the shop, and someone asks what tone i want in my drums.

thanks again everyone. great advice.

[DamoSyzygy]

Mike - I think the issue here may be with the sound you are trying to achieve.

If you were to walk up to Mike Portnoys kit and hit it, youre going to hear heaps of overtones. These overtones are not always noticed when the kit is being mic'd, EQ'd, mixed and compressed. Needless to say, going by a recorded sound is not the best idea.

It seems like your drums are very heavily muted, from the rings over the toms to the pillow in your bass drum, so Im assuming you havent had much experience with a band or other instruments.

If you were to take the muffling off your drums, gain a litle more experience tuning and learn to love the overtones youre getting from your kit, youll start to see how much better it can sound, particularly when a band cranks up around you (where you NEED the overtones to be heard)

A better drumset would give you more projection, more sensitivity and more tuning options, but will NOT necessarily get you closer to the sound you want.

Good Luck

[Mike Richards]

DamoSyzygy, Thanks you so much for the insight and adivce here. actually i do play with a band every week, we play heavy progressive music. with my current setup it sounds great to me from the throne when we play. they always say my playing is amazing. but i dont know if my kit sounds as good to them as it does to me.. maybe itll sound better if i remove the "handicap" in all my drums and tune them properly.

but i know what you mean about when there is a band playing with you, my kit sounds soo much better.

although im still going to get a new kit. one of the main reasons being: i want to have more drums and cymbals. but i dont want to sink money into my current set, when i could save that money towards getting a whole new semi-pro kit of better quality that will last me, and will sound much better without me having to use muffle rings, and lowering my snare so much that the resonance head and snare beds are resting on the stand.

thanks again for the reply. very helpfull. i wish i could hear what that video would sound like if it was an unprocessed microphone that recorded the whole set, then i could hear how it really sounds.

[furbeedog@gmail.com]

You may have the reso heads on too tight if your batter feels too lose. I like to keep the reso tuned higher than the batter, as do many drummers, but if it's too high then it can result in bad tone or a choked sound. As for the sticks it's all about technique, keeping the stick angle close to the angle of the cymbal is good as is using a more glancing blow as opposed to just mashing the stick into the cymbal as hard as possible. If preserving sticks is an issue then you can practice softly and then when/if you're playing with other people you can play louder but just bring extra sticks. Sometimes playing softly can really help your control. Just keep practicing and your technique is bound to improve just by trial and error, you'll find the longer you play, the less sticks you break.

As for the set, there are a lot of different brands and a lot of people who would recommend any particular one. If you're looking into starclassics for 1500 then you'll probably need to go used performer. For 1500 I might look at either Taye ProX, Taye TourPro, Mapex Pro M, Mapex M Birch, or a TAMA Superstar. The 1500 will probably not buy you cymbals either, unfortunately, especially if you end up only getting a shell pack, which adds the cost of hardware on top of the set. Most of the above mentioned sets come with all the hardware needed for the set plus a couple cymbal stands. Try heading to your local drum store and trying out a bunch of kits to see what you like. Remember, which heads you use and how you tune them are important as well. Even if your set is great, poorly tuned heads can make it sound horrible. Sorry for all the bulky paragraphs btw, and good luck figuring out what you're getting.

[harryconway]

but i know what you mean about when there is a band playing with you, my kit sounds soo much better.


Still chasing that "studio" sound I see. What you need to do is get behind every type of set possible and see what set sounds good to you. High end drums like the pro's use, Mike's Starclassics, Gavin's Sonor's, Joey Jordison's Pearl Masters, Shannon Larkin's Yamaha Birch Custom Absolutes, these kits can all be made to sound very similar or amazingly different, using the techniques discussed earlier in this thread. I drive a 26, 15, 16, 18 Ludwig 6 ply maple kit. Not exactly prog. rock sizes, however, Mickey P. just added those larger sizes to his kit. Alan White of Yes and Neil Peart Rush played Luddie 6 ply back in the day. Don't think I ever heard anyone say their drum sound sucked. In fact, your in luck. Here's your eBay prog rock kit here: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250143448612&fromMakeTrack=true&ssPageName=VIP:watchlink:top:us an 8 piece kit. Clear maple, like my kit. Concert toms can be turned into 2 headed drums, no problem. Could be "the last kit you'd ever have to buy".

[Mike Richards]

harryconway, im not sure why that quote made you think i want studio sound. it would be great if that was possible, i just want nice sounding drums, that will suit with the type of music i play. "clear, punchy, deep, with mild overtones. more OT on the snare". is that not possible without a mic?

what i dont want in my drums are when you get that long bash sound from your drums, and all your toms sound the same, and they sound like they all have snare beds, sounds messy and makes your playing sound sloppy, you cant tell what your hitting because each hit is so loud and unfocused with overtones off the wall.

thats what my current kit sound like if i dont use my e-rings, and cripple the snare beds to be touching the metal stand (which afaik, is probably rewining my snare's reso head and snare beds)

i was just looking at this thread..
http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29058
and what they say is the same thing that you just explained to me in your last post here, that with any pro level kit, tuning the proper heads, and having the right sizes is the main part of getting your sound, and not the brand. and the factors for deciding on a brand is: hardware, finishes, company, etc.. because all pro kits (no matter the company) will give a great sound, you just need to get the heads, tuning properly to match the tone your looking for... then in that case, i think mapex would be my choice. their hardware and prices seem very good. i dont like most of their finishes, but they have one that i like (very dark green'ish black marble). i have yet to try out a mapex kit though. but from what i hear they are good kits. would a Pro M or Saturn be considered a pro level kit?

either way i still have my main question. its not what brand i should get, its what specs i should get. drum sizes (depth, radius), ply thickness, shell type, etc.. because afaik, lets say i get anything. a 13x3.5 brass snare for example, that wont get me the deep, rich, tack!! sound would it? at least not as well as a 14x5.5 or a 14x6.5, right?? i just need to know what sizes give what sound.. anyone know how i can figure this out..

thanks again for replies. and sorry for asking so many question over. i just dont want to be stuck with a kit that should have been something else. i need to learn about what drums i want.

[harryconway]

harryconway, im not sure why that quote made you think i want studio sound.


The quote, no. Your continued references to Mike and Gavin's sound (posts 6 and 16), yes. The quote, well, by playing your existing set in a live situation with band, you are experiencing an EQ of sorts, in that the band is masking the weaknesses of your current kit. So you can see that even your set "can" sound good, or at least better, with a certain amount of voodoo thrown onto it. Throw more expensive EQ onto more expensive drums, and bang, killer drum sound. But you still need to know "how to tune and how to select heads". The Mapex Saturn and Orion kits, I consider pro-level. The M, I don't. Certainly some will beg to differ. Get into the Pearl website and look at the Masters Premium, for they give you more options on ply's than just about anyone else, here: http://www.pearldrum.com/masters.asp I don't think you'll find that kind of selection with Mapex. As far as sizes, most prog. drummers use traditional sizes. 12x8, 13x9, 14x10, etc. Terry Bozzio and Mickey P. both played Mapex for a short while.

[Mike Richards]

thanks again for the quick reply. i never knew about that EQ you get when you play with a band, thats very interesting. thats why my hihat sounds so perfect when there is some loud distorted guitar, i dont hear the buzz/pitch that i usauly do.

thanks for the link. i found this on the pearl site too, its pretty much excactly what i was looking for:
http://www.pearldrum.com/masterworks.asp
3/4ths down the page, it shows what wood produces what sound, and what ply thickness projects what tones. (judging by those charts/info i think 6 Ply Maple seems right, what do you think?)

i guess this is just the way i am, but i want to get equipment that is popular for the kind of music i play. heavy/technical metal (Tama, Mapex, Sonor, Meinl, etc..), and im pretty sure Ludwig and Pearl arent in that category afaik. and Pearl is "very" expensive, from what i saw. the masterworks series pricing list. although their hardware looks amazing.

cymbals now is a whole other thing, i have no idea what i want because i think they all sound excellent from the samples on their websites (Sabian, Zildjian, Meinl, Paiste). very hard descision although im leaning towards Sabian or Zildjian for some reason.. i like the look of the meinl logo on the cymbal the best, but sound comes first imo. and i find it hard to chose because they all sound so great, lol

thanks again for the information. great advice.

[harryconway]

Can't go wrong with 6 ply maple. That's what I play. Blue/Olive badge Luddies.

[DamoSyzygy]

/4ths down the page, it shows what wood produces what sound, and what ply thickness projects what tones.
Dont look too much into this, as the differences arent nearly as profund as you would think. Decent head selection and tuning will do more for your tone than the shell composition.

[Mike Richards]

everyone keeps saying that its the heads/tuning that gets you whatever sound you're after.. since this is the case, why am i looking at pro-level kits? why not get an intermediate, mid-range kit.. like a Sonor Force? or a Mapex Pro M? and just get good heads and tune them properly. and just spend the extra money on a nice mic setup and EQ.. would that work?? or would my sound be better acheived, and sound better if i get a Sonor S-Class or Mapex Saturn/Orion? just a thought. please let me know what you think would be a good route for me to take..

thanks again everyone.

[mickeyman]

There is not as much a difference between the pro kits and mid -level kits as there was years ago. The manufacturers seem to have figured out easier ways to add some of the details (mass produced, I suppose) that make a kit sound good without spending a fortune.
You do want to get a kit with good bearing edges. 45 degrees seems to be standard but some pro kits vary the edge with the size of the drum.
With pro kits you'll get nicer wood like maple. Pro kits also give you cooler finishes (usually) and higher end, more sturdy hardware.
I'd say go with the middle of the road that has precision bearing edges, iso mounts and decent hardware and find a finish you like but don't be too picky.
Check out Mapex M Birch and Taye Pro X.

[Mike Richards]

the M birch seems very popular in these forums, although im pretty set on getting a maple kit. probably 6 or 7 ply. cause what i ultimately want to do now. is get a kit and stick with the brand names, and wood type, thickness, etc.. just pretty much find out what i like, get my prefferences straight, so i can stick with them. so lets say i decide on Mapex/Zildjian.. then id use those brands on my kit always, and keep adding/removing components of the kit, maintaning my preferences (i like to be semi-biased in a way, not sure why excacly).. so i want to decide now. and if none of the cheaper kits (Mapex ProM, Sonor Force) with some good heads and tuning will be able to get my sound im looking for.. then i will have no choice but to increase my budget.. i want to get something that i will be happy with, and make sure i make the best choice possible.. as for finishes i like black, dark green, and the natural maple wood color.. (im not really into the sunbursts, and striking finishes)

so, what do you think? would it be possible to get a nice high pitch, hollow, tack! snare.. dead, thud kick drum.. and punchy, deep sounding toms.. with one of those mid-range kits?? if i have good the right heads and proper tuning for that sound??

thanks again.

[skippy]

from reading your posts ive now decided when you say snare beds you mean the snare wires. have you tried tightening them? my friend had a problem with his snare buzzing and rattling so i took a piece of clear scotch tape and taped the middle of the snare to the head. not to tight and i only used one piece and it sounded better. for tuning google the drum tuning bible. and listen to everything these other guys are saying about wood and heads. but most important of all you have to find your own sound. the sooner you learn that the better. have fun.

[Jdrum14]

If your looking for a durable drumset that will last a very VERY very long time, look into Pearl's Export kit or their new Vision kits. Both are cost effective, but yet sound professional.

I own the 6-piece export with Evan's Clear EC2's on all the toms and an Aquarian Superkick II on my bass drum. I've been to Guitar Centers and played on the Expensive Kits, and mine sound just the same or better!

The Vision kits are even better. Look 'em up, and read all about them.

And to fix your snare problem tighten the bottom head fairly tight, and the top head even higher to get a "pop" or "snap" sound. And if your snare wires are loose, tighten them up more. It's not good at all to leave your snare bed on the hardware. That'll just ruin the resonant head.

[LiveGoat]

Here's what I would do in your situation. You've got 1500 bucks. Throw it in the bank. There's no rush to get a new kit at this point. Spend a fraction of that cash on heads for experimenting with the sound you're looking for and buy a nice high-end cymbal every month or so (new or used). While this is going on, throw some more savings into the bank. Do this for a year or so and by the time you're ready to do the dutch and get a new kit you'll be way more confident in your choice. I saw a band called seduce do a reunion gig a while back and their drummer, who is phenomenal and a collector of vintage drums, decided to do the gig on an Accent kit and it sounded like a vintage luddie kit. It's mostly in the heads and tuning.

---LG

[Mike Richards]

thanks for the advice everyone.. im still wondering about my last question in my last post.. anyone able to comment on that or let me know through their experience if its a possibility for me to do that and get a good sounding kit?

thanks agian

[Mike Richards]

alright, tommorow im going to a local drum shop to try out some kits. any suggestions on what i should ask about if they want to know what sound im loooking for? or any other advice would be great. thanks

[DamoSyzygy]

everyone keeps saying that its the heads/tuning that gets you whatever sound you're after.. since this is the case, why am i looking at pro-level kits?
Most notably for the greater level of projection and sensitivity that better quality shells offer. They also cater for a wider range of tunings, because the bearing edges are able to be cut more accurately due to the higher density of a quality shell.

[Mike Richards]

alright, so on monday i went to the drum shop. I tried out the Mapex ProM, Mapex Saturn, Sonor Force 3007, and the Sonor S-Classix. i liked all of them. but i think the ProM fit my budget pretty well. although none of them sounded as good as i thought. even my current set right now sounds better.. im guessing its because the kits at the shop werent tuned very well, and the accoustics in that open room arent nearly as good as my basement.. every hit lasted very long, its was like a bash sound.. instead of a short dead, tack!, thud!, doo! (which is what i like).. but i guess with the proper heads and tuning that can be changed no?

The Mapex Pro M was a 6 peice kit, comes with cymbal stands and all hardware, etc.. ($1,200).. and the guy said for a zildjian cymbal kit with [hihat, ride, and 2 crashes].. would cost $600.. thats soo expensive.. i saw cymbal packs on musiciansfriend.com for under $350, and they include [hihat, ride, 2 crashes, splash].. thats one cymbal short of what i want for under $400..

anyways im not sure yet what i want my kit to be like.. but this is what i think would suite me the best.. does this look like a strange setup? or is fairly popular?
http://img487.imageshack.us/img487/3850/kitsetupvj4.png
hopefully you guys can give me some advice now that i have tried whats available to me. and got some more info.. thanks again.

[fourstringdrums]

That's a very common setup, not strange at all. If that kit fits your budget and you like it, go for it. However I'd stay away from getting a cymbal pack for $300 - $400 because most likely you're talking about budget cymbals (Zildjian ZBT, Sabian B8 etc..) a set of quality high end cymbals is going to run you $600+ Your best bet is to buy the best quality cymbals you can find used. You may luck out and get a basic set (ride, hats, crash) for $400.

[Mike Richards]

thanks for the reply.. so what is a good cymbal, im not sure about sabian or zildjian yet.. but this is what i was planning on getting. it seems like a good pack for the cash..

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Sabian-B8-Cymbal-Pack-with-Free-10-Splash-and-18-Crash?sku=447849

but as you said the B8's arent very good quality cymbals.. but then again it will probably sound amazing compared to my Solar cymbals i have now.. im using a B8Pro Crash, and its not bad.. but it has a bad sound when i first hit it.. like its made of crap metal.. is there much difference between B8 and B8Pro?? whats better?

so lets say i decide to get some quality cymbals, which i probably should.. what are good ones to get from sabian and zildjian. is the AAX or HHX series any good? what about Zildjian K? whats a good band for my buck.

thanks in advance..

[drumbuddy105133]

an upgrade from solar to B8 isnt going to get you very far. However the kinds you listed at the end are good too. Look into Zildjian A's (Avedis) too, those are good

[CAMERON]

Do you have access to a a place where you could test the cymbals for yourself,its not good for us to tell you what we like coz everyone has there own likes in a cymbal.Personally i think paiste cymbals are fantastic but look on this forum and people will say they are crap.Try out cymbals and then decide for yourself