DW Factory Heads

[wooltonboy]

I'm intrigued by the DW factory supplied heads.
I believe they are made by Remo, but they appear to be a different type of "Mylar" than is usually used by them.
In fact, they remind me of the Aquarian Studio X in both appearance and sound.
I was watching the Cream Reunion DVD and Ginger Baker has them on his Dw's.
They sound "thick" like Aquarian. They actually sound like the studio X.
Just wondering if anyone else has any info on these heads
Cheers
Phil

[joeybeats]

I have a DW set on order, so what the heck, I called and asked. Spoke with someone not in customer service, maybe he was, I'm not sure. I was told that they are made by Remo and "similar" to clear Ambassadors on the bottom, and Ambassadors with a special pattern of coating to provide muffling on the batter sides. Who knows what "similar" means. This person also told me, when I asked if I should swap them out, that I would probably like them as they are designed to bring out the best sounds from DW drums. As expected with that last comment, I'd say! LOL Anyway, that's the story.

You can call Remo and inquire further for their side of the story ... I got too busy and forgot to call, though I intended to. Let me know, will ya?! Joey

[Skitch]

I too have noticed that these heads are different than the normal Remo head.


The collar is crimped and not open, revealing the epoxy bond.
The appears to be different.
They do not sound like Remo Ambasssadors sound.


Anyone else?


Mike

http://www.mikemccraw.com
http://www.dominoretroplate.com


http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=drummermikemccraw

[wooltonboy]

Yeah, they are definately different.
Which leads to the question: Why do they use this "material" seemingly only for the DW heads, and do not make a "Remo branded" version available to the masses.
With all the mostly positive feedback on Aquarian, particularly the Studio X, I'm suprised they haven't done this. You can see it's a different, or thicker type of Mylar by the fact that they are a little more "opaque" than an Ambassador, and seem "denser"...like Aquarian
Mmmm
Phil

[joeybeats]

I just hung the phone up with Remo. The lady I spoke with takes the orders from the DW factory. She says they are specially made for DW ... they add the white coated ring you see around the head per DW's spec's. They also imprint the head with the DW logo for DW. Finally, she reports they are all regular clear mylar Ambassadors. Joey

[wooltonboy]

Thanks for the info Joey.
Guess I was off on the wrong track. But they do seem a bit thicker to me.
Must be just an illusion!....lol
Phil

[Mediocrefunkybeat]

Check out www.mikedolbear.com and read their Remo factory tour article. It's very, very interesting, but they also cover the DW heads. I believe the mylar is actually the same, but as has been said, they use different mounting rings (which have an even bigger QC problem than their standard heads). I actually quite like the sound of the DW heads, Ginger Baker's kit on the new Cream videos sounds awesome, but it won't beat his 60's Luddies.

[joeybeats]

MFB - That was the most resourceful link I've seen at DrummerWorld in quite some time. More info from it than speaking with DW and Remo directly. Not only is it informative and educational, but moreover, I found it quite an enjoyable read. Thanks! I was particularly surprised to learn that Remo makes the Roland V e-drum shells, and that they do so much custom work.

For those of you who want the particulars regarding the Drum Workshop info provided at the site, I've copied and pasted it below, but the rest of the article is truly worth a read for any drummer.

"Remo actually have two methods of mounting the head in the rim. Most of the drum kit heads (the Weatherking heads) use the ‘U’ channel and epoxy method, but for higher tension heads and some special heads for kit manufacturers (Drum Workshop being one), Remo use a system originally devised for marching heads called dry crimping. This method has no glue - it uses a steel ring inside the aluminium channel and they use this mainly for the high strength heads like marching heads that are subject to very high tensions. This method uses a slightly larger aluminium channel into which is placed the head material and a smaller square section steel rod. The outer Channel is then bent around the inner section that secures it and the head material and actually provides a system that grabs the head material tighter as the head is tensioned.

The two main types of head that we saw being ‘dry crimped’ were Kevlar marching heads and drum kit heads for Drum Workshop. Kevlar is what military bullet proof vests are made from. It’s a very, very strong material and it can be tuned very tight, so Remo’s dry crimping process provides that extra support needed for this type of woven fabric. At the time of our visit Kevlar was in very short supply as most of it was finding its way to Iraq and Afghanistan in bulletproof jackets. Its price was skyrocketing to which was making production more difficult.

Dry crimped heads aren’t any ‘better’ than Remo’s U channel/epoxy heads (the Weather King variety) and in fact they have a higher chance of being rejected by Remo’s quality control as the manufacturing method actually makes it very easy to distort the head, meaning the plastic doesn’t lie flat in the rim and there is a big wrinkle in the film. Obviously no one wants distorted heads so there is a higher rejection rate than for other heads. It might be a more difficult method but that’s what DW want, so Remo, being their supplier, has to comply."

So, with all that info, I kinda look forward to using these suckers on a new (Four weeks to go!) set that DW is cooking up for me. And, I agree that the Royal Albert Hall Cream dvd wherein GB sounds fab. Check it out. I've been banging along with it for the last month. A great dvd for those of you who need some inspiration. Baker as an old man is still great and there are quite a few good tracks on the two disk set. I particularly love Clapton on Crossroads. Jack Bruce is one of the most underrated bass players, and still has a great voice. And well Baker, how many kids became drummers because of Wheels of Fire? Live Cream was one of the first albums I ever bought, first 20 anyway ... still dear to me. Joey

[Mediocrefunkybeat]

No problem. That site is actually really good. One of my regular boredom haunts and it helped me at college when I was writing a review of a Pete Lockett gig I went to see, there's a rather large interview with him somewhere on there.

It does strike me as odd that DW ask for those heads. It's fair enough really, but it makes no logical sense to me to actually ask for something that's going to be harder and (presumably) more expensive to produce. If they sound good though, they sound good. I'm trying to debate on my next set of heads. Aquarian Textures, Remo Fibreskyn FA or Evans G1's. Hmmm...

I watched some of the Cream concert on TV last year. It was good, but my attention started wandering towards the end, I don't honestly know why. What shocked me the most was the fantastic tone that Jack Bruce got from that fretless bass. He sounded amazing, even though his voice is pretty much broken, he played and sang with so much passion. It was inspiring to watch. Clapton was good as ever, he's never been bad particularly but Baker's energy was just something else.

[Skitch]

I actually don't use the DW heads which came on the drums when I got them. I use the Remo Ambassadors and a Powerstroke 3. I also remember when Ludwig marketed their heads as the crimped method which they emphasized "won't pull out like other heads which are bonded in epoxy." This was at the time when Ludwig had four series of heads; Rockers (obviously for Rock), Groovers (aimed at Jazz), Striders (for Marching) and Ensemble (for concert and symphonic band). I don't know that there was any difference in these and even though I tried to order some Ludwig heads for my drums, they were always difficult to get. I eventually went with Evans (when Evans was located in Dodge City, Kansas and the hoop was a ceramic material) and then later went to Remo Pinstripes on the Ludwig kit.

Okay, I am now back......


Mike

http://www.mikemccraw.com
http://www.dominoretroplate.com


http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=drummermikemccraw

[masonni]

I took a tour of the Remo facotry last year, and it was really cool to see how everything was done. They explained the whole DW head thing, and what a pain it was to get that coating done the way DW wanted it.

Also, Remo has a factory out side of the US that all the heads that come stock on most drum kits are made. stock for most brands, other than DW, that is. They all have the dry crimp lock system, only Remo's "weather king" heads are glued.


Oh, and did you know that the acctual pinstripe on the pinstripe heads are all put on by hand?

[Skitch]

I took a tour of the Remo facotry last year, and it was really cool to see how everything was done. They explained the whole DW head thing, and what a pain it was to get that coating done the way DW wanted it.

Also, Remo has a factory out side of the US that all the heads that come stock on most drum kits are made. stock for most brands, other than DW, that is. They all have the dry crimp lock system, only Remo's "weather king" heads are glued.


Oh, and did you know that the acctual pinstripe on the pinstripe heads are all put on by hand?

Great info here! The guy putting on the pinstripe must have nightmares! What about the Powerstroke 3s?

Mike

http://www.mikemccraw.com
http://www.dominoretroplate.com


http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=drummermikemccraw

[Fat Elvis]

i have the newest DW heads on two of my toms and coated ambassadors on two other ones, and surprisingly, its hard to tell the difference between the two sonically. The clear DW heads have a bit more stick attack to them, but tone wise they blend well together. Although my kit looks somewhat odd right now, but the coated ambassadors are new, as are the DW heads, so thats the way it will stay for now. I do like the look of the DW heads.

Maybe the coating on the DW heads sort of warms it up like a coated head would, but still providing the attack of a clear? Either way, i am going to stick with either coated or clear ambassadors.

for what its worth, my local GC did say they could order me DW heads -- if that interests anyone.

[joeybeats]

C'mon, Elvis, update that DW link below your sig, will ya? Show them new babies off! Joey

[Sesh]

I'm intrigued by the DW factory supplied heads.
I believe they are made by Remo, but they appear to be a different type of "Mylar" than is usually used by them.
In fact, they remind me of the Aquarian Studio X in both appearance and sound.
I was watching the Cream Reunion DVD and Ginger Baker has them on his Dw's.
They sound "thick" like Aquarian. They actually sound like the studio X.
Just wondering if anyone else has any info on these heads
Cheers
Phil

Just a thought - but as Ginger baker is...well..ginger baker! it is possible that the ones he's using on the cream DVD are special orders - maybe emporers with the DW logo and coating applied as per there usual ambassadors. Or just tuning/miking/desk FX etc. You never know

[Sirwill]

Dw does make a great head. They even make some custom heads for the pros that are not available to buy on the market. Mr. Peart uses these spacial heads. "Rhythm in the hands of few" Sirwill