Jeff Indyke here!

[DrumNut]

Jeff is not only an awesome player, but prolific with education materials.

He has his own Drum television show in New York, is on Drum Radio, and has over 100 drum dvd's and tapes.

Jeff teaches concepts of Billy Cobham, Carter Beauford, Simon Phillips, Bonham, Van Halen, Buddy Rich, Krupa, Tony Williams and more. I love his tapes.

And, such a modest guy.

[JohnMunsey]

Anyone who can teach Cobham or Buddy is sick. I mean that in a good sick way! lol

[DrumNut]

yes, this guy teaches Cobham, Buddy, Krupa and Tony, crazyness.

He is a former student of Al Miller.

[DrumNut]

But he's an educator, so he wont get as much recognition or response. You never seen an educator on the cover of a drum mag lol

We want to talk about who is on the cover, glamour

[DrumNut]

Anyone in here from Long Island see his Drum TV Show???

[Kevinm]

Can't stand the sound of his kit! But he has some very good points! Maybe just my phone accents the kits sound that I don't like!

[DrumNut]

When I called the dial-a-beat I felt the same way, the accents really cut through that phone!

[mediocrefunkybeat]

But he's an educator, so he wont get as much recognition or response. You never seen an educator on the cover of a drum mag lol

We want to talk about who is on the cover, glamour

Wrong again... Dom Famularo.

Dial-a-drum is pretty cool; it must be said.

[JohnMunsey]

That's true, MFB. Dom is the man.

But I still think it's harder for educators to be recognized as much as guys in rock bands.

I dont even know if a drum educator has been on the cover of Modern Drummer much.

[mediocrefunkybeat]

I'm pretty sure he's been on the cover, and if he hasn't then it's an utter travesty.

I agree though, it is MUCH harder to get recognised as an educator than as a recording artist. Dom Famularo has (quote) 'Limited studio experience' (maybe a misquote, but it's on the Famularo website) (unquote)

However, the fact that he IS recognised says something IMO.

[JohnMunsey]

I think the limited studio experience is a quote from one of the teachers on Dom's staff.

I heard Dom did jingles and commercials decades ago, but I dont really know.

I saw Chapin on the cover of MD once, but it was a very small picture! Here's the guy who taught the guys on the covers!

[JohnMunsey]

I ordered a couple of his DVDs, this guy is freagin good! He analyzes the heck out of bonham and cobham!

[DrumNut]

Which concepts did you order?

[JohnMunsey]

Last Sunday my cousin saw his show in Long Island and they said he's very funny on it lol

[JeffIndyke]

Hello,

Jeff Indyke here! I heard tremendous things about Drummerworld!

Thanks very much for anyone who may listened or viewed my audio/videos and Drum TV Shows.

Those who know me, know I have done studies on the concepts of many drummers like Bonham, Moon, Peart, Cobham, Buddy, Beuford and many others.

I am currently producing some educational material on Danny Carey's work since a video clip I did on Youtube got about 2,000 hits in one week.

I am wondering what concepts and songs you might be interested in me to break down and teach of Danny Carey. Any advice or feedback would be valuable!

As an example, here is one of my video clips on Danny Carey. Please also, if you get a chance, tell me what I can do better for you to learn.

Thanks so much!
Jeff

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghNcpvqmskY

[T-1000]

Hmmm a fake? I just don't know.

Anyway, welcome, imposter, how do you play Lateralus?

We all love you, by the way.

Crap, man, I just watched *your* video on youtube. It was 'real interesting.' You from New Yoik?

[JeffIndyke]

Thanks so much!

Yes, I'm in Long Island, and have Drum Education TV Show in 3 areas of New York.

Please feel free to call me at (516) 263-9782. I want to provide service to the community and continue to enhance my product on this show, so feedback is important.

Thanks!

[Stu_Strib]

Jeff,

I've never "talked" to you per se, but I have been all over you and Danny Britt's web pages for the past year, and love what you do there.

The only constructive bit of criticism I have is to make your broadcasts shorter, or break them up into bits. Although I enjoy your sense of humor and your talky bits, some guys just want to jump on and get a few quick pointers!

I LOVE your Bonham work. So many people have tried to imitate him, but you are one of the most authentic I've seen!

Keep up the good work.

Stu

[JeffIndyke]

Stu,

Thanks very much for the kind words and feedback!

Do you have any suggestions or requests (or anyone) on a specific Bonham topic?

I also do a Bonham article/sound segment with Classic Drummer if you are interested in looking at that!

[Stu_Strib]

Well, considering I dove into your Bonham stuff on the site, I can't really think of anything else to cover!

I can't remember, but did you cover the quick triplet fills in Good Times, Bad Times? I've had too many arguments on here with uninformed guys to explain that the triplet is a hand foot foot (with the hand removed!), but so many guys on here believe he is actually playing one-footed triplets at that tempo.

You always break things down pretty well. What I like, though, is how you take the lick and then show us all how to implement it in other ways.

No offense either, but could you invest in better camera gear? You could get a nice little DV camera and say a MacBook and have a killer video show!

Stu

[JeffIndyke]

Stu,

Thanks for the feedback and kind words. The camera will probably be my next investment. And maybe voice-activated computer equipment. My vision is not that good, so I have to have people help me with interenet, email and forums

I do have studies/courses on "Good Times, Bad Times".

Also, my show will now be in Brooklyn also, for any Brooklynites!

So now its: Manhattan, Staten Island, Long Island, Brooklyn

Any of you in these areas. Please give any feedback or constructive criticism.

[JeffIndyke]

Medi,

Thanks for the kind words!

Please call anytime at (516) 263-9782. I have some studies similar to Bruford (e.g., melodic linear, triads, etc.).

Ideas #3 & #4 on mine and Dan's Paradiddle-didle article (link below) is similar in theory to what Bruford does on this (I dont remember exactly), but if you study it, you can get the mobility of it.

http://stage.sbomagazine.com/CurrentIssue/performance.aspx

[JeffIndyke]

No problem.

I am now producing several studies on Danny Carey also.

There are influences from classical music!

[Sparta]

Hey Jeff, just wanted to say I love your videos..keep em up!

[JeffIndyke]

Sparta,

Thank you very much for taking the time to write, I appreciate that!

I have 4 or 5 more new Danny Carey studies coming soon!

[JeffIndyke]

I just heard from Eyal Maozm a guitarist and composer living in NYC who just released a CD on Tzadik Records with John Medeski on organ from Mediski, Martin & Wood

He is interested in doing some work with me and saw my TV Show.

Is anybody familiar with Medeski or Eyal? Eyal is playing at the Montreal Jazz Festival he said.

www.eyalmaozmusic.comhttp://www.eyalmaozmusic.com

[JeffIndyke]

We have added some new videos of mine up! Hope you enjoy it!

http://www.youtube.com/user/DrumTVShow

[JohnMunsey]

Hey Jeff,

Bad hair day??? lol

I like the playin though lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5Veop39YKU

[JeffIndyke]

We've put several new videos up! At this rate, we'll have 100 in 2 months!

http://www.youtube.com/user/DrumTVShow

[JeffIndyke]

About 10 new drum lesson video clips were added based of my TV Show!

Some on Chapin/Bellson, Carey, Seraphine, Purdie, Famularo, Gadd, Weckl, Lars Ulrich and more!

http://www.youtube.com/user/DrumTVShow

[yves]

Hey Jeff.

I've watched a couple of your videos off the net.

Seeing all those vids on youtube is fantastic.

You're certainly doing the drum community a great service by sharing studies like that.

[Stu_Strib]

Hey Jeff,

Great work on the Gadd I and II sections! Have you ever compiled written notation to go along with your video ideas? I would really love to have just the core concept as a written exercise. The best thing about your videos is that you take a riff and explore all the possibilities. A nice compilation of say, "Steve Gadd Core Riffs & Variations" (for example) would be outstanding, and I would pay money for them!

Stu

[JeffIndyke]

Wow, thanks so much everyone, a real honor!

My vision is not too well, so I get assistance with posting, but I'll try to post as often as I can. Please call me (516) 263-9782 also.

Stu, I'll answer your questions soon! And I'll try to put new lessons up tonight

[NUTHA JASON]

great vids prof. you have a great teaching style. excuse my ignorance but is there a dvd i could buy with all your drumtv material on it?

i'm going to work on your fast snare pattern (the one with 5 in it) today:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bY-tnUH6ps&search=fast%20drumming (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bY-tnUH6ps&search=fast%20drumming)

j

[JeffIndyke]

Hi Jason,

Thanks so much! An honor for a main guy here to say it and be so selfless.

I will refrain from posting my products generally speaking, but since you asked most of my products can be found here, including the Drum TV DVDs!

http://www.dannybritt.com/jeff.htm

[JeffIndyke]

We've added more videos today!

Nicko McBrain, Bonham, Weckl, Tony Williams, Buddy + Bobby Colomby Snare Feel!
Please also post your requests.

http://www.youtube.com/user/DrumTVShow

[skippy]

I just heard from Eyal Maozm a guitarist and composer living in NYC who just released a CD on Tzadik Records with John Medeski on organ from Mediski, Martin & Wood

He is interested in doing some work with me and saw my TV Show.

Is anybody familiar with Medeski or Eyal? Eyal is playing at the Montreal Jazz Festival he said.

www.eyalmaozmusic.comhttp://www.eyalmaozmusic.com

medeski martin and wood is a bad ass band. and i enjoy your videos from wat ive seen.

[JeffIndyke]

Thanks so much!

There's a new Buddy + Bobby Colomby-inspired Snare Pattern video up now!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4TENTBH5nA

Jeff
(516) 263-9782

[JeffIndyke]

I will be attending Steve Gadd's clinic in NY. Anyone else attending?

[JeffIndyke]

I can't remember, but did you cover the quick triplet fills in Good Times, Bad Times? I've had too many arguments on here with uninformed guys to explain that the triplet is a hand foot foot (with the hand removed!), but so many guys on here believe he is actually playing one-footed triplets at that tempo.

Stu

Hi Stu,

I do have a study on Good Times, Bad Times. Listed below are all the Bonham studies:

John Bonham Instructional Audios/DVDs by Jeff Indyke
The John Bonham Drum Instruction Package
This package fuses all the instructional materials I have produced based on John Bonham! With this package, you also receive 3 free audios & 2 free gifts.
*Study on Buddy Rich, John Bonham, (Accented Tom-Tom Melodies)

*Study on John Bonham (Rhythms based off of "Good Times Bad Times")

*Study on John Bonham (Triplet Bass Drum Principles - influenced from "Moby Dick")

Study on Tommy Aldridge, John Bonham, Nicko McBrain, (Power Bass Drum Fills)

*The Basics of John Bonham - An intensive development of exercises to help achieve intense foot control, speed and endurance.

John Bonham (Led Zepplin) Song Analysis Concepts

These concepts are not a complete chart of the song! They are based of off the main rhythms and fills of the tune. On each idea, there are several variations composed. So you the student can work these concepts into your own playing!

Rhythm and Fill Analysis on "Stairway to Heaven"
Rhythm and Fill Analysis on "D'yer Mak'er"
Rhythm Analyses on "The Immigrant Song" and "Whole Lotta Love"
Rhythm and Fill Analysis on "Dazed and Confused"
Rhythm Analyses on "When the Levee Breaks" and "Heartbreaker"
Rhythm and Fill Analyses on "Over the Hills and Far Away" and "The Ocean"
Rhythms based off of "Good Times Bad Times"
Advanced Bonzo Beats - Rhythms in the Style of John Bonham
Solo analysis and variations on "Moby Dick"
Rhythm and Fill Analyses on "Fool in the Rain" and "Custard Pie"

Bonzo - The Final Chapter - More wailing rhythms and fills notoriously in the philosophy of John Bonham. Included is a Bonham style with a modern funk approach!

BUDDY RICH Versus JOHN BONHAM - A tremendous challenge of power. 2 Audios.

Bonham Seminar Audios I & II

Bonham DVD's I-V from The Jeff Indyke Drum Education TV Show, Season I

Bonzo Genetic Connection

[Mr.Echo]

I like your first video(Single Stroke 5) you did on DannyBritt.com,
My favorite part in the video is when you say "I like the way I said that!!"
I watch the video just to hear your say that line and of course to see your technique.

I'm glad to see you have your videos on mytube taken from
your NY Cable Show, especially for people who cant see the show(like myself who's stuck
on an Unknown Island with one computer).
Have to go now, Locke is calling me

[JeffIndyke]

I like your first video(Single Stroke 5) you did on DannyBritt.com,
My favorite part in the video is when you say "I like the way I said that!!"


Wow, interesting - out on the island! Glad you like them!

And a lot of people get a kick out of that part!

I also have a different video up on http://www.dannybritt.com/videodemo.htm

I think the single 5 is on Youtube

[Homer]

Um...is it me or ... why do you have a microphone and cable completely obscuring your face

[DrumNut]

Um...is it me or ... why do you have a microphone and cable completely obscuring your face

Hey Homer, is that all you can say from all the free drum education videos Jeff provides? lol

[JeffIndyke]

I have a New Bonham Video Segment on Classic Drummer Magazine Website as an accompaniment to mine and Dan's quarterly articles.

http://www.classicdrummer.com/indyke.html

Please let me know what feedback you may have

[DrumNut]

Jeff,

You got animals in your studio or something! Or live near a farm!?

What's with the Animal sounds in this clip in beginning and end!?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4TENTBH5nA#GU5U2spHI_4

[JeffIndyke]

New Video Clips up today on Jon Wysock of Staind!

http://www.youtube.com/user/DrumTVShow

[gmrakich]

Just got off the phone with Jeff...what a cool guy. He really does return phone calls and answers your pressing drumming questions.
THANKS JEFF. : ^ )

[JeffIndyke]

Hello All,

You can subscribe to my video by clicking Subscribe here and will be alerted when new ones go up!

Thanks!

http://www.youtube.com/user/DrumTVShow

[JeffIndyke]

Great News!

I will be providing Drum Videos for DRUM! Magazine starting soon!

www.drummagazine.com

[Mediocrefunkybeat]

Congratulations Jeff! I hope your enthusiasm for your work is put into the studies of all those who watch the videos.

[JeffIndyke]

Thank you, Mediocre!

Everyone - Please befriend me at myspace if you get an opportunity:

www.myspace.com/drumprofessor

[JeffIndyke]

Good Times, Bad Times study is up! Bonham triplets!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_LujPCpm3Y

[JeffIndyke]

Over 90 videos are now up on YouTube, over 65,000 views! And almost 80 Subscribers!! Where does it all come from!

http://www.youtube.com/user/DrumTVShow

[HardcoreLogo]

Hey there, the intro to Sober by Tool still throws me for some reason, I play it darn close, but I'm not sure I have it 100%.I know there are so many cool Danny Carey licks, but this one has allways bothered me because I'm so close, but not quite there...........

[JeffIndyke]

Hey Hardcore,

Could you either call me at (516) 263-9782 or tell me more about the song, like what album it is on and which part?

[JeffIndyke]

Last Night! In NYC at the Metropolitan Cafe

Terry Silverlight, Art, me, Dan

http://www.dannybritt.com/photos_files/TerryArtJeffDan.JPG

[JeffIndyke]

New video clip is up based on a Gadd influence of applying the drag!

Also a jazz interpretation of Max, Elvin, etc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8s9P75plk1k

[JeffIndyke]

Over 100 video clips are now up! Enjoy!

www.youtube.com/user/drumtvshow

Pls let me know what you want

[NUTHA JASON]

jeff called me the otherday a'right and he is one hell of a guy. i wish there were a few british guys like him as i would then go for lessons with them. but in spite of his videos being up for sale he still posts so many on the web for free. a generous spirit indeed.

j

[JeffIndyke]

Thank you so much!

10 More video clips were put up yesterday.

Here is an Elvin Jones concept lesson!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QurfuJ8ryWc

[JeffIndyke]

I want to Thanks everyone who watched our videos on YouTube and for your support!

It's exciting. In the, I think about 2 months, we now reached 100,000 views of the videos!

Welcome, DrumTVShow
Statistics
Video Views: 100001
Channel Views: 4213
Subscribers: 105

A few more subscribers and I think we are in the top 40 for subscribers for the month on Youtube

[JeffIndyke]

By the way, I would like to say I love Dan's "helicopter" moves in this video!

We have been working together for almost 2 years!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQaqlCjh9ig&search=dan%20britt

[NUTHA JASON]

that is some beaytiful work by dan right there. as i watch i just imagine what that stuff looks like broken over even a simple drum kit. with hand chops like that you can solo for hours on a three piece. nice one dan.

j

[Jeff Almeyda]

I just checked out Jeff's You Tube videos and I'm impressed. A real pro who knows his stuff... and he's prolific!!!

Too many guys are unwilling to share knowledge, he's the polar opposite of Joe "ballistic" or Jared Falk. Those guys that want to charge you for some supposed "secret" that'll turn you into Virgil overnight.

I'm gonna rip some stuff off from him to show to my students. :)

[JeffIndyke]

Thanks so much! A lot more videos will be up soon!

[JeffIndyke]

I want to thank everyone for their support. Because of it, I am in the top 40 on Youtube for musicians!

40 - Most Viewed Channels (This Month) - Musicians
#38 - Most Viewed Channels (All Time) - Musicians
#15 - Most Subscribed Channels (All Time) - Musicians

[JeffIndyke]

Now anyone on the internet can see my show from Manhattan on Tuesday at 4pm

http://www.mnn.org/

Just click Channel 57 @ 4pm Every Tuesday!!

[bigbang]

This is great news.Now that I'm off for the next 3 weeks(and have access to a computer) I gotta check this out.I've enjoyed your posts on youtube, you have a great relaxed teaching style and you've reminded me of some great little licks that i've completely forgotten about.

[JeffIndyke]

I am getting many international calls now, and am wondering if someone can serve as a translator. I cannot understand a lot of language other than English.

Please call me if you are interested in possibly translating these calls.

(516) 263-9782

Thanks!

[jollymosher]

ive watched alot of your stuff. and your good but your teaching style is really messy i can learn faster by just doing it myself.

[handito]

Hi Jeff
I would also just like to say that I dig your videos on youtube. Have you made any files yet about Chad Smith, Mitch Mitchells or Tony Allen?

[JeffIndyke]

Yes, I have done Chad Smith concept series under Bits & Pieces and TV Shows on him!

http://www.dannybritt.com/jeff.htm

[JeffIndyke]

Thanks!

Just a reminder it is on TODAY!....

[DrumNut]

Hey Jeff,

Didnt know you had your own hair salon - this explains your cool hair do!

http://jeffreyindyke.com/

[JeffIndyke]

8-10 more video lessons of Danny Carey concepts will be up on youtube shortly!

[Bernie20]

I've been hearing about this guy all over the place in different forums, but I never heard of him, and now see his name all over, what is the deal with this guy? I never heard of him..

[T.Underhill]

"For the last 18 years, Jeff has presented his world wide Drummer's International Hot-Line Dial-A-Beat (516) 539-BEAT.... A number for Drummers world wide to hear creative drum ideas over the phone.
Jeff is now in his second season of " The Jeff Indyke Drum Education Show" The Big Beat Continues". Airing (PA) Ch. 20 Nassau & Western Suffolk New York From April 05 to Sept 05. For each show Jeff has created an intensive focus upon various topics of the greats of today. This season will be a killer.

Jeff's favorite shows from season 1 was "The (Undisputed) Bonzo Files". This years first DrumRadio.com presentation "Bonham's Up" is built of off the original "Bonzo Files".

Aside From Jeff's continuous production schedule, Jeff also loves to teach & coach the Art of Drumming. From time to time Jeff has presented his " Rudimental Drum Clinic" at various public schools. To have this opportunity to be invited to be part of DrumRadio is a prestigious honor."


I think he's does a really good job of his breakdown and analyzation of famous beats and grooves. Do a search of his name on Youtube and enjoy watching! He's also a hair stylist by trade. Feel free to check out this thread already in progress...

http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12637 (http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12637)

[geek_boy_in]

Jeff I second one of the posts below asking for some instructional material on Tony Allen
Tony's references:
http://www.africanmusiciansprofiles.com/tonyallen.htm
http://www.wrasserecords.com/artists/info/31.html
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/world/awards2003/profile_allen.shtml

I would be more interested in his older work with Fela Kuti during the 70s. He alone plays polyrhythms live simultaneously like 4 drummers. I don't like his new stuff made in the last 5 years though .....

but nonetheless Tony is so introvert, under appreciated and under-studied .. .... Bonham is really popular .... many people interpreted him in and out ... but It would be real good if some knowledgeable person like you can give us a deeper insight into Tony's playing and make us understand what is it that is giving his rhythm a different feel ......

I really liked his feel in the album Confusion / Gentleman with Fela Kuti http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00000JOEX/102-2944545-9972942?v=glance&n=5174

[Bernie20]

Hi Jeff,

I just learned that you are a hair stylist by trade. How do you find the time to it all?

[DrumNut]

and now see his name all over, what is the deal with this guy? I never heard of him..


Jeff Indyke has perhaps produced more DVDs and audios than any other drummer, he's a machine man

[HardcoreLogo]

Hey Jeff, good talkin' to ya on the phone........I'll get that fax # to ya soon!

[JeffIndyke]

I just want to say that Terry Silverlight is one of the nicest guys!

I will be doing some TV shows on Terry's incredible work. To me, Terry is an International Drum Star.

[DrumNut]

What a jerk - I dont see him posting any contributions

http://bsato.blogspot.com/

[TitanSound]

I hate people like that.

Jeff puts in time and effort to help other drummers out and some idiots just do not appreciate it.

[jazzgregg]

I hate people like that.

Jeff puts in time and effort to help other drummers out and some idiots just do not appreciate it.

No, some drummers do not think he is helping.

G

[fourstringdrums]

No, some drummers do not think he is helping.

G

*raises hand*

I watched the video linked on the blog and I had no idea what he was talking about. Even if it is a complex subject, good teachers should leave the student walking away atleast understanding a bit of it for the moment.

[T.Underhill]

Usually I can kinda follow along and understand but in this video?....I haven't the foggiest idea what he is talking about.

[fourstringdrums]

Usually I can kinda follow along and understand but in this video?....I haven't the foggiest idea what he is talking about.

It's really simple. Ok, here's an anology: I added an extra letter somewhere in this post...I invented that.

Didn't find it? Here, I did it again.

:)

[DrumNut]

I hate people like that.

Jeff puts in time and effort to help other drummers out and some idiots just do not appreciate it.

Yeah, Jeff is respected by some great drummers. Usualy the average ones put him down

[Stu_Strib]

Yeah, Jeff is respected by some great drummers. Usualy the average ones put him down

HAHA GREGG! You were just called average, I do believe :-)

[TitanSound]

No, some drummers do not think he is helping.

G

I can see where you are coming from.

He may be no amazing teacher but anybody who helps us out is a star in my eyes!! I find his approach exciting as you can see he is bursting with enthusiasm and that can only help more novice drummers realise how much fun playing the drums is :)

[jazzgregg]

I can see where you are coming from.

He may be no amazing teacher but anybody who helps us out is a star in my eyes!! I find his approach exciting as you can see he is bursting with enthusiasm and that can only help more novice drummers realise how much fun playing the drums is :)

Is that what he's bursting with?

And Stu, yes, it appears I have been called average- the secrets out. Let me guess, I've been pwned now, right?

G

[obscuras]

He seems a nice guy, i havent checked out his videos yet

I saw the video on his blog and...

'Molecularization' What the Furniture?
I always thought 'Adding an extra beat at the end' was a sure fire way to pish your band, bassist, and conductor off, if your playing in a band setting. Obviously, in a solo setting, changing time is utilized, hell i do it, but 'Adding in an extra beat before he 'Returns', You can't really copyright a metre of time =\

Though i could just be talking rubbish. Its just my oppinion anyway...

[NUTHA JASON]

i hope jeff reads this thread because he, like all of us, needs some constructive critiscism. i have watched many of his vids too but it is unclear what he is driving at. different camera angles and more prepreparation is in order. i would suggest he visits gospelchops.com to se how those young cats explain their chops:


play it at speed to convince of its worth
talk it through
play it slow and point out important parts
speed it up to groove speed
then play a groove and put the chop in to show how it can be applied.i'm sure jeff has a lot to offer but following through steps 1 to 5 would make it far more effective.

j

[Just Drums]

HAHA GREGG! You were just called average, I do believe :-)

Welcome back dude!

20 chars.

[Paul Quin]

What a jerk - I dont see him posting any contributions

http://bsato.blogspot.com/

Okay, first the disclaimer: I enjoy Jeff's videos, in part because he is so quirky, and he is obviously a good player and yes, I often have no idea what the hell he is talking about. The truth is, however, that it doesn't matter. he is doing his thing in his way and if you like it fine - if not, move on - it's not like there's not fifteen million other things on Youtube with which to seek amusement.

It seems to me that you are criticising a blog where some guy is merely stating his opinion and trying to do so in an amusing (although not entirely accurate) way. Isn't he free to do so? I really don't see this blog as the act of a "jerk". It fails to really unearth new humor but attacking someone who posts as often as jeff is the price jeff pays for making himself so visible. I am also sure Jeff has heard or read much worse. If you're going to put yourself out there (as a a player, performer, teacher, clinician etc.), you got to take the knocks and these don't seem so bad to me.

Paul

[finnhiggins]

Sorry, but I have to line up with Gregg and say that having watched a few of those videos I don't think he's helping either. Reducing every single player on the planet to paradiddle orchestrations is a bit like presenting a style analysis of George Orwell which reaches the shocking conclusion that he regularly uses the letters "t" "h" and "e" in that order. Couple that with an obvious total lack of preparation and structure, no editing, lots of unrelated stuff that just gets played and seemingly surprises Jeff himself and god knows how much else and I really can't honestly say this guy is a good teacher.

I've had good teachers. They don't look like that. They think about their lessons before they start talking.

On the upside, that blog link did make me discover something very entertaining - purely because of audio issues on my Linux machine which resulted in the accidental replacement of Jeff's dialogue and drumming with "Make 'em Laugh" by Arthur Freed & Nacio Herb Brown from "Singin' In The Rain". It's a remarkably good fit.

EDIT: If you want to see what I'm talking about with the preparation and structure thing, go do a compare-and-contrast with Derrick Pope's vids and Jeff Indyke's ones. Spot the difference? One is concise and comprehensible, the other just leaves you scratching your head and wondering if the guy is for real.

[KzSgDrummer]

Could somebody please run this by me again -- what the heck is molecularization? Of course we're not talking about the science term.. the scientific journals will tell ma something totally different. Hopefully a scientist will call me up and tell me what scientific molecularization is.. nah nevermind to you scientists out there don't call me, lol.

But seriously, I don't get it. Does he mean 9/8 or 5/4 instead of 4/4? And how can this be used in a band setting without planning it out, where then it would be called "a bar of odd time at the end of this phrase" ... ?

One thing I do know - I have a lot of connections to Long Island, and listening to his accent simultaneuosly puts me into humorous ecstacy, and also makes me want to puke.

[Bernhard]

lots of unrelated stuff that just gets played and seemingly surprises Jeff himself and god knows how much else

A good one Finn!!!!

My feeling is:
In every lesson (called Steve Gadd chapter 1 - 28, Buddy Rich chapter 1 - 39 , John Bonham.....chapter 1 - 12..)
it's always the same one and only little lick - played in a very sloppy way - not suitable for any bandplaying or even recording.

So name calling is generating traffic - but no help for drumming.

But I love the guy!!!! I feel with him and want to help.....

Bernhard

[rendezvous_drummer]

I honestly don't understand much of what he's talking about. He's trying to help.

[finnhiggins]

Nice guy though, he's trying to help.

I agree that he's trying. But there are three things that push it over the line into me being quite severely unimpressed rather than just giving points for effort:

1) Aggressive self-promotion. Huge captions claiming 1.5 million viewers, "I invented this concept!" blah blah. Sorry Jeff, but I don't see that stuff on Thomas Lang's DVD, Jeff Pocaro's DVD or Billy Ward's DVD. Or anybody elses. So I really don't expect to see it on your stuff. If you have something to say, say it and then let other people decide the value of what you do rather than just trying to claim merit at every opportunity in as large a font as possible.

2) If you're going to teach you need to learn first. Much of what Jeff is saying on those videos is either wrong or obvious. If it's wrong, it's harmful to people who take it as advice. If it's obvious then it's also harmful because it is encouraging people away from actually doing their own thinking. Much of the stuff on those "concepts" lessons could be learned by anybody who has had, say, four focused lessons on reading, listening and transcribing. And if you transcribe that stuff yourself then you tend to learn more because of it - it helps develop your ears and your understanding of the surrounding music.

No good teacher I know takes the approach of transcribing music and then teaching it to students in chunks. "Today, children, we will be studying bars 46 through 54 of Tom Sawyer by Rush..." and so forth. The good ones just teach the students to transcribe and let them make their own discoveries, because that's how you actually learn.

3) Name-dropping. As Bernhard said, about 90% of Jeff's stuff is the same groove/lick re-arranged slightly, and I'm not convinced that half the re-arrangements aren't accidental. But his videos are laced with stuff saying that Jeff is an expert in teaching "Steve Gadd concepts", they reference Bonham... hell, he even has one which claims to be explaining Elvin Jones, instead it seems to be yet another paradiddle orchestration. Seriously, who listens to Elvin and hears paradiddles as the key, central concept? This ties in with the self-promotion stuff. When I search for Elvin on YouTube I don't want to see Jeff's lesson turning up in the list because quite simply it's wrong and insulting to Elvin's legacy that he's using a name of a player he clearly has no understanding of to promote himself and his work. God forbid some poor kid who's just discovered Elvin might think Jeff's actually teaching them something, rather than grossly misleading them.

So yes. Good intentions, but I personally think the methods are utterly reprehensible and actually highly damaging. The fact that there are people posting in this thread saying "You can't say that about Jeff, he's a great teacher!" has me really worried because I'm scared that some of you people out there are actually buying his self-promotion and thinking that he's telling you stuff you should be learning! For those here who're so mortified by the criticism, can you please enlighten me to anything whatsoever that you've learned from Jeff that you couldn't have worked out better for yourself from the usual primary sources? (i.e: Stick Control, a few lessons on reading/transcribing and a pile of CDs)

[gmrakich]

Jeff is almost completely blind and can not read notes...etc. He is doing this all off the top of his head, trying to remember all the points he wants to make.
I have talked with him on the phone several time, and he has been a blast to converse with. He needs a new cell phone though...it always sounds like he is in a submarine thats been hit.

[OZjazzer]

Frankly I hate this simplistic view of the work of the really great drummers. It's like learning to paint like Van Gough in 30 minutes. It trivialises great players while at the same time elevating him, by name dropping. And worse, it encourages that 'now I'll play my Tony Williams lick and follow up with a spot of Elvin' kind of thinking. There are way too many guys out there doing that already.

Others here have said the same things about his stuff. Maybe we're right?

[Garvin]

Jeff is almost completely blind and can not read notes...etc. He is doing this all off the top of his head, trying to remember all the points he wants to make.
I have talked with him on the phone several time, and he has been a blast to converse with. He needs a new cell phone though...it always sounds like he is in a submarine thats been hit.

That's hilarious. The perfect analogy for someone who has crappy cell reception.

Frankly I don't understand why we are coddling this guy. I've seen a lot of crap on you tube, mostly links from this forum (not all drumming, don't get upset) but if it sucks it sucks right? Am I missing something, or are we talking about someone who is in the room? I'm sorry if I'm being harsh, but my god! This is almost sad.

I'll no doubt ellicit the "let's see you do better" response, and that's fine... I'll admit, I don't have the technological capability to film and upload me celebrating the fact that I own a drumset. The title of this video should be "HEY! I OWN A FREAKIN' DRUMSET!"

I've seen amazing players and amazing videos before, I'm not them!!!

It reminds me of this guy who I've gigged with in my town once and only once. He refers to his music as "Brazilian", and he talks really big and gets high paying gigs and owns lots of nice stuff. I went to rehearsal and nearly had a heart attack when I realized that he had absolutely no idea what he was doing, couldn't read music, didn't pronounce a single word correctly, had probably only seen an hour long documentary on Brazil and probably couldn't even find it on a map much less produce 10 seconds of music that could remotely be referred to as Brazilian.....

Catches breath....

But I gotta hand it to him for trying???

No thanks.

[Hex]

Hello,

Believe it or not, that is my blog that the original poster was referencing.

And yes, my post on Jeff Indyke was meant to be harmless. I did refer to him as my "favorite YouTube celebrity" after all. I don't think that was too harsh.

Anyway, it's quite strange to be surfing the Drummerworld forum and all of the sudden see a link to your blog. How the heck did you find it? I actually use it primarily to converse with some friends of mine who live far away. (None of whom are drummers.) Of course, anyone is welcomed to read it, and welcome to criticize whatever I write.

But, to set the record straight, I'm really not a jerk. I'm actually quite a nice guy. :)

EDIT: I updated my blog too.

[jazzgregg]

That's hilarious. The perfect analogy for someone who has crappy cell reception.

Frankly I don't understand why we are coddling this guy. I've seen a lot of crap on you tube, mostly links from this forum (not all drumming, don't get upset) but if it sucks it sucks right? Am I missing something, or are we talking about someone who is in the room? I'm sorry if I'm being harsh, but my god! This is almost sad.

I'll no doubt ellicit the "let's see you do better" response, and that's fine... I'll admit, I don't have the technological capability to film and upload me celebrating the fact that I own a drumset. The title of this video should be "HEY! I OWN A FREAKIN' DRUMSET!"

I've seen amazing players and amazing videos before, I'm not them!!!

It reminds me of this guy who I've gigged with in my town once and only once. He refers to his music as "Brazilian", and he talks really big and gets high paying gigs and owns lots of nice stuff. I went to rehearsal and nearly had a heart attack when I realized that he had absolutely no idea what he was doing, couldn't read music, didn't pronounce a single word correctly, had probably only seen an hour long documentary on Brazil and probably couldn't even find it on a map much less produce 10 seconds of music that could remotely be referred to as Brazilian.....

Catches breath....

But I gotta hand it to him for trying???

No thanks.


You crack me up man. Very true.

edit: Oh yeah, I forgot to mention, Bernhard is spot on as well. I'm glad I wasn't the only one who noticed those things...
G

[KzSgDrummer]

I do think Jeff Indyke is a bit odd, but that doesn't mean I hate the guy. He's great! In fact, he's becoming a bit of inspiration to me. I've been working on a new drum technique lately that I call 'Subatomicmicronuclearlization.' It involves skipping every third quarter note in a bar of music and replacing it with a double-paradiddle. It's pretty complicated, but I invented it.

HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!1!!111!!!1111one1!!1!1!!!!!!1!! !!

[Deathmetalconga]

attacking someone who posts as often as jeff is the price jeff pays for making himself so visible. I am also sure Jeff has heard or read much worse. If you're going to put yourself out there (as a a player, performer, teacher, clinician etc.), you got to take the knocks and these don't seem so bad to me.

Paul

Excellent point.

Sheesh, lighten up everyone.

[TitanSound]

OK, OK!!!

I see where everyone is coming from. I was just sticking up for one of our own. Some very good points made in this thread as to why he may be a hinderence rather than a help!! I just didnt look too deeply into it.

[NUTHA JASON]

yes. i hope it helps him in the end.

j

[Jeff Almeyda]

I agree that he's trying. But there are three things that push it over the line into me being quite severely unimpressed rather than just giving points for effort:

1) Aggressive self-promotion. Huge captions claiming 1.5 million viewers, "I invented this concept!" blah blah. Sorry Jeff, but I don't see that stuff on Thomas Lang's DVD, Jeff Pocaro's DVD or Billy Ward's DVD. Or anybody elses. So I really don't expect to see it on your stuff. If you have something to say, say it and then let other people decide the value of what you do rather than just trying to claim merit at every opportunity in as large a font as possible.

2) If you're going to teach you need to learn first. Much of what Jeff is saying on those videos is either wrong or obvious. If it's wrong, it's harmful to people who take it as advice. If it's obvious then it's also harmful because it is encouraging people away from actually doing their own thinking. Much of the stuff on those "concepts" lessons could be learned by anybody who has had, say, four focused lessons on reading, listening and transcribing. And if you transcribe that stuff yourself then you tend to learn more because of it - it helps develop your ears and your understanding of the surrounding music.

No good teacher I know takes the approach of transcribing music and then teaching it to students in chunks. "Today, children, we will be studying bars 46 through 54 of Tom Sawyer by Rush..." and so forth. The good ones just teach the students to transcribe and let them make their own discoveries, because that's how you actually learn.

3) Name-dropping. As Bernhard said, about 90% of Jeff's stuff is the same groove/lick re-arranged slightly, and I'm not convinced that half the re-arrangements aren't accidental. But his videos are laced with stuff saying that Jeff is an expert in teaching "Steve Gadd concepts", they reference Bonham... hell, he even has one which claims to be explaining Elvin Jones, instead it seems to be yet another paradiddle orchestration. Seriously, who listens to Elvin and hears paradiddles as the key, central concept? This ties in with the self-promotion stuff. When I search for Elvin on YouTube I don't want to see Jeff's lesson turning up in the list because quite simply it's wrong and insulting to Elvin's legacy that he's using a name of a player he clearly has no understanding of to promote himself and his work. God forbid some poor kid who's just discovered Elvin might think Jeff's actually teaching them something, rather than grossly misleading them.

So yes. Good intentions, but I personally think the methods are utterly reprehensible and actually highly damaging. The fact that there are people posting in this thread saying "You can't say that about Jeff, he's a great teacher!" has me really worried because I'm scared that some of you people out there are actually buying his self-promotion and thinking that he's telling you stuff you should be learning! For those here who're so mortified by the criticism, can you please enlighten me to anything whatsoever that you've learned from Jeff that you couldn't have worked out better for yourself from the usual primary sources? (i.e: Stick Control, a few lessons on reading/transcribing and a pile of CDs)


Finn, once again you've summed it up accurately and succintly.

The aggressive self-promotion really gets me. Reminds me of a snake oil salesman. (or Joe Ballistic or Jared Falk)

I've studied with a laundry list of teachers, from unknown local guys to jazz legends and the best teachers are always very humble.

Maybe he's a great guy, I don't know him. I just find it hard to trust someone like that.

[geek_boy_in]

Its good to know that I am not the only one to feel let down and was just keeping quiet because Jeff has got a sticky thread in this forum .... I tried his videos a couple of times but couldn't understand any of his English ( maybe because am neither American or British) ...... I didn't like the way he demonstrated the lessons also ... I couldn't find any pattern or structure into the madness ( and with his fast english and weird mic it made it worse ..... the video kept on dragging on and on and on .... Thank you Sir for wasting 30 mins of my meagre 2 hrs practice time in which I could have actually practiced a simple rudiment and expanded it on my own ).....

at the end I have stopped paying attention to this Helpful guy ......

about the blog ... the author was humorous and he was not being so insulting to merit being called a jerk ... and blogs are anyways personal views ......

[GRUNTERSDAD]

I have only watched two of the videos from this guy, and my only thought is that he seems to start them with the assumption that one has seen them all or at least the one prior to the one currently running. I think this is the main reason for the confusion. If he put some thought into the film or video, such as, this may be the only time this person watches this, so I better be clear, then it may help. Just my humble opinion.

[jazzgregg]

Its good to know that I am not the only one to feel let down and was just keeping quiet because Jeff has got a sticky thread in this forum .... I tried his videos a couple of times but couldn't understand any of his English ( maybe because am neither American or British) ...... I didn't like the way he demonstrated the lessons also ... I couldn't find any pattern or structure into the madness ( and with his fast english and weird mic it made it worse ..... the video kept on dragging on and on and on .... Thank you Sir for wasting 30 mins of my meagre 2 hrs practice time in which I could have actually practiced a simple rudiment and expanded it on my own ).....

at the end I have stopped paying attention to this Helpful guy ......

about the blog ... the author was humorous and he was not being so insulting to merit being called a jerk ... and blogs are anyways personal views ......

I am sure there are many subjects on which people are keeping quiet because they feel they should. Does this sound right?

G

[KzSgDrummer]

I have only watched two of the videos from this guy, and my only thought is that he seems to start them with the assumption that one has seen them all or at least the one prior to the one currently running. I think this is the main reason for the confusion. If he put some thought into the film or video, such as, this may be the only time this person watches this, so I better be clear, then it may help. Just my humble opinion.

I believe this is because he tapes them for his TV audience, although I don't know this for a fact. But if it's true then they'd most likely be taped in 30 minute segments, or at the least 15 min. But he understands hardly anybody on Youtube is going to watch the whole thing, so he's broken it up as best he could into bite size chunks.

[rendezvous_drummer]

So yes. Good intentions, but I personally think the methods are utterly reprehensible and actually highly damaging. The fact that there are people posting in this thread saying "You can't say that about Jeff, he's a great teacher!" has me really worried because I'm scared that some of you people out there are actually buying his self-promotion and thinking that he's telling you stuff you should be learning!

Agreed. That's what I thought when I first started watching a couple of his videos. People might not comprehend what he's doing, begin doing the exercises in the way they think is how Jeff meant, and then claim that if Jeff Indyke did it, then it must be right. I just think he needs a totally different approach to teaching. A more understandable and effective approach.

[DanBritt]

..............................

[T.Underhill]

What's with the bullet statements???

[NUTHA JASON]

thanks dan. i agree.
and i know also that it can be hard to tell a mentor where he can improve. the tables turn and the teacher can become the taught ...but its not easy. i hope that this thread about jeff can help him constructively and, you reading it to him, can help you as you try to help him. a lot of helping going on right there...that's what i like about the drumming community.
as a school teacher myself i know that teaching is not as straight forward as people assume and sometimes a great drummer does not = a great drum teacher (some of my most expensive drumming DVD prove that)...but perhaps a great drummer + some simple tips from the right people can make a huge difference. i wish a top drum teacher would get together with steve gadd and put a real gadducational DVD together for instance.
j

[Bernhard]

One thing I have to say is Jeff has one of the biggest hearts in the drum industry and has constantly - constantly - provided what he can to the drum community for atleast 30 years. For free..... Peace

Hi Danny

Yes - I agree that Jeff is probably the nicest guy around. We all look for possibilities to help as much we can.

Bernhard

[HardcoreLogo]

You guys think he's hard to follow on the video's?You should call him(lol).I did to see if he was for real, and he totally is........at first I got a kick out of it and thought it was a "Jerry Lewis" type act, but nope, he's for real...super nice guy, but what the hell are "genetic" funk so and so's (LOL)

[Stitch Kaboodle]

Jeff. I love your style man. Can you please transribe your "Mushies Experience" please. I'm having difficulty comprehending it in full.

Thanks

[Stitch Kaboodle]

I must say I don't find him very comprehensive

[anthony]

Hi Stu. I saw that you were talking with Jeff about one of Bonhams bass drum licks in good times bad times. If me and you are talking about the same part in the song where he does the triplets he is playing the triplets with one foot and there is no snare drum.

Just let me try to make sure that we are talking about the same part. The tune starts and the vocal goes in the days of my youth etc.

Now i've reached the age and then comes the triplets on the kick drum. Is this the same part? If it is the bass drum triplets happen in between snare hits. Why do you think you can't play triplets at the tempo. I play that tune and i can do it. I was just curious why you think it wasn't possible to play the triplets.

Thanks for your time and i look forward to your response.

[JeffIndyke]

Very excellent to be here, thank you.

Check out Danny & Derrick's new videos too

http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20742

[Dave Mason]

Hi there Jeff.

Any chance of a UK Drum clinic?

I know many many people from the infamous UK drummer's site www.mikedolbear.com forums who would love to go to a drum clinic of yours in the UK! Maybe you could register there for some feedback aswell!

[HHxplorer]

Watching the Lars Ulrich vids from you now.
Tbh, it's got nothing to do with Lars Ulrich.
Atleast he's trying.
Just a bit too much talking.

[morbius25]

Ok, I think your grooves are cool, but half the time I have no idea what you said. Your mic set up sucks. Secondly, I love TOOL, I like Danny Carey, out of all the Danny Carey vids I haven't learned one of there songs from you. I could listen to the cd and get a better idea of what to do. Am I missing something here, or is there a code to breaking this puzzle.

[ayachtdrummer]

Yeah, Jeff is respected by some great drummers. Usualy the average ones put him down

that's quite a stretch.
I've watched many of his videos.It may say "Bonham","Gadd","Peart",whatever,but they all sound the same with JI usually going off into his thing far removed from the topic matter.
How do learn from someone who doesn't break anything down or make things easy to follow?
How do you learn from a teacher who grunts out the accents he's hitting on the snare drum?
How do you grasp grunting? Am I supposed to remember where the grunts go so I can play the groove?
c'mon-
this high praise he's getting here really surprises me.who,pray tell,is JI really trying to teach any way? I'll be danged if a beginner could watch YouTube clips and get a clue as to anything he's saying or doing.Few,if any of his lessons make me wanna woodshed either.

one more thing...hey Jeff...tune your drums,man,or have someone who knows how do it for you.That's a lesson you could learn from.

[DrumNut]

Someone should call him to get through to him. I mean, he does great things, but if he worked on his weaknesses it would be so much better.

I agree he needs to fix up his segments.

But also think he's doing something right since he has over 400 subscribers on youtube.

[Drummer Karl]

Hey Jeff,`not heard you often before...but in the last I watched you more and more...and I have to say: Thanks for all this great stuff!!!

I love your drumming and your sound, very cool!

PS: Special thanks for that Elvin Jones concept, I`m a big Elvin fan.

However, cool stuff Mr.!

Karl

[JasonCruz]

Hey Jeff,

This is Jason here, and I'm from Singapore. I recently discovered your videos on youtube, and I appreciate your work. My only little issue is that it's bit too wordy...But nevertheless, the ideas you demonstrate in your videos are worth 5 times over!!

Jeff, here's a little video clip of me playing with this newly formed bar band. We did a cover of Wilson Pickett's Mustang Sally. I would really appreciate it a great deal if you could comment on my playing. I sincerely apologize for the crappy video and audio quality of this clip! It was taken with a mobile phone camera, lol!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-ycitpC6nQ

Also, it'd be great if you could share with me and the rest of us you're concepts on time-keeping.

Thanks Jeff, and on behalf of the drumming community in Singapore, keep up the great work!!

[DrumNut]

Jeff,

Can you do a segment on John Densmore from the Doors?

[Trommur]

Hey, Jeff.

I Really like yor work though I've only recently gotten into it... But it's great stuff!

[DrumNut]

Oh my gosh!

Jeff you have almost 140 people who favorited this video of yours and over 20,000 views!

Do thing more like this one!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhUvAY7A3k0

[Womble]

Oh my gosh! Jeff you have almost 140 people who favorited this video of yours and over 20,000 views!


Makes you despair, doesn't it?

"The value of a 32nd is really...double the value of the 16th". Funny, I thought it was half.

[ayachtdrummer]

Oh my gosh!

Jeff you have almost 140 people who favorited this video of yours and over 20,000 views!

Do thing more like this one!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhUvAY7A3k0

well...has this guy ever been to a PASIC convention?
Ya know,the NOISE POLICE there will punch your name badge if you play obnoxiously.Get my drift?
Maybe JI could maybe (?)be an invited clinician and demonstrate his stuff,but if he was just another nobody on the convention floor playing every drumset in the hall playing a Gadd-ish groove and yacking on and on,the NP would be punchin' his badge.
I've seen it happen.
Punched 3 times and yer out,too,buddy!
whatever.

[Womble]

Get my drift?

Um, not really, no.

cha

[DrumNut]

I dont think someone should be judged by PASIC.

That's like saying a politician wasnt a a democratic convention. Maybe Indyke is independent and doesnt rely on the norm or on companies.

But, I have to admit, I sort of would love to see him go to one of these and see what happens. In some respects, yeah, maybe he should be challenged in this way instead of just recording in TV shows in his own studio.

Why dont someone call him and challenge him lol.

[jazzgregg]

Uh, I could be wrong, but I think he's saying that Indyke is crap. That if he started playing that stuff he does in a room full of drummers, and/or was obnoxious about it, they would not care, or worse.

I may be wrong though, but that's what I got out of it.

G

[DrumNut]

Is Molecularization a Real Drum Concept?

It sounds like a scientific thing, Indyke what make a good mad scientist lol

At the end of this video, he says in a crazy voice "THE OTHER SIDE!!"

HAHAHA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTJsbKlY_gQ

[secondXheartbeat]

So in a roundabout way he's calling odd-time fills "molecurization" and taking credit for inventing them?

[djp132]

This is similar to beat displacement. Theres a real musical term for it but I can't think of what it is. Adding or subtracting a beat in a fill or groove is nothing new. This is like me taking all my Moeller work and saying I invented a new technique. Indyke is a cool dude, but this is a bit strange on my radar.

[Just Drums]

Beat displacement, syncopation, phrasing - yes.

"Molecularization"? No. Not in my book. Never heard of it. Sounds like a term that belongs on Star Trek.

;-)

[Deathmetalconga]

It is silly for him to claim he invented this. People have been doing that for a long time - even before the advent of the trap drum set.

www.terrasonus.com

[Backwards Marathon]

its so wierd how he counts out loud as well. lol.

[jordanz]

I find him to be so fargin entertaining. I have no idea what he's talking about it, but it sure is fun to watch. That one beat he has (it's the only thing he ever plays) is really groovy, though.

[secondXheartbeat]

He's a great drummer, but that mic in his face needs to go.

[DrumMasterDave]

Yah i gotta agree. He is a not bad drummer. But i have also never heard of this term.

[radiofriendlyunitshifter]

jeff, i'm curious, why do you abstain from addressing those who are soiling your

name? instead you ignore the posts like they're not even there, and use this forum as

free advertisement for your products instead of conversing with drummers.

[finnhiggins]

jeff, i'm curious, why do you abstain from addressing those who are soiling your name?

I don't think we're trying to soil his name, more offended by his soiling of the names of considerably greater drummers than any of us - like Elvin, for example. If Jeff wants to put his videos up there that's fine, but I really wish he'd stop promoting them with the names of "Name" drummers along with them when the content of the video amounts to little more than loosely-connected name dropping and the inevitable link back to something to do with a paradiddle. Particularly when they're dead and can't stand up for themselves. I mean, if Jeff's perception of Elvin's playing is all about paradiddles then that's fine - but once he starts trying to publicise it under the banner of "education" then I think he's doing Elvin a massive disservice and insulting his memory. If you want to teach "Elvin Jones concepts" you'd better make damn sure that you know what you're doing. I've seen Elvin talking about his playing, and I don't recall hearing the word "Paradiddle" once.

[PBW]

Is Molecularization a Real Drum Concept?

It sounds like a scientific thing, Indyke what make a good mad scientist lol

At the end of this video, he says in a crazy voice "THE OTHER SIDE!!"

HAHAHA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTJsbKlY_gQ


The more I watch this the funnier it gets! I love the bit where he counts to five.... then adds another beat after it... like are we counting to 6 or what?

I'll give him this tho: he's kept us all entertained for free :)

[DrumNut]

I agree with PBW, the more I watch him the funnier it gets, he is just joyous and silly

This cracks me up like crazy, I could be having a very bad day, and watched this, and start laughing like mad!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wcxbm0e7Td0

[JeffIndyke]

Hello,

I honestly have bad vision and cannot always post until I have assistants type what I say for me. Unfortunately.

As for doing segments on famous names. I was never trying to or claiming to play exact transcriptions. Those who know me over the years know that my ultimate objective for viewers and students is for them to develop the potential of an idea that came from a famous artist and expand or improvise it to become their own.

I am all for the individuality of my students, but use a certain concept of say Elvin or Tony or Buddy, and then taking it where you want to take it. It wasnt my intention to give the impression that it is an exact transcription of any of these artists.

I would be happy to answer any question about this or anything else, and I want to thank you for this thread.

Please call me at (516) 263-9782 and perhaps I can better explain my intentions with my lessons. There have been a lot of misperceptions, because these segments were parts of my TV show and may come off a little bit scattered. Sorry for the confusion.

(516) 263-9782

[cnw60]

I agree with PBW, the more I watch him the funnier it gets, he is just joyous and silly

This cracks me up like crazy, I could be having a very bad day, and watched this, and start laughing like mad!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wcxbm0e7Td0

Oh my god!!! - that is hilarious! I love it.

[KzSgDrummer]

"A vibrant entertainer from NY, Jeff has performed .... for various populations to include nursing homes."

??


Ohhhh I get it: he's stating a political message, that with the baby boomers all nearing retirement age, he feels that various municipalities should be working to expand their housing supply for the elderly. I agree Jeff, this is a serious and impending issue that needs to be discussed more -- good for you! Fight the good fight!

[JeffIndyke]

Please feel free to give me a call to talk about anything. We are all in this together. We drummers have a brotherhood.

Thanks so much

(516) 263-9782

[drummerchick435]

Please feel free to give me a call to talk about anything. We are all in this together. We drummers have a brotherhood.

Thanks so much

(516) 263-9782
..........or sisterhood! jk! jk! I know what you mean.

[DogBreath]

Please feel free to give me a call to talk about anything. We are all in this together. We drummers have a brotherhood.

Thanks so much

(516) 263-9782

Jeff, that's very cool of you. I hope you don't get swamped with calls because of this... unless that's what you want!

[Sesh]

I'm a bit torn on Jeff Indyke at the mo...as I think a lot of people are.

On the one hand, he's a good player and is obviously very passionate about drumming, community and education - as well as making some very entertaining videos. And at the end of the day, it's all free so who can complain...?

Well me - because that (as derrick said in a much nicer way!) seems like total crap. To be honest, he explains that so badly it's hard to work out what he's doing anyway, but whether that's his way of explaining displacements (which I don't think it is) or whether he's saying 'hey, why not just add a beat onto the end of a fill' (great way to lose work, people if you do that in anything except a free drum solo), neither is an original inention, and nothing else related to either concept is new.

For me, it's seriously dangerous ground to claim to have even expanded on a concept in a new way - let alone proclaim to have totally invented an idea on drums in this day and age! Even guys like virgil donati don't claim that (and he's a lot closer than jeff). All that was as far as an invention, was a totally incorrect use of the scientific word "molecularization".

I have really tried to like what Jeff's doing, and I did dig his vids on bonham and some other ideas - but putting that crap out is nothing except harmful. surely that's barely distinguishable from me putting out a vid on how I inventd paradiddles and calling them "snowmobiles"

Hope that's not too harsh, I really disagree with that vid.

[nhzoso]

Thanks for the Offer Jeff, Love the Video's keep em coming.

[DrumNut]

I think Indyke is probably goofing around when he said he invented that. I mean I doubt he filed paperwork with the patent division or US government or whatever it takes to actually invent something.

Maybe we're all taking this too seriously.

Maybe we should call him or ask him to take down that video if it bothers us that much?

As an example, in this video he claims an invention with spoons but he sounds like he's kidding about 3 minutes in (Funny film btw)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jt59DCIohrA

[Sesh]

I think Indyke is probably goofing around when he said he invented that. I mean I doubt he filed paperwork with the patent division or US government or whatever it takes to actually invent something.

Maybe we're all taking this too seriously.

Maybe we should call him or ask him to take down that video if it bothers us that much?

As an example, in this video he claims an invention with spoons but he sounds like he's kidding about 3 minutes in (Funny film btw)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jt59DCIohrA

Fair enough - maybe he is...he's hard to read!

Seems like a really bizarre thing to be joking about, but whatever floats his boat I guess..

[PBW]

I think Indyke is probably goofing around when he said he invented that.
Maybe we're all taking this too seriously.


Well if he's goofing around intentionally, he shouldn't advertise it as "education" beacause people are obviously being mislead by this material.

[RexFeldstein]

Hi Jeff,

I saw you in a chinese restaurant last week and wanted to say hello but was a little nervous.

I enjoy your tv show and my friend says he sees you in Starbucks all the time. Is that true.

[RexFeldstein]

Well if he's goofing around intentionally, he shouldn't advertise it as "education" beacause people are obviously being mislead by this material.

Jeff is a funny guy, I wouldnt let things like this bother me. There are a ton more things in the world to be concerned about than him saying he invented a weird term.

He offers more of his time for free than any drummer I know.

He is nothing but positive, and so many people seem to be negative!

[RexFeldstein]

Right on brother. I'll have to definitely say hello to you in Starbucks then.

Maybe you can give me a free lesson ;0)

But please, not in singing ;)

[DrumNut]

Indyke is on most viewed on Youtube in a week!

Over 1,000 views! that is insane. I dont think a thousand people watched me play drums in my life lol

http://www.youtube.com/members?t=w&p=5&s=mv&g=1

[DrumNut]

http://jeffreyindyke.com/

[TitanSound]

Well he says himself that he is near blind so I hope not......

[DrumNut]

hahahahahahahaha! that was funny!

[Stitch Kaboodle]

I think we're all agreed he's one leg short of a milking stool but he sure is entertaining. I have never found him clear or easy to understand and he seems to be playing the 'nutty professor' card. He has atrocious technique and has a BPM range of about 5.

That said I really do like the guy as a person and I think he would be an ideal drummer for The Frogs.

[tamadrummer132]

um... id give out my #.. but i dont think my parents would appreciate it


BUT.

my aim is : Ddprince11@aol.com

my msn is : chuggstah12@hotmail.com


gimme a jingle x)

[secondXheartbeat]

Jeff, your positive attitude and obvious love of the craft inspires us all.

and any one can drop me a line at http://www.myspace.com/xsecondxheartbeatx

it's a private profile but i'll accept you if you message me telling me your drumerworld screen name

[JeffIndyke]

Thanks so much everyone!

[Mapex589]

Jeff - you are right.....drumming is brotherhood and it brings people together like no other instrument. I have tried to figure this whole phenom out but have not figured out the answer. Also why do drum companies and drum magazines stay away from the whole "use sex to sell" like the guitar companies do? It just seems like drums bring a little more touch of class than the others. Nice of you to offer your number to talk shop. I may take you up on that offer some day. Thanks for the possitive post!!

[radiofriendlyunitshifter]

i'd imagine you get an awful lot of prank phone calls, with you putting your personal

telephone number on the web like that.

[JeffIndyke]

I do get some funny calls alright!

But I also get a lots of calls from fans!

(516) 263-9782

[JeffIndyke]

I am down in Florida!

How was everyone's Holiday!!??

Jeff
(516) 263-9782

[JeffIndyke]

Anybody get any drum goodies for the Holidays?

[JeffIndyke]

Hello out there in Drumland!

What Drummers would you like to see videos on?

Keep in mind I have covered so many drummers between tapes, CDs, videos.

But if there is someone new, or something new on a drummer I have covered, please let me know here or by calling me!

[weegs51690]

Jon Theodore, Stewart Copeland (i'm not sure if you've covered him yet or not), Ginger Baker (again not sure), but mostly Jon Theodore, since i'm fairly sure he uses a lot of Afro-Cuban patterns.

[JeffIndyke]

Jon Theodore, Stewart Copeland (i'm not sure if you've covered him yet or not), Ginger Baker (again not sure), but mostly Jon Theodore, since i'm fairly sure he uses a lot of Afro-Cuban patterns.

I will check out Jon Theodore! Thanks!

I have many CDs/Tapes on Copeland and some videos on Youtube.

I also have many audios on some stylistic concepts of Tony Williams!

[Doom]

John Otto, Im not a big fan of his band so if there are any videos of him with or without them that would be great.

[JeffIndyke]

John Otto, Im not a big fan of his band so if there are any videos of him with or without them that would be great.

Great! I'll look into this! thanks

There was a post that is no longer here about coping Tony Williams. I recently did 9 DVD's based on Tony's concepts on "Believe It"

[rendezvous_drummer]

Larry Mullen Jr. I know he's not the most spectacular and impressive drummer out there, but I just like watching things about him. My favorite drummer. Him and Elvin Jones.

[JeffIndyke]

Larry Mullen Jr. I know he's not the most spectacular and impressive drummer out there, but I just like watching things about him. My favorite drummer. Him and Elvin Jones.

Cool, will add Larry to the list to think about.

By the way, if any of you want to speak in detail about the drummer you request and what about them you would like to learn - or if you just want to BS with me, just call me!!

[nhzoso]

Tommy Lee, get a bunch of fake tattoo's and a bandana (rambo style) and play hard and do some stick twirling, throw it in the air and catch it, maybe have Pam Anderson come over and sit across from you as you play... : )

[JeffIndyke]

I do have some concepts that cover the style of Tommy Lee but also others in my collection

[HHxplorer]

19" Sabian HHXtreme.
It's a beast :)

[DrumNut]

hahahahahaha

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoaPneBI3nU

[fourstringdrums]

hahahahahaha

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoaPneBI3nU

Not enough coffee to keep me awake during that.

I'm sorry but what does that have to do with Lars? I'll admit, sometimes when I watch Jeff's videos I think "That groove was kind of cool" and I'll admit he does have some chops, but he really needs to learn how to explain things. I was watching the video on Jon Wysocki and he mentions his name..that's it. He doesn't say how what he's playing has to do with Jon's style or a particular song it's taken from. So it is really difficult to learn more about a style of a particular drummer from him, atleast for me.

I just want to say two other things that bother me about his videos that I wish he would change:

1) He needs to get a headset mic. He keeps talking even though his mouth isn't in front of the mic.

2) He needs to stop getting off the subject. In this video he stops to tune a drum, and in another I saw he goes on a tangent about a Bruce Willis and another die hard movie or something, for about a minute and a half, AFTER he starts talking about whatever it is he's going to explain.

[JohnMunsey]

Dude!

What's this about! lol

Is this Tool music!!???? lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxyTcT_Qkds

[murphinelli]

I'm sorry but what does that have to do with Lars?

Clearly you must know this is the main beat from Master Of Puppets? I mean what kind of Metallica fan are you?....;-)

[Bernhard]

It's not only Lars. If you watch carefully, you see some Steve Gadd and Elvin Jones influences in there. Perhabs I'm wrong but I'm quite sure also about some Charlie Watts and Ringo Starr (two sticks - one in the left hand - one in the right!!!!)

Bernhard

[fourstringdrums]

It's not only Lars. If you watch carefully, you see some Steve Gadd and Elvin Jones influences in there. Perhabs I'm wrong but I'm quite sure also about some Charlie Watts and Ringo Starr (two sticks - one in the left hand - one in the right!!!!)

Bernhard

He should explain that...that is what I can't stand about his "lessons", they're not clear, and I hope he takes that into consideration. I commend him for doing the lessons but if they're not clear they won't do as many people any good.

[JeffIndyke]

Here is a lesson that went over better (as far as youtube commenters!) than others!

The Single Stroke Five -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tVnMdmFZZ8#GU5U2spHI_4

[centralzeke]

Really cool video man!!! Just goes to show simple things like the single stroke 5 can sound awesome..

[JeffIndyke]

Thanks so much!! I am hoping to have about 5-10 more videos on youtube shortly

[samthebeat]

I have noticed some you tubers can be very agressive and stupid/uncalled for in their commenting towards you. I have watched all you videos and enjoyed/found usefull everyone pretty much. I like your style to, your playing has a great swing to it.

[JeffIndyke]

Thanks very much Sam! Much appreciated!

Yes, rough crowd. They are making racial slurs to me and orientation remarks that are untrue! Silly kids!

[Drummer Karl]

Awesome, I love all the videos...my favourite is the Elvin Jones concept!! Great mate, great!
Do you still make those education vids?

Karl

[JeffIndyke]

Thanks! Totally Karl. Here are some of the recent shows. Anyone can sign up for my newsletter (I dont want to advertise or spam the board here out of respect to everyone here.) so email me at Thedrumprofessor@gmail.com to sign up pls

THE JEFF INDYKE DRUM EDUCATION SHOW SEASON IV &V”.


For Season IV & V Jeff really laid it down. By now “The One Hour Focus” really comes into maturity!!! Alot more playing & improvs. Since “The Bonzo Snipets” ; Clark Files”; “Al Miller Tributes” & “The Dan Britt Collections” were so elaborate, textured & thorough, Season IV went right into Season V!!!!


Bonzo Snipets…Based off of a rare collection of studio sound rehearsals & out takes of Bonham working to beds & just grooving & wailing!!! These were pure genius & pure improvs!!! These were a gas To Play!!!


“Dan Britt Files” ..Based off of Dan’s 60 second Collections I & II. These were the ultimate technical challenge!!!


“Mike Clark Files”…Based off of Mike’s award winning work on “Thrust” Herbie Hancock.


“Al Miller Tribute”… Based off of My favorite recollections & applications of my second Mentor & Legend.


“Genetic Funk The Outer Zone II”…Jeff’s most famous elaborate combinations of the amazing Genetic Zones!!!

As I look back at Seasons IV & V, I can really see my passion & intensity for these ideas. The biggest public reaction was to “The Clark Files” & “The Al Miller Tributes”.

[SickRick]

I'm sorry. I didn't get it. Really. Tried hard, couldn't make it. What exactly are you trying to get across in that vid?

In all honesty: If I hadn't known already what a Single Stroke Five is, what it sounds like and how to use it, I wouldn't know it after watching that vid. You're just playing some funky grooves with some fills - where is the point of that?

Maybe if you'd give a written explanation of what you're showing it would be easier to understand. But like this, the video does not have any educational value - it is a video of a guy playing some funky grooves. That is cool - but not educating.

No offense indicated, just some construvtive critique telling you to try to explain things a bit more in depth and structured.

I liked your playing though.

[JeffIndyke]

Thanks for the honesty and feedback! and compliment!

[Class A Drummer]

Really cool playing and cool grooving Jeff, but i have a question. I cant seem to tell whether you are starting with your left or your right hand. Any help?

[Johnest]

If your talking about with wich hand he start is single 5 stroke roll, since it's five stroke, he almost surelly start with the same hand that he finish with.

Like, one, two, three, four, five... r, l, r, l, r... Or the opposite. l, r, l, r, l

Sound logical to me.

Great video Jeff, as always. Thanks.

[JeffIndyke]

Thanks so much!

yes, to end up on beat 1 on the cymbal with the right hand, I started with the right. Please feel free to call me with any questions!

This is the continuation of that 5 stroke lesson

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MaBp6JMuIs

[JeffIndyke]

...and I have to say: Thanks for all this great stuff!!!

I love your drumming and your sound, very cool!

PS: Special thanks for that Elvin Jones concept, I`m a big Elvin fan.

However, cool stuff Mr.!

Karl

Thanks so much Karl! I do videos on the Classic Drummer website also and have been talking with DRUM! also!

[murphinelli]

He should explain that...that is what I can't stand about his "lessons", they're not clear, and I hope he takes that into consideration. I commend him for doing the lessons but if they're not clear they won't do as many people any good.

Jeff,

Do you have any response to this?

I know one strategy for getting "hits/views" on YouTube is to put something popular in the name/TAGS. i.e. "Tool" "Danny Carey" "Lars Ulrich" etc....How many people do searches for "Tool" compared to "dotted eight note"?

That may work for the normal joe blow....99% of the YouTube audience....However, it is not a good/fair strategy for drummers like those on DW.

I know "Dotted eight note Groove Concepts" would probably not catch too many fish....But using Lars Ulrich in the name and having the lesson have nothing specifically to do with Lars.....????

I also commend you for doing these free lessons, but please take some of this feedback into consideration.

Thanks,
Murph

[Womble]

Jeff,

Do you have any response to this?

Of course he doesn't. Why are you guys still wasting words trying to be helpful to him???

[JeffIndyke]

Thanks for the question.

Those who are familiar with my catalog know that for decades I have studies based off the concepts of great drummers. This does not mean I provide an exact transcription! It means I was influenced by a concept the drummer did, and then instead of just being content with copying it, I'd rather my students take the idea and develop their own style off it.

I have studied the concepts of so many of the great drummers, and if the lesson is based on their work, it is therefore very relevant to them, and is accurate to put their name in the title.

This is from my earlier concept courses, but the idea is similar -

"The solution I came up with was writing out several of the main parts exactly, and then several hip variations on each part to help strengthen the technical skills needed to play the tunes. The variations also help serve the excellent purpose of allowing one to play the tune with more of their own feel and input! I also spend time relating these concepts to other types of musical applications. Which allows the student to use these ideas in other tune situations. The technical and creative results of this procedure have been phenomenal"

I would rather speak on the phone about this. I will speak to any of you and be happy to explain it.

[JeffIndyke]

I had them take Dom's name off the title of that video, it's not worth all the hassle of this, even though it's based on the philosophy he often talks about and inspired by him

[JeffIndyke]

Some of you will like this aright, but I have a throat infection and can barely speak

[JohnMunsey]

Jeff, good stuff man, keep them coming

[fourstringdrums]

Jeff,

Do you have any response to this?

I know one strategy for getting "hits/views" on YouTube is to put something popular in the name/TAGS. i.e. "Tool" "Danny Carey" "Lars Ulrich" etc....How many people do searches for "Tool" compared to "dotted eight note"?

That may work for the normal joe blow....99% of the YouTube audience....However, it is not a good/fair strategy for drummers like those on DW.

I know "Dotted eight note Groove Concepts" would probably not catch too many fish....But using Lars Ulrich in the name and having the lesson have nothing specifically to do with Lars.....????

I also commend you for doing these free lessons, but please take some of this feedback into consideration.

Thanks,
Murph

In the Dom thread when it got way out of hand because of his Dom video, I said this exact same thing. I think that's why those famous names are in the title, to get more hits. Then he says their name in the video to make himself believe they are related. There is no other way to explain how he can say "This is a Tony Williams" lesson, and then go off on something that has nothing to do with him.

[fourstringdrums]

Thanks for the question.

Those who are familiar with my catalog know that for decades I have studies based off the concepts of great drummers. This does not mean I provide an exact transcription! It means I was influenced by a concept the drummer did, and then instead of just being content with copying it, I'd rather my students take the idea and develop their own style off it.

I have studied the concepts of so many of the great drummers, and if the lesson is based on their work, it is therefore very relevant to them, and is accurate to put their name in the title.

This is from my earlier concept courses, but the idea is similar -

"The solution I came up with was writing out several of the main parts exactly, and then several hip variations on each part to help strengthen the technical skills needed to play the tunes. The variations also help serve the excellent purpose of allowing one to play the tune with more of their own feel and input! I also spend time relating these concepts to other types of musical applications. Which allows the student to use these ideas in other tune situations. The technical and creative results of this procedure have been phenomenal"

I would rather speak on the phone about this. I will speak to any of you and be happy to explain it.

I respect that but the problem is that even things played because of an influence still usually show some evidence of the influence. Your lessons don't do that in my view. You should atleast say "So and so did THIS (play an example) and it inspired me to come up with THIS"

[fourstringdrums]

Well....He does apparently have a large staff that decides the names....Therefore he is not ultimately responsible....I heard they are going to re-name all of the YouTube videos and take out the drummer's names....That's what one of the staff members told me....;-)

He's the one giving the lesson, why should someone else decide what they're called? If he's allowing them to do that and it's misleading, then he's just as wrong as they are. Titles aside, he usually mentions the drummer's name in the lesson itself, then does nothing to connect the name with the playing. I really wish he would answer for that. I know he said they're "influenced", but as I said in response, the influence still has to connect somewhat with the drummer it derives from even in explaination. If I put up a video of my playing saying that it's influenced by Joe Morello, and then proceed to do blast beats (which I can't do btw) :) for 7 minutes, I'd better come up with a reason for how what I just played is influenced by him.

[JeffIndyke]

Hey Guys,

I have been basing my lessons off of the great drummers who inspired me for decades.

The only difference now is they are on youtube and they are free.

If a lesson is a result of an influence by a great drummer like Dom or Tony Williams, I give credit where credit is due. The lesson is a conceptual lesson, not always a specific "five stroke roll" lesson. It is a more abstract approach.

If a concept is as a result of listening to Tool and Danny Carey and I work off of a Danny Carey concept, then Carey is very relevant to the lesson.

[NUTHA JASON]

hi jeff

i'm asking all the pros this question. i think the answers could be very instructive to many of us.
let's say there was a totally new drum rudiment that was suddenly discovered and was so totally applicable that any drummer worth their salt would quickly try to learn it, master it and use it in recordings and gigs. this hypothetical new rudiment is quite hard to play and totally unrelated to any other rudiment. it is so good that you know that the next time you sit in on a session the writer is probably going to ask you to use it somewhere in their song.
my question is: starting from scratch what would be your way of learning it?

thanks
j

[JohnMunsey]

Jeff,

this guy Steve Vallee is really putting you down, I say you stick up for yourself

The guy from Drum Bum said good things about you, but Steve Vallee and and someone who goes by worsmit (anonymous wimp) are really tearing you apart in here

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.music.makers.percussion/browse_thread/thread/7380f1f0145789cd

[JeffIndyke]

On our Youtube channel, we officially reached 700,000 views! Thanks for those who supported me.

When it hits 1 million I will reveal what's in the bottle on my floor tom! haha

Also I will dedicate some future youtube segments to Drummerworld and mention the guys!

[Mediocrefunkybeat]

When it hits 1 million I will reveal what's in the bottle on my floor tom! haha



Absinthe? Perhaps? Maybe?

[JeffIndyke]

hi jeff

i'm asking all the pros this question. i think the answers could be very instructive to many of us.
let's say there was a totally new drum rudiment that was suddenly discovered and was so totally applicable that any drummer worth their salt would quickly try to learn it, master it and use it in recordings and gigs. this hypothetical new rudiment is quite hard to play and totally unrelated to any other rudiment. it is so good that you know that the next time you sit in on a session the writer is probably going to ask you to use it somewhere in their song.
my question is: starting from scratch what would be your way of learning it?

thanks
j

Primarly, alright, I'd probably spend 2 night (7 if really difficult) on my practice pad. Then after that I would start developing it on the drumset with as many orchestrations I can think of, and varying and brainstorming on it.

Finally, if