Playing Bassdrum in Spee-Metal Songs

[Exident]

Hey folks,

do you know any kind of Speed-Metal songs? Or drummers like Marco Pitruzzella?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6H0cFiqGm8

In these songs they are playing always extremly fast on the bassdrum. Ca. 8 Hits per Second with both feets.
I think mostly it is practice but there hast to be a little trick with the bassdrumpedals i guess.
How i have to configurat my pedals if i wanna play that speed?

MfG
Tobias

[emmerson]

alright here is the solution for EVERYONE who wants to play blazing fast double bass, its simple ..... PRACTICE

[emmerson]

alright here is the solution for EVERYONE who wants to play blazing fast double bass, its simple ..... PRACTICE

[jazzsnob]

practice practice practice years of hard work and focus practice practice


then repeat

[bonzolead]

I agree you'll have to PRACTICE I know you are looking for the easy way out but there is no easy way PRACTICE,PRACTICE,PRACTICE and when you are done PRACTICE some more.Good things don't. always come easy.Good luck

Keep Swatting,
Bonzolead

[Wavelength]

Read the Double Bass Technique Thread...

...and practice your ass off.

[Exident]

Hey,

:) thats right. I will practice my ass off and i'm still practicing my ass off.
But in my opinion the whole metaller have a specific pedal adjustment...perhaps a low beater angle, low footboard or a really hard spring...
I´m was playing with a soft spring, a big beater angle and a middle footboard ( i hope i described it right. )

MfG
Tobias

[Jeroen aka aksie]

this question proves that you have not spend enough time on it YET. When you practice on it everyday at least an hour you will figure out yourself how you need/want to adjust your pedals, your perfect throne height, your perfect spring tension etc...

when you go really deep into double-bass, only then you will find out the true meaning of keeping balance, ankle-motions and more of that kind of stuff.

[Exident]

Hey,

YES YES YES!!! I got it back. Before i had my appendix operation i was able to play up to 960 beats per minute with my both feets. I had a 3 week break, no drums. After this it was over with my 960 beats/min...And i wasn`s able to learn it again...

Now i made my spring harder an the beaters a little bit more nearly the bassdrum...and BOOOMM it is working again! I can play more than 960 beats/min! Now it is working better than before. Jesus, thats great.

But my knees hurt a little bit now...have no idea why^^

MfG
Tobias

Ps:. Could someone tell me some really fast drummers please?

[voldak]

That's great that you have it back! I will never be that fast (my left leg hates me).

Really fast drummers....metal drummers= Flo Mounier, Derrick Roddy...just two off of the top of my head. Can name some more later if still needed. :D

[h3r3tic]

Hey,

:) thats right. I will practice my ass off and i'm still practicing my ass off.
But in my opinion the whole metaller have a specific pedal adjustment...perhaps a low beater angle, low footboard or a really hard spring...
I´m was playing with a soft spring, a big beater angle and a middle footboard ( i hope i described it right. )

MfG
Tobias

I think no style requires a specific kind of spring tension... specially when playing metal.
I play metal too, and I have to say that the reason that I use the spring tension on maximum is just a matter of confort, it gives a really confortable feel when executing for example heel/toe method...
I know really good metal drummers here where I live, and one uses max tension and the other uses low tension....
Just use what you feel better since it doesn't hurt yourself
Peace ;) and yes PRACTISE :)

[voldak]

I haven't been able to mess around with spring tension much. I have a Tama Iron Cobra double pedal that is about 4-5 years old. The current springs do not hold the tension settings I put them on. So, I've been playing with both springs with no tension.

Whatever works for you, will work (as far as tension goes). But, if you are having some hard times with your double bass I have heard that the lower the tension (on the pedal) the better. When the pedal is set to a higher tension the beater springs back too hard and your feet/legs have to force it to bounce back instead of it rebounding naturally.

[Exident]

Heyho,

in my opinion you have a better control about your pedals if tension is max. My problem was that i had no control about the beaters. Sure it is harder to play with hard ones because you have to invest more energy but if you are able to spend this energy, you can control them much better. And they bass sounds more definied...more punch...with low tension it is one bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb because its to "soft". Now it is like
brbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbbrbrbrbr

And i can play now the whole of tempos untill 960 beats/min. Earlier i could play up to 720 Beats/min and than i had to jump to 960 if i wanted to play faster. I wasn't able to play the tempo between...because the low beaters were uncontrolable. (hard to describe)

And the beaters don't swing so long...They get faster in her "normal position". Thats really comfortable if you change often between Hihat and Bassdrum etc.

In my opinion everyone should start with low tension and get it harder and harder. Its a good practice for your legs.

But its up to the drummer for what he decids.

MfG
TObias

[h3r3tic]

Heyho,

in my opinion you have a better control about your pedals if tension is max. My problem was that i had no control about the beaters. Sure it is harder to play with hard ones because you have to invest more energy but if you are able to spend this energy, you can control them much better. And they bass sounds more definied...more punch...with low tension it is one bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb because its to "soft". Now it is like
brbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbbrbrbrbr

And i can play now the whole of tempos untill 960 beats/min. Earlier i could play up to 720 Beats/min and than i had to jump to 960 if i wanted to play faster. I wasn't able to play the tempo between...because the low beaters were uncontrolable. (hard to describe)

And the beaters don't swing so long...They get faster in her "normal position". Thats really comfortable if you change often between Hihat and Bassdrum etc.

In my opinion everyone should start with low tension and get it harder and harder. Its a good practice for your legs.

But its up to the drummer for what he decids.

MfG
TObias

Well, I´ve gotta say that max tension works extremely good for me ;)
But again it´s just a matter of confort...

[voldak]

I have been noticing that a lot of the great speed/death metal drummers use very high tension for the bassdrum. I'll have to rig up some way to get my springs work so I can try it out. Hopefully it could help out my speed/comfort level as well.

[bigfatbobby]

You should check out Jan Axel Blomberg, the drummer for the norwegian black metal band Mayhem. He's not just a guy who blasts between snare and whatever, he has got good ideas, too. If you wan't something really mind-blowing, then you should check out "A Time To Die".

Felix

[komodo]

Check out flo mouniers DVD,i was blown away,one of my idols. I tampered a lot with my pedal to get it the way i like it,but the left is still set at a dodgy tension. But i reminded it is the drummer who controls the speed,not the pedal. So jus need to practice.

Can i ask a quick question (not to hijack,jus assume its an easy question but i was just confused recently :P), if my metronome is get to say 60bpm,is it te quarter notes that make 60 beats per minute?So if i played 8ths i would be playin 120 bpm,16ths- 240bpm? Is that correct?

[komodo]

Doesnt matter,found a thread related :D Sorry :p

[MagnZ]

You should check out Jan Axel Blomberg, the drummer for the norwegian black metal band Mayhem. He's not just a guy who blasts between snare and whatever, he has got good ideas, too. If you wan't something really mind-blowing, then you should check out "A Time To Die".

Felix

He is insane. But dosent he also play with Dimmu Borgir now? Well anyway he is an incredible drummer.

[drummer625]

Right now what I'm doing is taking all of the rudiments and exercises I practice for drumline and playing them on my feet and my feet are improving speed very very fast. I suggest anyone that wants fast, controlable feet to do that.

[finnhiggins]

I've never understood the whole incredibly-high-spring-tension thing. It just seems like making work for yourself, apart from at one small specific range of tempos and subdivisions where the "spring-back" speed of the pedal is aligned with the speed you're playing at. But then when you try to play a tempo where the pedal doesn't come back in time with the subdivisions you end up having to fight this really solid spring all the time to get the strokes in the right place. I just see the spring as having the job of taking the beater off the head, anything resembling speed comes from the foot. Which is nice in theory and on my right foot, but I'm having to spend a bit of time retraining the left after about four years off the double!

[nhzoso]

Can i ask a quick question (not to hijack,jus assume its an easy question but i was just confused recently :P), if my metronome is get to say 60bpm,is it te quarter notes that make 60 beats per minute?So if i played 8ths i would be playin 120 bpm,16ths- 240bpm? Is that correct?


Yes that is correct.

[komodo]

Possible,actually definate dumb question,which way do you turn the bolt to increase tension?Cockwise,anit-clockwise?got an eliminator pedal an the tension on the left isnt enuf,so need to tighten,but which way do i turn :P

[Tama Player]

Hey,

YES YES YES!!! I got it back. Before i had my appendix operation i was able to play up to 960 beats per minute with my both feets. I had a 3 week break, no drums. After this it was over with my 960 beats/min...And i wasn`s able to learn it again...

Now i made my spring harder an the beaters a little bit more nearly the bassdrum...and BOOOMM it is working again! I can play more than 960 beats/min! Now it is working better than before. Jesus, thats great.

But my knees hurt a little bit now...have no idea why^^

MfG
Tobias

Ps:. Could someone tell me some really fast drummers please?

Well, for feet, theres Tim Waterson, Joey Jordison, Gene Holgan....

For hands, Art Verdi, Mike Mangini, Johnny Raab....

Tim Waterson-------> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEwLs8OWyAc

Art Verdi---------------> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-v6IM1hpgI&mode=related&search=

Just to give you an idea......

[mosher]

Derrick Roddy is the man

[Tutin]

Derrick Roddy is the man

Too right man, very fast and very stylistic.

[joethemassacre]

Possible,actually definate dumb question,which way do you turn the bolt to increase tension?Cockwise,anit-clockwise?got an eliminator pedal an the tension on the left isnt enuf,so need to tighten,but which way do i turn :P



well experement, it should take less then 2 mins =/

and im surprised no one said stick control, using your feet. thats what ive been doing.

[kjsm]

alright here is the solution for EVERYONE who wants to play blazing fast double bass, its simple ..... PRACTICE

surely this simplistic absolutist attitude is no better than the get-fast-quick(?) scams 'instantly double your speed overnight' etc?

it's not practise makes perfect - (not unless, like some legal document, we specifically define 'practise' as eg playing something to a healthy repetitive degree and playing it without error thus 'practising' it correctly) - it's make perfect [your] practise.

analogy: taking a pill that claims to make you lose 100 pounds overnight instead of gradually healthily excercise training with good guidance for a year and following a sensible diet taking into account your unique body ways is obviously the worse way. thus i dont condone spending 200$ on Joe Stupid's ballistic system (not elegant phrased i know but c'mon!) instead of working through eg a stick technique book slowly with a metronome on your feet. but equally i absolutely condemn what is analogous to running hours a day every day for years on hard tarmac road with poor shoes and making spasmic twitches instead - this ''its just practise'' stuff. or rather, that is analogous to practising 'badly', something which seems rarely addressed. practise is no good if it'snot good for you! like i said, unless 'practise' specifically means the drumming equivalent to what i described about running and dieting above, then it's useless and in the long term, severly damaging in all aspects. and, as annoyed as im sure you more venerated (and it seems, annuated) drummers out there are at what you call 'youtube kids' saying ''i use heeltoe i play 888bpms i just need a technique to get my kick speed up to derek roddy speed for next week i just bought a double pedal today'', you're surely being no better by dismissively saying 'just practise for year and years', without mentioning that like someone starting a new training regime, you consult your doctor first! you have a personal fitness trainer (if you're that into it), you have a coach...etc. get a teacher to look over this stuff carefuly examine how you play in mirrors videos and look throughout this amazing free source we have the internet (though look for the most reputable sources).

there's such a thing as practising badly.
bad practising is worse than not practising, in some ways.
it can lead to arthritis.
rsi.
tendonitis.
carpal tunnel.
spurs formin on your spine.

technique (in its intended sense) is part of it all.
those who 'didnt practise' like buddy rich claimed happened to have...GREAT technique.
alex luce probably confirm that for you.

this isnt made to incite trouble if it does the fault is in the misinterpretation of the reader.

ps - all this pillow playing for the hands or 'tapping your feet' on the floor
we're drummers. we're inclined to do this kind of thing. but there are drummers plenty of them on this very forum who are understandbly complaining at the damage and years of near unlearnable bad technique and injury caused by reboundless surfaces and hard floors. so come on ... we're using motion not muscle (alone). thoughts?

i <3 drummerworld.

pss - i just wanted to say i agree with another drummer on here - i know using 'stick control' is a goood template (yes, template) for foot control practise but it should not be to me followed to the letter. feet are not hands! we wonder why it's 300bpm one week and 60 the other - they're not meant for this in the same way. or rather, to assume the approach between hands and feet training is the same is ignorant. cmon, people are learning bad habits out there as well as good. though i have to say this particualr forum is a constaant source of inspiration to me. thank you all.

[Mr. Pasquini]

I'd say highest tension you can pull out of the springs, half way up on the weights on the beaters should do you well; that's standard fast pedal settings. (George Kollias)