Hey jazz teachers and players, technique for swapping sticks and brushes?

[Spreggy]

I'm still a bit of a fumbler when it comes to setting down the brushes and picking up the sticks, and vica versa. Same with turning sticks around from rim clicks to trad grip. I'm hitting all the usual problems like losing the groove while switching, and just a lack of a total strategy.

I play a 5 piece and really don't want to give up a voice, so the top of the bass isn't available. On gigs I'm using a music stand laid flat to accomodate a small mixer and the stick bag laid open flat. I don't want to use any types of tubes, as they are useless for brushes. Are you guys placing sticks to the right/non-hat side, or picking them from one side only?

Any advice, strategies, practices? How do you handle all this stick rotating, swapping, etc?
Thanks!
John

[Casper "DrPowerStroke" Paludan]

I'm still a bit of a fumbler when it comes to setting down the brushes and picking up the sticks, and vica versa. Same with turning sticks around from rim clicks to trad grip. I'm hitting all the usual problems like losing the groove while switching, and just a lack of a total strategy.

I play a 5 piece and really don't want to give up a voice, so the top of the bass isn't available. On gigs I'm using a music stand laid flat to accomodate a small mixer and the stick bag laid open flat. I don't want to use any types of tubes, as they are useless for brushes. Are you guys placing sticks to the right/non-hat side, or picking them from one side only?

Any advice, strategies, practices? How do you handle all this stick rotating, swapping, etc?
Thanks!
John

Hey, that's a funny question. I never really thought about it, but one technique is to have a stick bag hanging from the floor tom, and then just taking them out of there when you need them. If I know I will be switching in the middle of a song, I may put them on the floor tom. Trust me, nobody will know the difference whether you play it for a few minutes....

I remeber learning to be relaxed about it from watching the star drummers (Jack DeJohnette etc) do it. I have seen brushes picked up from any surface, be it a drum, floor, bag, plush covered table etc. and they are just totally cool about it, so I decided to be too! It is valuable to play a few "wrap up" notes, like a small fill, and then lay out for the bar. That will give you plenty of time to switch. Also, this often is very natural as you will switch between choruses in a tune normally. Hope this helps. DPS

[jazzgregg]

I'm still a bit of a fumbler when it comes to setting down the brushes and picking up the sticks, and vica versa. Same with turning sticks around from rim clicks to trad grip. I'm hitting all the usual problems like losing the groove while switching, and just a lack of a total strategy.

I play a 5 piece and really don't want to give up a voice, so the top of the bass isn't available. On gigs I'm using a music stand laid flat to accomodate a small mixer and the stick bag laid open flat. I don't want to use any types of tubes, as they are useless for brushes. Are you guys placing sticks to the right/non-hat side, or picking them from one side only?

Any advice, strategies, practices? How do you handle all this stick rotating, swapping, etc?
Thanks!
John

I studied with Joe Hunt who was the slickest switcher you've ever seen. You could be standing right in front of him, watching him and still not notice with your eyes or your ears. (Oh yeah, NO sound of putting the stuff down ON the drum, either!!)

Now he only uses a 4 piece so he put them on the bass drum, but you can put them somewhere else, however, I think the positioning is key (floor tom would work, but you are essentially losing a voice which you don't want to do, plus, you may want to use the floor tom). You need to be able to reach with your left hand first, while still playing the cymbal with your right hand. Anyway, back to the system- and it took practice- for sticks to brushes, reach down with your left hand while riding the cymbal with the right and put the stick down while picking up a brush; start comping with that (or lay out with the left hand) a bit before you actually need to switch, so this whole thing happens earlier than the switching point. Then, when it's actually time to switch play time with the brush in your left while quickly (Joe was super fast) putting the stick down and picking up the other brush. No notes missing, no obvious hi hat splashes to cover your tracks, no laying out completely if you don't want to.

For the reverse, it's basically the same. While keeping time with the left hand sweeping the snare, reach and get the right stick, start playing the cymbal whenever you want. Then in your own time, swap out the left brush for a stick. Now all of this sounds easy but the only way to get it really smooth is to literally practice switching, go 8 bars and 8 bars back and forth, for example.

Joe's key is one thing at a time and speed/accuracy in doing so. It might sound like a funny thing to practice but if you want to get smooth, you'll have to.

For turning sticks from Trad grip, that's easy! hold your stick in your normal grip, then when wanting to do rim clicks, push the butt end forward with your bottom 2 fingers and thumb and rotate your hand forwards so the palm is facing down while transferring the grip from the trad position to essentially the matched one, butt forward. To go back, hook the fingers underneath and push the stick the other way and flip the palm back. It's simple once you see it, though typing it isn't! Does that make sense?


G

[KLittle123]

That's actually something I've always wanted to look cool while doing. I remember watching portnoy throw a stick (he had a precrision aim) to a balcony to some kid and then grab a new stick all while still playing...it was crazy awesome.

I've always wanted to learn how to flip sheet music super quick, a teacher i know who plays piano does it in .2 seconds.

[jazzgregg]

That's actually something I've always wanted to look cool while doing. I remember watching portnoy throw a stick (he had a precrision aim) to a balcony to some kid and then grab a new stick all while still playing...it was crazy awesome.

.

What does this have to do with switching from brushes to sticks and vice versa?

G

[KLittle123]

What does this have to do with switching from brushes to sticks and vice versa?

G

I don't know, you're switching sticks...same thing as picking up new sticks. You can realy categorize it as the same thing, I didn't feel like making a new thread about how to pick up drums sticks once you break one. I didn't know it was make different from picking up sticks after you're done with playing with brushes.

[k3ng]

I've always kept a pair of sticks on top of my bass drum, sometimes 2 pairs. It's easy to reach and doesn't take up wanted space. It also stays put so you can pull it out any time.

As for switching from rim clicks to trad, I just play rim clicks with the tip of the stick on the head, so no real need for much switching.

[KCDrummer]

I keep one brush on the outside of the floor tom rim and the other on the outside of the snare rim. If your drums aren't tilted too much, the brushes will just sit there. The sticks go under my left leg, between my leg and the throne. I learned the stick thing from Jeff Hamilton and the brush thing from a buddy of mine.

It works well because--say you're switching from brushes to sticks--you're placing the brushes in an empty space (not having to place them around sticks that might be laying there) and you're reaching for your sticks with an empty hand.

[jordanz]

I've seen three approaches:

1) Keep the brushes in a bag/holder on the floor tom and switch one stick-to-brush (or vice versa) at a time.

2) I saw Willie Brown III place both brushes on the rims of the floor tom. He would carefully place them there before the song started (or after he was done with them). The sticks go between his, uh, "gluteous" and the throne.

3) The brushes/sticks not in use go on the bass drum.

I've tried all three. I like the throne spot for the unused pair but I've had a lot of trouble getting the brushes to balance on the floor tom.

[Spreggy]

Thanks you guys, lots of good info. It looks like I'll need to pick up a tray for the right side of the kit, as I don't have any bass top exposed, I need them there the whole night because this band launches into the next tune so fast I'll miss a few stick set-ups, and fishing them out of a bag on the floor tom doesn't sound smooth enough for brushes. I think there's an opportunity for invention here.

[murphinelli]

I use the approach jazzgregg mentions. I do keep the brushes on the floor tom, so I do loose that voice...But find it's quickest to transition back and forth. The sticks go back in the bag on the floor tom, but the brushes stay on top. Trying to put brushes in a bag while their open and go back and forth is a recipe for dropping and fumbling.

I was listening to Bill Stewart this morning off Bill Carrother's "Duets with Bill Stewart." This is a piano/drum duet CD. Very interesting...Anyways there's a song or two in there where Bill swaps back and forth between brushes, sticks, and mallots that I would love to see in person. At one moment it sounds like he's playing with mallots, then sticks, then brushes, and back...He may be using a combo stick/mallot in that case, but not sure.

[UPSTROKE]

I hate to see commercial ads on drum forums. On the other hand, I sure hope some creative
people check this out. Rogers Drum Company used to make the most fantastic little stick trays that were absolutely PERFECT for this stick / brush switching job. I'm enclosing a couple of pictures of my old Rogers kit. Hopefully, some one will either get fired up to produce such a fantastic little gizmo, or let all of us know where to find something like it.
Of all the silly stick trays on the market today, I've not seen one that was as functional as this one from Rogers.

1177111772

[wy yung]

Yesterday on a jazz gig I had to use brushes, mallets, sticks and other percussion instruments throughout a single tune. I kept all the brushes, sticks etc on my floor tom and the percussion instruments on a table. I dropped my Meinl "Birds". They made a noise but nobody seemed to notice. Except the bass player.

I think it is just practice. If you are a clunker, simply practice not being a clunker. But expect that you may still clunk from time to time. ;-)

[lstardrums]

if you have a gut, you can stick them underneath your gut where your stomach hits your leg. i have a little gut and thats what i do. works great.

[Spreggy]

I hate to see commercial ads on drum forums. On the other hand, I sure hope some creative
people check this out. Rogers Drum Company used to make the most fantastic little stick trays that were absolutely PERFECT for this stick / brush switching job. I'm enclosing a couple of pictures of my old Rogers kit. Hopefully, some one will either get fired up to produce such a fantastic little gizmo, or let all of us know where to find something like it.
Of all the silly stick trays on the market today, I've not seen one that was as functional as this one from Rogers.

1177111772

Excellent product! I have to laugh at those folks selling those cheap plastic trays at sixty bucks a copy.